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Software Businesses Hardware Linux

Hardware Vendors Will Follow Money To Open Source 194

Stony Stevenson writes "Dirk Hohndel, Intel's chief technologist for open source, believes the installed base of Linux-based desktops could potentially double this year, based just on Eee PC sales. Speaking at open source conference Linux.conf.au in Melbourne, Hohndel said commercial pressure will be the incentive for traditionally Windows-centric hardware vendors to begin offering open source drivers and Linux-based systems to their customers. 'Open source has made the most inroads in the server market, where Linux-based servers represent roughly a quarter of the total market. But in other segments, such as mobile phones and desktops where open source hasn't had as much of an impact, vendors were less interested, Hohndel said. Linux penetration of the desktop environment is currently at around 0.8 percent, but Hohndel said consumer behavior is changing this.'"
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Hardware Vendors Will Follow Money To Open Source

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  • by pleappleappleap ( 1182301 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @11:42AM (#22247038) Homepage

    could potentially double this year
    This statement doesn't mean a whole lot. What could potentially happen and what's likely to happen have never exactly been the same thing. I, myself, do believe that this is likely to happen, but saying that it could potentially happen is a cop-out. I could say that an asteroid could potentially hit the Earth this year. I'd be right, but I wouldn't be saying much.
  • Integration is key (Score:5, Insightful)

    by TheMeuge ( 645043 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @11:46AM (#22247084)
    While I think he makes sense, I think something else will be a far more important factor in driving Linux and open-source into the mainstream - the integration of technological products based on linux, across multiple platforms. The Google phone concept, if it is realized successfully by multiple companies, will certainly provide much of the impulse needed to push Linux into the consumer mainstream.

    Just the ability to sync your mobile phone with a Linux platform (which I assume it will provide) will be a huge boost for Linux on the desktop, when it comes to small and medium business.

    Actually, the slashdot "does it run linux" meme is very much appropriate here. If the devices you want run Linux and are compatible with other Linux devices, it only makes sense to adopt an all-Linux home/shop/business, etc...
  • by AoT ( 107216 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @11:49AM (#22247132) Homepage Journal
    To be fair, a lot of people don't care about embedded because no one sees the OS in embedded systems. It just isn't as Glamorous as desktops. Not that embedded systems aren't important mind you.
  • by splante ( 187185 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @11:51AM (#22247154)
    That's only if you call the Eee pc a desktop. Don't they even refer to it as a "mobile internet device" or something like that?
  • by Asic Eng ( 193332 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @11:56AM (#22247244)
    saying that it could potentially happen is a cop-out

    He said something different though: "The Eee PC is expected to hit 3 and a half million in 2008. There's a single computer that's going to double this figure this year". It seems the cop-out is in the summary rather than in Hohndel's statement.

  • by morgan_greywolf ( 835522 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @12:01PM (#22247322) Homepage Journal
    Yeah, this might sound wacky to some, but it's actually right on the money. Integration is a key selling point for the desktop leaders, Microsoft's Windows and Apple's OS X. If I walk into CompUSA, Best Buy, or buy something off of NewEgg or whatever, it's pretty much a given that it's going to work with Windows. In addition, if I walk into an Apple store, it's pretty much a given that anything I walk out with will work with the latest version of OS X.

    On Linux, we get a bad rap for poor hardware support. It's not really the case. We have good or, in many cases, excellent hardware support for a wide swath of popular hardware. But you have to do the necessary research to know what to buy and what not to buy when it comes to buying hardware for your Linux machine. In the Windows world, you stick with the big names -- they're guaranteed to work. In the Linux world, one scanner model from a vendor might be supported by SANE and another from the same vendor might not be.

    A bright, enterprising individual would do well to come up with an online and -- even better -- a brick and mortar store that specializes in selling hardware that works well on Linux. Sure, it's been tried before and failed -- but that was then and this now and Linux has gotten much better support for hardware in recent years.
  • by betterunixthanunix ( 980855 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @12:02PM (#22247340)
    I am always a bit wary when people talk about usage of some particular system "doubling." Linux usage will undoubtedly increase on the desktop, but doubling? That's a very generous estimate of the situation. I would be happy if it doubled, if only because people would slowly stop assuming that everybody in the world is either a Windows or Mac user. Let's be serious though: it will not double, unless someone big like Dell or HP actually tries marketing their Linux systems. Dell's Linux systems go un-advertised, and therefore unnoticed by anyone who doesn't know what Linux is or why it is worth their time.
  • by tripmine ( 1160123 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @12:04PM (#22247366)

    He believes the install base of Linux-based desktops could potentially double this year, based just on Eee PC sales..
    Double of a small number is still a small number.
  • by somersault ( 912633 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @12:20PM (#22247558) Homepage Journal
    IMO it's already been happening, even without the Eee PC. Dell and other large vendors (dont Walmart do cheap Linux desktops?) are taking notice and getting on board. Vista is making people aware that they don't have to just use XP, and the fact that it has a lot of incompatibilities, and plain sucks, makes it a better time for people to try out alternatives (or 'evangelise' to their friends, but I cba these days, I'm happy even with little things like Firefox taking off and showing the possibilities of opensource software on the desktop.. in fact I have to point out Firefox next time someone looks incredulously at me when I suggest that they can get a free piece of software like the GIMP to perform a function that they usually pay for..)
  • by InlawBiker ( 1124825 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @12:24PM (#22247618)
    Let's face it, not a lot of people are going to wipe out their Windows and install Linux. But something like the 'eee' is a good platform to put a wedge in the door. Even if it's just a tiny wedge. People will use it without even knowing it's Linux. They will understand that part of the low price is because Windows isn't on the machine.

