After Sweden's New Law, a Major Drop In Internet Traffic 337
iamnot writes "The new IPRED law came into effect in a big way in Sweden on April 1st. A news report has come out showing that internet traffic dropped by 30% from March 31st to April 1st. A lawyer from the Swedish anti-piracy agency was quoted as saying that the drop in traffic 'sends a very strong signal that the legislation works.' Is the new law, which allows for copyright holders to request the identification of people sharing files, truly curing people of their evil ways? Or perhaps it is just taking some time for Swedish downloaders to figure out the new IPREDator VPN system from The Pirate Bay."
April 1st (Score:5, Insightful)
I'd like to see... (Score:5, Insightful)
...statistics on how much traffic ramped UP in the days and weeks before April 1st. I imagine that some where afraid of the new laws, and they where getting in some last-minute downloads before they had to cut the line and look for new methods to hide their traffic.
They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't you see that the constant raising of stakes is simply going to end up fucking over everyone's civil rights in the end?
Cry all you want about the legitimacy of file sharing and how old media needs to adapt to the current technology, it's still legally questionable to "share" copyright works.
So now they make a law to get the names of users. You decide to start using VPN. They decide to outlaw VPN to certain IPs. You decide to use roaming servers. They decide to make filesharing software illegal.
Then everyone loses. Not just you guys who want to get your music and movies for free.
Re:Not fun anymore (Score:2, Insightful)
Good for you for doing what you think right and all, but my opinion is that these industries are on an all-out campaign to keep their stranglehold on the "industry" of entertainment, milking as much money as they can possibly get their hands on, so I really don't give a damn what they think is fair. They want to bend me over, I'm going to chase them around and bend them over instead, if I can.
So your point is? (Score:5, Insightful)
I fail to see your point. Downloading stuff that the authors seems to completely hate you for is somehow Freedom?
No. That's a childish approach. With freedom comes responsibility. Now, I think the industry is behaving like a rabies dog but they're within their rights to disallow us to copy their material without giving them a krona.
Freedom is to being able to NOT BUY INTO THEIR SHIT. Accept their rules since it's in fact codified, but refuse to participate in transactions with them unless you're offered a FAIR DEAL and things YOU ACTUALLY WANT.
Ah, bad science and statistics.... (Score:5, Insightful)
sends a very strong signal that the legislation works.
Or it might be an indicator that the legislation has a chilling effect on free speech and fair use.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:4, Insightful)
Fixed that for you.
Re:So your point is? (Score:5, Insightful)
Traffic down 30%, sales up by...? (Score:5, Insightful)
The arguments for implementing and enforcing this law is to "encourage legal alternatives". So, after a 30% drop if file-sharing traffic, we'd expect to see a 30% increase in sales of CDs, DVDs and e-books. Or, there is no correlation between downloads and lost sales, just as a bunch of scientific reports suggest.
Anyone care to wager that this purported increase in sales will not, in fact, happen?
Re:April 1st (Score:5, Insightful)
Exactly... a 24 hour period?
Slashdot has days where there are only about 70-100 comments on articles, does that mean people are against reading, or people don't like websites that start with 'S'?
Let me know at the end of April, if the amount is significantly lower than March.
I know quite a few people that were scared about Conficker that stayed offline too.
Re:So your point is? (Score:5, Insightful)
It's a bit naive to think that these regulations are related to the actual behavior of the population, there just needs to be an excuse that sounds reasonable enough to most of the population to accept it.
Re:Not fun anymore (Score:5, Insightful)
Legislation will get worse and worse to the point where we are all under constant surveillance. We don't need to give "them" any more leverage to these draconian laws. We are in our right to fileshare on a personal level - that is, with friends and family. Let's stop filesharing with "strangers" and we're untouchable.
