3G Cel Service Starts in Japan 225
Graymalkn writes "According to this story on the BBC, DoCoMo has finally launched the world's first 3G cellular service in Japan. Phones start at $560 and can go as high as $800 for one which can double as a video camera." Eventually they'll be able to watch movies on the new phones, but for now service for the phones is limited to a 20 mile radius around the center of Tokyo. I haven't found an exact number of bandwidth, but I believe it's like 384k downlink. To your phone. Once again, my jealousy runs rampant.
Fun! (Score:1, Funny)
Good Lord (Score:1)
Although it will be a great watching the Fifth Element during my Political Science class. Hmmm... This applys to government... By having government in it. ^_^
1 hour battery life (Score:4, Flamebait)
Re:1 hour battery life (Score:4, Informative)
That article merely says that it heats up after 15 minutes (i.e. It doesn't say that it overheats. My laptop heats up pretty wickedly but it still works). Every technology has to start somewhere. This will give them the capital to make v2 that has a long battery life and is commercially accepted.
Re:1 hour battery life (Score:2)
Not to be too much of a troll, but would you buy a new phone for several hundred bucks (or several thousand yen) with one hour of battery life? Or would you, like most people, wait till rev 2? Where is the capital going to come from? According to reports, they hope to sign up 60 million users by next year. Might be tough when almost every Japanese has a working phone and the 3G stuff is just a little too "new". Just my thoughts.
Re:1 hour battery life (Score:2, Informative)
The article says "heats up," not "overheats." (Score:1)
Re:1 hour battery life (Score:1)
Re:1 hour battery life (Score:1)
Re:1 hour battery life (Score:1, Informative)
Serious question (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:Serious question (Score:1, Troll)
Just another manifestation of the BIG LIE of American technological superiority.
Re:My, what a slanted view... (Score:1)
Re:My, what a slanted view... (Score:1)
If you've got one user, what does it take to upgrade her? If you have 10, how much more work is it? (probably more than 10x)
Also, if you have one unit area to cover with transmitters, you just have to replace the one transmitter (plus a backup?). If you have 1000, you have to lay out a lot more money. And this part is probably the biggest deal.
Re:My, what a slanted view... (Score:2)
Also, it's nothing to do with the fact that public education in the US is so crappy you have to import foreigners from ineffective "socialist" countries just to keep the infrastructure from falling apart. Your engineers/scientists are mostly second generation Americans or foreigners. Upper echelon natives become lawyers, bankers, or PHBs. Lower echelon Americans become ??? but not engineers. Somehow India and Russia can afford to churn out 100000s of competent engineers a year, but America is too efficient to do that. It's more efficient to let those silly socialists have state subsidised college education. That way the US can keep corporation taxes low, but make sure there are enough techs to keep things running. It's great - the owners get very rich. It leaves ordinary Americans on the slag heap, but who cares about that.
No, it's because America is just too big, after all it's always the smaller counties with advanced technology, those little Carribean states must have teleporters by now.
Re:Serious question (Score:2)
Sorry, you lost me there. Who doesn't have fixed price broadband? I can't speak for Asia, but I know in Sweden broadband is everywhere - and I have never seen it for anything but fixed price. Generally speaking you are talking about 250 SEK (25 USD) for 512k down.
There are providers who don't even bother with DSL or cable. Take www.tele2.se and www.bredbandsbolaget.com who are installing ethernet connections to homes. I have one in mine - a little socket beside the front door. According to Bredbandsbolaget it will go live this month. Oh and they cost 495 SEK (49.5 USD) setup and 200 SEK (20 USD) per month.
long term thinking (Score:3, Insightful)
Wow, that statement really illustrates how Japanese think in the long term.
I hope, for their sake, that they can run legacy networks over the new backbone.
Re:long term thinking (Score:1)
I hope, for their sake, that they can run legacy networks over the new backbone.
If they freely make forecasts like this, then it's pretty obvious that they have some plan in place for legacy stuff.
Re:long term thinking (Score:3, Interesting)
I got Sprint PCS when digital service was pretty new (3-4 yrs ago?) and the reception was crystal clear... as long as I stood still and did some funky yoga moves to align the antenna. The service is much better in NJ and NY today. Based on that timeline, 3G service in the US won't be any good until at least 2006.
