One In Five Windows Installs Is Non-Genuine

snib writes "Microsoft disclosed Monday that, according to reports collected by the notorious Windows Genuine Advantage tool on millions of users' PCs, 22% of all Windows installs do not pass its validation tests and have therefore been deemed non-genuine. Quoting: 'Since WGA launched in July 2005, over 512 million users have attempted to validate their copy of Windows, Microsoft said. Of those, the non-genuine rate was 22.3 percent... [T]he Business Software Alliance... reports that 35 percent of the world's software is pirated (22 percent in North America)...'"

The number is high

[adamstew]

I know for a fact that my install is 100% genuine...Although WGA has flagged it as non-genuine.

I obtained my copy of XP from a university site license that was given to all the students at the university of Pittsburgh. They just recently invalidated that site license...so you are looking at tens of thousands (if not a couple hundred thousand) students, faculty and staff that were all using that key that is now non-genuine.

i dont think that word means what they think it me

[User 956]

Microsoft disclosed Monday that, according to reports collected by the notorious Windows Genuine Advantage tool on millions of users' PCs, 22% of all Windows installs do not pass its validation tests and have therefore been deemed non-genuine.

genuine /dnyun/ -adjective

1. possessing the claimed or attributed character 2. descended from the original stock; pure in breed:

Even pirated software is genuine.

Unsurprising... use alternative sources

[Anonymous Coward]

A friend just bought a Toshiba laptop with Win XP at Christmas. Fresh out of the box, WGA thinks it is invalid.

Yay. Another pirate foiled, as far as WGA and MS are concerned. Of course, the reality is, he hasn't been able to update his system, so his security patches are out of date, and it will slowly get worse with time.

I recommended AutoPatcher [autopatcher.com] as the solution. It's a heck of a lot easier than waiting on the phone for MS or Toshiba support.

I hope MS weighs all those frustrated legitimate users against all the "pirates" they think they are catching.

Being legit is a pain

[zakezuke]

I currently have 4 machines running windows presently. Two desktops, two laptops. The laptops are quite legit, both came shipped with windows, Media center edition, and Pen edition. The desktops were not shipped with windows but have legit copies of XP pro on them.

The laptops, i've only had issue with one, the Toshiba pen edition. I "wanted" to do a fresh install on a fresh drive, but didn't have the tablet edition, nor was downloading possible as no copy would take my legit key.

Desktops, I've had NOTHING but issues. Motherboard upgrades, pre WGA systems would fail to authentiate. Post WGA systems in all fairness the warning was a tad more tolerant. I could browse the net, and get a resolution, well, except for the fact that on my via based board you needed to download the USB drivers, so alot of hassle to backup a system who's motherboard failed, who due to Nortons wouldn't mount under XP, just to get the same glitch when trying to transfer the old install to a new system.

I understand what microsoft is doing. They are trying to prevent casual piracy, those casual pirates who would otherwise buy one copy and use on many machines are likely to just buy another copy. But what they are actually doing is encouraging people like my self to download a cracked version of xp pro corp.

It would be "nice" if you could tell freaking windows "I bought new hardware, transfer this license". They can be control freaks till their hearts explode, so long as they continue to permit me to
1) Backup my existing install of windows
2) in the event of hardware failure, restore a backup, and have it work, or transfer the hard disk to another machine without assuming i've gone rogue.

Two invalid from major OEMs 50% of WGA fails valid

[Anonymous Freak]

I do on-site computer repair. In the last 6 years, I have only seen the WGA notifier notify of two truly invalid copies of Windows. (In both cases, the user knew/acknowledged that their copy was likely not properly licensed.) In the same time, I've seen hardware from HP and Dell both come with a key that the MS program cites as invalid, and declares non-genuine. Both with their original OEM installs.

So of WGA-flagged installs I have seen in the past few years, HALF were, in fact, valid installs that were flagged improperly. What was REALLY goofy is that one succeeded in re-activation, and even after re-activation, WGA still insisted it wasn't valid! (The other didn't need reactivation.)

Re:Really?

[dlim]

It's also theft. Did you miss the part where he lifted it from his employer?

idiots

[lewis2]

I've bought/built about 20 PCs for personal use over the years. I bought retail or retail upgrades for each machine (I have 3 concurrent licenses in total). Recently I got a SMART warning and swapped a data drive. I had to talk to a Microsoft support person to get a new license key as the one that came with my install CD didn't work. I since then had to swap the system drive and submitted a support request b/c it won't run windows update and they assigned me a case # a month ago and haven't called back. Fortunately for the community I know Microsoft's machines - even when patched - are a risk so I don't allow them on the public network without a firewall (openbsd in my case). However they should know better than to prevent a paying customer from applying their patches.

Re:A la Bash.org

[Fordiman]

Feh. I don't bother with WGA. Check out http://www.windizupdate.com

False..

[a16]

What you're saying is simply not true.

It's true that MSDN AA licenses are "restricted" in that you can't use them for commercial use, and you can't use new licenses/new installs after you leave an institution that is part of an MSDN AA program.

However they specifically state that you may continue using already installed software for as long as you wish after you leave your program, as long as you keep to the original non commercial rules - ie. follow the original license requirements. Therefore if they're marking an install as non-genuine, they aren't keeping to their own agreement. What I suspect happened here is that an institution has been giving out the shared media with a shared key, which isn't how it works (or at least not how it works wherever I've seen this) - students can share installation media but should still be granted individual keys by the MSDN AA administrator.

