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Satellites Used to Stop Car Thieves in Pakistan 215

Posted by michael from the remote-control dept.
zymurgy_cat writes "Yahoo has an interesting story about a company in Pakistan that uses satellites and mobile phone networks to monitor and disable stolen cars. Looks like they can also monitor people's driving habits and whether or not they're using the air conditioner. The article comments about how much easier it is for them to do things like disabling cars remotely than in Western countries. (Remind me to never rent a car in Pakistan.)"
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Satellites Used to Stop Car Thieves in Pakistan More

Satellites Used to Stop Car Thieves in Pakistan

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  • Wow. (Score:1, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Pakistan? I thought they'd just shoot the mule.

  • Pakistan (Score:3, Funny)

    by Gareman ( 618650 ) on Friday October 24, 2003 @05:03PM (#7304331) Homepage Journal
    Never rent a car in pakistan.

    You've been reminded.

    • Indeed, never rent a car in Pakistan.

      Unless it includes a driver.
      (For a Westerner) the low additional cost of a chaufeur is nothing vs. the chance of becoming the victim of someone trying to take you for a ride on an insurance scam through a staged accident.

      This is something to keep in mind in virually all third world countries!

    • Never rent a car in pakistan.
      Rent, schment. Never steal a car in Pakistan!

  • Oh, Come on. (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Davak ( 526912 ) on Friday October 24, 2003 @05:08PM (#7304360) Homepage
    Give me a break slashguys...

    Stopping stolen car = good thing
    Disabling stolen car = good thing
    Monitoring driving habits = good/bad thing

    Good if you are an employer and want to make sure your employees are not abusing the company time. Bad if this information is used to harm your personal rights...

    Just because this is in a different nation that many of you consider "backwards" doesn't mean that this is a stupid idea... or an upcoming technology here in America.

    Davak

    • Re:Oh, Come on. (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Eccles ( 932 )
      Disabling stolen car = good thing

      Unless it's smack-dab in the middle of a highway, or blocking an ambulance, etc. At the very least the car should warn of the imminent disabling and slowly reduce the throttle, so the perpetrator can pull off the road.
      • True, and I don't think stolen cars should be "automatically disabled". What should happen is the owner notifies police that the car is stolen and that it has the Trakker thing on it. Police use GPS to locate car. When they are close enough and the situation is safe, they notify company to turn off the car.
    • Thank you. It's easy to become disallusioned reading these forums. If there's something that has a possibility for abuse for end users (i.e. RFID), it's the end of the world and we all need to buy tin foil hats. But, if it's something that can potentially about the corporations/big brother (i.e. P2P file sharing), everyone's pointing out the possible good uses (e.g. sharing research papers, etc). When I read these comments, I think of the Buddhist "everything in moderation" idea. P2P is good and bad, j
      • The difference is who's being restricted. If P2P networks are banned, then you're eliminating civil liberties ("civil liberties" being defined as anything that a citizen can do). If you restrict the usage of RFID as use in evidence in criminal trials, then it's government that's being limited.

        The United States was born when it was decided that government was getting out of hand. The Bill of Rights was born in order to resist it happening again. Thomas Jefferson and his allies had in mind the prevention

    • Re:Oh, Come on. (Score:3, Insightful)

      by dafoomie ( 521507 )
      Good if you are an employer and want to make sure your employees are not abusing the company time.

      Bad if you are an employee and don't want to get grief for stopping for coffee at Dunkin Donuts for 5 minutes.

      Bad if you are an employee and aren't allowed to use the air conditioning unless a client is with you.

      I do agree with your point, it's not the idea or the technology thats "evil" or "stupid", like anything its just a tool that can be used for good things or abused. I think concerns of abuse are leg
      • Bad if you are an employee and don't want to get grief for stopping for coffee at Dunkin Donuts for 5 minutes.


        Is stopping for any reason not required for the activity that you are paid to perform whilst operating the vehicle explicitly 'against the rules' of e.g. your contract ?

        If so - you would deserve the grief. Get over it, or adjust the contract and send it back to legal for review -before- you would've signed it.

      • Bad if you are an employee and don't want to get grief for stopping for coffee at Dunkin Donuts for 5 minutes.
        Bad if you are an employee and aren't allowed to use the air conditioning unless a client is with you.

        And too bad for you if, when you find out about these policies, your first inclination is not to start looking for another job.

