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Microsoft Operating Systems Security Software

Gates on Spyware and OS Competition 690

Posted by michael
from the phear-the-penguin dept.
Ant writes "CNET's News.com has an article that says Microsoft plans to offer its own anti-spyware software." prostoalex writes "Both OsNews and InfoWorld talk about Bill Gates' speech at the Computer History Museum in California. Gates is noting that Linux is taking over, and claims that 10 years forward Linux and Windows will be the only OSs left in the market."
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Gates on Spyware and OS Competition

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  • 800lb Gorilla (Score:5, Insightful)

    by erick99 (743982) <homerun@gmail.com> on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:07AM (#10417873)
    It would make sense for Microsoft to make an anti-spyware product, after all, they should (but may not) know the most about how to protect Windows from spyware. I would also think that given the sheer amount of brainpower that they could apply to the task that they would put forth a good product. But, they have not been known as innovaters in the application world (I know, some would say in the OS world as well). Anyway, I wonder how the other folks who make and sell (or give away) anti-spyware software will react to the 800lb gorilla's entrance into their domain?
    • Re:800lb Gorilla (Score:5, Insightful)

      by TheSpoom (715771) * <slashdot@@@uberm00...net> on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:13AM (#10417895) Homepage Journal
      MS Engineer 1: "Hmm, here's a security vulnerability."

      MS PHB: "Well, let's get to work on patching it."

      MS Engineer 2: "Wait, couldn't we not patch it and instead sell the patch together with others as a piece of software with an annual update fee?"

      MS PHB: "Congratulations, you just got promoted."
      • Paranoia (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Stormy Dragon (800799) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:10AM (#10418136) Homepage
        Yeah, and Symmantec and McAffee are secretly making all the computer viruses so they can sell anti-virus software.

        Sounds like you need to get your tinfoil hat resized again.
      • Re:800lb Gorilla (Score:5, Insightful)

        by NanoGator (522640) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:23AM (#10418177) Homepage Journal
        "MS Engineer 2: "Wait, couldn't we not patch it and instead sell the patch together with others as a piece of software with an annual update fee?""

        I've met quite a few software engineers, and none of them would suggest that. (Nor would a PHB promote them, they'd take credit for it instead.)
    • Re:800lb Gorilla (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Osrin (599427) * on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:13AM (#10417904) Homepage
      It will be the same response that Microsoft always seen to get when they introduce something like this... lots of people complaining that they're not doing it, then they build something and lots of people complain that they've made a change.

      "Microsoft need to do something about security" - Microsoft release XPSP2 - "Microsoft changed a bunch of securty settings and now my badly written app does not work anymore".
      • Say you buy a new car, drive it out of the shop down the hill only to find that the brand new car with all the shining new features is missing steering and brakes. Then after you have crashed, your kids have been buried and you have after 2 years of legal battles and medical recovery the car company comes around and fixes the brakes. Would you then still feel you have something to complain about?

        There are two kinds of people who complain about MS. Those with somekind of hatred towards MS for whatever reaso

    • Re:800lb Gorilla (Score:3, Insightful)

      by MoThugz (560556)
      It would make sense for Microsoft to make an anti-spyware product, after all, they should (but may not) know the most about how to protect Windows from spyware.


      If they are really are the ones who know the most about protecting Windows from spyware, then almost every Windows user is doomed.

      Heck, Mr Gates himself faces the very same spyware problem.
    • Re:800lb Gorilla (Score:3, Interesting)

      by gregduffy (766013)
      <sincerity>

      Before I worked at Microsoft as an intern last summer (I'm a college student), I was under the same impression about the amount of brainpower they had.

      I worked specifically for MSN Ads, and everywhere I looked (I also talked to my friends in other departments) I found sloppy coding practices, FUD, and general CYA-motivated B.S.

      9/10 people I met didn't know what they were doing, but they were too good at political maneuvering for it to matter. The people that knew what they were doin

      • Re:800lb Gorilla (Score:5, Informative)

        by killjoe (766577) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @02:55AM (#10418444)
        Sounds like every other large corporation in the world.

        My advice as a veteran is to stick with smaller companies. Not only will you make a bigger impact but you'll also be appreciated. You definately wait till you are married and have kids before you get your soul sucked out by a large company. Of course by then you'll have lost the will to live anyway so it won't matter so much :)

        good luck.
        • by 0x0d0a (568518) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @03:25AM (#10418561) Journal
          There's nothing that someone who has been working at a large company worries about more than a bunch of new fresh, stubborn, idealistic faces who is willing to devote all their time to work coming in and taking over. That's true even in the existing system.

          Microsoft is a very large company. It has an established hierarchy, and people who have worked for years to reach their positions, and now have guaranteed status. They're concerned about someone walking in and taking what they've spent a long time getting and rely on.

