Open Office Plans To Party Like It's Version 3.0 396
penguin_dance writes "The Register reports that 'OpenOffice.org is throwing a launch party in Paris on 13 October' to celebrate eight years, and hopefully announce the release of version 3.0. Some notes: [OpenOffice.org 3.0] will support the OpenDocument Format 1.2 standard, and be able to open files created by MS Office 2007 and Office 2008 for Mac OS X." As maj_id10t notes, though the OO.o site does not yet carry an announcement, "Lifehacker has posted an entry stating the final release of OpenOffice 3.0 is available for download via their distribution mirrors."
What about NeoOffice? (Score:1, Interesting)
I've been using NeoOffice on a Mac for the last year+ while waiting for 3.0. Will NeoOffice continue on or will it fade away?
Mac OS X (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Openoffice? no thanks. (Score:5, Interesting)
There is such a huge difference in features and usability that there is no way that OpenOffice would gain any ground over Microsoft, in my opinion.
I'm not a big fan of OpenOffice myself and I can't really say anything about features, but to praise MS Office's usability seems utterly absurd to me.
I am reasonably computer-savy, but if I have to do anything more complicated than typing a really simple letter, Word drives me up the wall. It constantly feels like I have to work against it, instead of having it do work for me.
Same thing in Excel: I'd rather use pencil & paper or write my own scripts instead for every calculation I have to do, than trying to get Excel to do anything that even remotely resembles what I want it to do
Mind you, I'm not saying OO is any better in that respect. I'm just saying it can hardly be any worse
Re:Always felt a bit clunky to me oh and a questio (Score:3, Interesting)
I use OO.o daily. 3.0 has some major improvements, and you should check it out.
I largely prefer OO.o Writer to MS Word now that OO.o Writer has better commenting and revision control. I can rely on it for 99% of my work, but I find I still sometimes switch to Word under Wine if I get a manuscript that uses EndNote (rather than Zotero) or very complex embedded equations.
I have grown used to Impress. PowerPoint users might still have grips. I prefer LaTeX Beamer, but sometimes need to make or read PowerPoint presentations & Impress gets the job done.
The new solver in Calc makes it more useful. I think I prefer Gnumeric still & find myself breaking out stronger data analysis or data presentation programs.
Using OpenOffice with no problems?! (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm always sceptical when people talk about using OO seriously with "no problems".
It's strange that so many people on Slashdot make claims like this, yet for me and various people I know in real life, basic things like sorting in OO Calc seem to fail on any non-trivial spreadsheet. Heck, I even got the Undo command not to undo simple find-and-replace changes properly the other day.
And have they fixed the font embedding that kills PDF export from Writer yet? It's only been a bug since forever, with more votes than almost anything else in the bug tracker.
As long as this sort of thing is going on, usability isn't even an issue: OO isn't even useful for more than throwaway work, and it actually seems to be getting worse in the 2.x series to the point that it's not even useful for much throwaway work either.
Looking forward to 3.0 (Score:2, Interesting)
I cofounded a company last year and we decided to use Office 2007 since we're consulting with clients.
Wow it's been bad. Office 2007 has been a nightmare (endless bugs--crashing when accepting revisions, randomly moving to the top of the document as I'm paging through it, etc.), and interoperability with clients hasn't been as important as we thought.
I can't wait to use 3.0 in the office.
Re:What about NeoOffice? (Score:2, Interesting)
NeoOffice bases itself from Novell's go-oo semi-fork so it inherits the extra features of that version. They are working on NeoOffice 3 which will employ the 3.0 codebase but it is unclear to me whether or not they are still going to use Java to implement the UI. In any case, losing the need for X11 isn't the only reason for NeoOffice. If you want the solver, various import filters that the Sun branch doesn't include, or bugfixes the NeoOffice team have had trouble getting Sun to include then NeoOffice will still be worth a look.
Re:Openoffice? no thanks. (Score:4, Interesting)
Apple's got some intereting ideas in terms of Office Applications. They don't highly tout iWork, or even promote it that much, despite the fact that it shows quite a bit of promise.
Keynote is hands-down the best presentation app out there.
Numbers is considerably more intuitive than Excel, with its vastly superior UI. A few minor features are missing, though it's really a joy to work with.
Pages is the enigma of the bunch. Apple seems to want to combine the roles of the layout app with the word processor (Publisher vs. Word). They seem to have done a pretty remarkable job at the layout part, though the word-processing bits could still use some work. It's "different" enough that users might have a tough time getting used to it.
More importantly.... none of the apps are trying to mimic Office, OoO, or AppleWorks. If OoO tried to be daring for once, and adopted a completely new set of paradigms, rather than mimicking MS Office, they might actually have a compelling product. For now, though, it's a second-rate knockoff of an already mediocre product.
Re:Openoffice? no thanks. (Score:5, Interesting)
Do yourself a favor and learn LaTeX. Yes, it has a learning curve and you need lots of documentation and/or an internet connection to know which packages you need but at least it provides consistent results, doesn't reformat half of your text on a whim and isn't nearly as frustratingly annoying as any Word-like program.