    All they'll know is they can surf and do email, and maybe listen to some music. Next they'll want to know if they can open a spreadsheet or write a document. Eventually they'll say, "Oh, this is Linux. This isn't so bad."
  • 0.8 percent? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by sm62704 ( 957197 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @12:31PM (#22247726) Journal
    How do they come up with this figure? Microsoft can count every PC sold with Windows installed plus other licenses sold, Apple can count computers sold, but GNU can be freely given away.

    I gave copies of Mandriva to several people last year. None of these copies of that OS is counted as a desktop OS; they are counted as Windows, since they were either added to Windows machines as dual boot or replaced Windows completely.

    A lot of GNU desktops MUST be being counted as Windows. Nobody asked ME how many copies of Linux I gave away!

    Someone (Clemons?) once said there are three kinds of lies - lies, damned lies, and statistics.

    -mcgrew
    (don't bother with today's journal)
  • by mabhatter654 ( 561290 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @01:17PM (#22248436)
    Actually reality is that NOBODY has commercial games anymore.. Windows has games, but they're not in the numbers XBox or even PS3 as far as sales. Mac gets crumby games and they're growing... why?

    The opportunity is open to move laterally into Vista territory. Vista is "better" than XP, but not better "enough" to throw away XP and spend twice as much money on a Vista compatible computer.... since Microsoft spent the entire XP era shooting PC gaming in the foot (with XBOX) the number of people that care about high performance is dwindling... combine that with Intel's "integrated" graphics that again limit gaming or other high end apps and 75% of customers really aren't buying machines much past these low end boxes.

    The downside of Vista is that there is really nothing special Vista does, few apps, etc, that do something you can't do on Mac or Linux. (as we've taken gaming off the table and most people don't run "high end apps") Now is the time OEMS will want to move some hardware anyway they can. Due to the price of Vista, the sub $300 market is ripe for linux picking. The very dangerous thing will be when OEMS start selling small systems to do "just one task" very well.. eeePC is the tip of that spear... as they sell them hand over fist, more OEMS will want do do that too.
  • by bkr1_2k ( 237627 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @01:41PM (#22248726)
    What's next? A broader support base; in users, vendors, and monetary support across the board. With more support come more advancements under the hood as well as better applications. With more advancements, the gaps in market share will also drop a few percent more over time, possibly more than a few percent. Then the end-user will really have true choice.
  • by Just Some Guy ( 3352 ) <kirk+slashdot@strauser.com> on Thursday January 31, 2008 @01:43PM (#22248752) Homepage Journal

    And they will love you for it, until they try to edit their photos with GIMP.

    I think your average user would be better served by other applications [koffice.org]. And for all the times I hear "but they won't have Photoshop", I have to wonder how many people actually use PS in the first place. Outside a handful of graphic designers, no one I know has it installed.

  • by cdrguru ( 88047 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @02:19PM (#22249296) Homepage
    Linux hardware support might very well come. Open-source drivers aren't going to be the way it happens.

    The problem is today most computer gear is commodity chips with the software/firmware/driver making it a unique product with a value proposition for the consumer. The hardware is easy to replicate - China has built a large part of their enconomy doing just that. The software is more difficult - so much more difficult that successful companies in the hardware space may be taking advantage of Far East production of the hardware device but keeping the firmware and drivers close to the vest. Failure to do that invites theft and results in a cheap knock-off with the R&D provided for them.

    What this means is a printer where the driver does most of the work is cheap to design and cheap to produce. Anyone can copy the printer. Copying the driver - unless the hardware is 100% identical - isn't going to work. But if the source were available, it could easily be adapted to slightly different hardware by a junior programmer. Instant windfall for someone.

    Same goes for a next-generation gigabit network card that has firmware downloaded into it or just about any software-based device you can think of.

    Patent protection is meaningless in a global environment where one party doesn't respect any patents. Look at the DVD player situation today - $29 retail DVD players are not paying the $6 DVD Forum licensing fee. There isn't enough room in there for $6 to anyone. But the US Customs folks allow these in all day long even though they are violating US patents. To block them would uselessly create trade problems and would prevent US consumers from getting cheap DVD players. This happens with every other sort of device you can imagine.
  • by paeanblack ( 191171 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @02:45PM (#22249702)
    Let X be a small number greater than 0.
    A: Under the assumption that double of a small number is a small number we have: Y is small => 2Y is small
    B: Thus for all n > 0 we have (2^(n-1)) * X is small => (2^n)X is small
    C: Thus by the principle of mathematical induction we have that (2^n) * X is small for all n > 0 and X > 0.
    D: However, if X > 0 , then the sequence a(n) = (2^n) * X has no upper bound and is strictly increasing. Hence it diverges towards infinity.
    E: So either double of a small number is not necessarily a small number, or all positive numbers are small numbers.


