Microsoft IE 7 Goes (More) Beta

Hans W. Smith writes "Microsoft has unveiled Internet Explorer 7, releasing the new "preview" version of its Web browser to the general public for testing. The latest version works only with Windows XP Service Pack 2 and includes many of the features Microsoft has been touting for months such as: privacy protection,tabbed browsing and a search box similar to Firefox. They tried to outdo Firefox tab browsing with a feature call Quick tab which shows thumbnail view of all open tabs in a single window." Yup, you saw it yesterday. Posting before coffee never works.

"Quick Tab"

[arcdx]

They tried to outdo Firefox tab browsing with a feature call Quick tab which shows thumbnail view of all open tabs in a single window.

This can be accomplished in Firefox by using the foXpose [mozilla.org] extension.

IE7 is a dupe!

[Alphab.fr]

The "new" quicktab feature is nothing more than a copy of the Firefox Viewmatic Foxposé...
http://viamatic.com/index.php/firefox [viamatic.com]

And M$ says to dev, please install IE7 Beta and test your pages... except that if I do that, it kills IE6, and I can't check my pages as they'll be seen by 90% of visitors...

grow up

[Anonymous Coward]

Of course digg posts articles faster, but at least at slashdot, most of the users aren't fifteen year old kids with nothing better to do than post comments like "Mac is kOOL!"

About the article..as for me, I'm really looking forward to IE7. For all the great aspects of firefox, it still has many shortcoming, like being extremely slow and opening the occasional webpage incorrectly.
If IE7 can offer tab browsing and do a reasonable job, I might just switch back over. If it sucks, then I'll just stick with my current browser, Opera.

Re:Microsoft should thank Firefox

[CyricZ]

I know you're joking, but keep in mind that many of the innovative developments which are credited to Firefox actually appeared first in other browsers, such as Opera, Konqueror, and Amaya. Tabs, ad blocking, mouse gestures, and so forth.

Re:Arn't they bored?

[masklinn]

I'd suggest switching to Firefox 1.5, which does free the tab's memory (unless it's within the set cache size and stuff), and actually remembering to set the cache size.

Re:"Quick Tab"

[masklinn]

For the tab dragging&dropping, you may want to check the Super DragAndGo and TabMix Plus extensions (I don't even remember how tab dragging&dropping works in out-of-the-box Firefox though, I never use it without plugging a dozen extensions in)

Re:css fixes?

[Bogtha]

Yes, yes and yes [msdn.com].

I appreciate that it's a genuine question, but a completely information-free comment should not be Score: 4, Insightful.

Re:IE7 is a dupe!

[feste12]

To Microsoft's credit, if you install the IE7 beta, there is a one-click uninstall which reverts you back to IE6 (without even restarting your machine). The web developers out there shouldn't worry about testing their sites. They can always switch back to IE6.

Needs "Genuine Advantage" validation

[james_bray]

Just to save some people the bother of downloading....

IE 7's Rendering Abilities seem worse

[Kasracer]

Check out Slashdot itself. On Opera, Firefox, IE 5 and 6, it seems to render nicely. Check out Slashdot with IE7. A good chunk of the bottom overlaps all sorts of stuff. I can't read the last few lines of someone's reply if they're the last comment. Also, my website www.binaryidiot.com renders perfectly with IE 5, 6, Opera, Firefox, Safari, Konquerer. In IE7, it places the add that should be on the right, between the navigation and the content. There is a HUGE space there. For some reason I am also seeing a lot of horizontal scroll bars for many pages. Looks like I'm going to need to make even MORE server side code to make sure IE7 works correctly. This is very frustrating. I wish the rumour that Microsoft purchased Opera was real. At least then we'd have a decent browser to work with. Another thing bothering me about IE7 is all the inconsistancy. Some back and forth icons, as well as the Favorites Center icon all have jaggies on them (these are seem even more with theming off) yet the icons on the right of the address bar look flawless. Also, I'd say almost 100% of windows applications have a menu at the top. Does IE7? NO! You have the option for the class menu but then it places it between the address bar and the tabs. If you unlock the bars, you can't move it up or down. There is no setting to put it where it belongs and if you have theming on, it has some odd lines on it that don't do anything. I fear for the web

I tried it ... some thoughts.

[Gnascher]

1. They are requesting that developers install it and test thier sites and report back. However, it installes OVER IE6, so you can't have them both on the same machine. This is a major showstopper for a developer, since we NEED to have IE6 installed for current functionality and compatibility.