Re:Well...

[pla]

Your story is telling...mostly telling lies. Added RAM? that alone wont cause it to need a new key.

Presuming you mean that seriously, rather than just to troll the guy...

He said, and I quote, "I added a gig of RAM and a different video card" (bolding mine). Two changes, depending on which ones, can trigger reactivation.

Really quite annoying, actually. I find it much easier to just pirate VLK versions. That way, no messy activation (or cracks thereof) to bother with.



To which I will reply: Fine, Why didn't you just call Microsoft?

Have you ever called a company to tell them they've made a mistake? Hmm?

Trust me, it takes far less time to just download a "third-party patch" to correct the problem, than trying to do things the "right" way.

Re:The number is high

[eli pabst]

I had the same issue happen at the University of Pittsburgh and it wasn't just limited to student software. The volume license key I was given as a student was identical to the one that my department IT administrators had, so this wasn't just an issue of "loaning" it to students. The "real" reason they decided to invalidate the license key was that Microsoft wanted them to start giving out XP disks that had *individual* license keys rather than a volume license so that they could track who was distributing software.

From the U of Pittsburgh's own software distribution site:

"Students are permitted to keep, for their personal use, copies of Microsoft software received under this license upon leaving the University."

Plus I just read the official Products Use Rights statement and their isn't anything about loaning or revoking the license at any time.

Re:A la Bash.org

[Jjeff1]

False positive rate?
Not sure, but we do work for schools. I walked in to a computer lab one day, and saw perhaps 5 out of 30 machines with a stupid WGA error message. Mind you, all of these machines were the identical model PC, purchased at the same time, imaged at the same time, with the exact same WinXP disk image and the exact same internet access.
Based on that, I'd say their 22% rate is just about accurate, though not for the reasons they think.

Re:My policy is...

[molarmass192]

If your copy of Ubuntu won't play DVDs, that's between you and Google, my friend

I know you're being funny, but last time I checked, Windows didn't play DVDs "out of the box" either. Try laying down a fresh XP or Vista install and playing a DVD. On that note, there is 1 "legal" way I know of to play DVDs on Linux, and (sadly) it's via the CNR [linspire.com] ... as for no-so-legal ways ... umm ... Google!

Re:A la Bash.org

[basscomm]

I had a similar thing happen to me, upgraded one too many times in X number of days. However, I called Microsoft's telephone activation (per the dialog box that popped up), gave them the code that Windows gave me, assured the guy on the other end that I only had XP installed on one machine, and they gave me a code to activate.

Re:Well...

[rsmoody]

I agree. Let's not forget all of the false hits. My favorite thing is when you have to reinstall an OEM (Dell, HP, Compaq, etc) and you don't have the exact fracking CD to use and naturally the completely LEGAL key won't work or if it does if fails to validate, drives me up the fracking wall! What fracking difference does it make if the CD is not the exact one? NONE! It's still fracking legal! God I hate M$'s bull$h|t! All I am doing is LEGALLY installing a LEGAL copy of Windows using a LEGAL key! The last time, I was told by the recording to contact the manufacturer of the system, no option whatsoever to talk to someone in India. What fracking good is that going to do other than delay me and my customer further and cost my customer more by being forced to order a restore CD that refuses to allow me to do a repair install. Gee, thanks for the help. At least with linux, you can just keep the home folder and save all of your info and settings. That's a big no-go with anything from M$ because clearly they know that when you buy a system from a vendor and it comes with Windows, you can't possibly have the need to do a repair install, the ONLY thing you will EVER need to do is format and start over. Ugh.

Re:A la Bash.org

[Anonymous Coward]

Search google...

"wga crack" ext:bittorrent

Solves the problem, and puts the WGA numbers back where they should be.

I distribute a miniCD to friends that fix that WGA problems with windows XP.

Re:Church Charges and Windows Tax

[Technician]

That's cheaper than the church charges.

What church charges? I was under the impression it wasn't mandentory. They recommend a tithe which is close to what the government charges for what the church used to do. Government didn't used to have Social Security. The Tithe was for the church storehouse to feed widows and elderly. The Government has replaced that function which most churches no longer perform.

Offerings is for the operation of the church. It is seprate from the Tithe. Most churches haven't kept them seprate and no longer teach what the Tithe and offerings are for.

Remember, the Government (in the USA) has taken over the church Tithe. Offerings are a gift and not mandentory.

The same can not be said for a Windows License.

Re:A la Bash.org

[Endo13]

What's the false positive rate?

I don't know any exact figures. But I do work in a PC repair shop, and here's what I've seen personally. Out of dozens of PC's we've worked on that came up as not having "genuine" Windows XP, we've had about one or two that actually had illegal copies installed. The rest were all false positives. Even worse, I've personally tested an illegal copy and it passed the WGA with flying colors. Didn't even have to pull any special tricks or use hacks.

So personally, I would have to say any figures Microsoft gives on this aren't even close to accurate.

Re:A la Bash.org

[lukas84]

Are you sure they were really false positives?

Most problems with XP i've seen so far are machines that do have a valid Pro OEM Key to be installed with a (well known pirate) VLP Pro Key.

This problem was mostly caused by lazy pc repair shops and neighboorhood kids.