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McAfee, Macromedia Flirting With F/OSS Community 286

Posted by timothy from the batting-eyes-shuffling-feet dept.
xbsd writes "Those computer industry specialists claiming that the end of Linux is fast approaching may be interested in two recent movements inside the industry. Two weeks ago, McAfee, one of the world leaders in computer security products, launched its first commercial antivirus solution for Linux, and just yesterday, Macromedia announced that it is joining the Eclipse Foundation and plans to deliver a next-generation rich Internet application (RIA) development tool code-named Zorn based on the popular open-source IDE."
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McAfee, Macromedia Flirting With F/OSS Community More

McAfee, Macromedia Flirting With F/OSS Community

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  • Oh crap. (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:23PM (#12753405)
    Does this mean McAfee is going to start releasing virii for linux too?
    • McAfee may have thought about this for some time, but check out the Macromedia - announcing getting in Linux business day after the news about advancing works over GPLFlash v2. Coincidence? Yeah right.

  • Anti-Virus (Score:5, Informative)

    by ThisIsFred ( 705426 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:26PM (#12753429) Journal
    By the way, the most effective and affordable AV program of the Windows world, namely Grisoft's AVG, already runs on Linux. Prepare for competition, McAfee!

    • Re:Anti-Virus (Score:5, Interesting)

      by bersl2 ( 689221 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:29PM (#12753447) Journal
      There's also ClamAV, which is a GPLed virus scanner (mainly for mailservers, but it does have a daemonized scanner and a CLI-based frontend).

      • Re:Anti-Virus (Score:5, Informative)

        by mattyrobinson69 ( 751521 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:38PM (#12753506)
        its also better than any scanner ive seen for windows in memory footprint and not hogging the screen during updates (usde freshclamd to update for you).

        Plus there's klamav (kde frontend) which is quite good.

        • Re:Anti-Virus (Score:5, Informative)

          by ThisIsFred ( 705426 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:52PM (#12753586) Journal
          I use ClamAV on the server-side, but only as a proactive tool; It halts the spread of viruses when used in conjunction with dazuko, because it blocks access to the infected files. ClamAV's drawbacks are that it can't repair files, and its quarantine feature isn't sophisticated enough to properly file away infected files. It can only dump them in one location, which is obviously bad when two files with otherwise important data happen to have the same name.

          I note that ClamAV might have had a memory leak up until 0.80, but it appears to be fixed now. Also, it's totally sweet how easily it can be configured to target certain areas, certain files, or even certain sizes of files. As you can see, I have not forgotten about ClamAV. :o)
          Plus there's klamav (kde frontend) which is quite good.
          Don't forget the Windows port!
      • Last I checked, ClamAV doesn't do real time scans on files (which is nice on a windows station!)

        Have they got that working now?

        • Re:Anti-Virus (Score:3, Interesting)

          by stevey ( 64018 )

          I don't think they've even cared to try.

          But it's no great loss, there is a kernel module available to allow on-access scanning for arbitary purposes : Dazuko [dazuko.org].

          I used that to hookup real-time virus scanning with a couple of different engines - there's a userspace deamon which you can use to block, or allow, any file operations with.

        • Re:Anti-Virus (Score:5, Informative)

          by niiler ( 716140 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @09:32PM (#12753828) Journal
          This is honestly one of the most annoying features of Windows AV programs. If you aren't click-happy, you don't need such features, especially on a linux box. When you turn it off on Windows, your machine speeds up by a factor of two.
          • Problem with your statement. Simply opening the window that contains the infected file can cause it to be executed. Windows reads the EXE file for file attributes, icon, etc.

            I've had many viruses attempt to spread simply by browsing their parent folder. Usually required me to scroll over them first, but not always. Depends on the virus, and on your windows version/settings.
          • Maybe, but one thing that is true is that it is the only way to have a "preventing" antivirus instead of a "corrective" one.

            In my Uniersity they use the Sophos antivirus, which monitors when files are Open, Read, Write. If it finds a virus it will deny you the access to the file. That way your computer wont be able to get infected.