Sure....! (Score:1, Redundant)
ALL I have to do is- give up any sense of privacy in my whereabouts to Government (big brother) Agencies....
As cool as it sounds, as much as I've wanted to have video phone, I think I will have to PASS.
No thanks.
As if they care (Score:1)
3G (Score:3, Interesting)
By the way, the phone's price will be less - networks subsidise the handset manufacturer's prices, based on the idea that you will spend craploads of cash when you actually use the phone.
Re:3G - Tangent (Score:1)
This whole cell tower situation reminded me of this little story, because it's the small portion of the community that cares wether there are cell towers around that actually expend the effort to get elected to some crappy local government position. Most of the time they run uncontested, or against someone with the same obnoxious opinions that are so unpopular that they only way that they can get what they want is by running for local office and winning. They are usually opposed to any change to their town because it wouldn't be that same as where they grew up anymore so they stand in the way of all proposals wether they are good or bad. Maybe if we had direct representation on the local level for issues like this things would be better (I know in my area that there are more people that want the new cell services then people who don't want the antennas), but if people don't care enough about these issues to speak up or go to town meetings, then they probably wouldn't go to vote either... Then again maybe town governments elsewhere aren't as screwed up as where I live.
Between the houses on Main street not getting painted because they can't figure out which color is 'historically appropriate', and the crappy cell coverage I'm starting to get a little pissed off. At this rate we'll either be stuck in whatever time period they deem historically apropriate and not make any progress, or the town will slowly decay due to process delays.
I love Japan! (Score:1)
Re:I love Japan! (Score:1)
And don't get me started on our superior automobile technology!
Re:I love Japan! (Score:2)
Re:I love Japan! (Score:1)
b) No matter how advanced you think your latest toy is, there is always something more advanced in the Tokyo stores.
One of my favourite pastimes when I lived there was to go to the first floor of the Yamagiwa main store in the Akihabara electric district to oogle the new toys that wouldn't show up in the States for months if ever.
Re:I love Japan! (Score:1)
Re:I love Japan! (Score:1)
and they don't give out as many *free gifts*
when you buy stuff.
Now Ishimaru denki is where I used to shop
for electronics (non-computer/PC) Got a great
deal on a Yamaha AV AMP. Funny thing was, it
was discontinued and still more advanced
than the models in the US, at the time I bought it
Ah Sigh, I MISS Japan.. Kaeritai!
Whoop Dee Doo (Score:3, Offtopic)
No need to be jealous...
Take a piece of large paper. Cut a hole in it 1.5" by 2.25". Cover your monitor with this piece of paper. Now start using your computer like this and you will experience things just as if you had this service on a cell phone in your neck 'o the woods.
Re:Whoop Dee Doo (Score:4, Interesting)
Take a piece of large paper. Cut a hole in it 1.5" by 2.25". Cover your monitor with this piece of paper. Now start using your computer like this and you will experience things just as if you had this service on a cell phone in your neck 'o the woods.
Step out from under that rock you've been living, and take a look at this cable I have here which connects my phone to my laptop for a wireless, high-speed connection. They've already got these for regular cell phones. Do you honestly think they are very far behind for 3G phones?
Even better.. (Score:2)
ir.. even better.. (Score:2)
http://www.djw.org/information/palm8290.html [djw.org]
Re:Whoop Dee Doo (Score:1)
I thought they were going to bluetooth everything together? You'd bluetooth for your LAN with your phone, PDA, and laptop, and the phone would go 3G out to the outside world to provide access to all of your devices.
Re:Whoop Dee Doo (Score:1)
300k is wasted on a mobile! (Score:1)
Not in North America... (Score:3, Interesting)
Yes, GPRS *is* happening (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Yes, GPRS *is* happening (Score:5, Interesting)
Actually, america currently lags behind europe in mobile technology - partly because the americans had a bout of NIH syndrome the first time round (remember the GSM-works-everywhere-but-the-US fiasco), and partly because they have a rather lower population density.
European firms could have jumped straight to 3G, but all firms concerned got together and decided that it would be more profitable to force consumers through an extra upgrade cycle, so switched their attention to 2.5G, which is the Windows ME of the phone world.
Re:Yes, GPRS *is* happening (Score:2)
Re:Yes, GPRS *is* happening (Score:2)
Sure. Read my lips: not GPRS in the US yet. We're too busy developing the disposable cellphone to lower the costs of changing carriers. The upshot? Once we DO have wireless broadband, it will be on paper phones that you cut out from the back of Kellogg's Corn Flakes.
