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No Windows (Officially) On OLPC

Posted by kdawson on Thu May 03, 2007 07:42 AM
from the thinking-of-the-children dept.
Operating Systems Software Education Hardware
Kadin2048 writes "Despite reports last week in major news sources indicating that the One Laptop Per Child project was in negotiations with Microsoft to bring Windows XP to the low-cost platform, Walter Bender, president of Software and Content at OLPC, said in an interview with Ars Technica, 'We are a free and open-source shop. We have no one from OLPC working with Microsoft on developing a Windows platform for the XO.'"
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[+] Hardware: OLPC to Run Windows, Come to the US 350 comments
An anonymous reader writes "'Yesterday Nicholas Negroponte, former director of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology Media Lab and current head of the nonprofit One Laptop Per Child project, gave analysts and journalists an update on the OLPC project. Two big changes were announced — the $100 OLPC is now the $175 OLPC, and it will be able to run Windows. Even in a market where there are alternatives to using Windows and Office, there's a huge demand for Microsoft software. The OLPC was seen as a way for open source Linux distributions to achieve massive exposure in developing countries, but now Negroponte says that the OLPC machine will be able to run Windows as well as Linux. Details are sketchy but Negroponte did confirm that the XO's developers have been working with Microsoft to get the OLPC up to spec for Windows.' We also find out that the OLPC gets a price hike and will officially come to the US. Could this be tied into Microsoft's new $3 Windows XP Starter and Office 2007 bundle? Now that the OLPC and Intel's Classmate PC can both run Windows, is Linux in the developing world in trouble?"
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  • Makes a lot of the previous comments (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Timesprout (579035) on Thursday May 03 2007, @07:46AM (#18970907)
    re MS forcing the price of the OLPC up with their hardware requirements look very silly now doesn't it.

    • Re:Makes a lot of the previous comments (Score:5, Funny)

      by spencer4554 (661744) on Thursday May 03 2007, @08:04AM (#18971059)
      MS is at the root of all evils in the world. You look silly for not seeing the big picture here.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by DragonWriter (970822)
      All it really seems to say is that OLPC staff aren't working on porting Windows, which no one, that I recall, ever claimed. The project has, however, also stated [theregister.co.uk] that Qanta, the company that is building the computer for the project, is working with Microsoft on Windows for the computer.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Locutus (9039)
        I could see either an SD slot or the extra FLASH but both seem to provide the same feature of added storage space. And just because the chipset has the support, it's not free or cheap. The SD slot required a new case and planarboard layout and it opens the package to environmental incursions. But like I said, putting expanded onboard FLASH or removable FLASH provide the same function. As far as increasing system runtime memory from 128MB to 256MB goes, it's a toss up as to if this really buys you anything

  • Heh... (Score:4, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 03 2007, @07:49AM (#18970931)
    If there's one thing you can believe coming from the OLPC people, it's when they acknowledge that they don't have something!

  • 3 bucks? (Score:4, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 03 2007, @07:50AM (#18970943)

    Bender also indicated that Microsoft has not contacted OLPC regarding its $3 software bundling program, nor have any governments requested that the XO be outfitted with Windows.


    I'm sure Microsoft did contact them, and asked for $50 in licensing fees per unit to ship it with Windows Vista Crippled Edition Ultimate, so Bender told them to bite his shiny ass.

  • Open Software Would Be The Better Choice (Score:5, Insightful)

    by NeverVotedBush (1041088) on Thursday May 03 2007, @07:51AM (#18970949)
    I am glad to hear that it won't be Windows. Open software is a much better choice when you are trying to distribute low-cost computers to every child. Windows would have locked them into the Windows upgrade cycle, required frequent net access for updates, and would have just hidden a lot of the internals from the kids.

    Open software, while it also requires updates, gives them a much better platform on which to learn. They can explore *nix operating systems, add programs - almost always for free, plus it will build an open software user base around the world. Not that that isn't already happening as more and more countries and companies switch to open source software, but by bringing on a new generation, this will be the push to put open source over the top.

    • Spare me (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Shivetya (243324)
      Open software is a much better choice when you are trying to distribute low-cost computers to every child. Windows would have locked them into the Windows upgrade cycle, required frequent net access for updates, and would have just hidden a lot of the internals from the kids.



      Get real, these are not machines destined for upgrades and I seriously doubt a full blown version of windows would have ever be used.


