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Networking Businesses Communications Media Television

The Problem With Cable Is Television 334

Saul Hansell writes in the NY Times about how various services offered by cable companies affect their spending and their revenue. As it turns out, a lot of the cost increases and investment needs are coming from television and video services rather than internet connectivity. The scramble for high-def and rising licensing fees for programming seem to be the biggest headaches for Comcast and Time Warner right now. Quoting: "By all accounts, Web video is not currently having any effect on the businesses of the cable companies. Market share is moving among cable, satellite and telephone companies, but the overall number of people subscribing to some sort of pay TV service is rising. (The government's switch to digital over-the-air broadcasts is providing a small stimulus to cable companies.) However, if you remember, it took several years before music labels started to feel any pain from downloads. As the sour economy and the Web start putting more pressure on the cable companies, they may be forced to consider breaking up the big bundles of channels they now insist that consumers buy and instead offer individual channels or smaller groups of channels on an à la carte basis."
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The Problem With Cable Is Television

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  • by Ralph Spoilsport ( 673134 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @01:22PM (#27807337) Journal
    I would actually pay for cable.

    What I want:

    HBO
    History Channel
    MSNBC
    CNN
    CBC
    BBC
    Comedy Central
    Showtime
    Science Channel
    PBS
    Animal Planet (for my daughter)
    Cartoon Network (for my daughter)
    VH1 (for the wife)

    That's it. I don't watch and don't care for the rest of it, because it's mindless brain drool, and a lot of what is on the stations I listed is also mindless brain drool, just less of it than elsewhere (like Oxygen, MTV, SPIKE, ABC/CBS/NBC, etc.). That's 13 channels I would watch, and watch at least once a week. I would pay a dollar a month for each. That would give them $13 a month they're not getting now. I would not pay more than $1 month, because frankly, TV is a big time suck and mind poison. but that's what I would do, and I am certain there are many people who agree with me.

    I don't want the Food Channel. I don't want ESPN. I don't want "Desperate Housewives" or "American Idol". It's crap. I don't want it in my house.

    But I am willing to pay for the good stuff, if I can be certain I will get GOOD STUFF.

    RS

  • by Narpak ( 961733 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @01:23PM (#27807351)
    I guess the problem is that majority of programming suck, or at least that the broad scope of programs available through a cable package is so diverse that many only enjoy a small handful while the rest that falls outside the individual field of interest is uninteresting.

    The tactic employed is to bundle "high quality" channels with "low quality" channels to ensure that if you want to buy the thing you are interesting you also have to buy a lot of crap that you don't are about. Selling individual channels, or smaller bundles, would mean you could probably ensure that what channels you get are those you actually want to watch; but it would also mean that a lot of marginal shows and channels would go out of business.

    Of course personally I believe that this is pretty much inevitable and that shows and programming enjoyed by a smaller minority will have to find other ways to reach their targeted audience (like say the Internet). And it probably wont stop there either. In fact I would go so far as to say that over the next two decades the traditional way (in so far as something as new as cable can be said to have a tradition) of watching TV will change in many different ways. Using myself as an example I don't watch TV. Not because there aren't shows I would be interested in, but because I simply can not tailor my day around a programming schedule (nor am I inclined to buy a cable package and a Tivo like device). For me the only option when it comes to watching shows is getting them online (and I am sad to say the options for doing that legal is severely limited in my Country); so for the most part I just have to do without until reality catches up with technology and gives me options suited to my lifestyle.
  • DTV and cable (Score:4, Interesting)

    by quickOnTheUptake ( 1450889 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @01:24PM (#27807355)
    Possibly OT, but when I installed a little outdoor DTV antenna the other day, I was amazed by how many stations I got. I'm wondering: as stations start taking advantage of the extra stations (you know, running more programs rather than running HD and SD stations with the same programming plus a weather channel) will large numbers of casual TV users decide the monthly cable fee isn't worth it?
  • by viralMeme ( 1461143 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @01:49PM (#27807535)
    They just don't get it, we don't want to subscribe to a hundred channels. What we do want is watch what we want when we want and not have to subscribe to half a dozen services on top of our ISP fees.

    If the telecoms want to make real money out of IPTV they need to stop subscribing to rights to channels and instead buy up their own material and repackage it for their own subscribers, else all they are doing is relaying terrestrial TV to an audience that can already get on .. Television. I mean, for me, why pay extra to watch television on the Internet ?

