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BT Plans Move To IP Telephony, Starting Next Year 228

pure_equanimity writes "The BBC have published an article saying that BT are planning to migrate from a PSTN to an IP network, a move to cost 3bn. They say that broadband will become ubiquitous, with customers having the ability to plug any device in to get access. They also say that current cheap broadband products will more than likely not be viable in five years time. They plan to start rolling out in 2006, and cover the vast majority of customers by 2009."
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BT Plans Move To IP Telephony, Starting Next Year

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  • PSTN? (Score:4, Informative)

    by OverlordQ ( 264228 ) * on Thursday June 10, 2004 @04:38AM (#9385062) Journal
    I'll admit I had to look this one up, if ya woulda said POTS, I would of known right off the bat.

    Public Switched Telephone Network btw.
  • by funkytwig ( 780501 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @04:42AM (#9385074)
    "cheap broadband products will more than likely not be viable in five years time"

    BT don't do any cheap broadband products, only expensive overpriced ones :-)
  • by ciroknight ( 601098 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @04:44AM (#9385083)
    Most likely they'll continue to use phone numbers. It's too much of an investment to try to change the number system, and on top of that, it'd be much harder for a traditional telephone to call an IP number.

    Basically, they're turning the voice data into packets and then sending the packets across their network, improving the effeciency of their lines. There's been a lot of discussion about this lately actually. Either way, I wish the american phone companies would get on the ball...
  • by tokachu(k) ( 780007 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @04:45AM (#9385088) Journal
    Uncompressed telephone-qualtiy audio as PCM takes up 64 kbps (8 KB/s), just like an ISDN channel.

    It will certainly not be as bad, load-wise, as installing high-speed Internet access.
  • Re:Yea... (Score:2, Informative)

    by Tranzig ( 786710 ) <voidstar@freemail.hu> on Thursday June 10, 2004 @04:52AM (#9385116)
    I don't how things happen there but many elderly switched to ISDN here a couple years ago, only because they were persuaded by the ads. They don't know Internet at all, and their only reason for swiching was: ``They said it's faster''.
  • Re:Yea... (Score:5, Informative)

    by Zog The Undeniable ( 632031 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @04:55AM (#9385123)
    All BT's exchanges have been System X (digital) for a few years now, but pulse-dialling still works in software, should you want it. The main reason some people still have dial phones is that they were hardwired to the wall, and it's an offence to get anyone but BT to install a modern plug-in wall box. At a cost.
  • Re:rims? (Score:3, Informative)

    by Dogers ( 446369 ) * on Thursday June 10, 2004 @04:55AM (#9385127)
    I can only assume you mean DAC's? Where a cable is split into effectively 2 seperate lines (limiting your modem dialup to 28k, no matter what)

    Yes, they use it a lot here, but I dont think its an exchange limitation (generally anyway) - it seems to be more of a local box/cabling thing.. when we had an extra 3 lines put in the engineer said if we got 1 more, BT would have to upgrade the cable from the exchange to the subbox, then to our house! He also mumbled something about that probably helping them justify updating the exchange to DSL as well, but being students at the time, we couldnt afford the "chance" of DSL for the cost of another line :(
  • by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 10, 2004 @04:56AM (#9385131)

    Those without any experience of BT, especially as business customers should know that 2026 will be the more likely date. It is still a glacially slow behemoth that acts with sniffy surprise when expected permit competition in the marketplace.

  • background info (Score:3, Informative)

    by dncsky1530 ( 711564 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @05:01AM (#9385142) Homepage
    This might help: [fact-index.com]
    The public switched telephone network (PSTN) is the concatenation of the world's public circuit-switched [fact-index.com] telephone [fact-index.com] networks, in much the same way that the Internet [fact-index.com] is the concatenation of the world's public IP [fact-index.com]-based packet-switched [fact-index.com] networks. Originally a network of fixed-line analog telephone systems, the PSTN is now almost entirely digital, and now includes mobile [fact-index.com] as well as fixed telephones.
  • by Conor Turton ( 639827 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @05:09AM (#9385170)
    Yes, it is British Telecom. Originally it was public owned and was the only telco in the UK with the exception of Kingston Communications, a Hull City coucil run telco only available to the residents of Kingston Upon Hull. B.T was then privatised. It is the largest Telco in the UK. With the exception of a few cable companies operating in limited areas and Kingston Communications, B.T still owns most of the telephone exchanges in the UK and if you want to provide a DSL/Phone service you have to do it over their lines.
  • by l-ascorbic ( 200822 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @05:11AM (#9385176)
    BT is BT. Sure, officially they are British Telecommunications plc, but it's not like you'd bother looking up what AT&T stood for, when all you needed to know was "it's a big telco".
  • Re:Powersource? (Score:3, Informative)

    by NotWulfen ( 219204 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @05:14AM (#9385184) Homepage
    That mild voltage is supplied by the central office via huge banks of batteries supplying a 48V DC feed.

