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Is Google Too Smart For Its Own Good?

Posted by kdawson on Wed Dec 06, 2006 05:36 AM
from the sowing-seeds dept.
An anonymous reader writes in with a piece in Fortune speculating on what's next for Google. The writer believes that a supersaturated solution of very smart people, plus stock that may have run out of upside, will yield what he calls Son of Google — a large wave of innovative companies created by Google graduates. And a Google less intent on hiring, and less able to hire, the very smartest people around. Could happen.
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  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 06 2006, @05:43AM (#17126608)
    I'm not worried, at least not until we get to the Revenge of the Son of Google, or maybe the Bride of the Son of Google. That's when the entertainment value really drops off.
    • by Bloke down the pub (861787) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @06:14AM (#17126778)
      Will the odd numbered ones be good and the even numbered ones bad? Or the other way round?
    • by MadJo (674225)
      As long as we don't get the Bastard Son of Google. I don't think Lala of the Tikibar would like that.
    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by smoker2 (750216)
      Heh, you wait 'till Google Ep. 1 - BackRub Garage [stanford.edu] comes out, then it's really jumped the shark (laser equipped or otherwise).
    • by LarsG (31008)
      Those are bound to be stinkers, but Night of the Day of the Dawn of the Son of the Bride of the Return of the Revenge of the Terror of the Attack of the Evil, Mutant, Hellbound, Flesh-Eating Subhumanoid Zombified Google should be a hoot.
  • Perhaps... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by PatrickThomson (712694) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @05:54AM (#17126664)
    Perhaps part of the google ethos and internal structure is aimed at reducing competition from former employees - the sorts of pressures that drive people to break away are diminished, with the 20% project time and a good chance of whatever you're working on becoming a proper google beta. Of course, people that just have a drive to be the boss of the boss's boss will still form companies, perhaps they are eliminated at interview?
    • Re:Perhaps... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Calinous (985536) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @06:12AM (#17126770)
      I don't think becoming a Google employee is a very good start to form a business. Anyway, it is possible - just as former Microsoft employee could break in and form businesses. However, take into consideration the simple fact that after working for such a software giant, you will have non-compete clauses for several years, and quitting Google to someday form your own business seems less than attractive. And one more thing - Google only does searching (for money). All its other projects are free - bad thing to work on, if you want to start a company that will get you money. As a side note, I remember ex-Sun employee (Technology Officer or the same) quitting the company, creating a start-up that develops one thing missing from Sun (developing it well), and then being absorbed back (with their solutions and know-how) for a barrel of money. It seems fair, as while working inside Sun you might have been forced to work on something else. Again, Google employee might be able to start something like this - or not
      • Re:Perhaps... (Score:5, Interesting)

        by ufnoise (732845) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @08:52AM (#17128144)

        However, take into consideration the simple fact that after working for such a software giant, you will have non-compete clauses for several years, and quitting Google to someday form your own business seems less than attractive.


        Are non-compete clauses enforceable in California? Are out of state non compete contracts enforcable in California? According to this Wiki the answer to both questions is no.
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-compete_clause#En forceability_in_the_State_of_California [wikipedia.org]

        Does anyone know if Google requires you to sign a non compete clause?

        Working at a large software company in the Silicon Valley, I just had to sign a paper when I started saying my employment was "at will". It also said I wouldn't try to get other employees to leave the company for a period of two years after I left the company.

        You can't steal intellectual property and take it with you. You can certainly continue to work in the same area, even if it means having to move to California.
  • Google's success. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by 91degrees (207121) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @06:07AM (#17126738) Journal
    People are forgetting the secret to Google's success.

    Luck.

    They developed the right product at the right time. Microsoft did the same. They happened to be home when IBM called and got the DOS contract.

    heir graduates can come up with quality product but will they be able to provide somethign the market really needs?
    • Doesn't matter. The harm here isn't that they'll form companies to compete with Google, the harm is the brain drain, whether they form software companies or write novels.
        • And even that is not that big a deal. They can always buy the start up company when it proves successful, saving google tons of R&D money.

          Assuming it's an arena in which Google chooses to compete, and assuming the principals involved choose to merge back with Google. Which, if they leave in the first place, isn't all that likely. Bottom line, it doesn't work for Google if its best people leave. Best case scenario in your suggestion, Google ceases being an innovative engineering company and turns in

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      They didn't just "happen to be at home". Bill Gates' mum (!) set up a meeting for little Billy boy.

