Windows Patch Leaves Many XP Users With Blue Screens 658
CWmike writes "Tuesday's security updates from Microsoft have crippled Windows XP PCs with the notorious Blue Screen of Death, users have reported on the company's support forum. Complaints began early yesterday, and gained momentum throughout the day. 'I updated 11 Windows XP updates today and restarted my PC like it asked me to,' said a user identified as 'tansenroy' who kicked off a growing support thread: 'From then on, Windows cannot restart again! It is stopping at the blue screen with the following message: 'A problem has been detected and Windows has been shutdown to prevent damage to your computer.' Others joined in with similar reports. Several users posted solutions, but the one laid out by 'maxyimus' was marked by a Microsoft support engineer as the way out of the perpetual blue screens."
Re:Did you see the solution? (Score:0, Insightful)
there's a fix available here: http://www.ubuntu.com/
Note to self: clone hard disk before rebooting . . (Score:3, Insightful)
. . . my Windows XP updates get pushed, pulled or shoved down my throat . . . this sounds like an excellent reason to clone my hard disk before rebooting, and logging on to my company's network . . .
Re:microsoft screws users again. Why is this news? (Score:2, Insightful)
And people will still be ignoring it.
Intentional? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:0, Insightful)
Should have used Linux and LaTeX.
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:5, Insightful)
What I don't get is why people don't bother backing up important things like that.
Re:Remove automatic updates from your slipstream (Score:5, Insightful)
Here is a list of Microsoft stuff to remove from your XP slipstream:
Automatic Updates (for reasons related to the article) ...
Windows media player (including 6.4) because it downloads codecs at will.
Accessibility Options (unless you need them)
ClipBook Viewer (useless)
Games
Internet Games
Long list, wouldn't it be simpler to just remove Windows XP in it's entirety from your PC and replace it with something else?
Re:Need confirmation (Score:5, Insightful)
If it is true that only compromised computers blue screen then it's hard to fault Microsoft for their patch code choking when it stumbles across the exploit code.
It's pretty easy to fault them for not taking a checksum before they patch to ensure that the file isn't modified. If it is, warn the user.
Re:Need confirmation (Score:5, Insightful)
Sort of.....
You can't really blame MS for a crash that happens because the .DLLs/code on someone's machine has been modified by a malicious 3rd party.
But, you can expect an MS (or any other OS) to take appropriate actions to avoid patching a file that isn't exactly what is expected.
What you'd really hope for, is that when a problem is detected during the update process (IE - Crap - this .DLL isn't the .DLL we expect. Something is wrong!' - instead of modifying the .DLL it would present the user with some meaningful information like, 'Hey - this patch failed. You probably have a virus....you should get that fixed'. Or something similar.
It's possible that the patch took some reasonable efforts to ensure the patch would only be applied as expected; but I don't know. I do know that, even if it did, it didn't work.
There is a world of difference between an 'infected' Windows machine that has some annoying pop-ups showing up every 15 minutes, but is otherwise functional, and a Windows machine that won't boot because of a recently installed patch.
Re:Need confirmation (Score:5, Insightful)
Yeah. The owner of the machine would rather have the former... while everyone else on the Internet would rather they had the latter, as the former is probably sending out spam and trying to infect every other machine it can find as well.
Re:Need confirmation (Score:4, Insightful)
I was thinking that perhaps mebbe they should have a backup copy of that pre-patched kernel somewhere and give you the option to boot from it as a failsafe.
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Remove automatic updates from your slipstream (Score:4, Insightful)
But then how will I run Mass Effect 2?
Resistance is futile. You will upgrade. (Score:3, Insightful)
Resistance is futile. You WILL upgrade to Windows 7 as instructed. We are in full control of your computer. Your computer will remain deactivated until you comply with our instructions. You have no alternative but to obey.
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:3, Insightful)
"The most important rule is "Don't Panic"."
The second one: "Install Linux"
(Douglas would be proud of this one).
Re:Need confirmation (Score:3, Insightful)
Even if the file was modified, over-writing it with a valid one will not cause a problem under normal operation.
When the file is over-written, those modifications that you are thinking of are gone. The modifications can't come back from the grave as ghosts and cause a problem.
The only way there can be a problem is if 'something else' is making an assumption about that file incorrectly, and that does not mean that the assumption is that the file has been modified. More likely the assumption that it will NEVER be modified, which leads to the likely conclusion that it was in fact never modified. The file was exactly as expected by the updater and no matter how many times or ways you run a hash on it, equal is equal.
Re:LOL (Score:4, Insightful)
No shit Sherlock.
He was implying that the poster has only played those games, since he hasn't been using windows and those games are pretty famous for being cross platform.
What I don't understand is why "you can't play games" is supposed to be some sort of universal knock against people who don't use windows. I never played games even when I did use windows, it's just not my thing.
