Apple To Ship Mac OS X Snow Leopard On August 28 647
okapi writes "Apple announced that Mac OS X v10.6 Snow Leopard will go on sale Friday, August 28 at Apple's retail stores and Apple Authorized Resellers, and that Apple's online store is now accepting pre-orders."
Are you crazy if you rush out and install it? (Score:5, Insightful)
Leopard messed up audio programs of all kinds until Apple finally got around to addressing the issues with the .3 update. The recent .8 update screwed up some people's wireless connectivity. It hasn't been that long since some early adopters lost entire volumes of data when they upgraded.
Snow Leopard is supposed to be fixes, tweaks, and improvements, so maybe this one is a better bet, but still, I can't see myself pre-ordering.
Re:free upgrades? (Score:2, Insightful)
Snow Leopard? More like SLOW Leopard! (Score:2, Insightful)
See, I changed one letter, an 'n', for another, an 'l', as a way of making fun of the new release of Mac OS... I don't have any real reason for thinking it's slow, and it's not like I really have anything against Snow Leopard (apart from the fact that I, myself, am not interested in running Mac OS X any more) - it's just fun to make fun of it.
Re:Windows 7 (Score:4, Insightful)
Just wait until it gets bloated and begins to slow down. It happened with every previous version of Windows and unfortunately the behavior continues in 7 (I blame the registry). I have never had this issue with OS X, maybe because it separates the OS from the Applications so much.
Re:free upgrades? (Score:2, Insightful)
Considering you pay $500 extra for your mac, it's really not.
Re:new mac user here (Score:3, Insightful)
As I understand it, the version numbers here are pretty much on par with a Microsoft OS version number so 10.5 to 10.6 will be like going from 98 to Win2k and should be handled the same way
You're kidding, right? Please tell me you're kidding. Anyone who could possible equate going from OSX 10.5 to 10.6 to upgrading Windows 98 to the NT kernel-based Windows 2000 is one of two things:
- Too young to have actually used Windows 98
- Undergoing unhealthy bombardment by the Reality Distortion Field
Reading the list of changes, it looks more like going from 10.5 to 10.6 is more like going from RTM XP to XP SP3 (which includes the upgrades to MS software that comes free with a Windows license like Messenger, Windows Mail, Movie Maker, etc). It's the same operating system, same kernel, same framework, just with various "improvements" and some new programs.
Re:free upgrades? (Score:3, Insightful)
As an owner of an old Mac laptop that still Run OS X 10.1.8 let me say, that I still think that 10.2 should have been free, because 10.1.8 is so buggy and it will newer be fixed. Using NFS to mount a disk will almost always crash my kernel within an hour.
A big problem with the way that Apple does upgrades is that to get bugfixes, you often do need to buy the newest OS X and it's seldom free. I wish they would split the os from their applications, so the os bugfixes/upgrades were free, but they could charge you if you really wanted the i* software. I don't really like having to buy a new os, just to get working NFS.
That is ironic enough, one of the reasons that people keep their windows XP boxes(Instead of 'upgrading' to Vista. Windows XP was buggy when Microsoft released it, but Microsoft have used the latest many year bug fixing it, and all those bug fixes are free.
And XP bugfixes don't ever require new hardware unlike Mac OS X, where even if I wanted to buy the newest Mac OS X upgrade for Power PC, my laptop could not use it because its graphics chip is to slow. So I can't get all the bug fixes that Apple have developed and released because my Gfx chip is to slow. (Unless I buy new hardware. I begin to see why people call Apple a hardware company).
Re:several interesting issues (Score:3, Insightful)
1) this is an update, not a full installation. There is no "full price" edition, you MUST have mac os 10.5 on it now
Only the $29 version is an update and you need Leopard to use that version.
Tiger users can buy the Mac Box Set at $169 that includes Snow Leopard, iLife 09 and iWork 09.
Re:free upgrades? (Score:3, Insightful)
...that means that you are getting your PCs for $100 a pop.
You should let the rest of us in on the secret.
Re:Windows 7 (Score:4, Insightful)
The more you use your OS- the slower it gets. Browser histories get bigger and take longer to open. Search bar suggestions take longer to load (as the data gets more bloated). Folders take longer to open as there is more to list. 'My Computer' gets slower with every drive you add since it feels the need to refresh its data with the latest usage and sizes. Sometimes programs install themselves to context menus and that has some overhead when right clicking. How about programs that have background processes always running... these didn't come with the OS (I am looking at you Java- where the hell do you hide?). And why can't more registry items slow down windows? Searching takes time. Storing it in memory takes... well, memory (which could cause you to swap).