      It kind of pisses me off when Bill Gates is presented as some sort of rags-to-riches success story. He had some starting-post advantages, folks.
      That said, I don't really begrudge him his wealth - society was stupid enough to allow copyright and patent monopoly law (note that Bill Gates was hanging around washington when that was being decided - believe it or not, it wasn't until 1983 that binding U.S. preced
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by roaddemon (666475)
      How was Google lucky? They came into an already saturated search market and collected a vast market share because they did a better job of it than everyone else. If you switched to Google in 1999 or 2000, it wasn't because there was nothing else available, and it wasn't because they had a great ad campaign; it was because of the word of mouth that a great product generates.
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by 91degrees (207121)
        Their product is text ads. Not search technology. The search engine is just a hook.

        Someone else could have come up with the text ads earlier. They didn't. Google got there first.
    • Luck?! (Score:3, Insightful)

      A little off-topic, but in an interview the golfer Bernard Langer was once told that he was extremely lucky to sink a particularly difficult put.
      He responded 'The more I practise, the luckier I get!'.

      I don't believe the successes of Google or Microsoft are down to luck. Neither do I think that Warren Buffett is a lucky investor.
      Being opportunistic and taking a calculated risk sounds more like it.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by mgblst (80109)
        What has it got to do with managers? Entrepreneurs, sure, and the people who created Google are not managers, but Entrepreneus. And it is not luck, it was producing a good product at the right time. A better search engine, just when the whole world needed one. Microsoft could have had this sewn up, if they didn't underestimate the value of the internet. So could a lot of other companies, but it is a difficult thing to see the way the world is heading, especially for large businesses.

        You people make it sound
  • by pubjames (468013) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @06:08AM (#17126750)

    I'm not sure that online service providers are going to be naturally monolithic in the way that, say, hardware manufacturers or pre-web software companies are. I find it easy to imagine that Google's core business could be wiped out in a year by a new upstart with a better technology. Microsoft are lucky in that they have established lock-in - it will be superceded by something else over the long term rather than replaced by superior products of the same ilk. Google doesn't have any lock-in, and I think the nature of online serices is such that companies that try to establish it aren't going to be successful.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 06 2006, @06:09AM (#17126754)
    Is Slashdot Too Political And FUD'ish For Its Own Good?
  • by $RANDOMLUSER (804576) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @06:28AM (#17126844)
    Kind of how Failchild Semiconductor [wikipedia.org] was the wellspring for many of todays semiconductor companies? This graphic (PDF warning) was the best thing I could find. [businessweek.com]
    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Excellent example -- but perhaps an even better one is to look at Kleiner Perkins's previous track record -- Google itself is a son of one Kleiner company (they got theri seed money from a Sun founder, Andy; who in turn got his start from KPCB) - and Google's other money came from KPCB itself. Where'd that money come from? KP's other companies, of course - including AOL and Netscape. -- and where'd they get the money for those - From Fairchild semi, as the parent poster suggests.

      So in the same follow-th

  • Maybe, but (Score:4, Insightful)

    by joss (1346) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @06:35AM (#17126900) Homepage
    Hiring mediocre people backfires a lot sooner than hiring only really smart
    people.

    The kind of people who will form their own companies will do so irrespective of whether they work for google first.
    • "The kind of people who will form their own companies will do so irrespective of whether they work for google first."

      But it's much easier with $100,000,000 of stock option money in the bank...
    • Re:Maybe, but (Score:5, Interesting)

      by jellomizer (103300) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @07:57AM (#17127488)
      But really smart people can also be mediocre people as well. It is a common misconception especially among geeks who place their status on intelligence. You could be the smartest person on Earth and still a Mediocre person/employee. Things like...

      1. Hubris, The ancient Geeks knew this, Jesus knew this. Almost all other major religion know this. But a lot of "Smart" People tend to ignore this. Excessive Pride is Bad MmKaaa. This closes your mind, it prevents you from listening to what the "Less Smart" People who are saying. Because you assume just because you are smarter then them that you ideas are always more correct. Which is wrong.

      2. Wisdom. The concept of wisdom is a rather nebulous concept. Wisdom comes from experience, and your own personal insight. It is a case where a 5 year old could solve the problem and not you. Just because the 5 year old just recently experience a similar concept during play. a lot of "Smart" people tend to limit themselves from experiences, Book Worms, Video games... So they do not gain as much wisdom as say someone who never went past high school but has explored the word.

      3. Work ethic. A lot of "Smart" People will just flat out refuse to do a job that is beneath them, past their confront zone, or just not in their area of specialty. Like a parson with a BS In Computer Science with a 4.0 GPA and a highly skilled programmer being ask to help out lay network cable from Data Center A to the the New Data Center which is 100M away. Or an Artificial Intelligence expert refusing to program a Database Query. Or Refusing to learn a new language that the company is moving to. Also there are the smart people who just stop working when it is not fun any more.