    Since a lot of COs and switching centers already have this massive infrastructure for supplying DC power most (if not all) internetworking equipment can be obtained in DC power supply versions.

    So yes, the equipment at the CO will stay up through a power outage because it'll still be powered by those 48V batteries, equipment at the customer end is a completely different thing... but unless it's a full FTTH solution there are options for getting power to the CPE, like power over ethernet (if they use an ethernet last mile), and iirc there are power distribution solutions for coax if they decide to go that route.
  • Re:So... (Score:4, Informative)

    by Tooky ( 15656 ) <steve.tooke@gmai[ ]om ['l.c' in gap]> on Thursday June 10, 2004 @05:23AM (#9385211) Homepage

    So they are gonna hook customers up right before the prices go up? I thought prices would go down as time marches on? What about all that "dark fiber"?

    Reading the article I took it to mean that cheap broadband IP telephony products would be unviable in 5 years time, not broadband internet per se.

  • Re:PSTN? (Score:5, Informative)

    by stoborrobots ( 577882 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @05:33AM (#9385244)
    It's a Switched Telephone Network for Public use... as opposed to Private Automatic Branch eXchange...

    "Public Switching"... Heh!

  • Actually... (Score:3, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 10, 2004 @05:46AM (#9385272)
    the majority of BT users rent their phones for an annual cost that is far greater than buying one.. check out the House of Lords report. So it should be easy for BT to send them a new one, because they already own the rented one.
  • Re:Yea... (Score:5, Informative)

    by curator_thew ( 778098 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @05:49AM (#9385277)
    "They're not going to get some old lady to change her pots phone for some fancy IP phone"

    Did you comprehend the article? This is more about their internal network, rather than the customer equipment.

    They will convert their entire internal network into VOIP, so even if you have an old analog POTS line, your calls will be VOIP'd between exchanges.

    Naturally, once they have a native internal VOIP network, then they're in a better position to offer interesting VOIP services directly to the customer. But a vast majority of customers will still be using analog POTS.

    It's hardly surprising: if they don't do this then they will fall behind in offering the kinds of innovative services that upstart VOIP vendors can offer. It also makes for better service integration and interoperation with future 4G technologies, etc.

  • Re:PSTN? (Score:5, Informative)

    by Alioth ( 221270 ) <no@spam> on Thursday June 10, 2004 @06:04AM (#9385318) Journal
    Actually, PSTN does stand for Public Switched Telephone Network - the public bit meaning not private (as in PABX - Private Automatic Branch eXchange).

    Packet switching on telephone networks is a relatively new thing (compared to the history of automatic telephone switching). Until 20 years ago, most telephone switching was still done by electromechanical machines (google for Strowger Telephone Exchange) - huge rooms full of physical switches (uniselectors, bidirectional selectors) and relays which moved and clattered as subscribers dialed telephone numbers; the tones (such as ringing, number unobtainable, engaged etc) generated by a motor-driven machine. If you go to the London Science Museum, they have part of one of these exchanges you can play with.
    Trunk calls were routed using analogue frequency division multiplexing rather than packet switching. Signalling between mechanical telephone exchanges was done at voice frequencies (for example, the famous 2600Hz tone - in Britain, the frequency was different and it was known as 2VF - if you listen to some Radio 4 radio plays you'll find the sound engineers still like inserting the 'pip' sound when someone answers a call which you heard when the 2VF signalling wasn't quite fully supressed from reaching the subscriber's phone. These 'pip' sounds probably disappeared from the public network 20 years ago but the sound engys at the BBC seem to like them).
  • Re:PSTN? (Score:4, Informative)

    by Some Bitch ( 645438 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @06:08AM (#9385328)
    I suggest you do a little checking then I believe you will find an apology is in order. The P in PSTN is "Public" and always has been.

    "packet switched telephone network" gives 61 results on Google (all from idiots).

    "Public switched telephone network" gives around 119000 results.