Re:Yes, GPRS *is* happening (Score:1)
Actually, AT&T is piloting GPRS in the Seattle area now. Search slashdot or google to find more info - I'm too lazy.
Jenova_Six
Re:Not in North America... (Score:2)
Also, larger cell phone companies like Sprint, Verizon, etc, are beginning to test their CDMA2000 networks, I'm sure too, which (according to theory) will provide significantly higher data rates and better voice clarity.
Re:Not in North America... (Score:2, Informative)
Suprised that went unnoticed so long...
is it going to catch on ... (Score:1)
understandable, when you think of the kind of money involved here.
so the question remains. are people going to make the investment or not.
as good and cool is this sounds, right now i wouldn't!
what's your take on that?
Tom
Re:is it going to catch on ... (Score:1)
It'll be a while I guess... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:It'll be a while I guess... (Score:1)
What are your data for that? It costs 8 cents a minute to call from Sweden to Missouri, while it costs ~12-15 cents a minute to call long-distance within Missouri! Phone service is $15/month in Sweden, here in Missouri it is more like $30-40!
Existing infastructure? (Score:1)
correction on retail prices (Score:3, Informative)
The standard model costs about 48,000 yen ($400) while the fancier video model costs about 68,000 yen ($570). The data model can be had for about 28,000 yen ($235).
Why do I want to watch a movie on my cellphone? (Score:4, Insightful)
Theory: it was recently demonstrated that multi-tasking causes the human brain to be less efficicent. An increasing tendancy to do more than one thing at a time will lead to an overall reduction in the productivity of humanity. Because the time we spend will be less productive we will have to spend more time partially working in order for us to achieve the same output. This will lead to more multi-tasking. Wash, Rinse, Repeat...
Re:Why do I want to watch a movie on my cellphone? (Score:1)
Video calls...mmm...just waiting for family to get cable modem, I've got 2 megabits here + camera, let the fun begin...
Shhhh! (Score:1)
Re:Why do I want to watch a movie on my cellphone? (Score:1, Informative)
well...
Re:Why do I want to watch a movie on my cellphone? (Score:2)
Re:Why do I want to watch a movie on my cellphone? (Score:1)
Re:Why do I want to watch a movie on my cellphone? (Score:2)
Once the data is flowing around, you can do anything with it.
bandwidth... (Score:2)
However, once the spectrum disputes are over and the major players are back to their money-grubbing game, i'm guessing 144 kbps - 320 kbps would be the entry level bandwidth here in the states, mostly because it would require the least amount of transitional work in the packet switching department...
Meanwhile... (Score:5, Insightful)
Meanwhile much of the rest of the world struggles to get clean water and electricity. Just a reminder that you need to keep your geek-goodies envy in perspective.
Re:Meanwhile... (Score:5, Funny)
Yeah! Just think: if WE'RE jealous of this phone, and THEY'RE jealous about the power & water that we take for granted, just think how incredibly jealous they must be about this phone!
You'd be THE MAN in Ethiopia with one of these!
Re:Meanwhile... (Score:1)
Re:Meanwhile... (Score:2)
Actually, I understand cell phones are pretty common in third world countries, because they don't have the infrastructure for hard-wired telephone service.
Re:Meanwhile... (Score:2)
Other people in the world suffer, so therefore I should stop wanting better for myself?
I'm failing to grasp your logic.
Re:Meanwhile... (Score:2)
I bet you're one of those people who thinks that we should shutdown "sweat shop" type places in these countries so that these people can't have jobs at all...
All communities have to start their moderization somewhere. Previous generations in the civilization you live in had poor living conditions and poor labor conditions at some point in their history. They worked toward the technology you have now. The communities/countries you speek of aren't unequal to the rest of us they're just behand the times. Our progress will pull them forward, but if we stand still we don't help them at all.
One last thing: if you "believe in it", why are you reading slashdot and not out digging a well, or convincing people to leave their cultural homeland to go somewhere where there is a hope of the land supporting them?
