Slashdot Log In
Is It Windows 7, Or KDE 4?
Posted by
timothy
on Fri Feb 06, 2009 08:20 AM
from the spy-vs.-spy dept.
from the spy-vs.-spy dept.
An anonymous reader writes "Is it Windows 7 or KDE 4? In this video, ZDNet takes to Sydney's streets to find out what people think of what they think is a Windows 7 demonstration. The results are surprising." Or maybe they're not surprising at all.
Related Stories
[+]
Microsoft's "Mojave Experiment" Teaser Site Goes Live 464 comments
MojoKid writes "Earlier this week, Microsoft was reported to be arranging a kind of 'blind taste test' to get die-hard Windows XP users to try Vista. They were told that they were trying a new OS, called Mojave. The report went on to suggest that users liked the OS, though they were actually running Vista. Now it appears Microsoft has put up a
teaser site, with
plans to show the actual video footage next week. Though the footage should at least have some entertainment
value, it would be a bit of a reach to expect that the test methodologies were
real-world enough such that users had to deal with things like user account
control, driver updates, and broad application compatibility."
Submission: Is it Windows 7 or KDE 4? by Anonymous Coward
This discussion has been archived.
No new comments can be posted.
The Fine Print: The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. We are not responsible for them in any way.
not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Insightful)
9/10 people polled also couldn't tell the difference between rabbit shit and deer shit.
And nine out of ten couldn't tell the difference between your statistics and bullshit.
That said it is a useful comparison.
Someone who is just walking in the woods probably cannot tell rabbit shit from deer shit. A tracker or someone dependent on hunting for food certainly will.
Someone who just needs to run a browser and word processor probably can't tell Windows 7 from KDE. Someone who needs to configure and administrate systems for an organisation certainly will.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Interesting)
Someone who just needs to run a browser and word processor probably can't tell Windows 7 from KDE. Someone who needs to configure and administrate systems for an organisation certainly will.
True.
I actually had a long argument with my SO about Linux vs. Windows issue. My main point was this: whenever she experiences any trouble she still complains to me, and for me it is much easier to deal with Linux. So she gave it a try and it all went OK to her own surprise, she had no troubles using FF, Gimp and Pidgin.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
I have the opposite problem. My wife won't touch linux but still wants to use my PC.
Then she gripes that it doesn't "automatically log in" or gives me the "we should share passwords".
I say to her, "Do you know shit about Linux?" "no" "THEN YOU DON'T NEED MY PASSWORD FOR SHIT".
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Insightful)
Dude she just wants your password to check your email and make sure you don't have anyone on the side :)
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Meh
I linked my porn stash to a directory called .secret in my girlfriend's home dir.
She thinks she's clever for having found it, and gets some great ideas from the porn. It's a win-win.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Or it would be, if you had a girlfriend.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Or it would be, if you had a girlfriend.
#include <stdyourmom>
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Careful, sledgehammers need no passwords.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Nah, the dead can't talk.
You know anything about putting my honda back together?
Parent
Set her up on another VT... (Score:5, Interesting)
I set up my wife on my PC on another virtual terminal - (ctl-alt-F8), it automatically logs her in on boot-up, and whenever she needs "her" stuff, it's all there for her. With all her own passwords. Plus, my "stuff" remains untouched - so whether I'm downloading torrents, or in the middle of composing an email, wp, graphic, presentation...it's all still there when she's done (ctl-alt-F7, back to me)
Simple.
cheers,
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
This is why I have no problem with my GF running windows. If it breaks, I don't know what to do with it anyway, so it's not my problem.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Insightful)
References to Windows are one of the only times I see geeks proudly proclaiming their ignorance....It's just an OS by a company, not some insane enemy to be avoided at all cost =/
Hence "itsatrap" on every article about Microsoft supposed altruism.
They are the enemy, they declared it many, many times! The everyone-not-Windows crowd might not have a problem with Microsoft (and therefor Windows) If they didn't have so much history of UI/feature theft, assimilation of over a hundred of corporations, investing in corporations like SCO to assault the public image of Linux, claiming Open Source is dangerous and will destroy computing... Jesus, it's like a monkey throwing shit at you. You know the monkey's just doing what it does but you'll never in your right mind appreciate it.
Actually, let me make a much more concise attempt at responding to your comment.