          Linux is a loose network of some of the most devoted-to-work people, who want to stir things up and change the world, even if it results in a lot less money for them. It is a hypercompetitive meritocracy -- you can't work up any type of "status" that you can live off for years (well, maybe if you work at IBM).

          Microsoft/Linux is just another example of a neverending struggle. It's just a little more blatant than most.
        • Re:800lb Gorilla (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Jesrad (716567) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @06:42AM (#10419027) Journal
          Not every corporation.

          I've worked in a 120,000-employee corporation in 2002, and almost every single person I met there actually had a clue. There was no political bullshit, we had clear objectives and reasonable timelines, the only hassle was that it'd take a few days to get specific software and hardware.

          A colleague of mine worked for a subsidy of IBM last year, and told me it was the same way there, no bullshit, no slacking and no sloppiness, of course that makes only two small examples, but that's just to say such generalizations are bad overall.
    • Re:800lb Gorilla (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:47AM (#10418059)
      I wonder how the other folks who make and sell (or give away) anti-spyware software will react to the 800lb gorilla's entrance into their domain?

      That's the least of their problems. The big problem is when the 800lb gorilla will patent anti-spyware software. How will the other simians react to that?
    • Re:800lb Gorilla (Score:5, Informative)

      by Zemran (3101) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:25AM (#10418189) Homepage Journal
      Eeerrrr, if they really wanted to do something about it why not change the way the write software so that it is not so easy for outsiders to hack into their products and dump unwanted code onto their clients machines? This would efectively cut down on virii as well as spyware, trojans etc... Why do they chose to leave so many doors open? I believe it is because they are more concerned with leaving the doors open for themselves than they are worried about the effect of the abuse of those doors. Why does a Windows users email need the power to format their hard disk etc?
  • Mac OS? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by tuxlove (316502) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:09AM (#10417877)
    Gee Bill, what about Mac OS? Considering how good that OS is these days, not to mention the Mac hardware, you probably shouldn't turn your back on it in a dark alley. I think it'll be here 10 years from now.
    • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by bladx (816461) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:11AM (#10417888)
      yeah, i agree

      what's the deal? my summer internship (a school district) uses macs like crazy.. of my experience (and i know, it is not very much) mac os x has, by far, been the most stable OS i have had to use in the workplace. i'm not sure why it would go away so suddenly.
      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by tonywong (96839) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:23AM (#10418175) Homepage
        That's because Mr. Gates doesn't perceive Apple as being an OS vendor unto themselves. He looks at Apple as the premier research division of Microsoft.

        I'm only semi-kidding.

        OK. I'm not.
      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:4, Interesting)

        by FireFury03 (653718) <slashdot@nexusukGAUSS.org minus math_god> on Sunday October 03, 2004 @03:48AM (#10418644) Homepage
        os x has, by far, been the most stable OS i have had to use in the workplace.

        Does that include Linux? I use Linux exclusively at both home and work and I would struggle to make any stability comparisons amoungst any OSes that stay up for such long periods of time. In my (limited) experience, OS X and Linux seem to be on par with eachother when it comes to stability. Obviously OS X is easier for the average user to use, so that where it wins.

        I'm a big fan of *nix based OSes and I think Apple have made a good call with moving to a BSD-based platform. I agree that Microsoft seem to be overlooking Apple if they think they'll be gone in 10 years - it has seemed to me recently that OS X is rapidly gaining popular support.
    • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Informative)

      by Money for Nothin' (754763) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:12AM (#10417893)
      People have been predicting the death of MacOS and Apple for almost 2 decades now. That "wizard" over at PCMag, John Dvorak, has been doing so for almost that long, and look at where that prediction has gone.

      *tears out another Dvorak article, wipes, and flushes it down the toilet*
      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Interesting)

        by tuxlove (316502) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:58AM (#10418094)
        That "wizard" over at PCMag, John Dvorak, has been doing so for almost that long, and look at where that prediction has gone.

        I met Dvorak recently, and I have to say, he's very difficult to talk to. He's one of those guys who has no ability to just listen. A poor quality in a journalist. I found it very frustrating. His opinions aren't total crap, though. I think he's wrong WRT Mac OS, but he would have been right if Apple hadn't finally gotten a real OS by now. Until X, the OS was a toy, inferior even to Windows. Now it's for real, and it's serious. Microsoft has a long way to go if they hope to rival it.
      • by nounderscores (246517) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:02AM (#10418116)
        http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=1144882004 [scotsman.com]

        The above link has three pertinant quotes.

        "Microsoft's fortunes grew with personal computers or, more specifically, supplying the software for what used to be called "IBM-compatible PCs". It is easy to forget that 20 years ago there were a number of standards competing for dominance. (Of the others, only Apple survives.)"