      Besides, if you want to get nit picky. Windows delivers updates very easily and wholly hidden should y
      • They are more concerned with making sure these people can communicate with each other, receive information helpful to their daily lives (like weather)

        The OLPC is purely designed to be a teaching tool. That's it. This is the One Laptop Per CHILD program, not One Laptop Per Parent or Per Family. It has nothing to do with adults communicating with each other or checking the weather. It may be able to do that, but that's not what it is designed for. It will also never be a substitute for a real teacher, and is

      • Re:Open Software Would Be The Better Choice (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 03 2007, @08:09AM (#18971119)
        It's also a great way of ensuring that they never threaten the jobs of any of us in the first world, since they won't have a clue how to use the OS that 95% of our businesses use.

        Says the person who learns by rote. [wikipedia.org]

        I'm willing to bet these kids will be exposed to more OSs than you & know more about general computing concepts than you when they're twenty.

        The lucky kids will grow up with OLPC, be exposed to other linux flavours/Windows/OS X/whatever in other situations & end up know more about computer than you EVER will.

          • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

            by daem0n1x (748565)

            I use Linux exclusively at home. My wife, who is very far from being a computer geek, uses it for her everyday tasks, and she almost never notices the difference.

            So, for the majority of people, what's so special about Windows that will give them soooo much competitive advantage if they learn it instead of other platform?

      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        by Vihai (668734)

        Oh... but since they ARE the new generation, guess how much your clue will be useful when 95% of the business will use ANOTHER OS :)

        Anyway... don't worry... there is always market for "legacy systems support"

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by TheMeuge (645043)
          Something tells me that the people that the program is targeting are not going to be doing many spreadsheets for a Fortune500 company.
          • Something tells me that the people that the program is targeting are not going to be doing many spreadsheets for a Fortune500 company.

            Yeah, you say that now, but 10 or 15 years ago I bet you'd probably never have thought that some guy in Bangalore would be on the other end of the line when you called tech support...

          • Re:Open Software Would Be The Better Choice (Score:5, Insightful)

            by eno2001 (527078) on Thursday May 03 2007, @09:37AM (#18972323) Homepage Journal
            Looks like someone is assuming that the CIOs of the future are idiots. Only an idiot latches onto one single tool and eschews all others. I'm a 100% hardcore Linux guy, but I don't avoid Windows or Macintosh. Why? Because I can use them all completely and thoroughly to do whatever it is I need. How is it that I can navigate multiple OS platforms so easily? Because I have a clear understanding of what it is that the system is doing behind the scenes instead of just memorizing how an application works. Gimp? Photoshop? Same thing in my mind. CMD is just sh's retarded cousin. "My Computer"? Finder? Nautilus? Konqueror? All identical concepts in my mind. There is NO difference if you're not a moron. Now wake the fuck up, get to learning and quit posting worthless shit on the net you asswipe.
            • Amen to that. Every time I hear someone talk about "retraining" it makes me think of how shitty their training must have been in the first place.

            • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

              by Locutus (9039)
              That is the one thing I just can not get across to people who are afraid to try Linux instead of Windows. These people are having a very hard time keeping their systems running and many cases have paid over $200 a couple of times to have their systems completely rebuilt because of software problems. It seems that a very few actually understand the basic concepts and just memorize ways to do certain tasks. You wouldn't believe how many Windows users email me by finding an old email and clicking the 'reply'

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Silver Sloth (770927)
        I suppose it's inherrant in /. that you equate OS usage with job ability.

        The most important thing is that they are getting access to the internet, with all that that implies. As such it doesn't matter what OS they use, or realy which browser. But above and beyond that, anyone with any nous can swap between OS with little or no difficulty and it really doesn't matter if the office tools are M$ or OO, they both teach you how to use office tools.

        And, cost wise, if it's a choice between an affordable system w

      • Yet, they'll know how to use a OS that increases their productivity, not decreases it... They won't compete direcly with you on IT, but they'll (everything being the same) out-compete you on every other area that they are able to affect. And that includes the people how pay your salary.

        Of course, everything never stays the same. So, wait for big changes at the IT industry.

      • that's fine (Score:3, Insightful)

        by r00t (33219)
        The 1% of kids who care are the 1% who can do the most to power the economy. They are the ones worth supplying computers to, even at the effective $10000 per machine if you assume the other kids (99%) get no use out of their machines.

  • I don't see how this is any turnaround (Score:5, Informative)

    by AEton (654737) on Thursday May 03 2007, @07:56AM (#18970985)
    For unrelated reasons, I was reading the OLPC Wiki's Myths page [laptop.org] weeks ago and noticed this entry, which hasn't changed any in the time since:

    The proposed $100 machine will run a Microsoft Windows operating system
    True: Microsoft is working on a Windows based system that can be executed on the OLPC laptop. False: There is no strategy change. The OLPC is continuing to develop a Linux-based software set for the laptop in conjunction with Red Hat. But since the OLPC project is open we cannot (and maybe even don't want to) stop other people from developing and supplying alternate software packages.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by vhogemann (797994)
      Well...