Re:Meanwhile... (Score:2)
I suppose your one of these people who think that you do someone a favour by exploiting their slave labour than pat yourself on the back for it, all the while refusing to do the same work because you are 'above it' and becoming right irate at the some body suggests you should work for the same wages, under the same conditions, with the same labour 'rights' (complete lack of)
Do you know that most production in poor nations occurs in Export processing zones where these poor nations suspend taxation, labour law and tarriffs in effort to squeeze just a little money from the richer nations..? do you also understand that this system will (is) be used to keep the standard of living in these countries from raising. So stop patting yourself on the back as a humanitarian and realize that the system allowing these poor nations to bootstrap themselves is bullshit, the WTO and the rest are willing to encourage the abandonment of labour standards in order to facilitate the exploitation of the worlds poor.
Give your head a shake.
Re:Meanwhile... (Score:2)
Seen this logic (Score:1)
Re:Meanwhile... (Score:2)
It is ridiculous to to condemn a technology because it has uses some would find frivolous. The frivolity really amounts to a lack of imagination. We fail to see the possibilities, because we don't have enough of a spirit of play.
And we shouldn't patronize the third world too much. Sometimes technology can benefit them in surprising ways. Cell phones have been a great boon in some poor developing communities. They use them differently than we do -- they aren't personal devices, but are shared, and in places that aren't served by land lines. It connects them to the world, to family members who have emigrated, to government services.
A communication device capable of transmitting video would be great, especially where literacy levels are low. They could receive important video instructions: this is how you set a bone, repair a tractor, disarm a landmine, recognize and eradicate a crop pest, or protect your water supply from contamination.
I'm not being utopian here -- it's not going to end of poverty, but information technology could help the poor of the third world in many small ways.
Cost of service? (Score:1)
Re:Cost of service? (Score:1)
I'm sure they will be content to milk their corporate customers for top dollar for a few years before they lower the price enough to make it practical for personal use. After all, with the average user still impressed by the fact that they can screw a new faceplate on to their Nokia 5190, they won't be under much pressure to roll this out.
WAY faster! (Score:1)
2 megabits to my phone means 2 megabits to my laptop too! I can stand still for that.
Re:WAY faster! (Score:1)
Recently. 384kbits/sec was the predicted maximum, but even that kinda cut off service for everyone else in the same cell as you.
Currently Vodaphone (the largest UK mobile operator) are predicting rates of around 64 kbits for their 3G launch which is a bit more likely.
Still, they're all faster than GSM
Why is the US so far behind in wireless? (Score:4, Interesting)
But what I really want to know why the US is so far behind when it comes to the wireless world. While I don't labor under any sort of naive notion that the US has to be first in *everything* worldwide, this has perplexed me for some time. I don't think it's the technology, is it? Here are some ideas of mine, but I don't know how well grounded they are:
1.) Settlement in the US is much less dense than Japan or Europe, so there are greater infrastructual expenses involved with new wireless standards
2.) The NIMBY crowd in the US is more vocal than elsewhere and holds up new infrastructure installations
3.) Standards are more tightly controlled in Europe/Japan, meaning instead of three cellphone antennas for three different carriers on top of apartment buildings, perhaps there is one shared by all?
4.) For cultural reasons Americans are not as interested in games, instant messages, internet, and video as Europeans & the Japanese
-Adam in Philly
(who still uses a single band PCS phone made in, like, 1997 or something)
Re:Why is the US so far behind in wireless? (Score:4, Informative)
The US leads in broadband adoption, but whether this will continue is another question. US long distance phone rates also were the cheapest in the world for ages. There used to be a whole heap of reverse dial services which would use a US base to place to calls to the destinations and hook up the connection. These services used to be cheaper than a one way connection from many countries.
I think the US also leads in cable TV subscriptions, but I'm not sure. As for mobile phones, the US is way behind and primitive. I can't believe how much a cell phone would cost me here compared to Europe and Australia.
The answers that you propose for the differences in mobile adoption are interesting. I think you leave out one thing that really affects the whole game, regulations. In Europe ONE mobile phone standard was set, wheras in the US there are at least 3. The whole market is different. In Japan it's different again. NTT has a monopoly which it can do what it likes with. Sure Japanese phones are neat, and their wireless web is neat, but check the prices !
Also, I think the other thing to look at the differing business cultures. In the US there is very harsh, hard competition and wrenching of every possible profit. In Europe there is more cooperation and Japan there is a tradition of incredible mixing between companies and the government and a really homogenous population.
