Preview the Office 2007 Ribbon-Like UI Floated For OpenOffice.Org 617
recoiledsnake writes "OpenOffice.org has prototyped a new UI that radically changes the current OO.o interface into something very similar to the new ribbon style menus that Office 2007 introduced and which have been extensively used throughout Windows 7. The blog shows a screenshot of the prototype in Impress (the equivalent of PowerPoint), but this UI is proposed to be used across all OO.o applications. Some commenters on the Sun blog are not happy about OO.o blindly aping Office 2007, and feel that the ribbon UI may be out of place in non-Windows operating systems."
Nothing More Than Mac OS Floating Toolbars (Score:1, Informative)
How did this inane idea that Microsoft 'invented' some new type of UI interface with this silly 'Ribbon' stuff.
It's nothing more than classic Mac OS era floating toolbars that are overlapped in a menu.
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:5, Informative)
It's disallowed by MS specifically for Office-like applications. (nothing else)
I have always assumed that clause was added to gain a usability edge over OpenOffice.
So this could be interesting. *grabs popcorn*
Re:Underwhelming (Score:5, Informative)
I have a eeePC myself and I love the ribbon after I've minimized it, after that it works like a horizontal dropdown menu which is a plus because of the limited screen size. A minimized ribbon is actually smaller than menubars and toolbars. YMMV
Re:One of the main reasons I use OO now... (Score:3, Informative)
And that's exactly how much of his post you needed to read to get his message:
1. He uses OO because it doesn't have the ribbon like Office does
2. He doesn't like Office (hence the pejorative).
Seems to me that he communicated quite effectively.
Of course, you can decide that he isn't worth reading because he pokes fun of a product. If that's the case, I feel sorry for you. Plenty of insight is draped in sarcasm or stupid name-calling.
Re:Knew this was going to happen. (Score:5, Informative)
It only sucks in office until OO.o can implement it.
Correct. After that, it sucks in both of them.
Re:Nothing More Than Mac OS Floating Toolbars (Score:5, Informative)
What. The. Fuck.
They aren't even slightly alike. For one thing, it's attached to the window (floating toolbars *gasp* FLOAT). Floating toolbars generally didn't have multiple tabs of obtions in them-- I suppose there's no technical reason they couldn't have, but in my entire time using Classic Mac I never saw one. There's only one ribbon, where the typical Classic Mac app would have more than one floating toolbar. The ribbon has groups and a somewhat fluid grid layout, Classic Mac floating toolbars were just a simple grid.
Who modded this "Informative?" The ribbon is *nothing like* Classic Macintosh floating toolbars. The only similarity I can even think of it "they both have buttons."
Re:out of place in non-windows OS'es? (Score:3, Informative)
Open document, select text to be double-spaced, click on the lower right corner of the square named "paragraph", select "double spacing" in the third section of the menu that pops up.
There, it wasn't so hard, was it?
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:4, Informative)
"I just had to use a version of Office with the ribbon for the first time a few weeks ago, and I had a hard time with it."
That seems to imply that you're only a first time user /of that version of office/. And if that's true, then you had a hard time with it because you are probably used to the old interface, or the interfaces of similar programs. The ribbon is made to be easy to use for people who have *never used Office before*. And if you think no one is in that boat, take a look at your kids.
The fact is that the ribbon IS a much better interface than menus, and exposes options and settings that are easy to reach and understand. The ribbon is a GUI revelation, and anyone who says different is just afraid of change.
Re:I remember that UI style (Score:2, Informative)
Ahh GeoWorks, the "OS" that was on my first computer. The ribbon does remind me of GeoWorks somewhat, although I think that GeoWorks did it better [guidebookgallery.org].
Re:Keep this thing off my netbook (Score:5, Informative)
If you minimize the Office 2007 ribbon, it takes the exact same amount of space as a menubar. Even when not minimized, the ribbon is smaller than the default Office 2003 toolbars. I don't know who keeps spreading this misconception, but please stop-- the ribbon uses no more pixels than the menu/toolbars it replaced.
In short, Microsoft *did* think of the small displays. You're just assuming they didn't because your head is full of misinformation from reading Slashdot.
Re:I remember that UI style (Score:3, Informative)
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:3, Informative)
You press the pop-out button on the Styles pane. It creates a floating tool window rather than a sidebar.
These pop-out buttons are standard in the Ribbon UI.
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:3, Informative)
If you're an "advanced user", shouldn't you know the (unchanged) hotkeys? I mean, I'm a pretty heavy Office user, and I was apprehensive about the changes at first, but all the hotkeys still work and the ribbon is easier to actually find things that I don't already know about.
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:5, Informative)
Umm traditional toolbars show or hide elements based on window size...
The ribbon just tries to do it intelligently by hiding stuff you might not use as often, while a toolbar just uses icon placement to determine which to hide.