    If may come as a surprise to the telecoms that IPTV is a bandwidth hog, but not the rest of us. What they need to do is provide a high definition broadcast grid for live video, the rest to be provided in a peering arraignment to the local ISP switching center. The consumer then selects from a list of older tv progs and movies and they are delivered overnight to a DVR [pvrweb.com] or set-top-box.

    You pay for what you watch when you watch. Latest movie, ok top dollar, old movie, $1:00 a time. You also pay for online game subscriptions, video telephone, research and reference like the Wolfram|Alpha [wolframalpha.com] project.

    Of course even 'passive viewing' is old century for the current wired generation, they're more into making and being in their own personal movie [youtube.com] .. :) It depresses me as to all the innovators can see as to the future of the Internet, television and adverts. Back to the sixties I guess :)

    See also:

    Regular columnist Bill Thompson wants it all. And he wants it now. [bbc.co.uk]
  • Cable TV vs Internet (Score:2, Interesting)

    by cyberbill79 ( 1268994 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @02:02PM (#27807661)
    My first issue with the cable company came when they took SpeedTV (before it became a NASCAR station, ugh.) and made it part of a 'sports package' back in 2001. I had no want of the other stations they wished to 'push' to me as a subscriber, so we didn't pay for the new package. Since then, I have stopped using cable, and have been using such services as hulu and others which are perfectly capable of providing adequate entertainment over my 'turtle-slow' DSL line (note not using cable internet). I am not a promoter of nor benefactor of hulu, but wish to say it might be a better business model for the cable industry than what it currently has in place.

    To quote: (and you better know by who)
    "We make use of a service already existing without paying for what could be dirt-cheap if it wasn't run by profiteering gluttons..."

    I am sorry, but why should we pay a premium for what is already publicly available?
    -cb
  • Re:DTV and cable (Score:3, Interesting)

    by commodore64_love ( 1445365 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @02:06PM (#27807693) Journal

    My upgrade to over-the-air DTV has spoiled me. I watch it on a standard analog CRT, which is nothing special, but then when I go over to my brother's house I can't help noticing how "blurry" his cable television looks. DTV costs me nothing whereas he's paying $60/month for a blurred image.

    The one drawback of over-the-air is the finicky reception, which means sometimes you want to watch channel 6, but it isn't there. Oh well.

  • Re:Smaller Bundles (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Bieeanda ( 961632 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @02:10PM (#27807729)
    The reason we have the larger bundles is that advertising and programming on the more popular channels covers the deficits run by the less popular ones. Programming on Discovery, History or whatnot may be great, but it's the pap like MTV that brings in the lucrative advertising and eyeballs. Breaking the packages up just makes it easier for the stockholders to demand that under-performers get axed... and that's a category more likely to include the ones that we want to see, rather than the ones that the broader public do.
  • by surfingmarmot ( 858550 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @02:21PM (#27807819)
    Of course this is a generalization, but in the main the paradox is that free content usually ends up not being worth paying for because quality producers won't make it for long leaving largely low cost/low quality content over the long run. Quality producers and distributors stick to channels where the business model provides a sufficient fee structure (ad revenue, subscribers fees, etc.) via channel control to provide them revenue and profit. But consumers will only pay for content they value--both in quality and speed. The problem right now is most US internet connections are mostly too slow to provide high quality and delivery speeds that will command cable TV-level fee structures for advertising and subscriber fees. The US is way behind the EU in this. So the cable companies and telcos have a huge investment in infrastructure ahead of them before they can profit in the general market. Which is why they want a tiered internet--to phase infrastructure in slowly and match costs and revenues better to stay profitable. Their greed early on has them no painted into a corner--but you can bet they are figuring out how to make to consumer fund their rescue.
  • Re:Smaller Bundles (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Narpak ( 961733 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @02:40PM (#27807933)
    iTunes Norge have a severely limited selection of movies and series. In part because of the Norwegian Movie and Music industry, and in part because they refuse to follow Norwegian Law. Which is also why Apple/iTunes have threatened to boycott Norway several times. So iTunes is not a viable option since it does not provide what I want, and even if it did I couldn't be certain I would be able to access what I had purchased a few months, or years, down the line.
  • by earlymon ( 1116185 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @03:16PM (#27808251) Homepage Journal

    Welcome, once again, to another episode of cable operators complaining about internet delivery and content bundles. All together now - (sorry, I'm very snarky today) - cry me a river.

    The real issue is that all of the current non-OTA TV delivery systems have bitten off much more than they can chew.

    So far as I know, NO ONE in the USA is offering HD content as advertised:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_Lite [wikipedia.org]
    http://www.highdefforum.com/directv-forum/29158-hd-lite-directv-picture-quality.html [highdefforum.com]
    http://www.satelliteguys.us/dish-network-forum/51978-facts-about-hd-lite-e.html [satelliteguys.us]
    http://forums.joeuser.com/309174 [joeuser.com]
    http://www.tvnewsday.com/articles/2009/04/22/daily.4/ [tvnewsday.com]
    (I recognize that some of the above links seem to target satellite TV, but if you read through two things become apparent: users are equally slamming cable, and neither satellite nor cable has their arms around a solution.)

    Like it or not, the #1 driver for a cable subscription is TV - and they already cannot deliver on that.

    I'm not a big sports fan (but so what if I am or not?), but I can reliably report this: during a hockey and a basketball game, I DVR'd OTA and my so-called high-def service of same channels. Hockey results: OTA clear, puck actually disappeared with paid service. Round-ball results: OTA clear, paid service unable to distinguish if foot over line or ref was blind during slo-mo playback.

    And here's some technical anecdotes:
    1. Your channel package choice or size of bundle won't impact anything, it's backbone limited.
    2. When I upgraded to "HD" satellite, my house's RG-58 didn't cut it due to bandwidth limits on the RG-58. The '58 was ok for the short wall-to-TV pigtails, not otherwise.
    3. They can fiber this and cable that and MPEG-4 the other, but no one is supporting the infrastructure to get the job done.

    And a real big issue - once you've made the grade to premium cable or premium satellite, and you've replaced your TV - name your reasons, they're all valid: a) I want a new one, b) new TV standards and my set is getting old anyway, c) time to branch out and support my computer and Hulu, HTPC, et al, in the living room - you'll replace that TV with an HDTV and you'll go with the HD package from your for-pay provider (cable or satellite). The HDTV is an investment-grade purchase, just like your PC (any flavor), and the HD programming is too small an incremental price increase to pass up.

    Here's the invective we can now look forward to: if you're complaining about your TV quality, you'll be told the bandwidth suckers using torrents are to blame. If you're complaining about your internet service, you'll be told that the primary service is directed at TV quality. Either way, do not expect that the future holds a world where you're really going to get what you think you're paying for.

    Mark my words.

    (PS - No apologies to those not interested in HDTV, or TV - you're not the big market to these companies, and that's all I'm ragging on - I'm not dis'ing anyone's lifestyle or entertainment choices. HTH.)

  • by Tyr.1358 ( 1441099 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @03:25PM (#27808315)

    I think you are right, people do have different preferences for cable programming.

    Myself, for example, only watch Discovery, History, Sci-fi, and Comedy Central. My SO likes to watch the other reality tv channels. So what ends up happening is we pay verizon $130/month for premium programming, even though she only watches 20 of the 800 channels. In order to get those 20 though, we have to buy a whole block of channels we don't need.

  • by IntlHarvester ( 11985 ) * on Sunday May 03, 2009 @03:29PM (#27808365) Journal

    > Food Network, Golf Channel

    IMO these sorts of niche channels will be the first to go under an internet video regime.

    They only have a couple hours a day of original programming, the rest of the time is endless reruns and infomercials. It should be very easy to package together advertising-supported cooking or golf shows on the internet in a much higher quality format than cable.

    The only technical advantage Cable has here is the convenience of dialing up channel 123 and watching some golf. As soon as web video portals appear for these niche interests, that advantage disappears.

  • by zooblethorpe ( 686757 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @03:43PM (#27808469)

    I haven't watched TV in ages, not since living in an apartment building that had basic cable service for everyone as an amenity. And even then I seldom found the time to watch aside from when the San Jose Sharks were playing (hockey for those scratching their heads). Now, the "TV" as in "the display device" is hooked up to the Wii and the DVD player, but "TV" as in "programming some big media company beams to my tuner" is unknown in this house. Why bother? I have plenty else to keep me entertained.

    Cheers,

  • by thejynxed ( 831517 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @05:14PM (#27809163)

    They don't generate squat. The parent company of ESPN for instance, requires that the cable/satellite/Verizon people advertise, sell, and bundle ESPN channels in order to get any of their other channels for use on their systems.