        It's easier to find a job when you have one. I'm not advocating quitting in protest; protest quietly once, then start looking for other employment. When you find

  • Trakker can record a vehicle's movements and even excessive engine idling -- an indication a driver may be using fuel-guzzling air-conditioning without permission.


    Are they seriously that concerned over gas there?
    • If that's a problem for car rental companies over there, they should take out the A/C units, but that would be cost effficient and make sense.
    • On all semi trucks made after 2000 they have an onboard computer system for the ABS this is also tied into the Qualcom communications system. My company had monthly printouts they showed where I had driven and when and where I slept. They than reviewed my driving style (shifting vs. RPM's how fast was I going when I hit the brakes - was it slow even pressure or quick pumping of the pedal - They even showed how fast and what gear to what RPM I rolled down hills in.) In the event of a highjack or even drive
    • Are they seriously that concerned over gas there?

      Shouldn't we be, within reason? Have you totalled how much you spend on gas in a given year? It's not exactly chump change to most people there.

  • Sucks if they click the wrong car. (Score:4, Funny)

    by Polly_was_a_cracker ( 718522 ) on Friday October 24, 2003 @05:09PM (#7304368) Homepage
    Driving along drinking your morning coffee, when your car goes from 40-0 and your face goes from normal to peeling in 2 seconds.
  • Here i was thinking some unsuspecting car thief was getting walloped over the head with a $1.5B night-stick descending from the heavens....

    But hey! we were able to return most of that '78 corolla taxi!

  • Onstar anyone? (Score:5, Informative)

    by ajohnj1 ( 534707 ) <adjohn@gm a i l . com> on Friday October 24, 2003 @05:10PM (#7304377)
    Onstar has had these capabilities in most GM equipped cars for quite some time now. They use the tracking abilities for catching car thieves, they use Onstar to unlock car doors if you lock your keys in the car, they also have the ability to monitor or change any of the guages in the car as well. Whether they use all of the technology or not is another question, but the technology is in the US already.
  • There are several companys in Brazil doing the same, using GPS, satellites and cel phones. It has been done for eight years for cargo trucks and 3 years ago for cars.

  • Comment removed (Score:5, Informative)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Friday October 24, 2003 @05:13PM (#7304409)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • So what about American cars where the equipment is built into the car either way? If the equipment is there (and powered) then data and commands can be exchanged, whether or not the car owner is paying for access to that data.

      This is just the sort of thing that I expect we'll see used by the FBI in terrorism "investigations"

  • Why, it's outrageous! (Score:5, Insightful)

    by HardCase ( 14757 ) on Friday October 24, 2003 @05:13PM (#7304412)
    The article comments about how much easier it is for them to do things like disabling cars remotely than in Western countries.


    Yeah, nobody tell General Motors about this or they might invent OnStar [onstar.com].


    -h-

  • Phone log: (Score:4, Funny)

    by bcolflesh ( 710514 ) on Friday October 24, 2003 @05:15PM (#7304422) Homepage
    Dude, where's my car?

    - Qatar

    Allah! That's too far!

  • Superheroes (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Behind the satellite system ... stands businessman and crime fighter Jameel Yusuf

    Crime fighter, eh? Does that mean he wears his underwear outside of his pants?
  • In Britain, that would be considered a marked improvement.
  • How about during magnetic solar storms (like what we're getting right now)?

    could that make them hunt down the wrong guy and cut his arm off?
  • If it was my business, I'd want it in as many of my cars as possible. I'd also want a little camera in the steering wheel that would take a picture of who ever was driving the vechile, like an ATM machine that would start wirelessly transmitting ASAP when the car is reported stolen.
    You don't like it; don't try to steal it. Plain and simple. As far as monitoring the cars, you are renting them, not buying them.

    • Actually, you'd probably want the system to take and transmit a picture every time the car is started. You can discard the images when the car is returned safely.

      As a speeder myself, I'm a little wary of having a system that reports my speed, though. You can't drive safely on many highways in my area without exceeding the speed limit by 10-20% - because everyone else is speeding and travelling at a vastly different speed from the majority of traffic is more likely to cause an accident than speeding itself

  • Friday, Oct 24, 2003 Car's 'black box' convicts Montreal driver
    Quebec police won a dangerous-driving conviction Friday using evidence from the "black box" in the car, a first in the province.
    The black box or event data recorder (EDR), which automatically records a car's speed and other information, showed Eric Gauthier was driving at least 131 km/h when he hit another car in downtown Montreal in April of 2001.
    Yacine Zinet, 19, was killed in the crash.
    There were no witnesses, but police used the b
  • I used to work for a company that would track cars with a GPS/Cellphone tracker, installed in the vehicles of people who bought them, the service was primarily to give courtesy services, such as directions and locate businesses in proximity, Through a radius search in a database which was merged with Navtech data.
    The Tracker was superior technologically to that of OnStar, in fact the service was called OnGuard, the main advantage of their tracker is that you did not have to put the customer on hold to get

  • This system sounds nice.. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Awptimus Prime ( 695459 ) on Friday October 24, 2003 @05:24PM (#7304499)
    With the exception of what is legally allowed in the USA, I see no difference in this and Lowjack or other tracking systems.