    I rest my case.
  • BT coward.... (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 10, 2004 @06:15AM (#9385349)
    I work for BT and have known about this for a few weeks now, seems like a move in the right direction

    1000 people will have it tested in the south of England in 2005 I belive

    Now they just have to start offering good internet and phone products to win customers back ;)
  • Fears people have. (Score:2, Informative)

    by TheRealJFM ( 671978 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @06:18AM (#9385355) Homepage Journal
    BT (British Telecom) used to be a public subsiduary of the British post office (I believe). However, despite the fact it is its own company, it is *heavily* regulated by Ofcom, the telecom regulator. Basicly, about 90% of UK broadband providers provide ADSL (Asymectrical DSL - meaning faster Dl that Ul) from BTs network. This wasn't the case but Ofcom forced BT to allow other networks to run on the network at low cost, and also forced BT to allow very cheap rates for commercial isps to offer unlimited 56k dialup. Whatever network BT develop will be available to all comers, no matter which company, and this is assured by both UK monopoly law and Ofcom. However, I think the benefits for the UK will be huge, and everyone should benefit from that, not just BT. Think about it, a fibre based network running over the entire country, and if you RTFA you will see they are talking about linking in wit the 3rd generation mobile phone network (already IP based obviously), meaning you could have a single number for mobile, internet and "standard" phone. I think this has been in BT's pipeline for a long time, and I personally think it will be a good thing, provided Ofcom keep up to their end of the bargain. Oh, one thing though. Will it be encrypted, or will it be "tap friendly"?
  • by blorg ( 726186 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @06:24AM (#9385371)
    ...they changed the trading name [wikipedia.org] from British Telecom to 'BT' in 1991 and the corporate name to BT Group plc [yahoo.com] in 2000. You will find it hard to actually even find a reference to 'British Telecom' on bt.com.
  • Re:Yea... (Score:3, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 10, 2004 @06:39AM (#9385404)
    No, BT provided the conversion for free. This cost them a lot of money and engineers time but the trade off was that they could then sell more equipment and digital services to those customers, and make the money back plus profit. They could have an engineer doing nowt but travelling an area doing socket conversions and make money still, no problems. But when there isn't enough conversions to be done, they start to loose money. The number of conversions is low and the number of extra services they could sell to those who were converting was small; the customers who found all those features useful had converted long ago. So BT were doing free conversions for customer from whom they couldn't make any significant revenue from. So they started to charge for the conversions.
  • Re:rims? (Score:1, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 10, 2004 @06:47AM (#9385424)
    Actually I'm not all that surprised. Depending on the department they probably did not have enough information from your account to tell you if you had a DAC on the line. Telesales have a script-driven system called GT-X which has no access to your customer account (It's all batch). 150 customer service are slightly better SMART system, but it still isn't smart enough to provide detailed line setup information.

    Remember at all times that the person you are talking to is a thick bastard who couldnt get a real job and hates his/her life..

    If you mean telesales, yeah you're probably right. Bunch of script monkeys who used to sell the entire range of digital services to little old ladies who didn't want them. If you mean 150 then fuck you, I used to do that job and the vast majority of the people there knew their stuff.

    ..and just wants to go home.

    You got that bit right though.
  • Re:Actually... (Score:1, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday June 10, 2004 @06:49AM (#9385431)
  • by cybergibbons ( 554352 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @06:50AM (#9385433) Homepage
    Connect up a fax machine - if that blows up, then you can get somewhere as BT need to provide at least a 4800 or 9600 bps (can't remember which) fax connection can be established.
  • Re:rims? (Score:3, Informative)

    by jadel ( 746203 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @07:20AM (#9385512)
    This is quite common in Australia. Basically a pair gain allows one copper pair to multiplex multiple conversations (commonly two, but it may be more) allowing more phones to be connected without having to drag more copper through the conduits to peoples houses. A rim is a different device, basically a miniature exchange that connects via fibre optic cable to the main exchange building to avoid having to drag each individual copper pair all the way back.
    Being on either device basically guarentees that you will be unable to get ADSL, although Telstra the company that owns the phone lines will now attempt to transpose over to plain copper if they are cajoled enough.
    For more information on the Australian broadband experience have a look at whirlpool. [whirlpool.net.au]
  • Utter rubbish... (Score:3, Informative)

    by WIAKywbfatw ( 307557 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @07:50AM (#9385626) Journal
    Uh, you're post is complete and utter rubbish. STD (area) codes have always been specific to an area, dependent on where you're calling and never where you're calling from.

    The reason why people would give out the name of the area that they lived in is that, back in the days when the system was set up when overlaying the alphabet onto the digits 0-9 had more significance in the UK, part of the name would correspond to the area code. In fact, the area codes themselves derived from the place names.