References to Windows are one of the only times I see geeks proudly proclaiming their ignorance....It's just an OS by a company, not some insane enemy to be avoided at all cost =/
THE FUCK IT AIN'T.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Interesting)
My wife does digital scrapbooking. She was using a cheapo scrapbooking app, but started to find it too limiting. She started to insist on a purchase of Photoshop, which I resisted. So she got the free trial version, played with it for 30 days and loved it. I asked her to give gimp the same 30 days, and she did. We never did make that Photoshop purchase - she has managed to find gimp tutorials online and even a dead-tree book that has all sorts of hints, tips, and ideas for gimp. Now she does all her scrapbooking in gimp. Maybe I'll be able to sneak a switch over to Gentoo from XP on her box now. :-)
She's no techie, she's artistic. (NOT AUtistic, ARtistic.) Took a bit to get over the learning curve to the point where she was productive, but it wasn't terribly worse than the learning curve for Photoshop.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Interesting)
Same experience here with The Gimp. As long as SO hasn't become entrenched in using a particular non-free application, she grasps new free apps easily. I hadn't expected her to get used to the gimp (as every gimp article on /. might have you think) as quickly as she did. Perhaps not being English helps in this case :)
Getting her switched from Microsoft Office however is a different story. Having used it for years, she was wary about OOo and balked about not being able to find various options easily.
It goes to show that moving users from what they are comfortable with is a difficult process. If the new app doesn't have a clear win (Firefox + AdBlock for instance) users won't switch easily. But if the user is new to the domain, they will try it with an open mind and learn quickly.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Wait, are you saying that your wife does NOT live in her own little world AND effectively communicates her wants/needs? I'm not sure you appreciate the full magnitude of your discovery, sir. Please.. go on.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't confuse the fact that women remember what shoes another woman was wearing 3 years ago in March with some sort of all-encompassing perception of reality, because it's not. And seriously, when's the last time a woman ever told you exactly what she really wanted or needed? The only time that happens is right before or after a fight/breakup, because they're so upset that you didn't know to begin with. "You should have known I wanted you to vacuum upstairs because I left the vacuum cleaner sitting in the middle of the floor!"
My bad.. I just thought you left the vacuum out.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Informative)
I'm sure that most people will see the difference when trying to install a game, sync their PDA (with the instruction on their constructor webpage not matching what they see on their screen) or try to open the crappy humor Powerpoint filling their mailboxes. No need to be a admin to see a subtle difference between linux and windows if you don't have a diligent kid/friend that take care of every single installation problem for you.
This video reminds me of all those "infomercial" showing the latest innovation in carpet cleaning or kitchen robot ...
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Interesting)
From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mojave_Experiment#Reception [wikipedia.org]
"Participants weren't asked to work with peripheral devices (such as printers or scanners), nor were they asked about compatibility with older software or hardware.[4] Participants did not have an opportunity to try the software themselves[2], but were only demonstrated certain features by a salesman."
So while calling it Mojave prevented the bad hype from geeks, they still showed it to people in a very limited capacity that didn't actually show any of the things that were being criticized. Mojave proved very little, and this video is sort of analogous to that.
With as much certainty as the Mojave Experiment provided us with, this video demonstrates that Linux and KDE are indeed desktop ready and 100% compatible With windows. It's only when you tell users that it's not Windows that they start believing the M£ propaganda and claim that all of a sudden they can't run GTA4.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
that's because 9 out of 10 statistics are made up 73% of the time.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
Bucking for some informative karma I've tracked down some visual aids for our comparison:
Windows 7 [redbubble.net]
KDE 4 [photobucket.com]
Your welcome.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Funny)
I consider myself fairly computer literate and I can't tell the difference between Windows Vista and Windows Vista.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Insightful)
I think it would be more accurate to say that "people, outside their area of expertise, are generally clueless"
I consider myself somewhat of a Renaissance Man--I program, write, fiddle with electronics, skeet shoot, draw, wrench on my motorcycle, play a musical instrument or two, do carpentry and so forth. I find it moderately amusing to hear geeks who wouldn't know their way around an engine compartment tell auto mechanics that they're clueless--or nerds who can't carry a tune in a bucket tell musicians the same.
It's important to keep in mind (perhaps especially here on /.) that the average person isn't a computer expert. They use the computer the same way they use a car, or a stereo, or a blender--they don't necessarily understand (or care about) the differences between models, they just want something that works.