        "Google knows it cannot remain just a search engine company, because that leaves it vulnerable if someone else comes along and does it better. That is why it keeps adding services. The best publicised has been its proposed e-mail service, Gmail, which has upset privacy activists because it will include advertising based on the content of the e-mails. But it is likely to prove extremely popular because it will make searching through e-mail much easier and quicker, and because it offers a gigabyte of storage. For most users, that means they will never have to delete another e-mail. "

        "But Microsoft is vulnerable if a competitor shifts the focus away from the PC and on to the internet. And we all know the company most capable of that."

        Take that all to the extreme - If network centric computing and a company like google go to the logical conclusion of their efforts, subsuming encyclopedia software (remember encarta?), email, games and eventually word processing and other applications into an always on, globally available internet technology that would free you from not just your desktop but from even needing a permanent computer of your own, wouldn't the most logical thing to beat be problems with privacy?

        After all, if you can eliminate "spying" on a distributed system like that, then you've aready eliminated spyware as a matter of course (maybe by using thin clients and making all the intelligence and security reside in the server and communication layers).
      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Amiga Lover (708890) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:05AM (#10418122)
        > People have been predicting the death of MacOS and Apple for
        > almost 2 decades now. That "wizard" over at PCMag, John
        > Dvorak, has been doing so for almost that long, and look at
        > where that prediction has gone.

        Almost? He's been there right from the start with his way off base 'predictions'. He's a troll, and it gets him paid.

        "The Macintosh uses an experimental pointing device called a 'mouse.' There is no evidence that people want to use these things."
        -John C. Dvorak, SF Examiner, Feb. 1984.
        • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Insightful)

          by mwa (26272) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @06:59AM (#10419068)
          "The Macintosh uses an experimental pointing device called a 'mouse.' There is no evidence that people want to use these things."
          -John C. Dvorak, SF Examiner, Feb. 1984.

          If you're trying to discredit Dvorak, this is a bad example. The mouse has become the single most non-productive enhancement to computing in history. People used to fly through applications using TAB and function keys. Although they usually still can, they don't.

          Try waiting for a bank teller, loan processer, application taker, or yout typical computer user to do anything now and it's tap, tap, tap, reach, slide, click, tap, tap, tap, reach, slide, click, tap, tap, tap, reach, slide, click, .... just to move focus to the next text box. I find myself silently screaming TAB, dammit, TAB! TAB to the button and hit ENTER!

          What's worse is I'm finding applications that no longer implement focus shifting with tab. "Web apps" are notoriusly bad. Worse yet is where most workspaces "have room" for the mouse. Mousing literally causes in pain in my neck in my workstation.

          AFAIC, there's still no evidence that people actually want to use a mouse. They simply don't know of any other way.

      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:3, Funny)

        by atlasheavy (169115)
        I know this is off-topic, but... The Supreme Court of the United States Box? What in the world is that? Some sort of large wooden crate filled with nine elderly law-wranglers?
      • by mrklin (608689) <ken@lin.gmail@com> on Sunday October 03, 2004 @03:32AM (#10418581)
        That's your fault for getting upset by Dvorak. He is a professional troll. His job is to get various groups riled by his words which generate readership ("What will that idiot say next?") and thus generate revenue (subscriptions, magazine sales, ad revenue, etc). Dvorak is very good at what he is being paid to do. You provided a perfect example.
    • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by belmolis (702863) <billposer AT alum DOT mit DOT edu> on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:47AM (#10418055) Homepage

      As hardware gets cheaper and more powerful and becomes a commodity, Apple is likely to have an increasingly difficult time selling its own line of expensive machines. With the Mac OS now a layer on top of Unix, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple eventually gives up reserving its software for its own hardware and begins to sell Mac OS as a GUI and software bundle on top of Linux, essentially a commercial counterpart to Gnome or KDE.

      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by WiseWeasel (92224) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:08AM (#10418130)
        The falling price of components will also drive down the prices of Macs. There will always be a market for higher end computers, with actual though put into design and implementation, with the unified vision of a central authority. In fact, the rise of Linux and other open-sourced operating systems will only help Apple integrate Macs with other common OSs, as standards will be truly open. If Linux had the marketshare to define standards, that would open the door to any number of competitors who could make inter-operative software. A rise in the Linux platform's popularity (at the expense of Microsoft's marketshare) would only help smaller players gain traction. While the future of PowerPC is uncertain, depending largely on IBM's dedication to it, Apple and the MacOS are bound to have markets well into the future. If a company can assure tight integration and thoughtful design of hardware and software, there will always be those willing to pay a premium for a premium user experience.
        • Re:Mac OS? (Score:4, Insightful)

          by killjoe (766577) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @03:03AM (#10418464)
          I once read an article about the CEO of harley davidson. In that he said "harley davidson is not a motorcyle company, it's a fashion company".

          Apple is the same way. Apple sells products that people buy because they want to be "cool".

          Now just because something is cool that does not mean it sucks. Both Harleys and Macs are great products that just also happen to be very fashionable.