    It's almost as if they are afraid that ESPN would fall flat otherwise....

  • by jedidiah ( 1196 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @05:16PM (#27809187) Homepage

    I dunno. I would like to suggest a "radical" idea.

    Channels like "Food" and "Golf" should take cable out of
    the equation. Since they already air commercials, they
    should put themselves on the satellites unecrypted so
    that anyone who wants to can tune in.

    They could even allow cable services to rebroadcast the
    signal so long as it's unmodified.

    Unless it's HBO, the only thing I should be paying my
    cable company for is the cost of repeating signal.

    There should be none of this nonsense where cable
    providers are forced to pay for the priveledge of
    re-transmitting someone else's commercials.

  • by Fujisawa Sensei ( 207127 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @05:20PM (#27809225) Journal

    Cable set to the side. Forcing me to pay taxes and then using those taxes to benefit someone else is theft. Theft from me and my family. You think taxes are good, then defend taxes, don't dispute that they are theft though. If I stuck a gun in your face and demanded 20% of your money it would be armed robbery. When the government does it, it is called taxation. And I personally could not care any less than I do now, (zero), if Billy-Joe Bob gets anew heart or not. He could die before I walked across the road and pissed on him if that was all he needed. I also don't care if your mewling brats get an education or if your parents have to eat roadkill. Taking my money to benefit you and yours is fucking wrong,immoral and exactly what the founders of the USA were dead set against.

    Then pack the fuck up and leave. Nobody is stopping you.

    The United Arab Emirates have a 0% tax rate; perhaps you should consider immigrating there.

  • by Fujisawa Sensei ( 207127 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @05:31PM (#27809315) Journal

    The Libertarian assholes don't get it and never will get it.

    Its the same "Fuck everybody else so I can line my own pocket", asshole mentality that created the need for the progressive movement at the end of the 19th Century.

    If they had it their way, the only rights we would end up having were ones we could afford to buy and enforce as an individuals.

  • by IgnoramusMaximus ( 692000 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @05:38PM (#27809375)

    But when you are taking my money to give to people in the ghetto to have 5,6 or more babies. Taking it and giving it to illegal aliens so they can feed their ever increasing broods of children. Taking it and giving it to the person who contributed the most to your campaign. Or as in my hometown, taking it and giving it to two of the wealthiest individuals around here, so they can build themselves a baseball stadium and make even more money, it is fucking wrong.

    These are all examples of loss of control over taxation due to political corruption, and have nothing whatsoever to do with "socialism". A corrupt government in any political system will fuck the governed society up. So the problem is not with taxes it is with keeping governments accountable to their citizens, which is a whole different ball of wax.

    Your heart being bad and you needing a transplant is not my problem, nor is it societies problem. It is your problem.

    Only in a jungle full of, and run by, jackals such as you. The hallmark of civilization, and the point of societies, is that they offer support to their members in time of need. You are what is called a "sociopath" and by the looks of things you would be much happier in a cabin somewhere in the woods with no contact with anyone. If the government cannot find you, you will get to pay no taxes and no one would expect a shred of humanity out of you, since you would be living as a vicious animal, which is apparently already your personality. Just do not come out of there. Rabid animals tend to get shot.

    Fucking grow up and stop looking for the government to take the place of mommy and daddy

    Yes, the typical howl of a self-absorbed, narcissistic idiot who thinks all (or even a majority) of people can control their lives. Yet another "self-made" man who "made" his own language, was fed his own milk as an infant, who created or paid for thousands of years of development of all of the stuff he uses daily etc and so on. I usually do not wish bad things to happen even to idiots like you, but in your case I will make an exception: may a bus blow a tire, swerve and hit you, crippling you and may you discover that your insurance and savings cover less then 10% of the cost of your treatment.

    And while you are at it, get out of your mom's basement and get your own place, with money you earned and see if your attitude about taxes don't change.

    I have been running my own company probably longer then you have been alive. Which explains why I do remember things which are complete news to you. You would do much better to stuff all that Zhynovievna's drivel you've been reading in the garbage and read some history books for a change.

  • Re:Smaller Bundles (Score:3, Interesting)

    by earlymon ( 1116185 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @05:55PM (#27809525) Homepage Journal

    Personally I would be happy to pay Discovery money to be able to download or stream various programs they provide through the internet.

    Save your money, get almost everything you want right here - http://www.getmiro.com/ [getmiro.com] - now available for more than just Mac.