    To my understanding, many large commercial fleets already have tracking systems in place, which was originally designed for the trucking industry.

    Also, most new cars have extensive logging. I was unaware of this until the shop manager at my VW dealership complimented my easy driving. I asked how he knew, and told me some details and funny stories about how it's already saved them money.

    For instance, Joe Abusive buys a new VW. He doesn't like the deal he got, so he breaks stuff on his car because he's one of those types. Say, he sits on his porch and clicks the locks on and off with his remote until they are burned out. Upon taking it back to the dealer, they can see he accessed his car locks remotely 9500 times in the last 24 hours. A clear sign of abuse and would not be covered by warranty. That's a true story, by the way. I think the car in question was a new Passat.

    The tracking systems for truckers has been around for 10-15 years. It seems about that long ago that my uncle (a truck driver) was complaining about not being able to speed or take senic routes anymore due to some heavy new electronics on board.

    If I were a company owner and had a fleet of cars for employees to use for business use, I'd definitely investigate getting a service like this. Everyone I've known who uses a company car on a regular basis always drives them like there's no tomorrow. A terrible waste for the folks paying for that luxury.

    • Your dealer's shop manager just proved those logging systems should either be disabled or subject to some legal protection.

      The dealership SHOULD have the right to check those logs for information directly related to a problem reported with the vehicle - and maybe for indicators of impending failures. However, walking through the logs to check out your driving habits is a disgusting invasion of privacy, no matter how harmless it seems.


      • It's fine by me. I actually prefer this to being without. Sure, they can see I occasionally drive 98mph, but am very easy on my car.

        If something happened while the car is under warranty, and the dealer tried to pull some crap about it not being covered due to improper use or abuse, then I could get a printout of my driving activities to take to court with me.

        "See, your honor, this car has not exceeded 5,000 rpms once in it's logged history and has had all the required service performed on it".. "The engin

        • I'm not sure you've actually argued against my point - that the dealer should only be allowed to view relevant data from the black box.

          As for your example... I'm pretty sure a corrupt dealer and mechanic could either BLANK your black box, or replace it with a blank one without your knowledge, anyway.

          That, of course, brings up another possibilty - how long until someone hacks the black box through the standard dataport and starts selling a module to fake the recording to ensure it complies with your versio

          • "As for your example... I'm pretty sure a corrupt dealer and mechanic could either BLANK your black box, or replace it with a blank one without your knowledge, anyway.

            That, of course, brings up another possibilty - how long until someone hacks the black box through the standard dataport and starts selling a module to fake the recording to ensure it complies with your version of events?"

            Which would likely be as illegal as turning back the odometer and it seems it would be just as easy to discover by etchi
            • He wasn't saying "switch black boxes", he was saying "hook up this simulated speed sensor, these simulated engine sensors, this simulated oil-pressure sensor, these simulated brake sensors, etc."

              Then, drive like a bat out of hell until you have an accident. Disconnect simulated sensors before police arrive. Reconnect the original sensors. "Honest, sir, I was only going 30. You can check my black box if you'd like."

              Now, you have proof you're an "easy driver" who never speeds, and never jackrabbit sta

      • Now, come on. The newer systems that I know of don't log every second that you're in the car -- not saying that it won't get to that, but anyways -- they just can tell "abusive conditions".

        For instance, like doing burnouts? The computer can probably be set to record an event where the car is travelling 0 and then hits 40 within 1 second... That's usually a sign that the traction is overcome on the rear wheels, causing spin (and lots of smoke).