          AS long as apple can define "cool" it will do just fine, whether it's selling computers or earphones does not matter all that much.
      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Informative)

        by TheLittleJetson (669035) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:13AM (#10418147)
        As hardware gets cheaper and more powerful and becomes a commodity, Apple is likely to have an increasingly difficult time selling its own line of expensive machines.

        Rolls Royce still manages to sell cars.
      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:35AM (#10418219)
        When I got my 17" powerbook, I priced out a comparable dell - with you added all the things that apple included (wifi g, dvd burner, bluetooth), the apple was cheaper. Plus, I get 4 hour battery life, kick-butt looks in a smaller package, and a light-up keyboard. Please, put an end to the myth that it's more expensive!
      • Look at the problems with powerbook displays and iBook logic boards. Apple CAN'T compete on price so they HAVE to slash QUALITY to get even CLOSE.

        I own and admin a shitload of macs- ranging from a quadra 650 to G5s. The only macs I have that have BROKEN are one of the two G4s I admin, thirteen of the fifteen iMacs I admin, and BOTH of the G5s I admin (one blew a hard drive, the other the logic board and video card).

        All my beige Macs are rock motherhumping solid. Never had a problem with any of them, ev
      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Fulkkari (603331) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @02:16AM (#10418338)

        Yeah, right. Just because you only buy low-end machines doesn't mean everyone do the same. Macs are pretty popular in the media industry and have a group of very loyal fans. Unless they are going down, I doubt Apple is going down either.

        I don't see any reason for Mac OS to be a GUI on top of Linux either. First of all, it would be yet an other transition. Secondly, they wouldn't win anything at it. Linux kernel doesn't have all the stuff the Darwin kernel has. I think it's ridiculous that you are suggesting that they would switch a nice kernel that they have complete control over to a third party kernel they don't have control over which doesn't even have the same features.

        Don't get me wrong. Linux is okay and I use it too, but the truth is that it's being hyped way to much. Linux is not superior in any way as some people (like you) seem to think. Soon these people will learn that there are alternatives to Linux also. It isn't just Windows or Linux.

      • Re:Mac OS? (Score:4, Informative)

        by FireFury03 (653718) <slashdot@nexusukGAUSS.org minus math_god> on Sunday October 03, 2004 @03:56AM (#10418664) Homepage
        With the Mac OS now a layer on top of Unix, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple eventually gives up reserving its software for its own hardware and begins to sell Mac OS as a GUI and software bundle on top of Linux, essentially a commercial counterpart to Gnome or KDE.

        I think they would be completely missing their target market if they did that. People who buy Macs are getting them because they "Just Work". One of the big reasons why they "Just Work" is because Apple has complete control over the hardware they're using, they can test the software on exactly what the end-user will be using it on and make sure it all works. Furthermore, they can test upgrades on hardware identical to what the end-users are using.

        Whilest it's possible that they may eventually ditch BSD in favor of Linux if it looks like Linux will be beneficial for them, I doubt they will ever start shipping it as a stand-alone piece of software rather than a soft/hardware combo.
    • by argoff (142580) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:20AM (#10418163)

      As I said in another post, I think he knows darn well Linux isn't going to be the only other arround. He's just trying to get everyone else to gang up against Linux. It is a brilliant strategic move on behalf of MS, and a classic divide and conquer strategy. He's trying to do the same thing between redhat and novell too.
  • by OverlordQ (264228) * on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:10AM (#10417881) Journal
    but if Bill Gates says it too, it must be true:

    *BSD is Dying! (And will have died in 10 years)

    Just had to get that out of the way.
    • Re:I hate to say it (Score:3, Interesting)

      by timeOday (582209)
      but if Bill Gates says it too, it must be true: *BSD is Dying!
      It's already a nonfactor as far as BG is concerned.

      That said, Linux fills a niche that could otherwise have been filled almost as well by a free / open BSD. (I say "almost" because the license of BSD has lead to fragmentation that created an opening for Linux).

    • by pearljam145 (693265) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @03:06AM (#10418478) Homepage
      If any of you did look at the WWDC keynote by Steve Jobs, I am sure you guys would have realized by now that this entire discussion is unnecesssary. Come on, the next version of OS X (Tiger) that releases NEXT YEAR has features that Bill Gates still plans to implement in his version of Longhorn. I was astounded to hear that the OS X API would support calls that would process stuff directly on the GPU. Searchlight will deliver what everyone has been waiting for. Even today, almost a year after Panther was released, when I show a Windows user Expose', they are amazed to see such innovation. Microsoft is a company that heralded COM and DCOM as the best thing that happened to mankind since computing was developed. But today with .NET, MS says that COM is for losers. How long will be be before they do the same with .NET? I agree change is the only constant, but come on this is taking it a bit too far.
  • by rune2 (547599) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:10AM (#10417883) Homepage
    Hit by his own security vulnerabilities! I can just picture Gates running Ad Aware... heh maybe someone should suggest that he switch to using Linux and Firefox!
  • by thedbp (443047) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:11AM (#10417890)
    Is Bill telling his employees in the Mac Business Unit that all their hard work is going to be for nothing? Is he planning on shutting down the MacBU, an that's why he's saying Mac OS won't be around?