    I swear by it - I'm watching the Hubblecast HD right now (episode 27, in fact).

  • by IgnoramusMaximus ( 692000 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @06:06PM (#27809661)

    If they had it their way, the only rights we would end up having were ones we could afford to buy and enforce as an individuals.

    Quite right. It is no coincidence that most of them have fantasies of societal collapse followed by a "Mad Max"-type future where "real men" and their shotguns get to rule the day.

    They never seem to get it that a "working" example of a "libertarian society" is ... Somalia. No functional central government to rain on the "real men's" parade there at all. Everyone there is free to conduct "free enterprise" any way they see fit. Curiously however, libertarian immigration to the Paradise in Mogadishu remains rather low.... perhaps not enough pamphlets at the weekly meetings at the temple of the Goddess Alyssa Zhinovievena?

  • by IgnoramusMaximus ( 692000 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @06:45PM (#27810081)

    Actually they are examples of unconstitutional acts. I can not lay my hand on any part of the Constitution that grants Congress those powers (like giving taxpayer money to AIG executives).

    That is because US constitution is a general outline of government. No constitution of any country is capable of dealing with the actual details of governance. The AIG (rightly or wrongly) was given money because elected representatives attempted to rescue a nation-wide economy (nation-wide welfare being part of their explicit mandate) by doing so. One can argue the wisdom of the thing, but one cannot argue that they did not have the constitutional backing. Otherwise the federal government is pointless, and you might as well go 50 separate ways (at which point you will be whining about your state government not being "legitimate" ... etc and so on, ad nausea).

    If we simply followed the Constitution with a Congress limited to only the particular enumerated powers, with appropriate amendments as necessary such as for SSI, our politicians would once again be under our control, instead of spending like teenagers handed a credit card.

    Then you would have to come up with a whole new document that is phrased far more cleverly, and which could predict future. However smart the Founding Fathers were, the constitution is only a rough guideline and the devil is in the details of its interpretation. Which of course you do quite differently then many other people.

  • by molarmass192 ( 608071 ) on Sunday May 03, 2009 @09:30PM (#27811311) Homepage Journal
    Even better ... they should pack their crap up and head to lovely Somalia, the ideal capitalist society, no laws, no taxes, no government! Yeah, they have no infrastructure, no health care system (public or private), no education system, rampant disease, lack of food, and no police to stop people from killing you for what you do have, but hey, that's why you're the self reliant type and don't need no stinkin' government. In addition, there's no socialist pensions or medicare, mostly because people die in their late 40s on average, but hey it's one more thing you won't be paying taxes for! In fact, Somalia is so free, you can even chose to become a pirate, yes a pirate, and live a responsibility-free life in a tropical paradise. So, feeling oppressed by the tyrannical, thieving, socialist US government? Well, head to Somalia, no visas required, all are welcomed ... oh ... and bring lots of food, medicine, and money, they love that, and the government there promises nobody will kill you for it. Well ... if they had a government ... but that's part of the charm, and remember, come to Somalia, we've got pirates ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSBoO4GzHaI [youtube.com]
  • by IgnoramusMaximus ( 692000 ) on Monday May 04, 2009 @09:31AM (#27814893)

    The problem for a lot of people (with no judgments made on present company) is that they can see the positive effect of paying for Bob's new heart, but they never think clearly enough to realize that the funds to pay for it, had Bob not had the need or had I not been forced to pay, would have gone somewhere else, and--here is the most important part--society as a whole would be richer by the cost of one heart transplant.

    Well, strictly from the point of view of economics, completely empathy free, Bob's new heart is actually more economically sound investment then otherwise. Because paying for the procedure furthers medical training and the progress of medicine and maintains social stability, while on the other hand someone (since he his family would bankrupt itself trying to, unsuccessfully, save him through quacks and snake-oil remedies, them being the only thing they could afford) would have to pay for .... Bob's funeral, deal with his now destitute family begging on the streets etc. And since now his kids are beggars with no chance for education and a sizable resentment toward society - for they now know that they will be thrown in the garbage at the slightest provocation and thus have no social obligations any more, their "social contract" having just been demonstrated null-and-void - there is also a whole other, rather expensive socially and monetarily, host of "problems" on the way. This time involving gunfights. For which I would not blame them in the slightest. And I am not merely hypothesizing here. This is history and it is exactly how all of these "socialist" ideas developed: they were learnt the "hard way".

