What Does It Take To Get a PC With XP? 513
An anonymous reader writes "Christopher Null tried to buy a computer with Windows XP pre-installed on it from the United States' nine biggest PC makers. His findings: You can get one, but be prepared to fib."
With XP? How about without Windows? (Score:4, Interesting)
I have been looking at ordering a new laptop. I have been considering the Lenovo IdeaPad Y510 with the 256MB nVidia graphics card. My plan is to wipe it and use Ubuntu (according to ubuntuforums.org the Y510 is nicely compatible out of the box.) I'd rather not pay the Windows tax.
Anyone know if I talk to Lenovo I can get them to sell me the laptop without Windows?
The easy way... (Score:2, Interesting)
Does anyone remember (Score:5, Interesting)
when Windows 95 first came out. Microsoft were so confident that users would enjoy it they even included the ability to roll back to Windows 3.1
I wonder why they didn't include this option with Windows Vista...
Re:Torrent (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:How is this difficult? (Score:5, Interesting)
One more thing... you can also choose that option on the XPS line of gaming systems.
XP in VMWare on 64-bit Vista (Score:2, Interesting)
Vista failed to run most of my legacy software, especially VS.NET on my 64-bit vista machine. I had to install VMWare Workstation (had to pay for this because 64-bit vista requires signed drivers) and configured it to use half of my RAM and to use one CPU core. I picked up XP for system builders pretty cheap and it installed flawlessly. It's pretty stable, and being 64-bit, you can exceed 4 GB of ram, and I find my self having Vista always running without shutting down, and just sleeping or hibernating and having an instant on experience all the time. With more RAM and cores, I can concurrently run LINUX as well. Otherwise, the only place I could find a laptop with XP in LA was across the street from Vista Ford on Ventura Blvd. What's interesting, is if you make a U turn up the hill by there, medina road is at the top of the hill. (Bill Gates lives in Medina, WA).
Re:The Death of M$ (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:The easy way... (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:That's Microsoft for you (Score:5, Interesting)
If that's the case for gifts, where you've paid money for something, the case for right of resale would be even stronger.
Re:That's Microsoft for you (Score:3, Interesting)
Seriously?
That might be the case in the US of A ( not sure, as my lack of knowledge regarding US law is surpassed only by my lack of interest in US law), but over here in good old blighty we certainly can resell copies. CEX, a large high street retailer of second hand computer goods, will happily flog you a used copy of XP pro or home. Link [cex.co.uk]
Try not to wince too much at the prices.
Re:How is this difficult? (Score:3, Interesting)
we're not you and are, in fact, normal home users
I'm not you, and I, in fact, only use Windows at work. In my job role I basically get to tell people what they are and are not allowed to purchase in terms of computer hardware, so the OP's post is quite relevant to me.
I have seen at least one other slashdotter claim that they only use Windows because they have to for work as well. I've not seen many claim that they are 'normal home users'. I expect people in that category spend far more time watching YouTube or playing 'The Sims' than they ever do on slashdot. What level of interest does your average computer user actually have in how their computer works? Consider how many drivers are interested in how the alternator in their car works, or even know that their car has an alternator.
Please refrain from using 'we' when referring to yourself - unless you are perhaps royalty or an editor, then it is of course your perogative.
I'm pretty sure that shouldn't have needed explaining...
Joe Consumer wants XP... (Score:3, Interesting)
To anyone who actually cares about XP vs Vista (Joe Consumer is probably just going to take Vista or whatever, and doesn't care), don't you already have tons of copies of XP already around?
1. Joe Consumer wants XP. I recently directed a "Joe Consumer" friend of mine through the steps needed to get a laptop with XP on it, because that's what he wanted.
2. I don't have "tons of copies" of XP around. Just Windows 2000. I've already been through this with XP, and still haven't seen a compelling reason to upgrade other than "Microsoft wants to force me to". Unfortunately it looks like my next Wintendo is going to be a choice between XP and Vista, thanks to drivers that refuse to install on Windows 2000.
3. Yes, I absolutely have no problem rewarding Microsoft by paying four times as much for retail XP Pro because they think DRM is a really nifty idea (that's sarcasm, by the way, if you're American or otherwise obsessively literal minded).
Re:That's Microsoft for you (Score:3, Interesting)
We accept this from almost every industry. Automobiles, appliances, internet services, telephone service, cell phone services(pay to receive calls? You all are nuts to swallow that), and most of all your government. Everybody complains like hell, but they keep on buying the BS.
Americans PAY to receive cellphone calls? Can someone confirm that? Do people find this ridiculous, or is this commonly accepted?
Re:How is this difficult? (Score:3, Interesting)
Even without those, however, most corporate customers have access through Microsoft to Windows XP under Open, Select, or Software Assurance licenses and if the Vista licenses that come with the computer fall under the terms of those agreements, they may legally downgrade.