    man, that's really f-ed up. Maybe the Windows Office team are getting jealous of how good the Mac version of Office is getting and are planning on burning the MacBU to the ground...
  • OS X and FreeBSD (Score:4, Interesting)

    by ValiantSoul (801152) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:12AM (#10417894)
    claims that 10 years forward Linux and Windows will be the only OSs left in the market

    Um...Mac OS X is only getting better and more switchers from Microsoft, and FreeBSD is still running a lot of servers around the world (and ones that don't go down).

    I predict that in 10 years from now, Microsoft will be dead, linux and FreeBSD will feed off of each other making both extremely good choices (FreeBSD for server, linux for desktop). Then the competition will be between Mac OS X and linux for the desktop.
    • Ok, in the spirit of the parent, I present my shocking theory:

      In 2014, Linux will be the Unix of the 21st century. OpenVMS will run on every moderate sized box, and MS Windows 2012.L (linux version... AIX admins will get this one) will be an X client/server for remote control of all the other boxes.

      -WS
  • by chrispyman (710460) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:13AM (#10417900)
    That's quite interesting that he expects Linux to still exist 10 years from now. I thought that he expected that his SCO henchmen would actually be able to succeed in killing Linux.
    • by belmolis (702863)

      Evil intentions though he may have, Gates isn't an idiot. He may not like it, but he can see that SCO has made a complete cock-up of its anti-Linux scam.

  • ...and (Score:3, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:14AM (#10417911)
    those two operating systems will be running on Tablet PCs with 64k RAM and DRM. Oh and BOB.
  • by civilengineer (669209) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:15AM (#10417912) Homepage Journal
    "We ourselves are not going after the e-voting market or the nuclear reactor control market," Gates said.

    Who is the leader in the Nuclear Reactor Control market right now ? (I mean, what OS is running in nuclear reactors? I for one hope it's not Windows ME)
  • oh god ... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:15AM (#10417916)
    ... here come the mac zealots ...
  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:16AM (#10417918)
    Why spend the man power fixing his faulty product when you can use 1/2 the time time and just create a bandaid fix!!
  • prostoalex (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:16AM (#10417920)
    Gates is noting that Linux is taking over, and claims that 10 years forward Linux and Windows will be the only OSs left in the market.

    The only thing I see is in the OsNews article where Bill Gates is quoted to say "fast forward 10 years, the two leading OS technologies will be Linux and Windows." But "leading" is very different from "only". Nowhere does it say all other OSs will disappear.

    prostoalex, YOU must substantiate your statement NOW. Or are you spreading more anti-MS FUD??
  • Anti spyware? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by News for nerds (448130) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:20AM (#10417943) Homepage
    If MS just a bit disclose the hidden places of OS to the very owners of OS/PC, spyware will be immediately found and killed. Just make those HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\Curr entVersion\Run keys and other obscure parts more open and clear to users. Make non-technologically-competitive pieces of OS components open source. Don't lie to your own consumers.
  • by WindBourne (631190) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:20AM (#10417948) Journal

    There will be a number of OSS which will be around. In addition, ALL of the closed source will be sold to others. OS's make their real money (except for MS's) after it is put into maintence mode. Good example was hp-3000. Lost money at the OS level until it was put into mainence mode. Then it made big bucks for HP. Likewise, vms makes a lot of money for HP.

    Apple, by being based on OSS, may be spared that death, but hard to tell.

    All most certainly all the the closed Unixs will be in maintence mode or dead. What ever aspects of them that were interesting will be done in Linux.

    While BSD will almost certainly be around, I doubt that it will capture a big market. Nobody can really take the chance of MS swooping in and killing them.

    But Linux and Windows will probably be the 2 gorrillas.

    • OS's make their real money (except for MS's) after it is put into maintence mode.

      For me to buy this, I'm going to have to see some concrete examples. Got any links?

      Seems like Solaris has made money for Sun without being in maintenance mode. Same for MS. Same for Red Hat, Wind River, QNX, Palm, IBM (who have made more money and lost more money on operating systems than just about anybody), etc...