Re:Need confirmation (Score:3, Insightful)
Good idea, besides, it's not like such thing hasn't been done by others before.
Re:microsoft screws users again. Why is this news? (Score:4, Insightful)
The problem with Linux is that it's inarticulate. Look at Ubuntu, which is arguably the easiest way to get someone to use Linux if they're from a Windows background.
It works great, it's faster, and most configurations work right out of the box. if you have one of the few configurations that have been checked by the developers. (If you've got an ATI card like I do, Fuck You.) If you've got an older machine without one of the specific wireless cards detailed in document XR-122-65_rev_a_kernel26.6.1, you can with ndiswrapper and wpasupplicant. Rolling back the kernel version will also improve compatibilty on older systems. All of thse commands can be found on forums online, so there's lots of support for... ...what the FUCK are you talking about, Beardo? My machine USED to work, and now it doesn't and that's because I listened to you.
Windows is dominant because they write and market to people who aren't technical users. Read that bolded sentence again. Apple is hauling up their maketshare for the same reason -- they are marketing to the vast majority of people that want a computer but didn't spend their childhood in the CS lab. My dad doesn't want to learn how to use a command line to set up the email. My wife, lead tech support for distance education for a College, didn't like Ubuntu because of the Flash problem.
NOBODY GIVES A FUCK ABOUT PROPRIETARY DRIVERS. IF THE SHIT DOESN'T WORK THEN IT IS A LINUX PROBLEM. (Yes, even if it isn't.)
Hell, MS still has their ridiculous search, when you could just drop to a shell and type "dir *foo*.ext /s | more" and be done in 10 seconds. But you see, if you weren't the kind of person who reads /., I just a) bored you and b) acted condescending and c) said something unintelligible.
Linux is a spectacular tool, but like calipers, $30 ESD wirecutters, or my $200 soldering station, just aren't the right tool for the majority of people out there. If the developers get their heads out of their asses and learn how to market the software AND give the public what it wants, then and only then will Linux get its fair share of the market.
Re:The nut behind the wheel (Score:5, Insightful)
Uuuuuuuh..... A home user? Re-read that quotation that you so handily provided one more time.
See it?
It's singular. He applied updates to a single computer.
What sort of loon thinks that expecting home users to somehow test patches from their goddamn vendor before applying them is acceptable?
Interesting read, this link... (Score:3, Insightful)
From TFA: "To regain control of their PCs, users were told to boot from their Windows XP installation disc, launch the Recovery Console and enter a series of commands."
STOP COPYING LINUX ALREADY!
Re:microsoft screws users again. Why is this news? (Score:5, Insightful)
If the developers get their heads out of their asses and learn how to market the software AND give the public what it wants, then and only then will Linux get its fair share of the market.
The question is why would developers want to expand their market share among the non-technical users? Personally, I could care less if my mom uses Linux. You know why? Because she is not a developer and will not contribute one line of code to the OSS world. I want Linux to develop a following among the technical/programmer crowd. This means a larger developer base, which means a greater pace of improvement. This has been happening consistently for the 15 years I've been using Linux and that keeps me happily on this platform. Its all about Developers! Developers! Developers! to me. Microsoft and Apple can have all the rest.
When someone decides that there is money in getting non-techies onto Linux, they will be able to polish Linux into something really slick. Ubuntu is trying, but there really doesn't seem to be enough money in it now so they aren't able to apply a lot of resources to it. Who knows? There may never be any real money in that kind of market (for Linux, anyway).
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:5, Insightful)
Microsoft Windows is not a new product. If you don't know that it can't be counted on to work like a normal computer, that doesn't just mean you're not technical. It means you have been living under a rock for 20 years.
Strange, under my rock, Windows XP/2003 work well, I rarely have to restart my computers and when I do it is usually because of a hardware problem, long power outage (long enough to discharge UPS batteries) or because I am installing some software that needs a reboot. I get bluescreens very rarely.
for example:
Those 5 hours? Most of them were spent when I added more RAM, but had either a bad module or a bad slot, so I took that long to finally give up and disable 4 modules from BIOS, leaving 3GB (instead of 5GB what I wanted and 1GB of what was before). That was ~28 days ago. Then there were a few power outages and this PC was connected to a smaller UPS. IIRC only one of those 11 reboots was because the PC froze for some reason.
OS: 2003
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:3, Insightful)
Why not use a Windows live CD like Bart PE rather than Linux. It's easier for the people who've only ever used Windows and the NTFS drivers come from Microsoft.
Given that Microsoft were the ones to issue the problematic update in the first place, I don't think saying the NTFS drivers in a Windows live CD come from Microsoft is really any sort of recommendation.
Except maybe to scream.
Re:Legacy (Score:4, Insightful)
Okay. *upgrades to Ubuntu*
*tries to install Modern Warfare 2*
Hey, I can't run the installer, what's going on? *reads forums* What? Ubuntu doesn't support the latest Direct X? Fuck this, I'm going back to Windows.