        Or, they could record when you've hit that rev limiter for t
    • The rental companies will pay for this also. Provided the device can be removed when the car is sold. How many time have you heard the line "Who cares it's just a rental?".
    • Upon taking it back to the dealer, they can see he accessed his car locks remotely 9500 times in the last 24 hours

      Yep. A friend of mine bought a (then new) 2001 Silverado. He works construction so he spends a lot of time in the truck. At one point in time the interior of the truck started to come apart- stuff like the color flaked off the dash, the headliner started drooping, the seat sagged, the pedals got loose. He takes it to the dealer and they told him "sorry, you've spent 457 hours in this truck
  • Considering your odds of getting carjacked, held for ransom, and then murdered in the name of Allah in Pakistan are about 1:1, I'm all for it.

    If I had to go to Pakistan, then the more people on my side watching me 24/7 the better.

    Fuck privacy. I'd be saying, "if you lose sight of me for more than 5 seconds, drop the fucking hammer!"

    • And How!!!

    • If I were in a region known to be supportive of militant muslim fanatics, I'd be more like "if you lose sight of me for more than five minutes, drop a nuke on my last known co-ordinates."

      The Western version of a suicide bomber is just SO much more effective.

      Damn, but I'm going to get flamed for this, aren't I?

  • Not as good as the flamethrower option for South African cars: http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/africa/9812/11/flame.thr o wer.car/ [cnn.com]

    For an idea of why this was ever considered you can read a few articles of Natasha Marchetti's Mandela Porn: http://exile.ru/176/176160000.html [exile.ru]

    Guaranteed to make you loose that good feeling that you got when you helped defeat Apartheid.
  • Can you see me now? GOOOD.
  • After actually READING the article and not reading much into the headline, it looks a lot like lojack [lojack.com] - available right here is the USA as well if you want to track your own car to prevent theft and misuse (in the case of corporate vehicles). /. editors are wannabe NYT headline writers...
  • Here we use things like Lo-Jack for the consumer, and AirIQ for the corporation.

    http://www.wired.com/news/privacy/0,1848,45163,0 0. html
  • ... In fact, several (5-6-ish?) years ago, I made enquiries with insurance companies about premiums and conditions to cover a (then) late model Subaru Impreza [subaru.com.au] WRX [subaru.com.au] car. (The Impreza WRX has the dubious distinction of being very popular with ram raiders, etc, in Australia because it is wideley known to be able to outrun anything the Police have. It's popular enough that a bunch of guys tried to steal one from it's owner and passenger at gunpoint just this week)

    Anyhoo, most insurance companies either flat-out weren't interested in covering the car, or asked for incredibly high premiums. One *did* offer a premium in-line with other similar cars *but* with the condition that I have satellite tracking fitted by one of a couple of companies nominated by them. IIRC, at the time, the cost of installing the kit would have been circa AUD$1000-$1500. There was an annual monitoring fee too, don't remember what it was, but it was at least a couple-o hundred bucks.

    This whole business of locating a car, waiting for the police to catch up, then disabling the vehicle at a point when the orificer on the scene advises that it is safe to do so is something that has been advertised in car/bike 'enthusiast' circles here for quite some time.

    • A bit more info...

      I think this, 'QuikTrak [quiktrak.com.au]', was one of the companies that the insurance mob pointed me to...

      Also, a year-old story from the Sydney Morning Herald [smh.com.au] on a carjacked porsche [smh.com.au] recovered within 30 mins with satellite doo-da's...

    • Same in Belgium... (Score:3, Interesting)

      by morzel ( 62033 )
      It's basically the same situation over here in Belgium: a lot of luxury cars (Mercedes-BMW-...) are only accepted for full coverage by insurance companies if a certified anti-carjacking system (ie: satellite tracking, remote shutdown) is installed.

      The price tag for such a system is about EUR 1.500, plus EUR 30 monthly fee for the tracking and GSM communication costs (you can use the cellphone).

      They are not tracking your every move, since that would be too costly; you're only being tracked when actively re

    • Aussie cops must not have such great equipment.

      Somehow, I always picture them having souped-up V8's with 'INTERCEPTOR' printed on the back...
      • Aussie cops must not have such great equipment.

        For whatever reason, no, they don't. I see a lot of stuff about US State cops kitting themselves out with proceeds from crime, etc, etc. That doesn't happen here - proceeds from crime go straight back into gummint coffers.

        At various times they have dabbled with whatever was the latest/greatest/fastest. 10-15 years ago, when the Mitsubishi Cordia Turbo was the dogs nuts of fast small cars, the police in my state (NSW) got a few of them and let the Highway Pa

        • For once the japanese got it right in terms of outfitting their cops with cars. In order to deal with the problem of street racers, there are some R-34 skylines setup for police duty. Now THAT is a highway patrol car. It would eat a WRX for breakfast.