Parent
Re:not surprising (Score:5, Insightful)
Right, but how many people go around saying "Oh, I never drive a BrandA cars, I've always driven BrandB cars. I wouldn't even know how to drive a BrandA. The buttons might be in the wrong place, or the shift lever might be at the rear passenger door. I just wouldn't know where anything was?" I've heard the strangest reasons for not switching to Linux. One was simply "The Start button looks too different." Yes, the start button was enough to scare them. Heaven forbid that they ever get in a car that had the gear shift on the wheel column instead of the floor.
No, the reason tech people say non-computer people are clueless about computers is because the ones that stick out in our memory are so willfully clueless. They are the ones who would get in any car and find the buttons they need, but change the color of an icon on the computer and they are lost. The blender breaks and they buy what ever one is on sale, but when they need to check their email they "Only know how to use OutLook Express. What is this 'webmail thing' you are talking about?" And stereos, geez, Talk about moving the buttons around, every one I've ever owned had the volume dial in a different place. But the volume icon in KDE is right next to the clock, same as windows normally, and most of these 'clueless' users wouldn't want to find it. They would rather just complain that 'it doesn't look the way I remember it.' I don't know what it is about computers that induces this autistic-like behavior, but that's exactly what it looks like.
I settled the issue with my parents. I told them that unless they could name an application they wanted to use that I could not get them under Linux, then the next time they wanted their computer fixed it was getting Linux installed. A nice windows-like theme and KDE, sure, I'd go ahead and do that for them, but I was not supporting windows. My mother actually asked me to pirate her a windows CD, just because she didn't want to 'learn a whole new computer'. I handed her my laptop and asked her what she thought, and she thought it was a "nice windows theme, but that wasn't linux. I've seen linux, that's where you type away in that little text box with no pictures."
Now they run Kubuntu, and the only problem they've had is that the LTS version hasn't updated firefox in ages. Next time they ask about it, they get moved from LTS to stable, which frightens them. I can't wait till they ask again and get moved to bleeding edge nightly builds.
Parent
I fell for it.... (Score:5, Funny)
I'll admit I fell for it. But in my defense, they showed it to me in the morning and I was really tired that morning for some reason. It's like someone switched out my usual high quality Columbian coffee with Folgers or something that day.
It should be labeled under "fun", not "kde" (Score:5, Insightful)
I mean; even the editors themselves state that there isn't any conclusion to be drawn here; "we've learned nothing" because there simply are too many factors to consider. People don't know Windows 7 or people don't know KDE. Or people don't really care at all. So; fun movie, move along.
Thats it just show the eye candy. (Score:5, Insightful)
Any OS can look impressive when you find a demo that shows off all the eye candy to its full extent. You could have shown these people DWM configured nicely they would think it would be the next generation OS, UI. Vista got good visual reviews too. The problem is when you start working with it, things change. KDE and GNOME while have a rather niced polished UI, you still need to do things the Unix/Linux way. The same with windows no matter what you do to the UI it is still windows and need to work with it.
What I find really funny comparing Windows/Gnome/KDE with a Mac. The Mac actually has a lot less eye candy, yet perception has it as having more.
Re:Thats it just show the eye candy. (Score:5, Interesting)
My favorite piece of eye candy was the "static" when opening the photo.
When the hell is somebody going to fix that, and whos fault is it?
X? WM? Graphics Driver?
it's getting old.
Parent
Folgers... (Score:5, Funny)
The two guys' bottom line is nearly correct (Score:5, Interesting)
Still a nice little laugh, that video.
Re:The two guys' bottom line is nearly correct (Score:5, Interesting)
Parent
Re:The two guys' bottom line is nearly correct (Score:5, Insightful)
I think I learned quite a bit. I learned that when you get people in front of a camera talking about your product, they don't really pay very much attention to what they are seeing. If you look like a representative of the company, most people are going to say kind things.
Which to me, says an awful lot about the Mojave Experiment. It doesn't really matter what people say they think in that setting. It matters what they think when they install the OS on their own computer, and for Vista that hasn't been very good.
It also makes me question the effectiveness of usability labs I've sat through in the process of developing software for corporations. It's a painful process, and now I wonder if it is very accurate at all.
Parent
"I use Windows iMac" (Score:5, Informative)
So what does this experiment show? That people just aren't computer savvy.
But no punchline... (Score:5, Interesting)
At the end, they should have said:
"Have you ever heard of Linux?"
