Texting Teens Generating OMG Phone Bills 888
theodp writes "Last month, Washington high school junior Sofia Rubenstein used 6,807 text messages, which, at a rate of 15 cents apiece for most of them, pushed her family's Verizon Wireless bill over $1,100. She and other teens are finding themselves in hot water after their families get blindsided with huge phone bills thanks to hefty a la carte text messaging charges." Use of SMS in the US doubled from 2005 to 2006.
Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
This is really nothing new.. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
No More Phone.
Why text when you can talk? (Score:1, Insightful)
It's convenient once in a while- I get about 1 a month. For situations that you can't be disturbed in, it occasionally makes sense to text.
However, I don't get the obsession with texting that some teenagers have. Why text when you can talk? It's a heck of a lot easier, and texting is a literal pain to (I don't get how someone can type 200 texts a day and not have their fingers fall off).
It seems kind of silly to use text messages on a device with such limited input. A few phones have keyboards, but even then the keys are so small it's easier to talk.
Re:15 cents each?! (Score:5, Insightful)
Now it is 15c each way. I dont see how they can justify charging that much for a tiny exchange of data. It has risen WAY faster than the rate of inflation on a technology that should become cheaper (look at how minutes have come down) and it is ridiculous. My guess is that the only reason it works for the phone companies to do this is that the first people to start using them heavily are the kids with their parents buying them mobile phones. They dont have to pay per message so they dont think about the ridiculous costs (look at how much data is in a text message and how much a provider charges for data usage and it becomes clear how much of a rip off it is).
Re:Two words: (Score:4, Insightful)
I blame the parents (Score:1, Insightful)
Old news here (Score:4, Insightful)
Kids have always had insane phone bills. That phenomenon didn't hit the US with their flat local call plans, but here it's been a lengthy battle between the kids who prefer the impersonal way of communication because it eliminates the "danger" of "saying the wrong thing" with your body, and their parents who have to foot the bill for it.
Who's disciplining the parents? (Score:5, Insightful)
There's so many things wrong with that sentence I don't know where to begin.
asynchronous, faster, and persistent (Score:5, Insightful)
If you have something quick to say, a text message is much faster and more convenient. Texting is also particularly useful for bits of information you might need later.
OTOH, SMS is a really crappy technology. I think it's vastly overpriced even given how inefficient it is, but... wow. And the telcos have little incentive to fix it as long as people are willing to pay insane, outrageous prices per byte.
Re:6,807 messages? (Score:4, Insightful)
LOL
I (heart) U
U 2
U See WHF (what's his/her face)
OMG
Ugly
OMG YNK (you're not kidding)
I can easily seeing a totally meaningless conversation with nothing but acronyms and shortcuts and words no bigger than 5 letters, all in the span of a few minutes. Makes me wonder about our next generation. It really does.
Re:Not just kids ... talk to my wife (Score:5, Insightful)
That's a solid relationship you have there.
Three letters: WTF ??!? (Score:5, Insightful)
Let's compare: Digital cell phones use about 14.4 Kbps of bandwidth. (which explains their clarity) Figure about 30 seconds of talking to get the equivalent of a text message, with the "Hello, is SO AND SO there? Yeah. Yeah. It's Billie. 'O, o joy ur so kul'. -CHUCKLE- Ok, see you later. By by. ".
That works out to a total of 54,000 bytes, or 108,000 Bytes/minute. I get about 1,000 minutes at $70/month, a la Verizon. Each minute therefore costs $0.07. So the cost per 30 seconds of conversation is something like 3.5 cents, for 56,000 bytes.
An SMS message is, at its longest, 160 Bytes long. Include headers, let's be generous and say it's double that. (it's not) 320 bytes in an SMS message. Here, we're asking for 15 cents for just 360 bytes?!?!?
Voice
54,000/3.5 cents =
SMS
360 bytes/15 cents =
If you were buying soda, it'd be like buying a 12 oz can of soda for about $20 while a 2 liter bottle costs $1.
Does that seem like good math to you? BTW: I bought into "unlimited text messaging" back when Verizon offered it, and have refused to upgrade plans until I get it. I've got a network monitor, and when something goes wrong I can get tons of messages all at once if I'm not careful.