2. Fails the Acid2 test miserably

3. They've moved the Refresh button to the right of the address bar, while the Forward and Back buttons remain in the same position ... this is just dumb. All the navigation buttons should be grouped.

4. The "Stop Navigation" button has also been moved over to the right. They've also changed the look of the button to a red "X", so that it now looks like a "close something" button instead of a "stop this action" button.

5. They've "fixed" the functionality that allows you to utilize many CSS hacks to compensate for IE's rendering flaws, however they haven't fixed the underlying bugs that the "hacks" were intended to fix. As a result, a lot of sites I checked out that rendered just fine in all current browsers (including IE6) are now broken in IE7, because the "hacks" no longer work in IE7, but thier standards complience is still shoddy, and thier box-model still sucks.

6. The graphics for the tabs looks "clunky" as compared to other tabbed browsers.

7. They've hidden the main menu, so now you have to go through a few clicks to find the options that used to be only 1 or 2 clicks away.

Overall, I hope they don't think that this release is close to production readiness. They've changed a number of things just so that they look different, while in the process breaking a number of UI conventions that have long been established an work.

They've still got a lot of work to do in thier CSS support ... I don't understand why even some of the most basic CSS functionality is beyond thier ability to grasp. I can understand some of the more 'advanced' CSS features being a little tricky to interpret and implement, but basic positioning, sizing, padding and margin issues should be pretty easy to understand.

They claim to have fixed .PNG alpha channel transparency, and that's true ... to a point, but it doesn't work when the .png with transparency is used in a layer in some cases.

One thing I can applaud them on is that they've added the ability to use XMLHttpRequest without using thier proprietary ActiveX control, which will simplify those of us writing AJAX code into our web apps. They claim the old ActiveX method will still work for legacy support though.

So, that's my take. They've come a long way from IE6 ... but I beleive that they've got a long way to go in order to have a final release of IE7 that can truly compete against the other players in today's browser market.

Re:"Quick Tab"

[dema]

A shot from OminWeb's website: http://www.omnigroup.com/images/images-5/features/ tabs.png [omnigroup.com]

And Shiira on OS X has a similar feature called tab exposé: http://hmdt-web.net/shiira/screenshot/en#tabExpose [hmdt-web.net]

Re:"Quick Tab"

[virtualsid]

I think it's more sensible for me to post the marketing blurb by the Omniweb guys themselves:

Omniweb Features [omnigroup.com]

I hope that gives a vague idea - but somethings like the Workspace feature are best to be seen in action:

Press F2, and you get your ebay workspace with it's own history and set of pages up
Press F3, and you get your online comics all loading up in their own tabs come up.
Press F1, and you get your news + slashdot workspace. etc. etc.

The thumbnail tab browsing can be turned to text/thumbnail depending on preference. I normally use text tabs, not thumbnail - I can fit more tabs in that way :-).

The best bit really is that if the browser does crash (and unfortunately, it does at times), when you restart you are pretty much exactly where you left it, including history, so you can use that back button. The only issue you will have is if the site you were browsing has sessions, then it won't necessarily 'just work' - you'll have to log in again.

I hope that helps a little.

Sid

Re:"Quick Tab"

[Sir Codelot]

Or you may try the Reveal [mozilla.org] extension.

Re:Ready for prime time?

[Gnascher]

Apparently it passes the Acid2 Test.

Really?? It failed miserably when I tried it. The pieces were spread all over the screen, some with scroll bars, and all layered in front of a big red background.

Heh ... even if you graded them on a curve, they'd still get a D, since Firefox almost gets the acid2 test right.

It quick renders Digg.com (sometimes it takes ages on IE6), but I can barely click on the One Pixel Banner.

It renders Digg's HOME page fine, but click around the site, and you'll start noticing some positioning errors. Go to the "Digg For Stories" section, and you'll see some DIVs climbing over each other on the left nav.

Re:Enough of the tabs already

[Gnascher]

For now, view-source sitll uses notepad. I don't know if they've any intention to change this.

However, If you want contextual highlighting on IE view-source, just replace your OS-supplied notepad with one of the developer's notepad apps out there.