You're right in that an OS doesn't slow down on its own. It's additional applications that do it. But most people don't have a computer to JUST "use" Microsoft Windows. And for some other typical applications (browser, office, email)- usage causes more overhead overtime as the program tries to become smarter or has to show the user more data.
*drops the mic*
Re:free upgrades? (Score:1, Insightful)
> Just so you know, the Snow Leopard specs say that an Intel processor is required, so no G5 support.
I really miss the old Apple, when they used to support their hardware for more than 3 years.
Remember System 7.5.5? That was released in 1996 and supported Macs all the way back to the Mac Plus, introduced 10 years earlier!
So what are the compelling reasons to upgrade? (Score:3, Insightful)
You will not get 64 bit kernel, since by default 32 bit kernel is installed on all supported hardware except XServe. Even more, you can not install 64 bit kernel on hardware that could normally run it, since it appears Apple has restricted 64 bit kernel to hardware that has 64 bit EFI. Also, 64 bit kernel is not available on any Macbook.
So, basically, you have 32 bit kernel with 32 bit kernel extensions and drivers, just like in Leopard with hacks to allow it to run 64 bit user applications. True more applications are now 64 bit, but who cares if their mail or calendar is now 64 bit instead of 32 bit? It's not like your mail program needs more than 4 GB of RAM anyway.
And the applications that could really benefit from 64 bit like Photoshop are not available anyway. And once they are available they will run on Leopard as well (which was marketed as 64 bit end to end, when in fact the only application that is 64 bit on Leopard is Chess, and XCode).
So unless you really need that exchange support, I don't see compelling reason to upgrade at all?
Re:Windows 7 (Score:5, Insightful)
Microsoft's Astroturf campaign has been phenomenal for Windows 7.
It reminds me of the old days when Microsoft Marketing could have sold shrink-wrapped poo; those guys were that good. It's too bad the software was never as good as the marketing.
Re:Windows 7 (Score:5, Insightful)
Which makes their failure to sell Vista especially noteworthy.
Re:Are you crazy if you rush out and install it? (Score:3, Insightful)
Yes, because many (all?) of the Apple-supplied apps have been slimmed down from Universal Binaries to Intel-only executables.
And then fattened up again to 32-bit Intel+64-bit Intel executables.
Also, there has been considerable "tightening up" of the Apple-supplied apps in that they use Frameworks (what's known as dynamic libraries or shared libraries on other OS's)
Well, not exactly. There are conventional dynamic shared libraries and there are frameworks. Conventional dynamic shared libraries are pretty much the same as they are on other UN*Xes; frameworks *include* one (or more) such shared libraries, but they also include other items, such as header files, nibs, etc.
as much as possible, instead of having nearly all code stuffed in their .app bundle.
That's not new in SnowLeopard - they've always been linked with shared libraries and frameworks.
Re:Are you crazy if you rush out and install it? (Score:4, Insightful)
QUOTH YOU: - Money spent since 2002 on OS X 10.x - about $400. (Else my G4 Mac would stop functioning properly.)
Liar. You could go back and install the old Mac OS X on that computer any time you wanted, and it would have all the features and functionality it did when you purchased it. There's NOTHING about an OS update (or lack thereof) that is necessary to keep a computer functioning properly. As if the OS has an expiration date.
Hyperbole and bullshit.
Re:Are you crazy if you rush out and install it? (Score:3, Insightful)
I would also like to point out that you can't directly buy a viable version of Windows at this moment(Win7 isn't out, WinXP is only shipped with Netbooks as of 2008, and Vista is crap).
Re:Are you crazy if you rush out and install it? (Score:5, Insightful)
Oh yes... He could install the ancient OS X... But keep in mind that Apple no longer provides updates for it like MS does for XP of the same vintage (not that I'm a fan of MS by any means...) Furthermore, unlike XP, he will be unable to install most modern software since nobody supports 10.1, .2, and even 10.3 support is getting quite rare.
But back to your point. Yes, you are 100% correct that the old stuff will continue to function PROPERLY, but methinks the OP REALLY meant Effectively and Securely. Paid updates from Apple are really required for that.