There was an article in Wired a month or two ago when they talked about how successful the wireless web was in Japan, and The Economist has also commented on this. The fundamental question raised in both is whether it was 'a fluke' or something that can be translated all over the world. While it seems that fluke is harsh, it should be said that their are important cultural differences between these markets.
Re:Why is the US so far behind in wireless? (Score:1)
"The answers that you propose for the differences in mobile adoption are interesting. I think you leave out one thing that really affects the whole game, regulations."
Thanks for a very well-informed response. I did mention something similar to this in Idea 3 of my original post. But I thought that maybe it was a proliferation of antennae for different providers, not for completely different wireless standards. If this is the case, 3G could take a *long* time to be rolled out here in the States.
Also, one other thing I left out is the issue of spectrum. Do three different standards use 3x the amount of spectrum of a single standard elsewhere? I bet it does. And the US military, God bless 'em, probably uses a lot of spectrum here that is used for commercial applications in less militaristic lands like Japan
This is one of those times when I'm glad I'm a programmer and not an electrical engineer.
-Adam in Philly
Re:Why is the US so far behind in wireless? (Score:1)
I think you sig(?) says a lot about why we (American's) almost never see cool techonology while it is new. Americans just won't buy it. Japanese are willing to pay a premium for the latest, smallest, coolest devices. Americans will put up with obsolete devices until the next level has been around so long that it is cheap (because it too has become obsolete).
How many Americans do you still see with Nokia 5190s? It's pathetic.
Re:Why is the US so far behind..STANDARDS! (Score:2, Interesting)
So why does Finland and other low density countries have such a high density of cellphones (>65 cellphones per 100 inhabitants)?
Standards, Standards, Standards! Can you imagine if NetBIOS, IPX, and TCP/IP were all competing for WAN protocol usage on the Internet? The internet would be mostly useless. Buying different routers and adapters for compatibility, and still not be able to have an AIM go through each type - imagine!
Most countries in the world (exceptions being North America, Japan [PDC], South Korea [CDMA]), standardized on GSM for digital cellular.. and this was already back in 1992. Hence, there is probably 150 million GSM customers already, who can all roam between networks. The FCC eventually allowed GSM in, much against Motorola's liking, but on the 1900MHz band, thus making interopability a pain in the ass.
Take America for instance, while AMPS (analog) is dying for the most part as a protocol, you've still got CDMA (Alltel, Verizon), TDMA (AT&T - who is moving to GSM 1900 whenever the economy fixes up), iDen (Nextel), GSM 1900 (Cingular). That means, to cover all these phones, you need *5* base stations. Not only that, other than AMPS compatibility, phones do not generally allow for compatibility between them. So, you've got 5 types of phones manufacturers of all this equipment has to make up for.
GSM isn't the best, but it means real roaming with real coverage! I can take my Motorola Tri-Band GSM phone, and roam between Cingular in the US, Telia in Sweden, and whoever in Uganda. I can send SMS's between any GSM customer around the world. Try having a Verizon customer send a GSM to a Cingular customer.
3G is the 'final solution' to this incompatibility mess I'm told. We'll see
IANACE (I am not a cellular engineer, just some one fed up with cell phones.. flame away at my ignorance!)
Re:Why is the US so far behind..STANDARDS! (Score:2)
You need 5 base stations because you have 5 carriers. This has nothing to do with different standards, each carrier would need their own towers even if they all were GSM.
Also, the fact that 900/1800MHz GSM is not available in the US has to do with spectrum allocation. I believe that these bands are used for something else here, unlike the 1900Mhz band that was eventually allocated for cellular phones.
Re:Why is the US so far behind in wireless? (Score:2)
1) It is true that the lower population density in the US is a factor.
2) Americans have (in my lifetime) always had no charge for local calls from thier home. The only calls we paid for were long-distance calls. If I recall correctly, this hasn't been the case in many places outside the US. So Americans were slower on the uptake with the pay-for-every-call thing, and the pay for incoming calls thing.
3) What's the killer app? In Japan, the killer app for the 2.5g stuff was interactive directions to get to different places because their streets tended to be pretty confusing (grid style urban planning as used in the US really didn't get started before most of the cities in Europe and Japan were built). I'm not sure why, but I've never really wanted to do the email over the phone thing. Voicemail is easier do send, but harder to read. Combine voice mail with caller id, and you havee something that's good enough. I sure as hell don't want to compose messages on that tiny little keypad. I'm wating for a better interface, I guess.
One interesting note on the Japanese market:
Japan rolled out the first cell phone market around 1980. However, the Japanese phone monopoly had such a closed market that there was no innovation. By the early '90s Japan still only had around 100,000 wireless subscribers. Meanwhile the US and Europe had subscriber bases in the millions. It wasn't until the US, working on behalf of Motorola, made it a big deal in some trade talks that Japan deregulated. Prior to that, you couldn't buy your own phone, you rented it from your provider (I assume that was DoCoMo) and there was very little in cool features available. After deregulation they went from 100,000 to 3,000,000 subscribers in only a year or two, and quckly had the most advanced wireless consumer base in the world.
If you think I am wrong in that, its possible. I am doing it from memory of either an Economist or Reason article I read a year or so ago.
I don't think that the NIMBY types are really slowing us down too much. Mostly that's been a problem in semi-rural areas like small towns in Vermont or the southern Appalachians (in the cases I've heard of) and probably in more upscale Californian coastal communities. In Colorado, on I-25 between Colorado Springs and Denver, there's a great example of what the Cell-phone companies are trying to do to minimize the aesthetic objections. They have cell towers that are made up to look like trees. They're typically much less attractive than artificial Christmas trees, which I don't like to begin with.
Cell Towers made to look like Trees look worse (Score:2)
They have cell towers that are made up to look like trees. They're typically much less attractive than artificial Christmas trees, which I don't like to begin with.
Those Damned things are uglier and catch my eyes more than regular radio towers.
I know its off topic but these things are so ugly, its got to stop. No more fake antennas. If you want to disguise cell phone antennas, the best way is just to mount them on top of buildings. If buildings are not available - capitalize on topographical features. If the area is completely flat without any buildings, build a cell phone tower to make it more interesting.
2.5G (Score:1)
Will 3G finally bring about true global roaming? (Score:2)
For instance, when I'm travelling in Japan, I need a PDC phone that is proprietary to Japan, when I'm in the states, I need a Sprint CDMA phone (GSM in the states sucks), when I'm travelling in the rest of the world, I need a GSM 900/1800 phone, etc...
Is this still the plan, or do we still have to deal with a hodgepodge of incompatible standards?
Re:Will 3G finally bring about true global roaming (Score:2)
Even things like retrieving voicemail and full SMS back home is fully supported.
As far as I am concerned, global roaming is here now. What is really missing though, is a) cheap roaming (the roaming charges are ridiculously expensive the world over), and b) cheap data access. My provider charges me for data access outside my 100 free minute plan, and data access while roaming, that's just out of the question, financially, not technically. 2.5G or 3G hopefully may solve that...
Video cellphones? (Score:1, Redundant)
Ummm...what? (Score:2)
Second, video cellphones? Doubles as a camera? So how does that work? I pull the phone away from my ear and hold it up to my face so I can see a 1 in^2 image of my friend (and he can see me) then quickly jam it back to my ear so we can talk? Until the device overheats or the battery goes dead?
Video phones over *regular* lines exist today but nobody is buying them. Why would I want a video cellphone?
Re:Ummm...what? (Score:2)
Re:Ummm...what? (Score:2)
Re:Ummm...what? (Score:2)
From the horse's mouth.. (Score:2)
The Bastard's Prediction... (Score:3, Insightful)
3G is going to be dead in the water, at least for the next few years (5-10) here in the states. Why?
Because what it delivers can be done for MUCH less money. High speed wireless *is* a very cool thing, and very desirable. The problem is the cellular phone isn't the application for it. In reality, who wants to watch a movie on a small screen if you have to pay for it? Who wants to pipe music down the phone if you have to pay for it? These services are not going to be cheap (someone's got to pay for all of those licenses). What reason does a cellular *need* 300+kbps?
The only reason you would want that speed to your phone is if you have it hooked up to a PDA or a laptop. That's the only "killer app" I see for high speed internet. And if that's the case, there are better and cheaper ways of doing it. Think the "Freenets" that have been talked about on
I see cellular service sticking with 2.5 G here in the states. That allows you to do all the things that are a cellphone actually does well (voice, some limited data: e-mail, texting, *simple* WAP). For high speed data that you'd need for your laptop/PDA, look for the commercialization of 801.xx (or something similar).
So says the Bastard
Re:The Bastard's Prediction... (Score:2)
Freenets are for using your laptop on a park bench or in a coffee shop. 3G is for in your car, or for content direct to your phone.
Re:The Bastard's Prediction... (Score:2)
The problem I see is that only a handful of providers have the deep pockets to do G3, and so far its turned out to be a lot harder (and a lot more expensive) than anyone thought. A 801.xx type network, though, has a lower barrier of entry. I see a lot of smaller, regional companies doing pretty creative stuff with the technology, and then consolidation of the the industry over time (think the ISP market from 1995-2000). Sure, the technology isn't as good as what's proposed with G3, but the pricing will more than make up for it.
Add GPS, and you have... (Score:4, Interesting)
"you're currently at bus stop #445... there will be a bus there in 2.3 minutes, time enough for you to get a coffee at Starbucks, 27m around the corner. There is a lineup of 2 people currently, and average serving time is 43 seconds."
It's not THAT far fetched... and although advertising pays for many of these services, it's not necessarily a bad thing in all cases (if handled right, and opt-in).
MadCow.
Re:Add GPS, and you have... (Score:3, Informative)
In cities, GSM can give you position information in with an accuracy of about 100m [location.vtt.fi]. Which suffices for several location based information.
PHS [phsmou.or.jp] systems will provide an accuracy from up to 100m, too.
Telcos currently know in which cell you are and how far you're away from its base station. Sometimes, they even know your distance from a second base station.
This is already used to offer differentiated price schemes and (e.g cheaper rates in your home cell (no pun intended)) location based services in at least Japan [nttdocomo.com] and Germany [gisdevelopment.net], and BT [bt.com] has invested [groupbt.com] quite a amount for wcities [wcities.com], some location-based information service provider (a new buzzword, rejoice).
As you may see it's not far fetched, it's already (to some degree) there and it is considered as the next goldmine (or at least the investors hope so)
This doesn't necessarily requires advertisement as it can be seen as a advertisement in itself.
The providing telco can use it as argument to differentiate itself from other telcos.
Nonetheless, I think it'll surely lead to advertisement. The whole thing reminds somehow of yahoo.com.
This will NEVER happen in the US (Score:2)
Why? - well damn if they can send a man to the moon then those there geekers in NAZER should be able to get me mah TV phone lika Dick Tracy.
There is simply too much money to be made with the crappy service you already get and no incentive to cooperate in billing or roaming systems. I mean who do you think actually bought the congressmen and the FCC leverage? The phone companies.
Look at it another way. The spectrum auction drove the prices so high that phone companies no longer have the billions of dollars it would take to actually deliver the service. And you know what? That was the plan. Keep it on the shelf and off the market from anyone else so they could suck dollars for 1G 2G service now.
Re:This will NEVER happen in the US (Score:2)
Yeah, but that also happened in Europe. That's one of the things that's got Lucent and Nortel and Marconi in the crapper in Europe. No one can afford equipment because they're overextended in spectrum.
One of the other big special interests in the US mix is broadcast television. Little UHF stations that just broadcast home shopping are guaranteed access to cable markets. They're also guaranteed the right to hold on to their current spectrum through the ten years or so of the phase in period for HDTV (assuming it even happens). The TV UHF bands were part of the planned expansion room as 3G started gobbling spectrum, and now that's not gonna be freed up for a while.
Contrary to what they say in all those WTO chat rooms, not everything is a corporate plot to screw the little guy. Sometimes its just stupidity.
Never attribute to malice what can be explained by incompetence
- Hari Seldon
384 downlink - just dream (Score:3, Informative)
In Finland the maximum bandwidth of GPRS networks will be something like 20 - 30 kilobits per second during the next few years. This is due to the lack of advanced coding schemas (the starndards are here for up to 155kbps but no-one has implementations) and not allocating all 8 timeslots of the communication channel for GPRS (this will, however, not be the case in other countries shere GSM is not used as much as here).
However, if they really have the WCDMA working it's something very cool. And bloody expensive.
Source: GPRS for Application developers course at Ericsson last summer.
-Panu
Within 20 miles of Tokyo... (Score:1)
That kind of population density allows the rollout of things like PCS, i-mode, 3G, etc.
Who cares about 3G when regular GSM doesn't work? (Score:2, Insightful)
ObProvider: Cingular Wireless
Cat on the windowsill (Score:2)