      If Microsoft manage to fit a XP/Vista compatible OS inside the OLPC, I guess many people will be purchasing it to install on their desktops.. It would be perfect for a gaming machine!
      • It would be perfect for a gaming machine!

        Yeah, I can't wait to get a machine that's capable of playing Solitaire, Minesweeper, and FreeCell...
        • If it is XP/Vista compatible, probably it will be DirectX compatible too... It's just a matter of installing it on a full desktop computer.

      • Re:I don't see how this is any turnaround (Score:4, Informative)

        by jabuzz (182671) on Thursday May 03 2007, @08:36AM (#18971475) Homepage
        They changed the processor from a Geode GX1 which uses SDRAM to a faster Geode LX700 which uses less power and DDR memory. I would hazard a guess that the difference between 128MB of SDRAM and 256MB of DDR RAM is minimal, and it will make a difference to Linux.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by YU Nicks NE Way (129084)
        Here's a thought: perhaps the OLPC software does require the extra space? I'm really tired of the chronic mantra that "Linux/FreeBSD/whatever doesn't need memory/CPU speed/whatever" -- it's a classic piece of misdirection. Yes, Linux itself can run on a stripped-down system -- but GNU/Linux is a memory hog, particularly when GUI interfaces are involved.

        I think it's far more likely that Negroponte followed the lead of his brother who believed in flowers-and-candy welcomes on the basis of a serial con-man h

        • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

          by Jeff DeMaagd (2015)
          Go back to the early pieces on OLPC: how many people kept saying that (Nick) Negroponte was either deluded or lying about the cost, and that by the time it came out, the OLPC would cost almost exactly what a cheap laptop with Windows cost? Surprise -- that's exactly what happened.

          A cheap Windows notebook costs $175? Or am I missing something else? There aren't many notebooks under $500.

          Linux used to be able to operate in small spaces with low power requirements, the same with Windows, NT4 was very compact
      • *My* biggest question is "What are these kids actually going to DO with these computers anyway?" The sort of starry-eyed idealistic answer given by OLPC is basically "They're going to use educational software to learn, use the internet to better themselves, etc."

        But take a hard, realistic look at countries like Nigeria and THEIR experience [cnn.com] with an impoverished population gaining access to the internet. When poor Nigerians got access to the internet, they didn't use it to primarily to better themselves--th

      • Did you upgrade the XO just so "third party" software (OS) makers (MS) can release their software for your laptop? You dident deny it yet.

        Yeah, actually, they did. They've already said the hardware upgrades were because the countries that have signed on (Libya and Uruguay among them) asked for more RAM and a faster processor to increase the useful life of the computers. It's also worth noting that while this is portrayed as a huge price increase, when the initial countries were signing on, the estimated cos

  • Does it matter ? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by ceroklis (1083863) on Thursday May 03 2007, @08:10AM (#18971145)
    They may not be collaborating with Microsoft on this issue, but this is not going to prevent Microsoft from porting Windows to the XO and trying to sell it (or give it away) to the governments that will purchase the laptops.

    I am sure some countries will be more than happy to get cheap laptops on one side and then install Windows on them in exchange for a large discount from Microsoft for their government's Windows/Office licenses on the other. Thailand, I am looking at you.

    Some countries involved in the program are serious about free software, but I am afraid others are just looking for a bargain. Not to be pessimistic but I will wait to see what happens before considering the OLPC project as an incredible boon for free software, like some people here.

    • More specifically, and along the lines of previous commenter Aelion, OLPC itself (as Bender says) is not working on getting it installed, but they have given MS some test OLPC laptops to play with. I guess it depends on how you define "collaboration"
    • >They may not be collaborating with Microsoft on this issue, but this is not going to prevent Microsoft from porting Windows to the XO and trying to sell it (or give it away) to the governments that will purchase the laptops.

      So? What ever happened to freedom to innovate and freedom to tinker? Oh right, that doesnt apply when you use MS (or whoever is the bad guy nowadays) software. Maybe it should only run signed code to keep the boogeyman away. Is the DIY/tinker ethic just for FOSS now? How much of t

      • What ever happened to freedom to innovate and freedom to tinker?

        It was killed by the Xbox lockdown hardware.

  • But everyone knows having a Windows OS teaches a child invaluable lessons in stress management!

  • That's too bad (Score:3, Informative)

    by lakiw (1039502) on Thursday May 03 2007, @08:18AM (#18971253)
    I was looking forward to using the "show code" button on Windows.