I'll share my perspective having used Mac's since 10.1 (everything earlier I considered unusable,) Windows since 2.0, Linux since 0.99 and a plethora of random crap before that back to about 1978.
The amount of time I have spent messing with OS issues (problems) on OS X versus Linux or XP is FAR FAR less. If I value my time at a pathetic $20/hr, I've saved the cost of OS X probably about 100 times over. Whining about the cost of OS X updates is really, in my opinion, short sighted. This doesn't even get into how much better 10.5 is to use than 10.1. There is no F-ing way I would ever go back.
Re:Are you crazy if you rush out and install it? (Score:3, Insightful)
>>>Liar.
A little strong there.
Are you a teeny-bopper?
>>>You could go back and install the old Mac OS X on that computer any time you wanted, and it would have all the features and functionality it did when you purchased it.
>>>
No because the original 10.1 that came with my Mac would NOT run the latest software which requires 10.4 or higher. And yes I could use older programs like Firefox 1 or Safari 1 or Internet Exploder for Mac, but they don't operate properly with today's web. They just display garbage.
>>>As if the OS has an expiration date.
Actually, as I just explained above, they do. Apple and other manufacturers don't support anything older than four years. Contrast that with Wintel machines which can still get support even for 11-year-old OSes (like Win98), and therefore you don't need to upgrade unless you want to.
Re:Are you crazy if you rush out and install it? (Score:5, Insightful)
I have a G4 PowerMac which apparently won't run 10.6. Can Linux be run on this machine? Are there any stores/dealers/whatever that would do the install for me?
Yes, but why? Snow Leopard brings disk space benefits (good), full 64-bit support (useless to you), Grand Central which manages multi-core programming (useless to you) OpenCL (useless to you) and, um, QuickTime X.
So, you're missing out on saving 6GB and running QuickTime without any window borders. The vast bulk of Snow Leopard's advances are to make it scream on modern hardware. I don't think it's such a horrible thing to suggest upgrading your seven year old computer if you're interested in running the most current software on it.
But yes, you can run Linux on it. You'll save some more disk space, you won't get 64-bit support, multi-core anything, OpenCL, QuickTime X, or anything else that Snow Leopard or OS X in general gives you. But hey, at least you'll get to bitch about how you can't do those things with Snow Leopard either!
Re:Are you crazy if you rush out and install it? (Score:3, Insightful)
That hasn't been true since Spotlight was released. Ever since, each version of OSX added more and more crap that I can't turn off, like the 100% useless Dashboard.
You can disable Spotlight (it's in System Preferences, just add your hard drive to the Privacy list) and Dashboard doesn't run until you first open it. Remove it from the Dock and disable the function key for it and you'll never see it.
Additionally, you can completely turn off Spotlight if you want, but it takes either dropping to the command line or running one of the tinkering apps. Both methods work flawlessly, although there's really no need if your drive isn't indexed (and that's the only time it slows your system down, is when it's indexing).
Re:Failure? Sales figures say otherwise (Score:3, Insightful)
Except operating systems are judged by how many people upgrade
Are they? Says who?
The point is there are many ways of rating a product - and sure, it's no doubt of concern to MS that Vista isn't as successful as XP (although we still have to take into account that XP has been on sale a lot longer - what was XP's share in 2003?), but in no meaningful sense is over 20% market share a "failure".
But I don't know why I bother - evidently even posting hard figures from sources is "flamebait", if it doesn't toe the pro-Apple line of the mods. Why aren't mod points given out fairly, randomly, and evenly anymore?
Re:Are you crazy if you rush out and install it? (Score:4, Insightful)
you have a point. Apple only has 5 notebook models (white, air, 13" 15" 17") going at a time and they tend to keep the same model for 18 months or so with only minor updates. Compared to Dell that has many models, plus variations, and upgrades the entire consumer line with completely "new" models every 6 months or so. With Apple the tiniest inconvenience sticks out where with Dell, you'd be lucky to get the same internal parts even if the model numbers were the same, they change them all the time, even from week to week so it's hard to say any specific problem is "Dell's" fault and not your particular mash-up they shipped you this week because not enough people on the internet have Inspiron 13wzyz to complain about..some have 14wxyz and others have 13wxy ... get the idea.