      I have nothing to back up my statements other than vague assertions but then you haven't presented anything
  • RTFA! (Score:5, Informative)

    by kcarlile (589013) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:21AM (#10417949)
    He doesn't (at least as mentioned in the OSNews piece) say that there will be ONLY two OSes left. I quote:
    He did say though that "fast forward 10 years, the two leading OS technologies will be Linux and Windows" hinting that most others (Sun, Mac?) will be eclipsed from the main business scene.
    That's not saying that MacOS or *BSD or Sun or anything else will be dead and gone. FUD (unintentional or not) from the poster, methinks...
  • Too much control? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Kenja (541830) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:22AM (#10417952)
    While I tend to be that last one to state that Microsoft has too much control over ancillary markets, I was rather disturbed by XP SP2s inability to recognize several third party Anti Virus products and cotinue to warn about the vulnarbility of the system. One wonders what F-Prot and Command-com antivirus need to do to get on the "trusted" AV list at Microsoft.
  • Sounds bad to me. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by rincebrain (776480) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:23AM (#10417957) Homepage
    Is it just me, or does this sound like a revenue service waiting to happen?

    I submit that Microsoft will only judge as spyware products which either install themselves without explicit permission, or products which are not owned by companies who pay Microsoft.

    I hate to be so cynical, but I've been burned by too many Microsoft "features" [in recent memory: IE upgrades only available to XP users, and a Windows ME setup CD refusing to install to a FAT16 partition formatted by its own boot disk] to believe much of what they say.

    Just my $0.02 USD.
  • by Ride-My-Rocket (96935) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:25AM (#10417963) Homepage
    Gates said Microsoft will offer software to detect malicious applications and that the company will keep it up-to-date on an ongoing basis.

    I don't think people need software to detect these malicious applications; when their home pages get set to http://www.pornomonkeysonmeth.com and their 3.2 Ghz processor is pegged at 100% trying to open up Notepad, I think they're already well aware that malcious applcations are present on their system.


    CNET's News.com has an article that says Microsoft plans to offer its own anti-spyware software.

    Microsoft has also gone public with their newest strategy: develop software that will prevent maltware from being installed in the first place, instead of merely detecting its presence. They have codenamed this software "Linux", and it will be offered free of charge to all existing customers.
  • by khasim (1285) <brandioch.conner@gmail.com> on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:35AM (#10418001)
    Rather than look at how the crap gets installed and dealing with THAT, let's talk about software to remove the crap AFTER it gets installed.

    Here's some advice, Bill. It's easier to prevent the stuff from being installed then it is to clean up all the millions of variations that will be out there.

    Not to mention this will be another DAILY download update along with:
    #1. Security updates
    #2. Anti-virus signatures
  • He's right (Score:5, Insightful)

    by SilentChris (452960) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:37AM (#10418013) Homepage
    Gates makes the point, which is correct, that UNIX is losing marketshare, not Windows. If anything, scientists/network admins are moving to a combination of Linux and Mac just because UNIX-creators (*cough* Sun *cough*) haven't innovated in years.

    The battle for desktop supremacy, however, is already won. I like the fact that I can run UNIX apps on my iBook, but I just built a tower for Windows. There's just too much breadth of software to shift away from the platform. MS has also come up with some good stuff recently (.NET, which in some cases is what Java should've been) that cement their hold.

    Also, one would think UNIX refugees coming to Mac would boost the platform on the desktop. Not happening. I think people are finally settling on the fact that UNIX is a rock-solid server, but that doesn't necessarily make it a great desktop. Whether it's Windows or some other windowing system that wins the crown, I'm not sure, but classic UNIX is pretty much finished.
    • Re:He's right (Score:3, Insightful)

      by DunbarTheInept (764)
      By "unix", do you mean it the way people in the computer industry normally use the term, or do you mean the way people talk about it when they know lawyers are listening? I ask because your statement only makes sense if Linux isn't included in your term "UNIX" - and really the only people who view it that way are the old guard who don't want to let go of the old days, lawyers who have to watch out about the use of trademarked words, or people trying to spread fud about the death of unix, which is easier if
    • Re:He's right (Score:3, Insightful)

      by node 3 (115640)
      The battle for desktop supremacy, however, is already won.

      There is no 'won', there is only 'winning' (or if you really want, 'won for now'). Windows might be king forever, but it's not likely at all.

      Hardware and OS's are going to continue to evolve and as time goes on, I think the specific OS you chose is going to become less and less important.

      Also, one would think UNIX refugees coming to Mac would boost the platform on the desktop. Not happening. I think people are finally settling on the fact that U
  • by Binky The Oracle (567747) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:38AM (#10418019)

    WASHINGTON, D.C. - The National Association of Wolves, Foxes, and Stoats today announced that they would be launching a new initiative, providing security services for hen-houses and rabbit hutches nationwide.

    "We're pleased to be able to expand our influence and provide this much needed security," said B. B. Wolf, the association's president-elect. "It's important to recognize that a crisis does exist, and who better to determine appropriate measures than us?"

    In a separate interview, Mr. Wolf, accompanied by some of the association's external board members, forecast that given the popularity of coyotes in the western states, wolves, foxes, stoats, and coyotes would be the only mid-range predators in ten years. "Sure, you're gonna have your bears for the big stuff, and we might get some insignificant competition from barn cats and raccoons," said Wolf, "but I don't forsee any other real competition in the field other than the coyotes. And frankly... well, the coyotes show some innovation, but we really don't think they can compete on our playing field. Plus, they have fleas."