Why? Do you think your rights will be protected if you bend over? Do your think they'll let you file share with friends and family? Hint: DRM, anti-DRM laws and other crippleware. Sharing with my friends that again share with their friends only leads to to six degrees of Kevin Bacon before everyone from me to the Pope has it. They will not stop until such a thing as private communication is brought to an end. If you are Swedish you should know about FRA, IPRED, that just recently Aktuelt showed another proposal from the government to give SEPO access to FRA surveilance and so on. Already the EU directive on telecommunications is supposed to keep tabs on everyone you're in contact with, as you say laws are being put in place to shut down all anonymizing services, open access points and so forth. And this doesn't bother you? You just want to play along "by the rules", in your own words? You want to do the same when they require that everything you do be decrypted and passed through their proxies so they can be sure you're not a vicious file sharer too?
I would say: fight it [piratpartiet.se]. The Pirate Party has increased massively in size the last six months and keep reaching new heights. They're now chasing Folkpartiet in membership counts and is Sweden's second biggest youth party - if they keep going like they have in the last months they'll be the biggest soon. This is pretty much a whole generation saying "we want file sharing". If you're Swedish, help them out in the EU election in June - Europe needs someone to speak up against all the Orwellian laws showing up all over the place. Because it will not get better by itself, it'll only get worse. I've decided to donate to them even though I'm in Norway, noone here seems to have the balls to stand up to the EU, which has become the place to pass all the unpopular laws and for national politicans to just throw up their hands and say "we must".
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:2, Insightful)
Then everyone loses. Not just you guys who want to get your music and movies for free.
That's the point. Once the MAFIAA's tactics become so burdensome that they kill the net for everybody then they will have made an enemy of everybody and that is an unsustainable situation. My bet is on everybody, from the sound of it, your bet is on the MAFIAA.
Re:I'd like to see... (Score:3, Insightful)
That's a pretty regular usage if we're looking at a University (or something that feeds a Uni), which I suspect we are. You get growth starting around August when the kids arrive and start figuring out how to maximize their resources, a leveling off once they do maximize resources, a dip during the holidays, and finally followed by a return to previous stable levels. This is all against a slight slope in the curve, because bandwidth consumption is always rising on average.
There's nothing in the yearly graph that outright disagrees with TFA.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:4, Insightful)
Just as my bet is on the handful of guys inside the G20 meeting and not on the thousands of idiots getting beat down outside, my bet is on the handful of guys getting laws passed and not the millions of idiots trying to avoid getting caught breaking the law.
Or Or (Score:3, Insightful)
Wouldn't it be funny if sales of music dropped even more now that people don't sample before they buy. Other wise they'll just blame is on some new fangled technology that they now need to also make illegal because since there was no increase in sales people must have moved onto this new secret technology to steal even more music.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:3, Insightful)
You see, what you're doing here is blaming the victim.
Yes, the victim.
Very few file-sharers have the capacity to buy the stuff they download, they are just tagging along in what is a part of their culture, a culture which the media conglomerate has built very effectively.
So, the choice is to be left out of the loop on everyday culture or pirate.
Also, do you honestly believe that most of the restraints from the government wouldn't happen regardless?
Governments want control, they will seize any opportunity to get greater control.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:5, Insightful)
Then everyone loses. Not just you guys who want to get your music and movies for free.
Funny how I see the exact same pattern but I interpret it as a good thing.
An arms race between government and the people that has the people as the ultimate winner? It's better than good.
The method of slowly pushing the commoners down and the rulers up doesn't stop with a reasonable and gradual struggle to make the situation more balanced. It stops when the commoners revolt, the powerful raise their armies against them and discover that those armies are too heavily outnumbered.
Re:So your point is? (Score:5, Insightful)
Now, I think the industry is behaving like a rabies dog but they're within their rights to disallow us to copy their material without giving them a krona.
No, they're not. They're trying to sell air based on laws that originally regulated a privileged few among themselves. In the days where not everyone could afford a 'copying machine' it was perfectly okay. Things have changed, laws essentially didn't. I, for one, oppose any law that criminalizes a significant portion of the population without any benefit whatsoever in return. Intellectual Property doesn't exist. Get over it.
Freedom is to being able to NOT BUY INTO THEIR SHIT. Accept their rules since it's in fact codified, but refuse to participate in transactions with them unless you're offered a FAIR DEAL and things YOU ACTUALLY WANT.
I accept their rules as soon as they stop writing new ones when not enough people are breaking the existing ones.
Re:Ah, bad science and statistics.... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Nothing will change. (Score:2, Insightful)
Before: 3
After: 5
Re:Nothing will change. (Score:4, Insightful)
Even if they can't route around it (or until they do), the summary may be right that this is a sign the legislation is working.
If I went round to every persons house, put a gun to their head, and told them I would shoot them if they kept sharing files, I think you would also see a dip in the stats like this.
Just because it works, it doesn't mean that its reasonable, proportional or fair. Luckily, like the gun example, the authorities/record labels will need to follow through with their threats. As soon as people realise that people aren't being shot for sharing, they'll start again. And if people are shot for sharing, there'll be protests on the streets. Not what any government wants.
Re:Traffic down 30%, sales up by...? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Nothing will change. (Score:5, Insightful)
Just keep watching that traffic... (Score:5, Insightful)
We've seen these things happen before after new legislation, but now watch the traffic slowly increase back again (and possibly beyond) previous levels in the coming few months. :-p
Counter-productive (Score:3, Insightful)
Of course it bothers me with the slippery slope that is the surveillance legislation orgie, but this story and my comment is not on those issues.
I'm already a Pirate Party member.
What I realize is that continuing to fileshare copyrighted works is COUNTER-PRODUCTIVE to the cause.
By the way, I really am Swedish.
Re:So your point is? (Score:5, Insightful)
Have you forgotten about the terrorists? They are just as good a reason for censoring the net than filesharing, or X numbers of other lame excuses. If you want the internet to be free from censorship in Sweden, you have to fight by imposing your will on your politicians.
At the moment, you and the GP have battered wife syndrome, you are saying it's us, if we change then the politicians and other bad people will have no reason to do this to us..
Guess what? Your internet will be censored unless you stand up and say no. That means, not accepting simplistic demonizations of filesharers, and not accepting the travesty of copyright that now exists. Your culture is being taken away from you *today* through stupid international copyright extensions. Death of author + 70 years means you don't get to read a book freely, your children don't get to read freely, your grandchildren don't get to read freely, and on and on. When your kids ask you what you did to make the world a better place, what will you say to them?
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:1, Insightful)
If some of those "legislators" had half a brain cell, or half a heart between them they would do the opposite and pass a law making it *legal* to share media between people for no charge. They would strengthen laws criminalising those who are genuine pirates selling copies for money. But, as the previous poster points out those laws already exist ! Fight these idiots who are the real "pirates". They are using this issue to attack freedom and society.
Re:Ah, bad science and statistics.... (Score:5, Insightful)
sends a very strong signal that the legislation works.
Or it might be an indicator that the legislation has a chilling effect on free speech and fair use.
Which is the way it's supposed to work...
According to its designers, the MAFIAA [mafiaa.org], anyway.
Re:I'd like to see... (Score:3, Insightful)
what country could possibly look at a drop in overall internet usage as a good thing?
Re:Not fun anymore (Score:3, Insightful)
These people don't understand reason. The correct answer is "fuck 'em".
They will just switch excuses i think (Score:1, Insightful)
how about the following:
terrorism
child porn
IP woes
I think that a surveillance state is being pushed on us a combination of benevolent idiots and/or power freaks. downloaded content, much like the vcr (Boston strangler) and the phonograph(derided as a subversive tool of communism) will be both a threat and a benefit to content providers, but it is feared by the dominate media powers that be as it is seen to be disruptive enough to break up the status quo.
I'd take a guess and say that these laws are more about content control and political intimidation rather than about any legitimate sense of copyright/ patent/ trademark protection(I hate the vague term "IP") . The stuff I listen to you wont find on a top 40 list or on any radio station in my area. This whole " download equals lost sales" idea has had it validity questioned in several studies that I am too lazy to look up at the moment. iirc, there was one by Alan Greenspan and other groups ,several antedotes by independent musicians, and some other vague thing that I would remember if I wasn't so tired.
At least in the United States, copyright was originally seen as a needed evil to spur creation of culture and ideas. one of the great ironies of the pro IP groups, such as Disney, is that many of the works that they established themselves on would have been out of reach had current IP laws been in effect. Hollywood existed as a way to escape copyright/trademark in the rest of America. America's early industrial success happened to its extent because many early American factories were clones of British ones that several men had memorized.Take a look at canals and their lobbying when they were starting to be replaced by the railroads to see how excessive market protectionism can interfere with the evolution of the economy. I fear that excessive control of our culture for business interests has lead our culture to be sterilized, inefficient, and decadent. To be somewhat fair, I believe that limited IP laws in terms of scope and length can contribute to culture. I personally would have that defined as 15-25 years depending on the pace of the medium, its ingenuity and relevance to its field in general. Infringement should be scaled as portion to the offense, uploading a CD for noncommercial purposes should have less consequences than assault or stealing a copy for a store in my opinion.
Getting back to your post, I think that IP theft is the excuse for the rise of the surveillance state in the wold, not its reason. governments are increasingly starting to see their citizens as children and servants to be monitored and controlled. I think that the excuse changes, but the agenda stays the same.
rant's over. My sense of entitlement is getting the better of me, so I leave it as an exercise to a karma whore to find the specific examples for me, and for a media shrill to refute my fatigued rants.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:2, Insightful)
Very few file-sharers have the capacity to buy the stuff they download, they are just tagging along in what is a part of their culture, a culture which the media conglomerate has built very effectively.
This could be true for poor countries, but i completely doubt that a twentysomething who spends 200 $ for a pair of shoes or goes to a club where entry and drink is 30 $ cannot shell out 10 $ twice a month for a DVD or a record (consider also that you can have old cd/dvd for a couple of bucks through ebay/online sellers).
Re:My dilemma is this ... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:So your point is? (Score:4, Insightful)
I am one of the original founding members of the Open Rights Group [openrightsgroup.org] in the UK and I've several times debated with my elected representatives about protecting various freedoms on the Internet. I don't have "battered wife syndrome" and I do take active steps to try and protect my freedoms. I don't know anything about you, but there's a good chance I've done more than you have to try and keep the Internet free. But that doesn't mean I need to disregard facts that seem inconvenient. Wide-spread piracy provides a powerful justification for attempts to stop it. And I don't know of any methods of stopping it that don't have the rights of innocent people stepped on as collateral damage, or that don't allow an opening for the government to insert a little scope-creep for political purposes. So in addition to fighting against infringements of my freedom, I (like the earlier poster) point out the flaws in the arguments of piracy proponents who are provoking a lot of these measures for the sake of not paying for music or movies or books.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:5, Insightful)
Very few file-sharers have the capacity to buy the stuff they download, they are just tagging along in what is a part of their culture, a culture which the media conglomerate has built very effectively.
A dollar a song, Bunky. Or less. Two bucks for a video. There's your pop culture, reasonably priced. Listen to music for free on Pandora, or watch TV for free on Hulu. Your culture's all covered, Ace.
Oh, wait, you want PhotoShop and Dreamweaver for free? And free development tools are part of your culture... how again? Besides, your "culture" has already kicked out a response to this, it's called "Open Source Alternatives." Are they as good as the professional closed source originals? Usually not, but they're close, and they're free. Want better? Get a job.
I forget... what was your argument again? Oh, yeah: So, the choice is to be left out of the loop on everyday culture or pirate. And the funny thing about that is, wait until you have kids: you'll be praying to God every night that they somehow manage to avoid the "everyday culture."
30% vs. (100 - 30)%, your math fails. (Score:3, Insightful)
So, after a 30% drop if file-sharing traffic, we'd expect to see a 30% increase in sales of CDs, DVDs and e-books.
Let's assume that file-sharing covers 1% of all media consumption and direct sales the remaining 99%.
A 30% drop is to 0.7%, so sales increase to 99.3%, a whopping 0.[recurring:30]% increase over what it was, or .3% in absolute terms.
Your numbers seem to work if it's 50:50 instead of 1:99. If you want an absolute (not relative) increase by 30%, then you need it to be 100:0, i.e. everything is file-shared. That doesn't make sense--who seeds?
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:4, Insightful)
watch TV for free on Hulu
"Sorry, currently our video library can only be streamed from within the United States."
You fail, Ace.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:3, Insightful)
The method of slowly pushing the commoners down and the rulers up doesn't stop with a reasonable and gradual struggle to make the situation more balanced. It stops when the commoners revolt, the powerful raise their armies against them and discover that those armies are too heavily outnumbered.
Except that in this case people aren't upset enough to start revolting, and distracted by all the comforts of modern society. The few angry nerds are making big talk on the internet, but the common Joe flips the channel on his TV and probably doesn't even know about the problem.
Remember that it takes a lack of food and a lack of distractions to create a revolt. "Then let them eat cake" is something few politician will utter today. If anything, the past couple of years in politics have more than once proven that nobody gives a shit about their liberties.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:4, Insightful)
"I can't afford it so I'll steal."
Which I knee-jerked to saying "How is that rating 'Insightful'?"
And then I had this flash that the same thinking is why the US economy is where it is.
When you steal/borrow what you can't afford, everyone loses in the long run.
Of course, that's an oversimplification of the respective situations
*(not because they borrowed too much, but because their retirement funds took a nose dive when everyone else borrowed too much)
Re:So your point is? (Score:3, Insightful)
Wide-spread piracy provides a powerful justification for attempts to stop it. And I don't know of any methods of stopping it that don't have the rights of innocent people stepped on as collateral damage, or that don't allow an opening for the government to insert a little scope-creep for political purposes.
I do: legalize what the pirates are doing. Abolish copyright.
"Piracy proponents" aren't provoking these measures; the bloated copyright-based industries are. Try directing your anger at the people who are pushing for more and more restrictions on communication and technology, not the people who want to share information and be left alone.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:5, Insightful)
You both have my sympathies; RobotRunAmok for the above, richie2000 for wanting it.
Re:Nothing will change. (Score:4, Insightful)
I have my doubts this drop has anything to do with either Piratebay or the new law.
Usage probably dropped-off due to fears over Conficker, as people avoided using their internet on April 1 (including me), and waited to see if there would be any carnage. But never mind the truth. Politicians would rather grasp any straw no matter how flimsy, to justify their acts.
Re:So your point is? (Score:1, Insightful)
It's a bit rich for an artist who sells off his copyright for a profit to then go and say he doesn't mind people taking it for free. Ofcourse, they don't, they've already got their money by selling the rights to their work.
Re:So your point is? (Score:3, Insightful)
Take a look at the link I posted to the organization I financially support. You will see that one of our activities is opposing copyright term extension in Europe, briefing MEPs and the media on the subject. What have you done to fight "people who are pushing for more and more restrictions on communication and technology" ?
As to "bloated copyright industries" why do you omit the many small labels and artists and writers and game producers and others who also depend on copyright to be able to sell their work for whatever price they can find accords with public desire for their work? The Internet has provided the first opportunity in a long time to subvert giant music labels by letter artists connect to their public directly and en masse. And you want to take that opportunity away from them?
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:3, Insightful)
If people are going into debt to sustain the entertainment industry, something's wrong.
I agree. If they're such pop culture addicts, they should be getting their fix from the Public Library, getting the most from their tax dollars.
But it has nothing to do with the prices set by the entertainment industry for its wares. If Jobs had set iTunes downloads at $5.99 per song, it would have failed. He set it at $0.99/song, and it's a raging success. That's the price that the majority of people were willing to pay, and that's how markets work.
Worse - we are often forced to buy the same damn thing twice, such as when a standard changes (VHS to DVD)
No one is forcing you to do anything, sweetpea! My VHS machines still work fine. You upgrade consumer technology because you *want* to, not because you are forced to.
or because of draconian DRM that blocks us from moving our Cassettes/CDs to our Ipods/computers.
There's DRM on your cassettes and CDs!?! Wow, sounds rough on your world. See, here on earth, nothing prevents us from moving music from tape or CD onto our computers. Again, my condolences.
unless you prefer lossless CDs like I do, then you'll be spending a whole lot more OK, so you're an audiophile. It's always been an expensive hobby, even thirty years ago in the "analog age." Presumably you enjoy it, so God bless. But I'm sure you recognize that any audio encoded above 128 kps is targeted to a niche audience, and that elite hobbyist crowd should expect to pay a premium for the privilege.
Re:Nothing will change. (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Post should be modded -1 Troll. (Score:3, Insightful)
Your post should be modded -1 Troll.
I am not a troll just because you disagree with me.
Are you saying that the 30Gb/s is 'free speech'? People have suddenly stopped making forum posts or blogging to the tune of that overnight? Why would they? Bizarre.
Are you saying that the 30Gb/s is 'fair use'? Although perhaps the view of a minority, it's not commonly seen that pirating games is fair use.
Free speech and fair use aren't limited to forum posts. Free speech and fair use *are* frequently squashed by legislation ostensibly not targeting them. I have personally chosen to say many things anonymously because I am not willing to deal with a remote but real possibility that I'll be dragged into court to prove I'm not a terrorist. Some things I have chosen not to say at all, not because they are illegal, but because lawyers commonly hold them to be within striking distance of poorly written laws.
If the drop in traffic is neither free speech nor fair use, why do you blithely claim it as a likely possibility?
*Something* changed overnight. They have made two unprovable assumptions: First, assuming that it was the legislation that changed the bandwidth usage; second, that the legislation only affected its intended target. My assertions are plausible, though no more provable or sound than theirs. My intent is to point out the fact that their logic is faulty.
Do you have a license to be an idiot?
Hello, I'm from slashdot! My license number is right next to my name. Good to meet you. :)
Re:Nothing will change. (Score:4, Insightful)
the summary may be right that this is a sign the legislation is working.
Not really. If you look at the longer term statistics the actual situation is that in the last 6 months prior to the legislation coming into effect there was a massive drawn out flood of traffic, almost doubling ordinary levels. What's happening now is that it's falling back to what it was before.
So the only effect was that people started downloading like crazy just in case, in anticipation of an event of unknown consequences. That it's only dropped back to normal levels is more surprising really; with the previous levels of traffic one might assume that some may have material to last them for years.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:3, Insightful)
Entertainment is not culture. You know how I know this? Because I have a God-given right to my culture.
God doesn't make laws, so leave him out of this. He's not relevant.
You do NOT have a right to your culture. Copyright law prevents this! Copyright is supposed to expire so that when things DO become part of the culture you can utilize and redistribute them. Unfortunately, copyright extensions have completely eliminated the whole fucking idea. The extensions were bought and paid for by the corporations whose profits you are so concerned about. They were neither desired nor voted for by the general public of any western nation. Understanding copyright law, and the fucking fucks whose media you don't think has become part of the cultural background? YOU FAIL IT!
If conficker IS a deterrent.. (Score:4, Insightful)
If Conficker proves to be a deterrent then it's a question of time before the MAFIAAs create some worms of their own.
Imagine a worm that targets torrents or torrents apps because, after all, that all torrents are used for. (/sarcasm)
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:4, Insightful)
This is me playing the worlds smallest violin for all those poor file-sharers denied access to the latest Jonas Brothers CD or Wolverine movie.
You can't afford it, then don't buy it. Your rationalization for stealing whatever isn't nailed down because it's easy and available are complete bullshit. People with talent and skill work to create things you will never be capable of creating yourself. You derive enough enjoyment from them to take the time to steal them, you should be paying for them.
Re:Not fun anymore (Score:3, Insightful)
Unfortunately, even if everyone stopping pirating today, legislation will still get worse and worse. The fact that pirating is possible at all still gives enough incentive to special interest groups like the RIAA (and Sweden's equivalent) to continue lobbying. In fact, it will be even easier for them, since the only thing holding back the politicians is the fact that there are at least some people fighting back.
Despite what we wish in our hearts, politicians never look out for "the common good". You have to give them an incentive to look out for your interests, and if you don't, they will cater to whoever does the most to get them re-elected. Since we can't match industry's campaign money, all we can do is try to organize as many people as possible to make things politically unacceptable. Don't roll over, fight back damnit.
Re:Not fun anymore (Score:4, Insightful)
If they cannot offer me what I want (unencumbered digital music), then I simply do not buy from them.
THAT is the solution to the problem, NOT illegal file sharing.
Money talks. Politicians listen to money. In fact, if yours are like ours, MONEY is the ONLY thing they listen to, which is why lobbyists bring suitcase loads of it to washington to bribe the politicians. They call it "campaign contributions". Ya, right.
Re:So why is 1 download 1 lost sale? (Score:3, Insightful)
That's the argument over Jammie's $220,000 fine for 24 tracks: an uncountable number downloaded and that is an uncountable loss to the recording industry.
In that case, 1 download is 1 lost sale.
If this IS the case, then 1 unmade download is 1 gained sale.
Your comment is wrong.
Well they're actually claiming in Jammie Thomas' case that one download = 9167 lost sales.
Re:Nothing will change. (Score:4, Insightful)
If that were the case, the decrease in traffic would be seen everywhere. The IPRED law is only effect in Europe. (maybe just in sweden? I can't tell) So check the traffic in the US for 4/1, if it goes down too, then it's not due to this law. If it's unaffected, then it's probably due to this law.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:4, Insightful)
"Europe doesn't import culture."
Everyone imports culture.
"Entertainment is not culture."
That's the most moronic thing you've said yet.
Re:VPNs are irrelevant (Score:3, Insightful)
You raise an excellent point, which briefly made me think, awesome - no matter what I'll still be able to get what I need.
Thing is, I think that torrenting, burning, unraring, playback has made many many 'dummy' users much smarter than they ever would be on a machine previously.
Furthermore, they have a taste for it now, if they find torrents are shut down, they will ask their geeek friends what to do instead.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:1, Insightful)
What's with all this "Ace" and "Sweetpea" bullshit?
You might have some points to make, and some might agree with them, but you still sound like an asshole.
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:4, Insightful)
Lolz. You sure do live up to your nic.
"Everybody" is not just "the millions of idiots trying to avoid getting caught breaking the law" it is EVERYBODY.
I would have though you could do better than that seeing as how it was YOU who brought them all into the fold when you wrote that "Everyone loses." That was the entire point of your original post wasn't it? To show that it wasn't just "the millions of idiots trying to avoid getting caught breaking the law" who were going to suffer as a result, right?
Re:They pull a knife, we pull a gun (Score:3, Insightful)
>>>He was confusing -- either disingenuously or because he's an idiot -- culture and entertainment.
No he wasn't. Culture and entertainment are closely linked, and often the very same thing. When you listen to Mozart, you're not being entertained, but also absorbing German-Austrian culture. Or vice-versa if you're an European reading Mark Twain's Huckleberry Finn, that too is not just entertainment, but also a part of American culture.
>>>Because I have a God-given right to my culture.
False. You can't view the Mona Lisa without paying the museum entrance fee. Plus you don't have a God-given right to things you don't own. If the artist doesn't want to share his painting of the Mona Lisa, he doesn't have to. ----- Also you never really defined culture. If culture is not entertainment, i.e. not music or books or videos or paintings... what's left??? Very little.
Re:VPNs are irrelevant (Score:1, Insightful)
You ignore history. Bit Torrent, when it first came out was only used by the "tech-savvy" file sharers. Now it's main stream. IPREDator VPN is now only used by "tech-savvy" file sharers, but it will someday soon be mainstream.
Re:VPNs are irrelevant (Score:1, Insightful)
bit torrent was once a minor, geek-only tool, but now it is used by everyone and his dog.