Ah the good ol days (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Unlimited SMS.. (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Parents and teachers are pussies. (Score:5, Insightful)
In most jurisdictions, that's "willful destruction of property" or a similar criminal and civil infraction.
The rule of law does not allow the government to take private property without fair compensation. A teacher is, at best, part of the government. I suspect any teacher that earned their school a $300 replacement fee would pretty quickly loose their standing.
An "F" or detention is much simpler.
What 6807 messages really amounts to (Score:3, Insightful)
Frankly if I had a kid sending text messages that often, I'd send them to a psychologist to try to help them figure out why they have this obsessive compulsive problem that they can't stop using the phone, and to help them get over it. A kid who is texting that frantically all the time has *problems*.
Oh, and I'd tell them they have to pay the bill, even if that means paying me back in installments.
No one said teenagers are intelligent (Score:2, Insightful)
It took me about 2 and 1/2 minutes of work a month. As I've always maintained, the vast majority of teenagers are far from the sharpest tools in the shed. It isn't exactly a difficult concept.... each text costs money, hence the more texts you send, the higher your bill will be.
Of course I also paid my own phone bill when I got my first phone at age 15. So a good solution would be to tell your kids that if they want a cell phone, pay for it themselves (no age restrictions on pre-paid plans). Pre-paid plans are also good if you pay for your kids' cell plans, because if they use up all of the money on the account, their phone simply stops functioning.
And last but not least, parents who let their kids use a service that is billed based on usage with no restrictions whatsoever kind of deserve to have this happen.
Re:Unlimited SMS.. (Score:5, Insightful)
And the assholes who run the companies use that to their advantage.
Re:Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Two words: (Score:2, Insightful)
1) Unlimited Texting plans
2) Pre-paid phones
3) Forcing the teens to pay their own phone bills
etc etc
Why don't we also completely forbid their access to computers as well and keep them in locked rooms just because they MAY look at porn.
Kind of a short-sighted solution if you ask me.
Re:Two words: (Score:2, Insightful)
If you're a good parent, you shouldn't have to resort to abusing them with the examples you provided.
Re:Why text when you can talk? (Score:5, Insightful)
It's an asynchronous conversation. If I want to know if you are coming to the pub later, I don't need to know right now, I don't need to interrupt what you are doing, and I don't particularly want to chat, because that's what we'll be doing at the pub. If I see a programme on television about fat chicks, I might text my mate — who is a bit of a chubby chaser — to take the piss, but I don't necessarily want a response or to talk to him. And from a purely lazy perspective, sending a few words via text message just seems like less hassle than a conversation. I'll typically talk to between six and ten people when deciding what to do at the weekend, it takes much less attention and time to do it with SMS than with voice.
Slashdot translation: voice == TCP, SMS == UDP. Voice and TCP require a set-up, whether that's a three-way handshake or a "Hi how are you doing?". SMS and UDP just communicate the relevant information and let you deal with it in your own time.
because it is a contract (Score:3, Insightful)
When you sign a contract saying 1 = $0.15, you are making the option of not spending $15 for a flat-rate you don't find necessary. If you think you're gonna be using lots and lots of SMSs that month, you should upgrade to the flat-rate plan.
Also, your analogy is flawed: is more like, suppose 1/3 liter Coca-Cola cans were $1 each and 3-liter bottles $2. At the beginning of the month, family A buys 10 such bottles. Family B, however, buys 3 cans each and every day. They will get the same amount of Coca-Cola, but family A saved 10 bucks.
Everyone knows larger packages are cheaper in terms of cost-to-benefit ratio. If you feel you're likely to reach the flat-rate pay-off limit, sign for a flat-rate. If your kids are not manageable enough, use pre-paid plans or punish them cutting other amenities to teach them to value their parents' hard-earned money.
Of course, there is still the wild WTF of having TO PAY to RECEIVE SMS in US, which simply doesn't make any sense to me
Re:6,807 messages? (Score:2, Insightful)
Yeah, kids these days. With their new-fangled gadgets and loose morales. There's just nothing you can do to keep them off your lawn.