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:1, Insightful)
The NT line does. It even has a symbolic name %USERPROFILE% which expands to the right directory path. Too bad almost nobody (read: nobody except properly trained enterprise developers) knows about this nice feature and Windows users are still forced to work under admin-level access rights by crappy software.
Re:microsoft screws users again. Why is this news? (Score:3, Insightful)
If most people had to install Windows to get it to work on their PCs, they'd be in the same boat they are currently in with Linux -- they wouldn't have any more clue how to install and configure Windows than they do Ubuntu. Having installed multiple flavors of both Windows and Linux, Ubuntu currently has the easiest installer I've ever seen, bar none. And I've had all the same problems you've described with Linux when I've had to install Windows from a retail (vice OEM) CD. In fact, I've even had to boot a PC with Knoppix, just to find out what kind of hardware was inside the case so I could go download Windows drivers to make the hardware work. However, since every PC maker since Windows 95 has included Windows installed by default (at least until recently), non-techie Windows users typically don't have to worry about it. Now, Windows is what Grandma expects on her PC. And since people, as a rule, are afraid of change, that will be the default until someone gives someone a compelling enough reason to use something else. Unfortunately, at this point, I suspect the only thing that will be compelling enough is, "You can't get a PC with Windows, anymore, ma'am...".
Re:Legacy (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:3, Insightful)
Intelligence, even extreme intelligence in something doesn't imply aptitude in all common things. I mean, what you think every person on slashdot is a well adjusted social individual?
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:3, Insightful)
It seems that Windows is not much user-friendly yet.
It looks like an interesting OS, perhaps in 1 or 2 years I'll try Windows again.
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:5, Insightful)
You're pretty dumb for someone getting a PhD.
Because "getting a PhD" == "being an expert in everything"
Except for the part where it doesn't. It's more like "being an impressive expert in one field"
Did you even bother to figure out what the AC's degree is in? How do you the AC should know how to deal with something like that happening?
Re:microsoft screws users again. Why is this news? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:in b4 the flamewar? (Score:2, Insightful)
True. Why does Linux suck so bad? Every 6 months Ubuntu breaks something.
Heh, if we made slashdot front page stories about those forum posts then even fewer than 1% would use Linux. But ofcource we just have to publicize forum posts about XP problems to give a skewed opinion. Oh well..
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:1, Insightful)
What is this? You have to reboot 11 days within that 321 days "uptime" and still claim a total "uptime" of 321 days? Oh and only one reboot is caused by PC froze for some reason - so it doesn't count?
Must be new method of counting system "uptime" from MS ... If I own my PC for a year and I reboot daily, can I say my "total system uptime" is 365 days? No none of the reboots were caused by "PC froze". Yeah right ...
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:3, Insightful)
I CAN'T GET MY FUCKING PHD DISSERTATION. I AM SO FUCKED.
You can still get your data off but it might not be easy. Your local PC shop should be able to do it.
People like me have been telling people like you not to trust windows for -DECADES-. You thought we were ignorant bigots and ignored us. Now you are suffering from the very problems we warned you about countless times. I don't mean to sound uncaring but you brought this on yourself.
Rarely? Surely an invitation for an uptime war. (Score:1, Insightful)
06:41:22 up 657 days, 19:06, 1 user, load average: 0.16, 0.18, 0.15
A gentoo box.
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:3, Insightful)
***Install Ubuntu and live problem free***
Ah come on. The 9.04 Ubuntu upgrade about four months ago -- Krackpot Kingfisher or some such -- did pretty much the same damn thing to a number of people. And some of the problems weren't especially easy to fix. (You ever tried booting a Linux PC with an empty menu.lst file and no kernel? Not as easy as you probably think) The major differences would be that Ubuntu users didn't pay money for the privilege of having their PC bricked. And that repairing a Unix PC is generally less painful than repairing a Windows PC.
The problem is that it is quite impossible to test updates against every possible hardware and software configuration that might be in use. I'm sure that Microsoft and Canonical try and try hard. But impossible means just that -- impossible.
The lessons, of course, are don't install updates until a few days after they are released, make sure that you have bootable media for your OS (if possible), and back up frequently. I learned that in 1963. Other people have been learning it ever since.
This incident, BTW, is a warning. It is highly likely if not inevitable that sooner or later the Windows automatic update mechanism is going to shut down much of the world's infrastructure either because the kids in Redmond have screwed up, or because some sociopaths somewhere in Eurasia have hijacked the update mechanism and used to to download something really grim, or because some country that the Western powers are trying to bully decides to retaliate.
Re:ha ha suckers!!! (Score:3, Insightful)
Dropbox works on Linux.
Ubuntuone doesn't work on Windows.
No cross-platform support = showstopper.