RC4 is the final version? (Score:3, Interesting)
I tried the PDF import plugin, but it doesn't give me any options and imports it directly as a slideshow with messed up text.
Locale (Score:2, Interesting)
OK, so I give it a try for the first time since I switched back to non-free OS world (many, many years ago).
The good: it is about 1 million times faster and more polished than 1.x iterations.
The yummy: the perspective of writing macros in Python instead of craptacular VBA
The puzzling... and maybe the ugly: I have yet to find a way to set OOo locale to "system locale".
Microsoft did a pretty good job with the regional settings, allowing for a lot of customization. Very useful for people who juggle with around 4-5 languages on a daily basis (with accents, chinese characters, and other oddities) and like to have a very customized "common ground" locale. I like to be able to write my dates ANSI style, separate my 3 digit groups with spaces, count in meters, use $ as a currency symbol, and then some.
It is just natural that an office suite should inherit all those settings from the OS (or at least provide a setting to do so).
And so far, it appears that OOo does not have this basic functionality? The "default" option actually sets the application locale to the same used for localizing menus (i.e. if the application menus are in en_US, then the standard en_US locale - including units, date, number formats) will be used...
Looks like I am stuck with Excel for quite a while then.
Tool Analogy... (Score:1, Interesting)
Your screwdriver is primarily used by your hands with tactile feedback. Visual feedback is there too, but is minimal. (I daresay almost any sighted person could manage to use a screwdriver blindfolded pretty easily.)
A computer is used by both your hands and eyes with virtually all visual feedback. With rare exception, the only physical feedback is the feel of the keyboard and plenty of people use that to justify buying better keyboards.
Yet for some reason you have no problem denigrating others for wanting something they are going to stare at for 8 hours a day to be visually appealing. Why? You mean you will do a better job given a dull, drab image than one more suited to your tastes? You mean eyestrain will not affect you at all?
Well, if so, bully for you. For the rest of us we'll realize that just because a tool is a tool doesn't mean it has to be a shitty tool.
Re:3.0? (Score:3, Interesting)
.
When you live within an office suite for nine hours out of twenty-four, six days out of seven, the UI matters.
Re:Using OpenOffice with no problems?! (Score:5, Interesting)
I represent over 150 business users that use ONLY OpenOffice for word processing, spreadsheet, etc, and I can attest that we do use it seriously with very few problems. Your comment is way-over-the-top wrong.
Are there some missing things that we would like to see? Sure. But that hardly justifies "isn't even useful for more than throwaway work".
Re:Using OpenOffice with no problems?! (Score:3, Interesting)
I represent over 150 business users that use ONLY OpenOffice for word processing, spreadsheet, etc, and I can attest that we do use it seriously with very few problems.
Do you? "Seriously"? Or just for quick letters that any old text editor could cope with and trivial data tables in a spreadsheet without any real calculation or data processing?
Your comment is way-over-the-top wrong.
Or your particular users have been very lucky, depending on your point of view. Have you tried sorting spreadsheet data where some affected cells contain formulae? Have you tried undoing a search and replace that used the options beyond plain text? These are data corruption bugs, not some minor UI tweak. These are the sort of crazy bugs that betray fundamentally broken underlying models, and which cost people whole documents if not noticed and worked around immediately.
Re:3.0? (Score:3, Interesting)
So you are in Home Depot and they have two identical hammers. One is god-aweful looking, like all hot-pink and looks like a professional designer never touched the thing. Yeah... let's pick up that one.
You know, I would. A hot pink hammer? Hell yes!
Tastes vary. I'm not going to attempt to defend OO.org's UI, as I haven't touched it in awhile, but there are plenty of cases where I've seen a UI make the right choices -- better choices -- yet be shunned because it is different than what you're used to.
Oldest, best example I know of: How many people use the dvorak keyboard layout? Even among a generation which has never had to touch a real typewriter in their lives, and for whom qwerty is completely pointless?
I've been guilty of that myself. OS X arguably has some better consistency even with certain keyboard shortcuts (home/end), yet it was so different than what I'm used to that I'm grateful to be back on Linux again.
If OO.org was compellingly better than MS Office, then I'd be inclined to agree with you. But it has fewer features and is generally lacking in more areas than it has strengths.
And as long as that is the case, that is also the conversation we should be having -- not whether it's "pretty".
Fact: Ubuntu (via Compiz) has prettier desktop effects than Vista. Yet Vista has more users than Ubuntu. Would more eye candy "sell" more copies of Ubuntu?
Re:Openoffice? no thanks. (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Openoffice? no thanks. (Score:2, Interesting)
iWork ODF (Score:2, Interesting)
The only issue I have with the iWorks suite is that Apple decided to introduce yet another file format, seriously pissing off their customers who have started a petition to include ODF. Whilst ODF and DOC are supported by the nifty 'TextEdit' most of my work is done in Pages and Numbers and if it were to be possible to use ODF as the default file format Apple iWork users could exchange documents easily with OpenOffice users giving the format another boost.