"What have you heard?"
"What you say if I told you this was Linux and not MS-Windows?"
bait and switch and switch... (Score:5, Informative)
I started the video, and it stuttered, and started over... with an actual demonstration of Windows 7. I had to reload the page to get the KDE4 prank video.
Was that supposed to be some kind of Zen test?
Re:Is KDE4 actually usable yet? (Score:5, Informative)
Yeah, 4.2 is far, far better than 4. I use it and love it!
Parent
Re:Is KDE4 actually usable yet? (Score:5, Informative)
I blame the distro. They should not have made KDE4 the default so early - they should have stuck with KDE 3 until at least 4.2.
AS far as I can remember KDE 4.0 was well know not to be really ready.
Parent
KDE4 user (Score:5, Informative)
I've been using KDE4 since openSUSE started including the previews.
I felt the KDE team (and Suse) had, to be polite, been rather dishonest about it.
I don't know but to me it always seemed clear that the 4.0 was more a "early tester" release.
By now KDE4.2 is starting to get really usable and really configurable and could be used by more casual users.
Sure, if you have tons finely tuned stuff in KDE3.5, you'll really miss them.
But KDE4.2 offers enough basic functionality to be usable by most people.
Is it worthwhile looking at it yet or should I just stick to 3.5 for the forseable future.
If you don't depend on highly specific KDE3.5 customisations,
or if you're ready to spend time re-tuning everything again in a slightly different way,
then KDE4.2 is definitely worth giving a try.
On the other hand if you absolutely require the same level of ultra smooth-polished user experience that KDE3.5 offers, you'd better stick with the KDE3.x branch for now and probably wait until somewhere around the KDE4.5 version. (maybe just giving quick shot to KDE4.3 and 4.4 just to watch progress).
Ditto for KDE5.x in a couple of years : stay with KDE4.5 until that one matures. ;-)
Parent
Re:eye candy (Score:5, Insightful)
Am I the only one who doesn't want eye candy these days?
Don't get me wrong, I don't want the look of Pre-OSX Mac or early Unix operating systems, or windows 3.1... I don't want things that are painful to look at. Just a simple, quiet appearance that doesn't distract me from what I'm doing.
I can get that in Windows and KDE 3.5. I can get it in Gnome.
Vista screwed the UI, and I can't get it there (I can come close, but they made some things use the same colors, while in earlier versions of windows, they used different colors - such as input fields and non-input page backgrounds. Windows 7 hasn't fixed this.
KDE 4, MacOSX, Windows 7, Windows Vista... Too much bling and not enough customisation in the UI for me.
Parent
Re:eye candy (Score:5, Informative)
Xfce is your friend.
I use Xubuntu. Plain, clear, simple and *fast*. 8.10 runs out of the box everything on my ThinkPad laptop including Bluetooth. Get it.
Parent
Re:eye candy (Score:5, Funny)
You'll buy KDE4?!?!
I've got this pirate copy of KDE4.2... It's much cheaper than the original.
Parent
Re:eye candy (Score:5, Funny)
That's a bug in your legal system. I heard you recently voted a new president who may submit a patch.
Then again, your system is so broken you may want to consider a ground up re-write.
Parent
Re:eye candy (Score:5, Informative)
Can I legally play a DVD on a Linux box in the US?
Yes.
Ask Dell. They now include a closed source DVD player app to cover this niggle. The rest of the world uses the free codecs and the libdvdcss library just fine.
Another Linux roadblock gone eh.. Soon people will have to come up with real arguments.
Parent
Re:eye candy (Score:5, Insightful)
"Another Linux roadblock gone eh."
How about Blu-Ray?
Parent
Re:eye candy (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
Re:eye candy (Score:5, Insightful)
Mod parent up. Almost all attacks against eye candy are based on a false dicothomy between beauty and functionality. Wobbly windows are not useful? Well, probably neither is your wallpaper. Or the painting on your house. Or good-looking clothes. And as much as it may sound surprising, woobly windows do not get in my way, I like them and nowadays I feel unconfortable when I have to use another system that does not have them. Different people, different tastes.
Going all "eh, I prefer functionality" is like ignoring a incredibly hot girl because "since she's beautiful, she's probably dumb". One thing does not exclude the other, specially considering Compiz/KWin are remarkably fine-tunable.
Parent
Re:Welcome to Niggerbuntu (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent