MS Reportedly Adds 6 Months of Vista Downgrade 244
LiteralKa sends in a poorly sourced Reg story claiming that Microsoft has granted OEMs six more months to sell PCs using Windows Vista with the support to downgrade to Windows XP. OEMs can now offer such arrangements until July 31, 2009 — the previous deadline was January 31, 2009. The article claims as source "a Reg reader" without further details. Neither Microsoft nor any OEM has confirmed the rumor, and only a few scattered bloggers have picked it up.
Desktop Operation System Evolution (Score:5, Interesting)
In those 8 years, Windows has hardly evolved. Honestly, Windows Vista doesn't add too much groundbreaking stuff to Windows XP, the only real technological novelty is the graphics.
Eight years is a lot in computer history, and if you look at what it was 8 years before Windows XP, that was 1993. So Windows 3.11 is to Windows XP, what Windows XP is to Windows Vista, but the difference between XP and Vista is much smaller than the difference between 3.11 and XP!
why does the evolution of desktop operating systems like Windows go slower now than a decade ago?
Re:Desktop Operation System Evolution (Score:3, Interesting)
why does the evolution of desktop operating systems like Windows go slower now than a decade ago?
It's not exactly the way you paint it. There is no 'line of succession' between Windows 3.11 and Windows XP.
XP and Vista are derivatives of Windows NT. Version 3.1, the first version of NT, was released in 1992. There's a chasm of difference between Windows 3.11 and NT 3.1.
Between Windows 4.0, which was released in 1994 or 1996 and Windows 2000, there's not that much difference outside of the user interface changes. And between 2000 and Vista there's not that much difference, aside from user interface changes. But the evolution as a whole shows that 4.0 and Vista are very different operating systems.
Windows 95/98/ME and descended from the same line as 3.11. And thus have the same problems.
So, no, it's not that simple.
Linux and Mac Evolution (Score:5, Interesting)
Well- this is Slashdot, so...
Look at how much Linux desktops have evolved over the last 8 years. Actually- just over the last four. Also- look at how Apple's OS has evolved over the same time period.
The only company that seems to be having a hard time evolving a desktop OS is Microsoft.
Re:Vista Home (Score:5, Interesting)
I can do better than that. I pushed out 37 vista business installs about 4 months ago to all of our workstations here, and I've not had a single problem with it. The bees seems to love it and, for me, it's a heck of a lot easier to manage. I watch all this bashing going on and quite frankly, I don't get it. I understand that YMMV, but it seems like Vista is getting hammered but nobody's really tried it. I've heard a lot of "It won't run on my hardware" and "It won't run our winfax95" but c'mon...It's 2008.
I've had a very mixed experience with it myself...
I've got a tablet running Vista that probably shouldn't be. It was never designed with Vista in mind and the hardware is just barely supported. It runs, but not well. I'll likely go back to XP again with it fairly soon.
At home, I've got several machines running Vista Premium and I've had absolutely no issues with them at all. They're used extensively for gaming and the performance is just fine. No complaints.
I've also got several workstations at work that we're testing out with Vista Business and have had no trouble with so far. A few people are having issues with the GUI changes, but that's about it. They're generally as stable as XP was.
Then we've had a number of clients buying new computers and getting stuck with Vista. Their experiences generally range from bad to just plain horrible. Lots of incompatible hardware and software. Unexpected learning curves. Lots of complaining about strange issues. Repeated service calls.
I think a large part of the problem has been that this is the first major OS change that a number of people have had to deal with. Folks have been using XP for a number of years now, and everything has more or less worked the same. Now you've got folks just ordering a random computer from Dell, or picking something up at Best Buy...assuming that everything will work the way it has been...and suddenly stuff doesn't work. Their printer won't work with the new computer, their old software won't work, the buttons are all moved around.
Most of the issues I've seen are with people who didn't really expect Vista on their machine, or didn't actually research what switching to Vista would mean for them. For the folks that have intentionally upgraded to Vista it has, more or less, worked.
Which certainly doesn't make it a good OS... Or even much of an upgrade in a lot of cases... But I don't think it's as horrible as a lot of people are claiming either.
It's a Microsoft OS - anyone who expected rock-solid stability and bullet-proof security needs to have their head examined.
Re:Desktop Operation System Evolution (Score:4, Interesting)
By july 2009 Windows XP will be 8 years old! Because they extend it till then, both Microsoft and the market agree that this 8 year old operating system is still relevant and not hopelessly outdated despite its age.
In those 8 years, Windows has hardly evolved. Honestly, Windows Vista doesn't add too much groundbreaking stuff to Windows XP, the only real technological novelty is the graphics.