Seriously, stop wondering about the next generation and own up to the fact that you were retarded when you were 14 too.
Re:15 cents each?! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Who's disciplining the parents? (Score:3, Insightful)
- A lobbyist - the most evil profession next to advertising executives
- for Dow Chemical - a most evil company
- "nearly died" when they got a $70 charge - to have "nearly died" over a $70 fee when you're a well paid lobbyist is insulting; being uninsured, breaking your leg on the job, getting fired from your minimum wage position because you can't work, then getting a $16,000 hospital bill is cause to have "nearly died" upon opening a bill
- for their 20-year old daughter - who needs to get a job to buy some fucking scissors to cut the fucking umbilical cord
As for "it is their business - not yours," I would respectfully disagree. It became our business the moment they let themselves be interviewed and have the information published.Re:Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
But seriously, most of the time bad behavior is the result of misunderstood parenting.
Some people give the kid no boundaries and not enough guidance, which is a disaster.
Some people give their kids too many boundaries and too much guidance, which also is a disaster.
(And quite a few parents get it right)
The kid in scenario 1 will feel like their parents don't love it and don't care for its wellbeing.
The kid in scenario 2 will either rebel, or become a follower unable to make its own decisions.
Balanced does it. The real world is an ambiguous place, and your job is to prepare your kid for the real world.
Re:Two words: (Score:4, Insightful)
Why is it that spanking, bed without dinner, or walking home no longer acceptable forms of punishment? Asking your child to try harder to make 'positive choices' isn't going to stop any disciplinary problems.
Re:What 6807 messages really amounts to (Score:3, Insightful)
Frankly if I had a kid sending text messages that often,
Our parents were afraid of/bothered by rock and roll/Madonna. We're afraid of/bothered by texting.
It's just the way kids like to communicate today. We've created a very connected society (SMS, IM, etc) and that's what kids are used to... constant communication with all of their friends. It's a new social order, really.
Re:Two words: (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:A $1,100 phone bill? TSNF! (Score:1, Insightful)
As a teacher...this is true. Have had other teachers show me papers where their students do this & it makes me shake my head. The funny part is that the teacher can't fail the student...the parents will come down on the teacher like a load of bricks. The funniest part is when the students arrive in their freshman college classes & pull this BS.
At every school in the district...cell phones are forbidden to be used. I see them being used in my classes & ask once for them to be put away. The second time...they are taken to the office at the end of the day. The principal is paid the big bucks...he/she can take the heat for "the parents little angels" not being able to follow simple directions like no cell phone usage.
Am I the only one who thinks that ad should be advocating for parents to completely ban their children from text messages?
You & I...along with fewer & fewer people...agree with each other. On the other hand...when "parents" are weak-willed & unwilling to be parents...you expect them to stand up to their "little angels"? Not going to happen. I constantly put up with children verbally attacking me & others for trying to make them mind & do the job their parents are not. Unlike their parents...I know what the word "NO" means in many languages & am willing to tell their "little angels" that no matter what you think...NO means you can't do that...no matter what you think. They don't like that answer...the principal will explain to them what "NO" means.
The concept of "good parent" is new... (Score:3, Insightful)
A child is a human being, after all--and (s)he encounters many situations, and many environments, while growing up. The home environment is important, and is terribly neglected in today's society--but it's not everything. Similarly, teachers and schooling aren't everything. And scheduled activities aren't everything. And television isn't everything. And free time isn't everything. They all come together and mix it up with a child's nature.
A good parent, yes, can do a tremendous amount. But a good parent functions (largely) within the context of an external world, and some children are harder to raise than others, good parent or no.
It's not only kids... (Score:5, Insightful)
Some of them do make an effort. But the breadth of vocabulary, the precision of their diction, and the depth of their thought have--for the most part--declined over the years. Multiply that difference by about a thousand and you'll know what's happened in the New York City Public Schools. (Once upon a time, they were among the best in the world.)
There are some counterexamples... but not many.
