Solaris No Longer Free As In Beer 392
Posted
by
timothy
from the leisure-suit-larry-ellison dept.
from the leisure-suit-larry-ellison dept.
rubycodez writes "Oracle, having acquired Sun Microsystems, including its Unix, will no longer give away free Solaris licenses. Oracle also states that some features of its Oracle Solaris will not appear in OpenSolaris, which means OpenSolaris may start to die."
So fork it. (Score:5, Informative)
Re:How different does it have to be? (Score:5, Informative)
This is the closed source version of Solaris, you can't redistribute it period.
Re:May? (Score:1, Informative)
To rephrase, take one product and sell it to each customer for as much as they can afford, using the number of cores and amount of RAM in their server(s) to judge.
Re:So fork it. (Score:1, Informative)
It's bizarre how the article carelessly switches from talking about Solaris (well, OpenSolaris FUD) to four or five paragraphs about "Project Wonderland", implying that Wonderland has something to do with OpenSolaris. I had to do a web search to remind myself what in the world this project was:
Project Wonderland is a 100% Java open source toolkit for creating collaborative 3D virtual worlds. Within those worlds, users can communicate with high-fidelity, immersive audio, share live desktop applications and documents and conduct real business. Project Wonderland is completely extensible; developers and graphic artists can extend its functionality to create entirely new worlds and add new features to existing worlds.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Wonderland [wikipedia.org]
Re:So fork it. (Score:1, Informative)
If you read more closely, you'll see OpenSolaris is poisoned by dependencies on key closed components (including libc) that Sun never released, only providing binary builds for. That fork's a non-trivial task.
Re:That's fine (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Well then (Score:5, Informative)
Can you name just five more of these things? Two real examples followed by some handwaving about dozens of others doesn't really convince, especially when everyone knows those are the only two interesting things about Solaris.
Here's five:
ZFS+DTrace are great, but certainly not the only features Solaris10/OpenSolaris/SolarisNext have going for it.
Re:That's fine (Score:3, Informative)
Yes. Correct on almost all accounts. It might even be worthwhile, but SUN managed to create an artificial community only. According to my 2 Sen, this also broke its neck: In and out. Free Java, no, don't, free Solaris, yes, no, new license. And the 'community' could decide what they wanted, as SUN employees they had to follow Ponytail's zig-zag course.
No, it is not 'fairly similar' to the other Unix-like systems, though. Actually, it is the furthest away from those systems.
Re:That's fine (Score:5, Informative)
Of course this is precisely the reason for licenses like the GPL that explicitly prohibit this kind of bait and switch tactic for "open source" software development. Trusting and relying upon the goodwill of a for-profit company that can have management changes or get taken over by a different company as is this case will always happen.
Score one more for Richard Stallman being proven correct.
Nothing is being "switched" all the OpenSolaris stuff is still there, Oracle just won't be adding new features it develops to it. All the code that was there is still open even without the magical GPL and can be developed further. From TFA :
"The good news is that those of us who have worked so hard to bring this project to life still wholeheartedly believe in it. A core group of the Wonderland team intends to keep the project going. We will be pursuing both for-profit and not-for-profit options that will allow us to become a self-sustaining organization. "
Re:That's fine (Score:1, Informative)
While the existing codebase is licensed irrevocably under the Open Solaris license, Oracle doesn't need to release any changes under that license and doesn't need to accept any community additions.
Any changes/upgrades to the various subsystems of Solaris such as ZFS need not be released under the open license.
Re:That's fine (Score:3, Informative)
Re:So fork it. (Score:4, Informative)
And if you read http://hub.opensolaris.org/bin/view/Main/no_source [opensolaris.org] , which is the ACTUAL list of non-source-available components, you'll only see "libc_i18n" listed. Not libc.
Re:That's fine (Score:1, Informative)
There's no such thing as a troop of Eagle Scouts.
That's like a platoon of sergeants.
Re:Talk about high aspirations (Score:1, Informative)
Hey, Einstein, anybody in computers is a janitor; just the pay levels change. Machines are getting both faster and smarter, needing fewer people to do a given amount of work. Add to this the tendency of most companies to treat the majority of their IT staff like shit, AND the hateful, unmentioned but expected 24-7 support so the PHB can get his email and you'll realize that ANY time in IT is time wasted. Even one year in IT is a career backwater. I'm doing everything I can to get out, even in this economy.
Re:I feel sorry (Score:3, Informative)
"This led to a simple solution: over-tighten them." :) no really it should work a treat but kind of scary to use on a 30k machine.
I would suggest locktite
That is stupid. (Score:3, Informative)
Oracle has made clear that Solaris has an important place in their integrated vertical offerings (why should they use anything else? the capabilities of Solaris+ZFS+dtrace are way above anything else in offer in the industry, Sun put several storage servers that show the potential of the integrated offering, Oracle I am sure is not oblivious to that, the day they had their talk about cloud computing in London they made a point of showing Sun hardware and of giving a slot to a Sun guy).
Re:May? (Score:4, Informative)
you only need to lie to managers that our "solution" (including support etc) will cover their ass should anything go wrong.
FTFY.
I worked support at a company that Oracle acquired and we went from having the best support money could buy to having the most expensive answering service money could buy. Oracle works very hard to make sure that their support process is consistent, repeatable and efficient at handling the volume of issues submitted. You'll notice I didn't say anything about being good at handling issues, that is not a concern for them. Most of the folks who were any good at all found jobs elsewhere and were replaced by offshore staf with little to no knowledge of the product whose primary purpose was to shuffle requests around while they drowned the few remaining decent support staff with inane questions. This is my understanding at least based on talking with folks who are still there, I was one of the first rats who fled that sinking ship.
No matter how bad Sun's support may have been in recent years* you can rest assured that it will be worse under Oracle's ownership.
All the being said, AC is right, Oracle sells to management not to the geeks. There's still a general perception amongst the management types that "you can't be fired for buying Oracle".
*I've never used Sun's support, no idea if it's been decent or not.
Re:I feel sorry (Score:4, Informative)
I dunno how many years this was ago but in the time I have been using Linux (since 1999), scalability and performance on the server-side have improved greatly, in large part due to IBM's interest in trying to bring Linux up to the level of AIX in these areas..... Comparing Linux to Solaris in 1999 would have been like comparing Windows ME to Linux at the same time. However things have improved a great deal. In particular the schedular wars have left us with a far better OS than we ha before.
I have generally found Linux to be the most admin-friendly OS out there. This is reason to use it where it works well. More recently Linux has gotten a lot of effort in resolving those very problems you mention.
This is just about price increases (Score:1, Informative)
Posting anonymously because I'm an employee, but in the short-term, this is simply a way of extracting more money from existing customers who will be forced to pay the "Oracle tax". Oracle raised prices in 2008 [infoworld.com] and 2009 [readwriteweb.com], but this year we were told "you have to increase revenues, but can't just keep raising the product prices". The solution? Sell more of existing product or sell new products. The trouble is, any new products (either developed or acquired) need some time to get traction. What better way to boost revenue than to find critical Oracle-owned components that we aren't charging for and beginning to charge? Sure, customers have a choice technically, but in reality any company heavily invested in Solaris will find it too costly to switch in the short term.