            I think that is a 10000000 times better approach for the end user, instead of having to disinfect your files / computer after it have been infected imagine, when John Sixpack do
    • It's ironic that you should quote RMS in your signature, because he would be the first to point out that McAfee and Grisoft's programs are both proprietary software -- the opposite of free software. Thus, these proprietary programs have nothing to offer users in the free world and these organizations are merely treating the free software community as a market.

      Doubly ironic that so many people consider anti-virus programs to be a part of good security because using a proprietary virus scanner is like askin
    • There is also Sophos AV [sophos.com], which supports [sophos.com] Windows, MacOS X, NetApps, Linux on Intel and Alpha, FreeBSD, HP-UX, AIX, Solaris, Tru64 UNIX, SCO, OS/2, OpenVMS, and NetWare. I had never heard of them until going to college, where Sophos was their "mandatory AV product" for all students, and haven't heard of them since. But I was pretty impressed by their product. Of course, I've gotten exactly one virus in my entire life, and it was a harmless DOS-era boot-sector virus acquired from a friend, so I was impresse

  • End of OSS? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by XFilesFMDS1013 ( 830724 )
    Who actually believed the people who were saying that Linux et. al. were going to fail? I mean, there's millions of people who want to use a better OS, and more importantly, many of those people also want to help to make their OS better.

    • Re:End of OSS? (Score:2, Insightful)

      by N3Roaster ( 888781 )
      Plenty of people believed Linux would fail. Many still do. There are a lot of people who simply don't get the notion that mortals can build something as complicated as an operating system. It's assumed that the people who know how and would be working on that sort of thing would be doing it in a corporate setting, completely ignoring the fact that lots of people developing Linux do so in a corporate setting. Take a random computer using non-geek who has never knowingly encountered Linux (or had a bad introd
    • For a propellerhead treatment of the question, there is this Hah-vahd link: http://hbsworkingknowledge.hbs.edu/item.jhtml?id=4 834&t=technology [hbs.edu]

    • Re:End of OSS? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by ErikTheRed ( 162431 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @09:25PM (#12753779) Homepage
      Who actually believed the people who were saying that Linux et. al. were going to fail? I mean, there's millions of people who want to use a better OS, and more importantly, many of those people also want to help to make their OS better.
      It's the same group that thought the Internet was 'just a fad.' And remember how that group included Microsoft?

  • Macromedia? (Score:5, Informative)

    by Conception ( 212279 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:28PM (#12753442)
    By Macromedia, you mean Adobe right? Super F/OSS friendly Adobe.

    • Re:Macromedia? (Score:5, Funny)

      by Stanistani ( 808333 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:52PM (#12753587) Homepage Journal
      Macromedia releasing...
      a next-generation rich Internet application (RIA) development tool code-named Zorn

      Hmm... "Zorn." Where have I heard that before?

      Didn't "Zorn" mean "utter destruction" in the rabbit-language from Watership Down [langmaker.com] by Richard Adams?

      'Zorn! Zorn!' cried the dreadful squealing voice. 'All dead! O Zorn!'

      • Zorn (Score:3, Informative)

        by fforw ( 116415 )
        Zorn is german for "anger, rage"
        • Either way... odd choice of a name... kinda desolate and hostile.

          Hmmm. Googling. Zorn is a jazz musician, an artist, and apparently a mathematician:

          Zorn's Lemma

          If S is any nonempty partially ordered set in which every chain has an upper bound, then S has a maximal element. This statement is equivalent to the axiom of choice.

          Or in layman's terms - "I meant to do that!"
        • Zorn was also half of the duo "Zorn and Thorn" in Final Fantasy 9. They were the ones that dressed like jesters and one was always like "We will get Zidane" and the other was all "Get Zidane we will".

          They eventually joined to make one monster that you beat with the help of Mog, and you got the ribbon.