Re:Two words: (Score:3, Insightful)
To that point, some kids really, really, need the carrot, and the stick is a bad idea. Just the same, spare the rod, spoil the child. Ignore the child, spoil the community.
Re:Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
Bollocks. I'm sorry, but you really are just talking politically correct crap.
For a start, there's no such thing as a perfect parent or a perfectly behaved child, no matter how good your intentions. If you really have children and you really believe they're little angels, have you ever had an honest discussion with their school teachers to make sure they're not just hiding their poor behaviour from you and indulging in it elsewhere? A lot of parents don't, and have absolutely no idea what they're missing. (And yes, I have worked in a school, and seen this phenomenon a surprising number of times.)
More philosophically, which is really more cruel to a child, a quick smack when they do something wrong so they understand that their behaviour isn't acceptable, or the emotional trauma of, say, being denied part of their weekly spending money allowance, which will punish them for several days?
Pain is nature's teacher, and using pain to discipline children is entirely natural. Arguments like yours, which equalise all forms of physical discipline, are painting a coloured world in black and white. In fact, I no longer support certain child protection charities precisely because they can't tell the difference between a parent with a temper who regularly beats their child (a genuine and serious problem) and a loving parent who uses occasional physical chastisement to teach their child what is and isn't acceptable behaviour.
Re:Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
You're about the only person here who's not a real retard.
Re:Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
Then physically and mentally abusing your kid will only cause him to become more evil.
So don't.
Instead, stop seeing your child as "just plain evil", and start looking for solutions to his problems.
Re:Two words: (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Two words: (Score:3, Insightful)
Sending a kid that won't eat the dinner he's been cooked to sleep with no food is not a form of abuse. What are you supposed to do, make him what he wants? My parents never did and I came out fine. If he's hungry, he'll eat what he's been cooked.
Re:Who's disciplining the parents? (Score:3, Insightful)
2 words (Score:1, Insightful)
Phone companies are hurting themselves (Score:5, Insightful)
Look at this story. Verizon got a one-off payment of $1100 from one customer, and maybe similar payments for a few more. However, by charging this money, they have alienated these customers, and worse, generated extremely negative publicity for themselves.
Even on technology-loving Slashdot, there have been many responses like these:
- Kids shouldn't be sending so many text messages
- I blame the parents for not controlling kids' use of their phones
- I don't like text messages anyway
The whole story is in effect a big advertisement for cutting down on your use of text messages.Verizon and other phone companies should switch customers who overspend like this to an unlimited price plan, retrospectively for that month - so that the customer never pays that high bill. They would lose money on this deal, but in return they would gain the gratitude of their customers, who are more likely to stay with them, bringing in a steady flow of income from their unlimited-messaging plans every month.
What's more, these customers on unlimited plans are going to send more messages, encouraging those around them to reply, and increasing the overall use of text messaging. Even if their friends or family are using different providers, the increased volume of text messages will increase dependence on mobile phones, creating a culture in which mobile phone use is accepted, and benefiting the industry as a whole.
Even criminals extorting money via kidnapping or blackmail are careful to consider what their victim is able and willing to pay when deciding on their charges. Being careful not to surprise customers with expensive charges is simply good business.
I have three problems with this. (Score:3, Insightful)
Why not use a prepaid, why not use an account with cheaper SMS?
The second problem I have with this is the goddamn phone companies charging so much for text!
In some markets where the consumers aren't idiots, the rate for a text is 1c or even less - in Australia it's a nice butt rapingly harsh 22 or 25c on average
The third problem I have is with companies that let exaggerated bills generate in the first place, I realise it's not their responsibility to an extent but every few years you hear of little Jonny dialing a 1800 number to speak to hot wet sluts for 300 hours in a month and his family end up owing 25grand or something - credit card companies put a freeze on excessive bills, where's this freeze for mobile plans?
But really,.... get a damn plan with unlimited SMS or something.