    For more information on the National Association of Wolves, Foxes, and Stoats, please contact Jack Valenti, press secretary.

  • by antdude (79039) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:39AM (#10418024) Homepage Journal
    in the CNET's News.com article:

    "This malware thing is so bad," he said in a speech at the Computer History Museum here. "Now that's the one that has us really needing to jump in."

    It's also a problem that has affected Gates personally. He said his home PCs have had malware, although he has personally never been affected by a virus.

    "I have had malware, (adware), that crap" on some home machines, he said.

    --

    Heh!
  • Sif (Score:3, Interesting)

    by higgo6 (645437) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:41AM (#10418032)
    I would cry if mac os x died. While I think it's rather silly since more people are turning away from ms. Mac os X and linux are the OS's gaining grounds. Lest Not Forget Firefox's impact on everything!
  • by Viceice (462967) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:47AM (#10418058)
    Although progress is being made against spam and viruses, Gates said the adware and malware problem is getting worse.


    "This malware thing is so bad," he said in a speech at the Computer History Museum here. "Now that's the one that has us really needing to jump in."

    It's also a problem that has affected Gates personally. He said his home PCs have had malware, although he has personally never been affected by a virus.

    "I have had malware, (adware), that crap" on some home machines, he said.


    Maybe somebody ought to introduce him to Mozilla. I can say for certain that 99.99% of all Ad and MalWare infections are because of IE and ActiveX. I've not seen a pop up of a piece of crap ware for more then a year now, ever since I started using Mozilla.

    Microsoft doesn't need to make anti adware products. All they need to do is either replace IE or make IE as secure as Mozilla, then keep updating it and the problem will go away. An Adware program will only add to the bloat.

  • by quax (19371) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:50AM (#10418068)
    You can pretty much spin this as "see even Bill Gates says Linux will be around ten years from now".

    This should give pointy hair bosses pause in claiming that Linux is just too risky.

    What a huge step to be so publicly recognized as the most prominent threat to MS for an OS that is not controlled by any one cooperation.

    In the end it will be inevitable that an OS becomes a commodity. MS tries to fight hard against this by building up the OS to do everything short of singing and dancing for you but I don't think that will save them in the long run.
  • by microbox (704317) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:56AM (#10418091)
    10 years forward Linux and Windows will be the only OSs left in the market

    What a politically contrived statement. He can't say "only windows" (read monopoly), so their must be at least 1 other OS, and people would laugh if an open source operating system wasn't included.

    Now all of a sudden he takes the wind out of the sails of the Linux zealots, and appears all controversial. Yep... in 10 years it there will be Windows and *nix, just like today.
  • My prediction... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by JeffTL (667728) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @12:59AM (#10418097)
    ...is that everything will basically be Unix by then. Yes, even Windows, if it still exists as such. Hey, even Apple is using BSD anymore -- the handwriting is on the wall for nonstandard systems like Palm OS ...and Windows... in anything bigger than a basic cell phone, as embedded Linux in such devices as TiVo becomes more commonplace.

    But on a more article-based note, as has already been said, it seems that the OS comment is a basic "*BSD is dying" troll.
  • by Quiberon (633716) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:08AM (#10418129) Journal
    A free one and a non-free one. What they're called, who knows. The free one will successively drive out the non-free one, though.
  • FreeBSD (Score:5, Interesting)

    by kiwirob (588600) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:11AM (#10418137) Homepage
    In 10 years from now I predict I will still be using FreeBSD on my desktop and probably MacOS on my Powerbook.

    Apart from the Dell machines I have reciently purchased for my company for a web developer who needed photoshop dreamweaver etc I'd not have a single windows pc in my office. With the speed in which Eric Laffoon is pushing along Quanta and having it built into base KDE I can see a time very soon when I will make Quanta my only development platform, intergration with CVS etc just makes it a great choice for PHP and web development.

    For mail I use Evolution and simply love it. Forget about all the virus problems that Outlook has.

    In fact the only thing I think windows has going for it is Photoshop. I've tried the gimp and sorry but it just isn't there yet for me, but in 10 years time I'm darn sure it will be!!!

    Say good night Bill, you are history!!!
  • Gates on spyware (Score:5, Interesting)

    by gamekeeper (793336) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:12AM (#10418140) Journal
    Now wait a minute,,
    in the article, Gates states "Operating systems like Linux (Red-Hat) require capable system administrators to maintain.. I want to do away with that"

    Does that mean that Windows sysadmins are less capable or will be less capable in the future??

    Doesn't that say alot for their fearless Leader??
    Doesn't that say alot for his Great intelligence( or lack thereof).

    You tell me what you derive from this statement, much less the article..???