Eight years is a lot in computer history, and if you look at what it was 8 years before Windows XP, that was 1993. So Windows 3.11 is to Windows XP, what Windows XP is to Windows Vista, but the difference between XP and Vista is much smaller than the difference between 3.11 and XP!
Very true. Vista has a few changes under the hood that are nice... But the major difference is in the UI. There are some GUI modification tools out there that let you customize your Windows desktop with different themes and visual styles... I've worked on XP machines that were skinned to look like Vista machines, and it is very hard to tell the difference.
Look at KDE, Gnome, or the Linux kernel over the last 8 years... Amazing changes, all sorts of added functionality.
Take a look at the MacOS over the last 8 years - again, huge changes. Not just from a UI standpoint but real changes in how the OS operates.
Vista is a little bit more secure... A little bit less stable... And a lot more shiny... But that's about it.
Re:Desktop Operation System Evolution (Score:3, Interesting)
So when you say operating system goes slower, please clarify under what conditions. I've run linux with compviz on the same hardware and although it runs faster than Areo, its still slower than XP and vista without Areo.
I can already say vista has delt better with leaky memory than XP and UAC has already stopped a program from doing something that I didn't want it to. And it doesn't run any slower. But that's just my experience.
Re:Vista Home (Score:3, Interesting)
No one with any sense (and who doesn't work for Microsoft) claims Vista is a "must-have" upgrade, though. It's basically a replacement for XP with a few extra bells and whistles... not worth upgrading if you have XP, but if you're building a new machine, there's no reason to avoid it.
I like that 64-bit support is more mainstream in Vista. XP Professional 64 always felt like an afterthought.
Beyond that, however, you are exactly right. There is no compelling reason to switch to Vista. And in many cases there are plenty of reasons (older hardware/software) not to.
Re:Vista Home (Score:2, Interesting)
Then we've had a number of clients buying new computers and getting stuck with Vista. Their experiences generally range from bad to just plain horrible.
I agree with this statement, most people I know with vista and like it, only web surf or type up projects. They would be as happy with a Mac as they would be with Vista or XP for that matter. I'm not a big fan of Mac or Vista but that's besides the point. The people I hear have trouble, are trying to get by with a budget computer (min requirements or less) and trying to play games on it (10FPS on low quality any one?), or upgrading a incompatible hardware computer to vista thinking everything would go fine because they spent a lot of money on the computer a month before vista came out, so logically it can run vista (PS: life isn't logical!).
I personally have tried vista, and didn't like it enough to make the change (I love XP and windows 3.11 still). I still can't stand that a lot of people bash Vista for stupid reason mostly; the constant security warnings when ever they open a program (My reply: then turn it off), others bash the UI (then download a mod and change it), even more complain about how their graphic cards can't run the cool DX10 effects (then don't use them or stop being cheap and buy something decent for once).
Offtopic: What will be even funnier is when they then try and change from 32bit vista to a 64bit xp without researching what it means and then find out nothing on their computer works. We need nerds to guide these casual users!!! (with out the intent on making the company the most money ala Fire Dog and Geek Squad; though some really do help but others don't understand the difference between ram and hard drive [go into best buy and pretend your buying a computer, act like a complete idiot and watch how they will do 1 of 3 things, take advantage, make mistakes or actually be of some help]) XKCD comic [xkcd.com]
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Noname
HP problems (Score:3, Interesting)
The HP Linux printer system is excellent, and this is not intended as HP bashing per se.
In fact, not only HP but also Samsung have excellent Linux support. My advice to Vista users is simple: do not buy HP all in ones, especially as you can get cheap to operate color lasers from other manufacturers.
Toshiba's at least doing it... (Score:1, Interesting)
This was sent to us from our sales rep from Toshiba in Winnipeg.
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Hi Everyone,
I wanted to announce that Microsoft has extended Toshibaâ(TM)s ability to provide XP Pro Downgrade Media for applicable notebooks with Vista Business until July 31st 2009. Previously, the cut off date was January 31st 2009. Toshiba will do their best to continue to include XP PRO Downgrade media in the box with all of our notebooks shipping with Vista Business pre-installed.
If you have any questions, please let me know.
Regards,
[name withheld for privacy]
Sales Representative, MB/SK
Information Systems Group
Toshiba of Canada Ltd.
150 Greenwood Ave.
Winnipeg, MB CANADA
R2M 2T3
[...]
Inside Sales Support: 1-800-TOSHIBA
www.toshiba.ca
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So it's at least confirmed for Toshiba.
On another note: Jesus Christ... stop turning every thread on here into a f**king flamewar... -_-