    Replace the word "small" with "even" if you care to blow a giant smoking hole in your logic.
  • by sethstorm ( 512897 ) * on Thursday January 31, 2008 @03:03PM (#22249944) Homepage
    Never mind the EEE, how about the laptops that have some actual quality in them? It's one thing to shortchange the laptop and use lower quality/knockoff components all around(and get support out of desperation); it's another thing with laptops that are actually worth their expense in proven design and quality components(and get support).

    As for the China Problem, once there is someone brave enough to say "no" to them(and to those who step in their place) and enforce patent controls to where we can control quality with our borders.
  • by azgard ( 461476 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @03:26PM (#22250366)
    I think you underestimate the Chinese. They have literally millions of smart people. And reverse engineering software is much easier than reverse engineering hardware. Just FYI - I from Czech Republic, and currently work as a developer for one American company, and people here in the development center are just smart as Americans are. Chinese will catch up in software in 5-10 years, if that haven't already happened (it may not be so visible, because they ignore English and work in Chinese - which has much larger potential user base).
  • by plasmacutter ( 901737 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @04:25PM (#22251508)
    STOP PIRATING WINDOWS [articles.tlug.jp] if you want linux to grow.

    This means refusing to hand your cd's over to your friends, refusing to visit usenet or x/y torrent site and download it, etc.

    If you present them with the actual cost of windows, rather than the ubiquitous perception of "free", they will be compelled to see the real value...

    200 bucks for MS operating system, or free for one that works 99% as well for 99% of users.
  • Education (Score:3, Insightful)

    by MadMacSkillz ( 648319 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @05:09PM (#22252410) Homepage
    In the education world, we are drooling over this concept. Instead of buying $1,200 laptops, we can buy $299 "mobile internet devices" that run Open Office and Firefox...

    Let me back up. The majority of educational software is now web-based. 90% of middle and high school computer usage is either web based or using a dedicated word processor. It's not the Asus specifically that has us interested, but the concept. If you've seen the Asus, it's really more like a web appliance. The average person would look at it the same way they look at the iPhone or an ATM machine... they don't know or care what the OS is underneath.

    So for education, this could be huge. As competition increases and these devices get down to $199, the previously expensive idea of "one laptop per child" does not seem so expensive any more. There are three groups of people who need to be paying close attention to this: Microsoft, Apple, and Textbook makers.

    Put this together with education's interest in "Web 2.0," aka "The Read/Write Web" where all your school books and files are available to you online anywhere, and you're brewing up the perfect storm. Apple should be working on a device of their own right now, if they're smart, and Microsoft.... Microsoft should be praying.

  • by wertigon ( 1204486 ) on Thursday January 31, 2008 @07:06PM (#22254608)

    I purchased one here for list price no problem last week - they have them in stock all the time.

    You mean they had them in stock all the time before you told Slashdot where to get one?

  • by JohnBailey ( 1092697 ) on Friday February 01, 2008 @12:46AM (#22257788)

    On the contrary, it is a lack of support on the side of Linux developers. In order to compete, and finally see the oft-mentioned "year of the Linux desktop", it is up to the developers to put in the effort to make Linux run as well as possible.
    So Windows should be held to the same standards perhaps? Hate to break it to you, but Linux developers have already done it. Most standard hardware works out of the box with no added drivers needed. The more unusual stuff does need some careful choices, but the same could be said of any hardware that needs a manufacturer's driver disk.

    Last time I installed Windows was last August, pretty standard hardware, a copy of XP home SP2... And a driver disk for the network card, the sound card, the TV tuner card, The motherboard drivers, the keyboard and mouse, and last but not least, the video card. All non Microsoft drivers for hardware designed primarily to run on Windows. Oh.. and I needed to make a driver disk to get windows to recognize the SATA drive I was about to install onto, and needed a second keyboard and mouse to get everything working, as Windows didn't recognize my Logitech wireless usb keyboard and mouse.

    Now for Linux, I inserted the disk, and I had the network card recognized and set up automatically, and the sound card was also automatically set up and working on first boot, as was the motherboard drivers with USB2 functionality, and the SATA drive was recognised as such and treated appropriately. All on the exact same hardware which was all older than the copy of Windows I was installing. I would have had to download drivers for the video card, but thats about it. And Linux took minutes to format the entire 500gig drive, where Windows took hours.

    If I am to take your statement seriously, we should hold Microsoft directly responsible for any hardware that does not work under Windows, as to paraphrase your comment, "It is up to the developers to put in the effort to make Windows run as well as possible"

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