    Gk.
  • Message to SUN (Score:3, Interesting)

    by flibberdi (800264) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:21AM (#10418165) Journal
    >>
    10 years forward Linux and Windows will be the only OSs left in the market.
    >>

    stirring the pot are we? ;)

    He can't say "10 years forward Windows will be the only OSs left in the market." now can he?? (remember the european court has a ruling coming soon). He could say "10 years forward Macintosh and Windows will be the only OSs left in the market." but that would send too many to the mac sales rep. Whatever he puts in the "[any-os] and Windows will be the only OSs.." the "Linux" choice is the smartest, it will push (further) Schwartz and McNealy to launch their attack on RedHat . My guess is that he had those brainwashed to belive that LINUX is the threat to them, and if they would get back to former greatness, they could still get the high-end server market - "and between us [he put his arms around them, tilts his head and smiles], we don't plan to pursue the server market, we belive the desktop is our thing, you know, china and the expanding market" As they embraced the idea, he padded them on their backs and forwarded a bunch of cash as a part of a "bigger deal" and laught to himself.
  • Windows?!? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by linolium (713219) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:21AM (#10418166)
    Don't you think they should improve their operating system's security before they sell additional anti-spyware software? This just seems like another way to coax more money out of consumers..
  • by whistl (234824) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @01:33AM (#10418213)
    Reminds me of when the head of DEC said (a long time ago) that in the future, the world would only have something like 10 (mainframe) computers. He never foresaw microcomputers.

    10 years ago, we were all cursing Windows 3.1, because it was so unstable. Very few of us even heard of Linux. No one, at that time, thought it would be as critical to our lives as it is today.

    I predict that in 10 years, "personal computers" won't be the center of our computing universe, like they are today. We'll all have moved on to something completely different. WHo knows what that will be?

    Nobody today can possibly guess what our future computers will be like. But I sure hope whatever they are, they don't ALL come from the tiny little imagination of money grubbing jerks like Bill Gates. And if it does, God help the rest of us.

    --

    Patrick Wolfe

    "Stress is when you wake up screaming, and you realize you haven't fallen asleep yet"
  • by ion_ (176174) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @02:02AM (#10418306) Homepage

    From the article (emphasis mine):

    As to how Microsoft is going to beat Linux according to Gates, it seems to be via its software's value, rather than the price. Bill Gates is trying to create software that needs little maintainance and little support. By doing so, he hopes to cut down the number of IT administrators needed on companies (a good admin costs overall up to $200,000 per year for a given company here in the Bay Area, for example). On the other hand, Linux rivals (e.g. Red Hat) are making money primarily by support calls and require capable administrators. Gates hopes to elliminate this need.

    Wasn't it supposed to be Linux that kills jobs [slashdot.org]?

  • Spyware (Score:3, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 03, 2004 @02:09AM (#10418320)
    Now if we could get the ISV's to put spyware under one tree:
    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windo ws\Curr entVersion\SPYWARE\Run
  • Crap (Score:5, Funny)

    by melted (227442) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @02:52AM (#10418433) Homepage
    If _BillG_ has to run anti-malware programs, everyone else is in _deep_shit_.
  • by Linker3000 (626634) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @04:28AM (#10418750) Journal
    Let me translate for you: "Our software leaks like a sieve....so we're going to start selling corks..."
  • by Syre (234917) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @05:13AM (#10418842)
    Bill Gate's critical point in this interview, and how he intends to compete against Linux in the server market is actually something to be concerned about.

    From the OSNews article:

    As to how Microsoft is going to beat Linux according to Gates, it seems to be via its software's value, rather than the price. Bill Gates is trying to create software that needs little maintainance and little support. By doing so, he hopes to cut down the number of IT administrators needed on companies (a good admin costs overall up to $200,000 per year for a given company here in the Bay Area, for example). On the other hand, Linux rivals (e.g. Red Hat) are making money primarily by support calls and require capable administrators. Gates hopes to elliminate this need.
    This is a real issue. Red Hat and the Linux companies have little incentive to make products which require less support, because this could cut into their support contracts.

    Microsoft then can show a lower TCO by putting lots of resources into making management easier and do-able by lower level cheaper employees.

    They could win (at least temporarily) with this strategy if we aren't careful (and don't get administration on Linux to be as easy and automated as possible).

  • My OS predictions (Score:4, Insightful)

    by plopez (54068) on Sunday October 03, 2004 @11:17AM (#10420225) Journal
    in 2014 we will be running Windows XP, SP7.

    Seriously, they are having problems writing Windows for AMD64. While open source OSs chug along. Will linx run on mainframes? It already does. Will windows run on mainframes? It probably will never make it. As long as there is a spectrum of hardware Windows with its sloppy architecture, coding and design will be locked into to the low end of the market. billg is out of touch, or just plain doing market speak (same thing really).

Algol-60 surely must be regarded as the most important programming language yet developed. -- T. Cheatham

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