          Interestingly enough, did anyone else know that, in final fantasy III, at the part where Locke rescues Celes, and you're underneath South Figaro, there's a Ribbon in the 2nd basement, right underneath the 2n
      • Hmm... "Zorn." Where have I heard that before?

        Anders Zorn [www.zorn.se] was a swedish painter, probably not where you heard it but it's the only Zorn I've heard of..

        /Mikael

      • Well, from the google search [google.com] it would appear Zorn is really Tzadik [tzadik.com]. So I guess that clears things right up.
    • The parent is first to mention that Adobe DID buy Macromedia [slashdot.org] (for $3.4B). Adobe isn't exactly nice with its patent arsenal (which it used to sue Macromedia), and hasn't made known any intention to support F/OSS.

      • Adobe also helped put Dmitry Sklyarov in jail [freesklyarov.org]. Adobe is not an organization we ought to do business with because they treat people so badly. Bad laws don't deserve respect either, and I realize that Adobe is not a legislative body. However, the damage Adobe helped bring on is real, and their actions against Sklyarov show us that they're willing and able to wield that power against others. We should hold in contempt those that would stump for and use the power bad laws give them to stifle our freedoms.

  • from McAfee's datasheet... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by brer_rabbit ( 195413 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:32PM (#12753466) Journal
    from the first line of McAfee's datasheet...

    The world reverberated from the effects of viruses such as Nimda, CodeRed, and more recently, Slammer, Mydoom, Netsky, and Bagle.

    well, the Windows world reverberated....

    • Re:from McAfee's datasheet... (Score:4, Informative)

      by Slime-dogg ( 120473 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @09:14PM (#12753707) Journal
      All the world. Though non-windows systems were not affected, the bandwidth sure was.
    • I don't think you understand. The main payload of those viruses was not the one listed on the McAfee's site under "payload". The huge problem was that it brought coorperations and isp's computers to a screeching halt because of the sheer volume of traffic they generated. The members of the linux world using those servers suffered as well.

      A solution that monitors traffic through linux servers for Windows viruses warrents an opening like that, since 99.9% of the viruses it catches will be windows virus
  • I am glad that they are releasing an anti-virus solution for Linux.

    Yes, there are almost no viruses that *run* on Linux, but there are viruses that arrive in my mail and on disks that I am handed by clients. I at least want to identify which viruses I am dealing with so I can inform my clients. ClamAV does not recognise all of the new ones. (Have to collect them all!)

    Unfortunatly the "buy on line" link starts at 11 licenses, not one.

    As for Macromedia, I would be happier if they would provide a Flash cl
    • Correct if I am wrong, but ClamAV is a virus scanner for the mail stream, and not for the system. McAfeee is for the linux system as a whole and not for filtering a stream. No Comparision can be done.

      Yeah, it would be nice to see Macromedia move all their items to Linux. If they did, they are more likely to be the standard than will be whatever MS comes up with.
      • You're wrong. ClamAV can scan pretty much anything, including Samba shares, which is extremely useful.
      • The "clamscan" command is a command line virus scanner. The problem is not usage, the problem is up to date virus signatures.

        ClamAV also tend to have a problem with false detection of viruses in multi-part zip and rar files.

        I prefer to use a number of scanners. It helps find the unusual viruses and trojans.
    • Just so you know, there's about a zillion free-for-home-use Linux antivirus applications. F-prot [f-prot.com] and Panda [pandasoftware.com] are just two of them. Personally, I run NOD32 [nod32.com] on both Windows and Linux, but it aint free. It's good to see McAfee with a no-setup-drama on-access scanner though.

  • Turnabout (Score:5, Interesting)

    by overshoot ( 39700 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:36PM (#12753490)
    Well, fair's fair.

    Microsoft bought a Rumanian company that produced border protection (protect MS clients by filtering on Linux hosts) and turned around to "cut off [McAfee's] air supply" with an MS client antivirus offering. Of course they shut down the Linux border filters.

    In return, McAfee fills the vacuum by offering a Linux-hosted border filter.

    Works for me.