Re:Two words: (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm a teenager living in my parent's house, and I can honestly tell you I'm glad they spanked me and grounded me and chewed me out when I was younger, because it taught me not to give them a reason to punish me further on in life. I'm sick of parents who let their kids (my friends) do whatever they want because they're more concerned with being the child's friend than being their parent. Sure, you can be friends with your kids, but you still have to be an authority figure and prepare them for the real world, where they can't do whatever they want without repercussions. Be there to talk to them, laugh with them, and help them with problems, but also be there to slap their hands when the reach for the cookie jar out of turn. If you're a good parent, you'll know how to balance friendship and authority.
That being said, you obviously need to be responsible in your punishments. Spank your child, but don't beat the crap out of them with a wooden switch. Ground them from something they hold dear, but not from something they need- monitor computer use so it's only for homework, or limit their cell phone to family numbers and 911. Send them to bed without supper, but make them a decent breakfast the next day, and talk things over with them as they eat (this an especially good way to show you've forgiven them and make amends). Kick them out of the car on the way home from school, but not a long way from home. Don't take your anger out on them- you want to teach them, not torture them. If you're a good parent, you'll know the difference.
Re:Two words: (Score:2, Insightful)
Greed (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Two words: (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Two words: (Score:3, Insightful)
Society is getting to the point where the desperate PC desire for everyone to be "equal" is trickling down to children as well. Let me tell you something: children are not equal. They are not "little people". They are blabbering semi-functional idiot savants that require a lot of discipline and guidance to be able to grow up and function in society. That has been true since humans first started breeding. They are also beautiful and innocent. That doesn't mean they should be given drugs or sent off to therapy because fucked up parents can't be bothered to assume the responsibility of educating their own offspring, or because some stupid law or social perception makes it "bad" to plant a big loud one in their rear because they broke the den window after being told ten times to go play baseball somewhere else.
You "new age" touchy-feely "send Jimmy to the shrink so I don't have to abuse him" people make me sick. You think your kids are so better off than everyone else's and you're damaging more than you could ever know. Humanity has been raising children for thousands of years, and we've done good. Discipline is not abuse, no matter how much you'd like that to be the case. Learn to tell the difference between the two, or shut the fuck up.
Re:Two words: (Score:5, Insightful)
According to whom Doctor Spock? You? What makes you the expert? Where's the Ten Commandments of parenting given from on high that works in every possible situation? You're incredibly naive.
Re:Two words: (Score:3, Insightful)
The plain and simple fact is, most people are plain and simple. They don't philosophize. They react. If they know they can get away with something, they'll do it. This is as true of adults as it is of children. The raising of children is not so much to instill an understanding of right and wrong, but rather to learn the consequences of bad behavior. If they end up actually doing deep thinking about morality, great. But don't hold your breath.
Denial (Score:3, Insightful)
But what if X is true
Stop seeing X as true!
Denying the existence of a problem is one of the most common ways to deal with problems. It does not have good track record, but people usually deny that as well, building a solid fortress of logic against reality.
Re:Two words: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Two words: (Score:3, Insightful)
If your kids are so scared of disappointing their parents, then they have a whole slew of problems far more severe than a tanned ass. If they are hurt more by your disappointment than by physical pain I fear for their mental health.
My fiance and I will not start trying for children for about a year, so I cannot speak from experience other than from talks with other parents and psychologists. But I sure hope that my children shed more tears from being spanked than tears from fears of disappointing me. I hope I am never that consistently controlling or demanding of my children.
--
Re:Two words: (Score:3, Insightful)
(a) give little Johnny a time-out?
(b) give little Johnny a lecture about how to behave in public?
(c) blow little Johnny away?
Re:Two words: (Score:2, Insightful)
Regardless, generally, unless a kid has genuine mental problems, a firm-but-fair approach works. A child is like any other half-wild animal; establish authority in a non-threatening way and from there it's smooth sailing. In fact with kids it's even easier - you can talk to them, and they're a helluva lot smarter than a dog.
Re:Two words: (Score:3, Insightful)
Otherwise the military and law enforcement would just need megaphones and bags of candy. As evidenced by modern military and police actions, laws, punishment, some people need to have the shit beaten out of them and even killed before they and their peers will behave.
If physical force has to be used to keep adults (who definately know better) in line, how is it even remotely possible to keep some kids in line without force or threat of physical force.