Re:"Quick Tab"

[DesireCampbell]

The best bit really is that if the browser does crash (and unfortunately, it does at times), when you restart you are pretty much exactly where you left it, including history, so you can use that back button. The only issue you will have is if the site you were browsing has sessions, then it won't necessarily 'just work' - you'll have to log in again. I love that - I've got Session Saver [mozilla.org] for FireFox. It can save multiple windows of multiple tabs as "one session" and then save multiple sessions - i love it.

Re:IE 7 and 6 live peacefully together?

[toddbloom7]

Just install IE 7 as a standalone version [pinoytechblog.com] using the iexplore.exe.local hack. Viola, IE6 and IE7 are both available.

Re:IE 7's Rendering Abilities seem worse

[porneL]

IE7 isn't compatible with IE6 bugs and hacks anymore, but it's still far behind other browsers in standards compiliance. That's going to be a real plain for web developers - both IE and non-IE code breaks in IE7.

Re:MS flip flop

[stubear]

While it wasn't in Internet Explorer, Microsoft had tabbed browsing in their help browser (based on IE) for Visual Studio long before even Opera had tabbed browsing. You do know Opera had tabbed browsing before Firefox don't you? Firefox, contrary to Slashbot mythology, did not invent tabbed browsing, extensions, nor any of the other features that are common to the application. In fact, Firefox, while a competent browser, is nothing more than a shining example of the lack of innovation in the open source community. It clearly deomnstartes the lengths that open source developers will go to in aping features and design conventions from other apps and claiming them as their own, going as far, in some cases, as to claim they were invented by the open source application.

Run IE7 locally without replacing IE6

[AC-x]

The iexplore.exe.local trick seems to work for IE7.

Simply download the installer, use WinRAR or similar to unpack the installer into a folder, add an empty file called "iexplore.exe.local" then run iexplore.exe.

No having to uninstall IE6, or even install IE7 at all. The interface gets a bit messed up but it's definitely running a new engine (still some CSS bugs I can see tho, tut tut....)

Channel 9 Video

[BunkAsInBed]

http://channel9.msdn.com/showpost.aspx?postid=1594 60 [msdn.com] has a video of some of the IE development crew talking. The interesting thing was there was a googl hat on the desk of the office he guy was in.

Re:Arn't they bored?

[Omestes]

You should try it on OS X, it has been a persistant (and persistantly ignored) bug on OS X for the last couple version (pre-PR, even). It runs like FireFox did on Windows around 0.5 . I can't cite my own usage right now, because I'm using the G4 Deerpark port, so my memory and processor use will be slightly more in-line than vanilla Firefox.

But with use, and exstensive tab use I will still climb into the hundreds of megs, even with the process idling. (App closed). As said above, the only way to clear up this wasted memory is by killing the process.

On OS X, it becomes almost unusable. I toy with switching to Opera daily, and use Safari for all my small tasks. Sadly, Safari updates kill Pithhelmet, so I lose my adblocker. And Opera seems rather like bloatware.

How to Run Both IE6 and IE7 PB2 On the Same PC

[wolverine1999]

This page explains how you can run both on the same PC without needing a virtual machine. It works well for me.

http://weblogs.asp.net/jgalloway/archive/2005/12/2 8/434132.aspx [asp.net]

Re:Run IE7 locally without replacing IE6

[Wierdy1024]

I highly recommed AGAINST doing this - IE7 runs fine, great etc., but when you close IE you'll find that windows explorer can no longer open folders, and that Internet explorer can open a web page, but hyperlinks no longer work. If a hyperlink is clicked 152 internet explorer windows open up, all saying "Action Canceled", and then the machine runs out of memory. I spent ages with system restore and registry backups trying to undo all IE7's registry changes, but in the end I had to format and re-install windows.

So overall, DO NOT DO THIS UNLESS YOU DON'T MIND BREAKING WINDOWS EXPLORER AND IE6!!!

Re:"Quick Tab"

[kitzilla]

As I believe at least one poster has pointed out, thumbnail image tabs have been around in Omniweb [omnigroup.com] on the Mac platform for a while.

Thumbnail tabs aren't for everyone or every application. But they're more than a visual gimmick if you use them properly. A picture is worth a thousand words -- and you can only get about two words on a tab without clicking it. I find a row of iconified web pages easier to sort, particularly before you get really zeroed in on something. If you're a visual person, this might be the case with you, too. All you need is screen real estate and RAM.

Anyway, thumbnail tabs are more than gimmickry if you use them properly, and if you process information visually. I tend to use Omniweb for heavy lifting, and Shiira or Safari for everything else.