    This area coding was taken so seriously that in some instances people wrote to the Post Office (because that's who ran the telephone system back then) to demand that their area codes were changed so that the numbers corresponded to more affluent places. For example, people living in the suburb of Anytown would rather have an area code refering to the posher neighbouring suburb of Sometown, so they'd petition for that area code to apply to them too. In many instances, because people in Anytown were reluctant to have a phone installed and answer the phone "Anytown 1212" (or whatever their number was) this held up uptake of telephony services to the point where the Post Office acquiesced and gave people the Sometown area code (or a derivation of it) that they wanted.

    I learnt all this almost 15 years ago from a BT engineer of 20 years experience. Ask any older BT engineer and they'll confirm this for you.
  • by fiji ( 4544 ) * on Thursday June 10, 2004 @08:22AM (#9385758)
    [I posted this to the other VoIP thread, but it is a useful tool]

    You can simulate a VoIP call and get the MOS voice quality score. So if you want to see how your Wireless setup fares, visit testyourvoip.com [testyourvoip.com].

    Even if you don't care about VoIP, it is a useful test of the latency and bandwidth of your connection. VoIP is pretty sensitive to late packets so this tool highlights connectivity problems.

    -ben
  • by Chep ( 25806 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @08:31AM (#9385800)
    Where are you locked in, Greece?

    Here the urban (unbundled) rate is 29.90&#128; for 5M/384k (TV-DSL and VoIP off) or 2M/384k (TV-DSL and VoIP on), and you can find providers starting at 12.99&#128;/month for 512/128.

    Outside of cities (non-unbundled rate), of course, the standard France Telecom gouging comes back, and prices are between 29.90&#128; for 1024/128 and 35&#128; for 512/128 (depending on the ISP, the base carrier being always FT).
  • Re:PSTN? (Score:3, Informative)

    by Alioth ( 221270 ) <no@spam> on Thursday June 10, 2004 @09:20AM (#9386091) Journal
    Sometimes they even put the old 'purring' dialtone into modern radio plays! The last Strowger exchange in Britain disappeared in the early 90s, the purring dialtone hasn't been on the public phone network since then. They also sometimes have the dialtone come back when the remote caller hangs up - in reality, you get the NU (number unobtainable - beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep) when the remote end hangs up if they were the person who calls you, if you were the caller, the line doesn't clear down until you replace the handset or a timeout period is reached.

    Actually, there's some website out there with a recording of the demo of 2VF signalling. It is _so_ quintessentially British. You can probably find it by Googling.

    Actually, that's a neat trick. If you call someone and are having an argument, and they hang up on you, don't put the phone down. If they pick it up again (probably to call and whine at one of their girl friends about what a nasty man you are) you'll still be there :-)
  • by ratb3rt ( 773844 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @09:49AM (#9386347) Homepage
    Apparently, no matter how successful the fibre trials are, only new builds or big business will get fibre from the exchange. No good for 99% of the population....
  • Re:Yea... (Score:2, Informative)

    by a5cii ( 620929 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @11:15AM (#9387483) Homepage
    This isn't the case.

    BT still use System X, System Y and UXD5B exchanges.

    System X (digital) is the newest, has most available select services - call barring, divert and so on - supports ADSL

    System Y (digital) is the second newest, has a lot of available select services - call barring, divert and so on but certain select services have different configuration options - supports ADSL

    UXD5B (analogue) is the oldest still in use on the Public BT Network, customers cannot get diverts put on when their line is broken with this kind of exchange, a lot of select services arent available. - does not support ADSL

    Its 4.15pm and i am off to work, call 151 and maybe ill chat to you - 151 BT faults
  • by optical-damage ( 786842 ) on Thursday June 10, 2004 @11:21AM (#9387566)
    Telecom Italia already carries 80% of its national backbone telephone calls on an IP based network infrastructure, and something like 40% of their international calls.

    This is the back-end of the service, multiplexing together thousands of calls over high speed (2.5 and 10Gb/second) network links. The network also uses class of service and many other configuration setups to ensure a consistent quality of service for the traffic flow. You can be sure everything will be massively resilient. In addition this traffic won't traverse the public Internet at all, but will be on a private network (though gatewayed to the Internet for connectivity to other services). This will allow BT to guarantee they wont be hit by Internet related issues like congestion, black-hole routing and so on. Dont compare this service to public Internet VoIP, its NOTHING like it.

    Personally I think this is a fantastic move, and will really help the UK take advantage of up and coming technologies over the next decade.

    PS there is already an Internet standard to map IP addresses to public phone numbers, and there is also work on integrating VoIP into the DNS infrastructure!

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