    BTW, yes there is an actual "show code" button on the keyboard. It's really cool. You can edit the code of most of the included applications and apply changes on the fly. I know it's for kids, but I REALLY want one of these laptops. Check it out at www.laptop.org

    • Re:That's too bad (Score:4, Interesting)

      by TheRaven64 (641858) on Thursday May 03 2007, @08:37AM (#18971485) Homepage Journal
      Why don't you check out Squeak [squeak.org] for your desktop or laptop. There's even an OS in progress that runs Squeak on the bare metal [squeak.org], with bootstrapping code in assembly and everything else in Squeak. Everything in Squeak is an object, including pixels in the frame buffer, and can have its code inspected and modified at run time. It should come as no surprise that Alan Kay is heavily involved with both projects.
  • putting WinXP in OLPC would be like trying to stuff a hippopotamus in to a compact car...

    • Re:i hope windows does not get in OLPC (Score:4, Informative)

      by madhatter256 (443326) on Thursday May 03 2007, @08:31AM (#18971405)
      There is TinyXP. it takes up 400mbs, and requires at least 40mb RAM. Google it as it will come up with information about it, and also download links. I'm sure posting links like that are violation of the rules here on slashdot, so I won't take that chance.
  • So much for OLPC for having its potential buyers in getting to use software that the majority of the world uses.

    I think this project is a waste of resources. Why build new and crippled systems (hardware-wise) and sell it to third world countries and call it a humanitarian service when there are thousands of old computers that are in working condition, capable of running XP and other modern software, but are not being used at all or are being thrown out. We could be saving a ton of resources if we just had a
    • define crippled and non-standard.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by ajs318 (655362)
      The OLPC is not designed for that. Passing on our cast-offs to someone who can use them is one thing, and it's not necessarily a bad thing in and of itself (unless it ends up overloading the electricity / telecoms infrastructure or mucking up established working practices) but OLPC aims to be something radically different.

      The ultimate aim is for some future revision of the OLPC design to be manufactured in the third world for use in the third world, thus breaking their dependency on the West. In order
  • I mean, I believe Windows still has a place in various environments where it's hard to find competing well-tried products, but if there's some environment I can't understand why one would use it, it's in aids for development nations. They don't need the hottest nVidia drivers for gaming, they don't need advanced CAD applications for construction, they just need the standard stuff, that many Linux distros today offers perfectly fine. They can even get full office suites, and then I think they're starting to

  • I hate Windows as much as the next person... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by PinkyDead (862370) on Thursday May 03 2007, @09:40AM (#18972367) Journal
    ...but that lack of Windows on the OLPC could be an issue.

    Mainly because your average Joe Schmo is absolutely convinced that Windows is a program for writing letters on, or something equally stupid. The lack of interoperability with the rest of the world (however stupid the rest of the world is) puts people at a serious disadvantage.

    For instance, we all know that ODT is the superior document format, but try giving one to someone (in the Joe Schmo category) who only uses Word. They look at you as if you had two heads. Same thing is actually quite common for the pdf format (I'm telling you, it happens).

    The OLPCs are not going to people who are sitting on the side of a ditch oblivious of the wider IT world. They will have heard of Windows, and they will want to know why they are getting this 'second-rate' linux thingy. When they do business they will do it with some idiot who is blissfully unaware of anything outside of Office.

    I wouldn't for one second suggest that Windows should be shipped with the OLPC. But there are perception issues that must be dealt with.

    I'm reminded of the film 'The Shipping News' - when asked what kind of computer he wants, Quoyle says 'an IBM'. He didn't know whether it was any good or not, he just knew that it was the 'right' answer. And unfortunately, at the moment 'Microsoft' is the 'right' answer.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by pembo13 (770295)
      What is the people receiving these machines don't have this ridiculous bias towards Windows?

    • Re:Good to know (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Bob54321 (911744) on Thursday May 03 2007, @08:06AM (#18971077)
      It is interesting to see that choice is good, unless someone may have the choice to install software from Microsoft. I know when I get a new computer, I like having the choice to run windows.

      Given who the laptops are going to, my guess is that Microsoft would have to give away any version of windows that actually ran on the computer. It is not as if the owners a going to have spare money lying around to buy a license.

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by TheRaven64 (641858)
        Microsoft offered at the start to provide free-beer (mmm, free beer) licenses for Windows to the project. In the volumes these are expected to be manufactured, they will be a sizeable percentage (not a majority, but a noticeable proportion) of the total installed base in the next few years, and they would really like to keep hold of that. The decision was made that the entire project should be open.

        One of the aims of the project is that local industries in developing countries will be able to start mak

      • It's also very tricky for Microsoft, Vista monster would not run on that laptop while XP will cease to be "manufactured" at the end of this year.... what Windows do they intend to use? CE?

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