      4. Hunan Skills, Human skills are important because what ever your job is at some level it will used for the benefit of humans. And you cannot advance in your career without human skills.

      I am sure anyone who worked for Technical Support has realized People with PHD are the worse group of people to to Technical Support for. Because when they call you they are already embarrassed that they needed to call technical support because they think of themselves smart enough to fix the problem themselves with out the help of some 2 Year vocational school grad. Then when you do talk to them on the phone they are less then honest on following your instructions. Finally when you give them instructions they will not follow it. compared with Blue Collar Factory workers (Which I have learned are actually very smart people too) they are not afraid to call when the problem is minor and can get it fixed before it becomes major, they tell you exactly what they did, they follow your instruction on how to fix it. They also write them self a note on how to prevent it in the future.
        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by renoX (11677)
          >A piece of advice? Find another language to rant in, please.

          No the content of his post was insightful, if you're not able to ignore some minor spelling mistake (maybe it was late in his timezone, or he was in a hurry, etc), go away.

          Your post isn't insightful at all, the GP is right there are many different type of intelligence and being labelled smart doesn't mean that you have all these skills, only a few specialised.
  • With the large number of companies in general merging as part of their profit formula, I don't really see why these would do the opposite. Google has always tried to let their employees work quite freely and in the past let ideas from them turn into financed projects, so I really don't see what big gains there would be for them to split up.
  • What? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by DMouse (7320) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @06:48AM (#17126980)
    Right, lets role play here for a minute. I'm a phd coder employed at google. I have a good chunk of cash in google shares that will vest soonish. So I'm going to take that money and go and start a startup because?

    Which wally thought that the primary motivation for programmers was making money?

    Pretty much every study of programmers motivations i have ever read has shown them to be intrinsically motivated by the opportunity to solve puzzles, and to be able to hang out with birds of similar feather. The fact is that money isn't that much of a motivator for coders, provided there is sufficient to buy toys. The latest laptop. A 30" lcd into which to plug said laptop. A plasma telly and an xbox 360 on which to play halo.

    Starting up a company is risky, there is a bucket load of work to do that isn't coding, and you have to stop talking to all the other coders who you like chatting with at work. Wtf?

    Someone has NO CLUE how coders think. And this made it to the front page of slashdot how, exactly?
    • Re:What? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by GrumpySimon (707671) <email@simREDHATon.net.nz minus distro> on Wednesday December 06 2006, @07:06AM (#17127106) Homepage
      Exactly - google will start losing talented people only once they stop doing cool things. As long as they keep putting out new shiny toys, what geek wouldn't want to work there?
      • by repvik (96666)
        Not only do they keep doing the shiny toys, their employees also gets the respect they really earn from their co-workers. And a lot of fringe benefits.
    • I wasn't aware that coders were not human.

      You've got three or four full retirement's worth of vested stock. Almost* everybody has some cool thing they'd like to work on, and being independantly wealthy means you get to work on it whenever you want, not just 20% of the time you spend working for someone else for wages.

      There are some people who don't have cool projects they want to work on. Those people are generally uncreative and lack internal motivation, and probably are not on Google's roles. Oh, and thos
    • Maybe they want to do more interesting things than work out different ways to show ads to people?
  • You graduate TO google. The reason this will not happen is that people are still heading towards Google to make cool products. They will pay you to work on your own stuff at least 20% of the time, what better investment could you get?
    • by glwtta (532858)
      They will pay you to work on your own stuff at least 20% of the time, what better investment could you get?

      I think the reasoning is if you have a pile of money in Google stock, you might want to take that and start a company to work on your own stuff 100% of the time.
    • So, if I get this straight, your basic argument is "because something is a certain way right now, there's no way that will ever change." That is pretty clearly foolish. Just because "people are still heading towards Google to make cool products," this is no way means that this will continue.
  • Google seems to be doing fine. They are hiring the right people and those people seem to be eager to work at google. If they do enough to keep those smart people, which they seem to be doing then I don't see a problem. Google is going all out to add Mac support for all of their products and now even have a Mac blog from the developers. Even if some employees do leave I see that being a plus for the internet. Google knows what people on the internet want and it gives them that. Programs like Google earth and
  • I work for Google (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 06 2006, @08:30AM (#17127860)
    Going anon obviously.