    But then there is of course that thing called "humanity" and the pesky little issue of what is the whole point of forming a society.

    Your point about Bob's future contribution is an example of the broken window fallacy, albeit made a bit strange by the health care aspect and the emotions and tangential problems it brings with it.

    Not at all. The "broken window" fallacy is because the alternative is status-quo, the windows stay unbroken. In case of Bob's heart the alternatives are more socially expensive (on average) and Bob gets to die.

    It directly affects Bob, for sure, but Bob should not be my responsibility unless I choose to take it upon myself to help him, and the indirect effects of Bob's future contributions are, quite frankly, unimportant--if he is working somewhere where he cannot be replaced, rest assured that someone there will pay for his transplant. This makes me (and most libertarians) sound like a stingy bastard until you realize that I, like most people (incl. said libertarians), will spend money to pursue my interests and to help the people whom I care about, and that letting me use my money to do so will result in a greater good for me and them*.

    Bullshit. You would not. A vast majority of "libertarians" are concerned only with their own ass and satisfying of their own astronomical greed, and would (quoting one of you on this very thread) "cross the street to piss" on Bob as he dies. The choice, historically proven, is between social unrest, vast hordes of destitute and dying in filth surrounding palaces of "capitalist" Robber Barons who occasionally take rides in their Rolls Royce limos, tossing coins out of the window and calling it "charity", and a stable society where there are no armed revolts of indentured "servants" lurking around every corner. And again, this is history not some hypothesis.

    Hell, with some of that extra cash, I'd even subscribe to my local public radio station along with hundreds of others, which could let them give Jeff the bonus he deserves, and Jeff could chip in with the rest of his family to help his brother Bob pay for his heart transplant!

    Which again is nonsense. For every "Jeff" there are a hu

  • by IgnoramusMaximus ( 692000 ) on Monday May 04, 2009 @10:58AM (#27815849)

    If Canadian healthcare is so great, why did comedian Tom Green have to wait 9 months to get his testicular cancer removed?

    Because he did not. He lives in California, long ways from Canadian medical care of his old country, and is rich enough to pay all expenses out of his pocket. And like many celebrities, he gets to be "Canadian" only for the purpose of lunatic rants against us. Otherwise he is just another denizen of Hollywood. His cancer was diagnosed and treated where he lives: the USA. Canadian medical system had nothing whatsoever to do with it.

    Needless to say, the "9 months" is also a complete fabrication. Quote Green: "The weird part is how quickly all of this has happened. In three months, I found out I had cancer, I got rid of the cancer, and now, I'm recovering from cancer". He was diagnosed at and the procedure was performed at the USC.

    Ultimately what he decided to do was go to the United States where he was taken care of the same week.

    Again more bullshit. He lives in the USA, and is probably ineligible for the Canadian medical care which requires at least 6 months continuous residence in one province (which is probably where the "9 months" nonsense comes from).

    Many, many canadians find themselves in the same boat. Government healthcare works about as well the the government DMV - i.e. poor, disorganized, slow, and controlled by politicians not customers.

    Yes, that is why the support for the single-payer system is on the ticket of all Canadian political parties, including the Conservatives, because they know in no uncertain terms that their votes would go down to single digits if they dropped it....

    You can rant an rave, but the global statistics show the truth quite clearly. USA is behind Slovenia in infant mortality for example ...

    Also it's a myth that the U.S. does not have universal healthcare. Anyone who needs it can get Medicare and Medicaid assistance directly from the Congress, while still maintaining the benefits of a competitive, innovative marketplace.

    That has been working out so great that over 60% Americans now want single-payer...

    Furthermore people who advocate killing-off private businesses and having a healthcare monopoly, make about as much sense as advocating we should kill-off Apples, Amigas, Linux, and just have everything run by Microsoft. Monopoly == bad. Multiple providers is better.

    Only if there is an actual marketplace possible in this area. It is so with computers and other gizmos, it is not with medical insurance. That is what has been demonstrated over and over by practical experience. That is so because the insurance companies can successfully obfuscate the particulars of their "offers" and the results are not detectable to their victims until it is far too late. And there is no apparent way to solve this problem. That is why in many places insurance companies (not just medical kind) have the same standing as loan sharks, i.e. societal parasites. Meaningful competition is not possible if there is no way to make individual transactions adhere to the "free market" principles. Which is also incidentally why medial care is not part of the marketplace.

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