        • The Holdens can't be much worse than the CNG-powered Chevy Luminas the city cops around here drive. The highway patrol is another matter... wouldn't want to try to outrun the CHP on the open road.

          I saw some Commodores in New Zealand... not too impressive looking. But come to think of it, I can't remember seeing any cops in the whole two weeks I was there.
  • Can you just imagine: Road side herf guns stopping runners by satelite. Ronald Reagan would approve.
  • The article mentions 300 cars stolen a month in Karachi which has population about 13 million. Total new cars sold in Pakistan is about 80000 a year which has a population of 150 million. At that proportion, Karachi share is about 7000 cars new cars a year. That means 1 out of 2 cars on average gets stolen in its lifetime!

  • Quck! Nobody's looking! (Score:3, Funny)

    by KFury ( 19522 ) * on Friday October 24, 2003 @05:50PM (#7304713) Homepage
    So is there a rush of vehicle thefts during periods of high sunspot activity and coronal mass ejections [nasa.gov] like now [com.com]?
  • Big Brother is very much alive.....
  • I believe that if you're not doing anything wrong then you shouldn't care if this company/goverment knows where you're going...

    I mean, what use could they give to this information?

    Privacy freaks look to me like if they want to do something wrong or illegal.

    I even wouldn't mind having the same service back home. I rather give up some of my overrated "privacy" but be able to recover my car in case of theft, or being able to located in case of a kidnap, for instance.

    Actually, if done responsibly, having th
    • Yes, but you don't have the kind of boss a lot of these people in Pakistan would have. I had one here in Oz, who would complain when the car came back with the Power/Econ switch on the transmission set to "Power". "The car is not to be driven in the Powe r mode"

      Ignorant git. Imagine if someone like that had a complete log of every action you took while you were driving. You could get sacked because some dimwit dived out in front of you and you had to brake hard and it got logged.

      There are bosses who would
  • " Trakker can record a vehicle's movements and even excessive engine idling -- an indication a driver may be using fuel-guzzling air-conditioning without permission."

    I'm going to Phoenix this weekend. Sure hope my friend asked his wife for permission to guzzle some fuel...

  • I guess it has to be said..... (Score:3, Funny)

    by Bombcar ( 16057 ) <racbmob@@@bombcar...com> on Friday October 24, 2003 @06:13PM (#7304897) Homepage Journal
    In A.D. 2003
    Car was stolening

    Thief: What happen?
    Mechanic: Someone set up us the brake.
    Car Jacker: We get signal.
    Thief: What!
    Car Jacker: Radio turn on.
    Thief: It's You!!
    Cops: How are you gentlemen!!
    Cops: All your brake are belong to us.
    Cops: You are on the way to destruction.
    Thief: What you say!!
    Cops: You have no chance to escape make your time.
    Cops: Ha Ha Ha Ha ....
    Thief: Take off every 'Zig'!!
    Car Jacker: You know what you doing.
    Thief: Move 'Zig'.
    Car Jacker: For great justice.

  • errr LOJACK (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Archfeld ( 6757 ) * <treboreel@live.com> on Friday October 24, 2003 @06:18PM (#7304940) Journal
    has been in use in california for about 10 years now, GPS locator, engine kill switch, road-side assistance, etc...

    BTW wether you pay for it or not EVERY CADDILAC has an active monitoring system running. Some friends had a new caddy but opted not to pay for the northstar system, while trying to find parking at a resturant in Vegas they went around the block like 8 times, the northstar operator came on and asked if they needed asistance, she was very helpful and polite but needless to say they were disturbed to find that their location data was being tracked anyways, and further it is being stored as aggregate data, but their unique vehicle id number is associated with this data, and the fact that they are not paying for the service means they have no ability to opt out, and Caddilac stated that the system was tied into the airbags, and anti theft system, so removal or alteration would void warranty, and likely disable airbags and such....

  • when I was in northern Pakistan... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by danny ( 2658 ) on Friday October 24, 2003 @07:17PM (#7305329) Homepage
    I visited Northern Pakistan [danny.oz.au] in 1999 - and I certainly wouldn't want to go driving anywhere there myself! The roads are often crumbling one-car-wide tracks cut into cliffs or landslides, and when vehicles going opposite ways meet someone has to reverse half a kilometre... I was happy to leave that to the local drivers to negotiate!

    This photo [danny.oz.au] shows a place (between the Shandur Pass and Gilgit) where we had to wait three hours while they re-dynamited the road...

    Danny.

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