The licenses that come with the computer are completely separate from Microsoft's volume licensing programs. Dell is selling you an OEM license for Vista that includes downgrade rights, which means you can run Windows Vista, XP, ME, 2000, 98, 95, or 3.1 on that particular computer (volume licensing is not tied to particular hardware). Large VARs and OEMs traditionally did not offer nor support any downgrade options themselves, but the corporate demand for XP over Vista created a significant enough market for some to offer it now. Whether you can get this on a home PC seems to depend on the salesperson you get (at least at Dell), with some offering it at no charge, some refusing to provide it even when requested, and others doing it for a $99 charge.
Re:With XP? How about without Windows? (Score:1, Interesting)
Getting a Lenovo machine without Windows is easy. I just bought a T61. It came with SuSE Linux pre-installed. No Windows at all, not even in a recovery partition. The wireless and video card are both made by Intel and are both supported under Linux.
Re:Does anyone remember (Score:4, Interesting)
Here's something shocking... Windows 3.11 (both Windows and Windows for Workgroups) outsold Windows 95 in both 1995 and 1996 calendar years. The reverse didn't happen until 1997. In fact, so many PCs were sold with Win3.1x after the introduction of Win95, catching software vendors by surprise, that several 32-bit apps initially released as Win95-only got back-ported to Windows 3.1x & Win32s in a subsequent interim release. (Case-in-point: Corel Print House from 1995/1996).
Your useless trivia for the day...
Assurance that */Linux has a driver (Score:3, Interesting)
Go to pricewatch.com and check the 'laptops, no OS' section or google for 'laptop barebones'. They'll all be the original brands, Clevo, Compal, Asus, etc, and not the reseller brands, Sony, Dell, HP, etc. But it'll be the same thing and cost less. What you get with the big names is 1: a support phone line, 2: the exact same laptop with a brand name sticker strangers will respect you for being able to afford and, of course 3: Windows.
4: Assurance that the operating system that you plan to install contains drivers for the hardware in the laptop. Is there a way to exclude laptops from pricewatch's results that contain a major component (e.g. accelerated video, WLAN, Bluetooth) with no */Linux support?
Re:How is this difficult? VirtualBox... (Score:2, Interesting)
Put them on PCLinuxOS or Mandriva and VirtualBox, with the latest KDE/Compiz or Metisse, and there, voila! Flashy stuff, with more than one instance of windows running, with LAN access...
Now, maybe VirtualBox might mitigate some of their drivers issues, and give you and your IT staff and the company a reason to brag about Linux.
What I like in KDE Control/Kcontrol is turning off the vendor them, changing the login icon image, adding pics to the changing background, and letting the login screen do its thing. Or, turning on and locking the screen saver, showing off kdesktop....
Re:How is this difficult? (Score:3, Interesting)
souls are a fiat currency - they have value so long as everyone *believes*.
Just like every other currency system. Though that would mean believers souls are worth more than nonbelievers souls. Nonbelievers souls wouldn't have any associated value to them, while believers souls would have some attached a value. Basically non believers would have a zero or null value soul. The only usage of that I could see would be avoiding/attracting entities that collect what they see as valuable souls. Of course there could always be some entity that collects zero or null value souls just to piss them off.
Re:The easy way... (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:Why purchase XP at all? (Score:1, Interesting)
"I have had nothing but problems with my Upgrade from Windows XP Pro to Windows Vista Business. The OS is plagued with driver and application issues,
That's not happening to everyone; Vista works fine for me.
Windows Explorer takes ages for the most simple of tasks,
Again, not happening to me.
the indexing service sucks up the hard disk even when the computer is in use,
So what? That's what you'd expect of an indexing service, right? Spotlight on Mac OS X does this as well, and I don't mind because I actually use Spotlight from time to time.
the user account control is endlessly nagging you,
This is a good thing. Previously, if you inserted a CD into a computer running Windows XP or earlier, and the auto-run script contained a trojan horse of some sort, then you were pwn3d. At least in Vista, you can see it coming and stop it.
it is less stable than Windows XP (I get at least one blue screen of death every few days),
I'm not seeing this behavior.
the performance is absolutely abysmal for even the most mundane tasks,
Windows Vista has been much faster than XP for me. You just need more memory so the library cache won't send you into virtual territory.
Windows doesn't turn on the screen half the time when resuming from standby, file sync doesn't work properly, indexing service wouldn't reinstall after uninstalling, none of my VPNs work properly, file search takes forever (with or without the indexing service turned on), when disabling and re-enabling my network card half the time the Disable button doesn't turn into a Enable button which requires me to reboot, the system restore wants to save the registry every time I boot (making it take forever), and an endless list of other annoying nuggets of lameness.
All of these have worked fine for me, too.
It's too bad you had a bad experience with Vista, but don't assume everyone's experience was as bad as yours. Personally, I would never go back to XP; Vista is that good.