  • Viruses (Score:2, Funny)

    by m85476585 ( 884822 )
    When will they release anti-virus software for macs?

  • we cancelled the Mcafee contract at our company (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:38PM (#12753503)

    we had a virus that corrupted MSIE (mshtml.dll) Mcafee was instantly disabled, that 100mb install became useless all because Mcafee based their application dialogs on the MSIE component

    we cancelled our contract with them soon after as we realised that if Mcafee dont understand security (they understand marketing though) so we will have to find someone who does understand security, and knows not to base the last line of defence on the biggest exploitable product on a windows system

    ClamAV is looking good because of the costing though reliabilty and accurate is still a concern

    -SJ

    • Might I suggest Trend Micro.

      Seriously, it's the only one i ever recomend to corporate customers. You can test their scanner by going to housecall.trendmicro.com. They release new pattern files as soon as they have them (none of the "wait till official release tuesday" shit like symantec) - and they release more than one a day if need be.

    • If this virus was running with enough priveledges to modify system DLLs like that one, then there's not much any virus scanner can do about it. If it had the ability to modify that DLL, it could have just as easily modified any other DLLs that any other virus scanner depends upon.

    • Totally have to agree here. Older versions of McAfee and Norton/Symantec Antivirus weren't bad, and I used to recommend them. Current versions of both now depend on the MSIE engine, and as you pointed out, can be instantly disabled by a corrupt IE engine, or even just changed security settings.

      I am the author of a small antivirus tool for Windows, and I saw first-hand how one of the viruses/worms I deal with turned up the security level on IE in all zones - making the user unable to run McAfee or Norton be
  • McAfee have had scanners for Linux for a while. They claim this is the first on-access scanner, though.

  • McAfee is not big deal, but Macromedia is (Score:3, Insightful)

    by WindBourne ( 631190 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:41PM (#12753526) Journal
    WHile I would rather see a real FOSS version of flash, shockwave, etc. I am happy to see Macromedia starting to take interest in OSS platforms. But sad that it takes the OSS world developing competition to get them to notice it.

    As to McAfee moving to Linux, well, that is not a big deal. It will make many of the PHB's and MS techs feel better about it, but it is like hanging a lock on the handle of a safe. It is the safe that is doing the real work, not a simple lock that attaches to the handle. McAfee will be a waste of money.

  • McAfee (Score:5, Interesting)

    by lheal ( 86013 ) <lheal1999NO@SPAMyahoo.com> on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:49PM (#12753572) Journal
    McAfee started out as a shareware company, selling an antivirus program for MS-DOS and Macintosh.

    They acquired a bunch of smaller companies, then started calling themselves "Network Associates" soon after they acquired that company.

    While they haven't ever been open source, they've usually (always?) had a product you could download and use without first paying them for it. And I think they have always given out free updates.

    I wonder how much of their corporate culture has survived from the old days? To what degree is "McAfee" just a brand name?

    • Re:McAfee (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Professor_UNIX ( 867045 )
      I wonder how much of their corporate culture has survived from the old days? To what degree is "McAfee" just a brand name?

      Absolutely none. Network Associates decimated many good products until they could do nothing but sell them off or spin them off into other companies at a substantial loss. TIS was absorbed into the NAI collective and they promptly ran Gauntlet into the ground as a firewall and then sold off the pieces to Secure Computing. They bought PGP, made a bunch of crappy releases and then s

  • So is this the DreamWeaver Answer? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by syntap ( 242090 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @08:59PM (#12753630)
    Macromedia announced that it is joining the Eclipse Foundation and plans to deliver a next-generation rich Internet application (RIA) development tool code-named Zorn based on the popular open-source IDE.

    Perhaps this is Macromedia's way of bringing something like the equivilent of what MacroMedia UltraDev set out to accomplish (basically Dreamweaver used as a dev tool). Is it possible Macromedia's involvement will be basically to skin Eclipse to make it more familiar to current Dreamweaver users?