I will try the new ooo and see where it is at.
I do like MsOffice 2008, have run the trial but it is a bit slow (despite 4gb ram) and on the expensive side for a small business with 4 users.
Another documented OOo bug... (Score:2, Interesting)
It seems the Windows version of OOo can't open files that are on a Windows file server that happens to have a "_" character in it's name. In our case, there's only one such unlucky server in the entire site, but that's the one that our people most commonly use. MS Office users can click on those files with no issue, but nothing happens with OOo. That is, OOo just closes with no warnings, no error messages. The poor program just dies silently.
In http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=53184 [openoffice.org], status says it's "fixed", but the activity log shows it's never been merged into the release version. This is the 3rd release since the bug was declared "fixed", but it's still not released. Scroll to the bottom of that bug report to see the story.
Related discussion here... http://www.oooforum.org/forum/viewtopic.phtml?t=52413 [oooforum.org]
Maybe I should just fix it muself...
Re:Using OpenOffice with no problems?! (Score:5, Interesting)
We do everything that a typical business would tend to do with it. Our company newsletter (8 pages, with lots of graphics, columns, frames), wiring diagrams, signs, letters, budgets, expense analysis, small databases, manuals, pdf exports, data parsing, inservice presentations, flowcharts, labels, dealing with lots of Emailed .doc, .xls, and .ppt's, etc.
Are there some bugs? Yes. Although we have not hit any that have prevented normal use or to cause us to not trust OO. But having conversed with MS-Office users- they have bugs also. There are bugs in just about every huge/complex program on any platform.
And I have reported some of those bugs and (as you also said) watched some of those bugs not get corrected over years. However, they don't prevent us from using the software, "seriously", for many years.
Re:3.0? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Openoffice? no thanks. (Score:3, Interesting)
It's not that simple. If you have a general method for interpreting arbitrary web content for screenreaders, I urge you for the sake of the visually impaired, and for the webdevs currently spending time on accessibility, and for the sake of your wallet, to go develop such screenreader software.
Blind people don't have to carry around scanners that interpret & speak out the arabic numerals on elevators and bank machines. The machines get braille.
A content provider interested in providing content to the visually impaired, has to provide content that the visually impaired can interpret. If you're not interested in providing to them, then that's fine (unless you are a business of sufficient size in some jurisdictions, or certain governments, etc...).
AFAIK there is no magic bullet technology being hidden from the general populous. It's not a choice between a handful of devs working on a couple of programs, and millions actually doing their job as content providers. If it's that easy, do it; I guarantee you there are buyers.
As for the last paragraph, it seems to contradict your earlier point. A few people working on the usability of computers vastly improves the situation for millions of computer users. Not to mention that it's not really between "using the computer knowledgeably" and "using the computer retardedly" in most of these cases. It's between "using the computer retardedly" and "not using a computer", which really doesn't benefit any developer.
Re:Font Embedding in PDFs (Score:3, Interesting)
Look at issue 43029.[...] it's a complete showstopper for using most professional grade fonts with PDF export.
Why obscure the situation, why not mention that this is only with "CFF-flavour OpenType fonts (*.otf)". How many people, not using DTP packages, are that fussy about the font they use that they won't accept a near analogue TTF font. Does it real make that much difference if people reading your text do so in Times.otf versus Times.ttf - like I said for professional print jobs you can be fussy but OOo is not a professional print production application (though it can be used as one).
This bug has become the standard counter-example in on-line discussions to all the OSS advocacy [...]
Such an important bug only has 12 subscribers - ie people that care enough to get notified when it is fixed. Doesn't seem like a major bug to me. I'd go with the classification as enhancement - a specific font file format support (not the font per se but a specific file format for the font) seems like something that doesn't actually stop anyone writing documents. FWIW. It will be a good enhancement to add as OTF is on the rise, but it's only really kicking off as of this year IMO and so OOo isn't so far behind the game on this.
Re:3.0? (Score:3, Interesting)
'If we're content with small closed communities that play only to themselves, that's a perfectly valid goal. It's a lot easier, certainly. You get it the way you want and basically enter stasis.'
No, that is the result of refusing to accept patches. Suggest that someone take the initiative for something they want is simply choosing not to be someone elses bitch.
If I get myself some tea and offer to fill your glass while I'm at it and you tell me you want milk instead I'll tell you fetch it yourself. The same is true when I scratch my software itch.
If you want a feature the developers aren't interested in and they invite you to submit a patch, that is an opportunity. Contribute in some way, hire a developer to work on gimp. Appeal to some of the corporate paid developers who DO have the goal of mass adoption. Hell, write some documentation for the project and you are more likely to get a slice of developer attention.
Some projects like bzflag might well be in stasis. It could be for many reasons but its not for asking people to contribute their fair share. More likely it is because they don't want the features in question and they aren't about to accept your patches at all!