Re:I'll say.. (Score:4, Informative)
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:3, Informative)
To most of the people i've shown the ribbon interface to, it wasn't even obvious that the office menu was even clickable... It just looked like a logo that was put there for decoration.
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:4, Informative)
Still, MS doesn't have any patents on the concepts of a ribbon.
Not yet, but that could change anytime [wikipedia.org].
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:2, Informative)
It's disallowed by MS specifically for Office-like applications. (nothing else) I have always assumed that clause was added to gain a usability edge over OpenOffice. So this could be interesting. *grabs popcorn*
Here's what Wikipedia has to say [wikipedia.org] about this "patent":
Mike Gunderloy, a former Microsoft developer left the company partially over his disagreement with the company's "sweeping land grab" including its attempt to patent the Ribbon interface. He refused to "contribut[e] to the eventual death of programming."[10] He states: "Microsoft itself represents a grave threat to the future of software development through its increasing inclination to stifle competition through legal shenanigans."[11] KDE developer Jarosaw Staniek[12] has expressed beliefs that the patent cannot be acquired due to the ambiguity of prior art.[12] As no patent has been acquired yet[update], they assert that anyone who has not signed the license can legally implement the concept in their applications without having to conform to Microsoft's requirements.[13] Microsoft will grant free licensing for all to implement the ribbon interface except for products competing directly with Microsoft Office programs.[14] If the design guidelines contain legal loopholes that give Microsoft a basis for future lawsuits against products exploiting this concept, those disenfranchised would not be able to inform others due to the non-disclosure agreement.[8]
KDE developer Jarosaw Staniek notes that the ribbon concept has historically appeared extensively as "tabbed toolbars" in applications such as Macromedia HomeSite, Dreamweaver and Borland Delphi.[12]
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:3, Informative)
It's disallowed by MS specifically for Office-like applications. (nothing else)
The license is royalty-free.
It's a simple click-through agreement.
The program does not involve code or technical specifications and there are no protocols or file formats.
The license is platform-independent.
The license is available for {any application] except [those] that compete directly with the five MS Office applications that have the new UI.
Office UI Licensing Developer Center [microsoft.com]
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:3, Informative)
I'd really rather see something new and different, a genuinely innovative new interface, as different from the ribbon as the ribbon is from pull-down menus.
You might be interested in buying the new car I'm going to build. It actually has a steering wheel that works the other way around, when you turn it left you drive right and the other way around. That is SO innovative. Oh, and I switched the break and gas pedal, to get some more innovation.
Why do they have to completely change the user interface in big software products from version to version? Even before Office 2007 the "New Document..." templates first opened in an extra window, then in the sidebar, then in an extra window again from version to version.
LOTS of people who use computers these days have very little clue about computers. I have to support them at work. Telling them to "click on 'File' in the left-most menu, then on 'Open'" is pretty easy. Trying to tell them to click on something that moves around, and appears / disappears all the time is pretty impossible. These are people who are only able to remember "I have to klick on the icon in the top left corner of the desktop to start program X". When things move around to different places they are lost.
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:3, Informative)
Almost.
Now, you'll have another executable. Double-click on that (make sure to close Office first, otherwise you'll probably need to reboot), wait half a minute for the package to install, then attempt to open the file again. If you did it right and all goes according to plan, you'll now be able to open that pesky Publisher document that you were foolish enough to create with either Office 2003 or Office 2007 SP1. If you didn't, go back to the beginning and try again.
See? Easy!
Re:I'll say.. (Score:4, Informative)
Re:How about some nice menus instead? (Score:3, Informative)
RE: "These experts seem to believe users actually READ all the options" -- for commonly used options they don't, but for the one time a year you want to remove duplicates from an excel sheet (actually found in a logical place under data tab, data tools group) people do read through options until they find what they want. The new ribbon layout makes that operation (find the random button you know is there somewhere) faster, at a slight cost to power users who don't know keyboard shortcuts, who take a single extra click to get to where they want, if the operation they are doing is of a different type to the previous one (want to conditionally format that new column, then click home, click conditional formatting, click data bars, click the blue bars).
http://blogs.msdn.com/jensenh/archive/2008/03/12/the-story-of-the-ribbon.aspx gives a good overview of why microsoft went the way they did.
Re:Hates them, we does! Nasty Bloated Ribbonses! (Score:2, Informative)
I just got a new laptop at work, and it has Office 2007, replacing the 2003 that was on the old one. The only thing that makes it at all tolerable is that my new screen is 900 pixels high instead of 768, so most of the space that the ribbon's burning up is new pixels
So double-click on the damn ribbon. Voila, the ribbon autohides. Suddenly Word, et al, take up even *less* space than before (thanks to the absence of toolbars).