  • Fear the virus (Score:5, Funny)

    by Colonel Panic ( 15235 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @09:01PM (#12753639)
    Yes you really need virus protection on Linux. The situation is dire. There are thousands of viruses being brewed up around the world to infect Linux boxen. Be afraid, be very afraid!!

    But now McAfee has come to your rescue. Only $49.95 for complete peace of mind.

    I feel so much better already.

    • Yes you really need virus protection on Linux. The situation is dire. There are thousands of viruses being brewed up around the world to infect Linux boxen. Be afraid, be very afraid!!

      But now McAfee has come to your rescue. Only $49.95 for complete peace of mind.

      I feel so much better already.

      Did you stop to think that there is added value in a linux application server scanning for windows virii from uploaded files? What about being able to scan your samba shares on your file servers. Wouldn't it be
  • MS are getting into AV, MS is getting into lots of things that they used to leave to ISVs... bring down MS, and the computer world is full of opertunity again.

  • Who is going to run the software.I think most Linux guys know not to open those emails that say:

    "Hello friend! I found this fantasic update for you! I hope you like it!"

  • Flirting? (Score:5, Funny)

    by ErikTheRed ( 162431 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @09:38PM (#12753869) Homepage

    Gee... I hope we get dinner, a good bottle of wine, and a movie before we get screwed.
  • Unfortunately for OSS, McAfee isn't looking for a serious relationship right now. She's been dumped by her long-term boyfriend, and really just wants a fling. They might have some fun for a night, but she's not going to return OSS' calls.
  • This is actually the second Eclipse initiative related to Macromedia products. It's just the first one to be officially developed by the company. For a while now, ColdFusion developers have been able to use the open source CFEclipse plugin [tigris.org] for development on Eclipse.

    From what I understand about Zorn, it will allow you to create Flash applications via the Flex framework in Eclipse. Flex is essentially an XML syntax for building Flash applications. It's much more geared to the developer market than the desi

  • use my free, gpl'd virus scanner instead (Score:4, Funny)

    by Trailer Trash ( 60756 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @10:42PM (#12754267) Homepage
    Put this in your root crontab:

    0 0 * * * echo "You're runnng Linux, you don't have a virus."
  • Please enlighten me guys. Are there linux viruses or what? Or maybe McAfee will scan windows (WINE) binaries or something?

  • Dear Macromedia: (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Heretik ( 93983 ) on Tuesday June 07, 2005 @10:59PM (#12754392)
    Make it truly open, or piss off.

    We've had plenty enough of your proprietization of the Internet, thanks.
  • or does "proactive anti-virus" sound like an oxymoron?

  • Story wrong (Score:2, Interesting)

    by dhammabum ( 190105 )
    McAfee has had VirusScan for Unix [mcafeesecurity.com] available for years. This is not its first "solution", nor does it say so in the press relase....


  • Wait, virus protection for Linux? Aren't Linux and Macs virus-free?

    That's one thing that I've always hated. People decide that because it's Linux/Mac, it's vulnerability free, and justify that as a reason not to secure it.
  • So I guess their product logo will be a huge, flaming ball flying through space on its way to destroy all life in the universe?

    Or will it be the weird little squishy piggy thing Zorn kept as a pet in his desk?

    Maybe... Just a coughed up cherry. :)
  • So because McAfee and Macromedia introduced linux products, all doomsayers have been proven wrong once and for all? It's only a big toe either company has trepidly dipped into the Free/Open Source Swimming pool. For all we know they could be pet projects just to keep their developers happy.

    I'm a linux user, but I will neither use nor need either product.
  • How about a 64-bit flash and shockwave plugin for browsers like firefox compiled on a 64-bit system?
  • I would have thought the URL was a clue:

    http://www.mcafeesecurity.com/us/about/press/mcafe e_enterprise/2004/20040524_104736.htm [mcafeesecurity.com]

    It's in there twice: 2004.

    The press release just says May 24, perhaps they are counting on Slashdot to rehash it for them every year.
  • really. Why TF link to these people? Dont give him that!

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