    Two things -

    1. Academic != Smart. The amount of small minds here (particularly the worst kind; small minds with large egos) is unreal. Just because you have a PhD does not make you smart.

    2. Most Google employees are total sheep. They are the type of people who want to join a cult. This goes against everything business owners stand for.

    3. Setting up a business has nothing to do with being smart or academic. Only certain kinds of people (generally, the kind of people who like selling, i.e. not nerds) enjoy and succeed at setting up businesses.

    People totally overrate Google employees. It's funny/sad.
    • being "smart" (Score:3, Interesting)

      Unless we define "smart", this is just a silly thread. Being smart is much more than a set of metrics, as you suggest. Many programmers themselves are not even good at programming.

      Google is not Mensa. Mensa is not even Mensa. If Google really was stocked with geniuses, it would suggest that they a) know how to find geniuses, b) know how to lure geniuses, and c) know how to make geniuses work together for corporate success. Frankly, I do not believe that ANYONE can do it. It would take... genius. :o)

      Software
  • by suv4x4 (956391) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @09:00AM (#17128254)
    What a major plot twist.

    If Google is "too smart for it's own good", I suppose same people would say "Microsoft is too dumb for its own bad".

    Then suddenly it all makes sense. Right? Nope. But still good 'nuf for Slashdot, start the presses!
  • Remember Lucent (Score:3, Interesting)

    by carn1fex (613593) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @12:55PM (#17133002)
    My uncle lost a ton of money in Lucent because his philosophy for success centered around them having the highest percentage of staff with PhDs in the industry. Take heed?
  • by CAIMLAS (41445) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @02:11PM (#17134542) Homepage
    It could happen, but it probably won't. Here's why: Google's employees live better than kings.

    What do I mean? They've got a vast selection of food that they could want to eat; they have fairly undisciplined day schedules; they've got no overt worldly responsibilities. And, what's most important, they can spend their days however they want working on things that interest them. They may not be golfing or doing 'leasurely' activities, but most academic types don't care for those kinds of entertainment anyway.

    When you enjoy every activity of your day (well, at least 'almost') why would you throw it away to try and compete against such an environment?
    • by DarkSkiesAhead (562955) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @06:16AM (#17126788)
      Excuse me... (AKA Mod down at will, but,) English, motherfucker! Do you speak it.
      Small piece of advice: If you wish to complain about English usage, you will be taken more seriously if you can do so without an extra comma, a missing question mark, unnecessary capitalization, a misused ellipsis, and pointless cursing.

      Better luck next time,
      -DSA
    • Is your username cockney rhyming slang?
    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by arivanov (12034)
      Bollocks.

      AFAIK they still happily throw out 99.9%+ of all candidates tagged as potentials by their headhunters leaving only what they like. The "cannot hire" is when the candidates start to turn them down. This happened to Yahoo and their other major competitors very long ago. In fact as far as yahoo goes many people turn it down even before reading the job description to the end (for plenty of reasons).

      This is yet to happen to Google. I have yet to see a person who has been selected for an interview, had a
    • by TheJasper (1031512) on Wednesday December 06 2006, @07:13AM (#17127154)
      I agree completely. As I understand it you are even required to spend 20% of your time on your own project. One of the smartest people I know will probably go to Google soon, so I don't think they have a problem with hiring. As to spinoffs, sure maybe there will be some, which is a good thing too. However, if you get to work on your cool idea on company time, and get bonuses in relation to the succes of your project, why start up your own company. Do you want to become a manager who has to run a business, or do you want to play with your toys. Google works by making it profitable not to start your own company. Sure, you might not make 1 billion dollars with a brilliant idea, but who needs that much money? If google makes it that your brilliant idea earns you millions and does the boring admin and pays you to work on your next crackpot idea that may or may not work then why would you leave.
    • by BokLM (550487) *
      Why do people want a GoogleOS ? What can they do that other companies like RedHat or Mandriva can't do ?

      They can sure make a good OS, but other companies are aldready doing that, and I don't know what they could do much better than others.

      The thing they can do however, is use their large userbase, to make that OS known by its users. I think they're starting to do something like that for the web browser with Firefox. Maybe the next step will be the OS ?
    • I'm not sure how this got modded to insightful, since it shows a complete ignorance of stock valuation.

      Growth stocks trade on P/E (price/earnings per share) ratios, with people willing to pay premium above-market P/E ratios for stocks with premium growth rates. Slow the growth, and the price will drop because people will pay a lower P/E for slower growth. The absolute $ price per share of a stock has got NOTHING to do with it's value. 1M shares ar $500 or 10M shares at $50 would both give the same company v