Should Cities Install Moving Sidewalks?

theodp writes "The real problem nowadays is how to move crowds,' said the manager of the failed Trottoir Roulant Rapide high-speed (9 km/h) people mover project. 'They can travel fast over long distances with the TGV (high-speed train) or airplanes, but not over short distances (under 1 km).' Slate's Tom Vanderbilt explores whether moving walkways might be viable for urban transportation. The first moving sidewalks were unveiled at Chicago's 1893 Columbian Exposition, and at one point seemed destined to supplant some subways, but never took root in cities for a variety of reasons. Vanderbilt turns to science fiction for inspiration, where 30 mph walkways put today's tortoise-like speed ranges of .5-.83 m/s to shame. In the meantime, Jerry Seinfeld will just have to learn to live with 'the people who get onto the moving walkway and just stand there. Like it's a ride.'"

On hackaday today!

[AnonGCB]

http://hackaday.com/2010/07/07/heel-treads-make-shoes-go/ [hackaday.com] Similar concept, personally I'd rather have the moving sidewalks because there is less user input and therefore less possibility for things to go wrong (crashing into each other).

The trouble with moving sidewalks

[Animats]

Nobody has ever come up with a good way to manage speed transitions. Belt joints don't work too well. The clever parallelogram arrangement that starts out wide and slow and transitions to narrow and fast was too complicated. Parallel sections at different speeds haven't been tried since the Paris Exposition in 1900. The few minutes of film of that system show someone falling. There are serious problems with various kinds of shoes, ranging from spike heels to Crocs. People keep falling down on the things.

Re:Obesity?

[bill_kress]

Your post doesn't seem very well thought out.

At 30mph someone could travel the 2 miles between his bus-stop and office in an amount of time that makes it not double his commute time--and get additional exercise, whereas that may take a prohibitive amount of time if he has to walk.

My commute turns from 25 minutes by car to 55 by MAX light rail--a large part of the difference is walking the 1/2 mile between the max station and my destination 4 times a day.

When I ride my bike it's much faster, but I don't want to deal with the extra mess when it's raining and walking with an umbrella is too slow, so I drive at least 1/3 of the year. I'd enjoy walking/rideing more, but there are limits to how much time/mess I'll commit to it.

How would a moving sidewalk hurt?

Re:escalators too

[demonlapin]

Oddly enough, if you just ask politely for people to step aside ("excuse me, I'm in a hurry" usually works), I've found they'll step out of the way for you. Works in Atlanta and Charlotte.

Re:Obesity?

[bit9]

I empathize with you completely. Just the other day I was waiting in line at the McDonald's drive-through for my morning coffee, and the person in the car in front of me, upon being handed his food, promptly took a large wad of chewing gum out of his mouth and casually tossed it out his window, as carelessly as if he was dropping a grain of sand onto a beach. I've seen people do this same exact thing with trash (fast food wrappers, empty soda cups, etc). Every time I see someone do something like that, I am instantly filled with disgust and anger, and I suddenly wish that it was legal to drag the guy out of his car and rub his nose in it like you would do with a dog that urinated on your rug.

Re:Obesity?

[OctaviusIII]

Oh but it's not happening now in most parts of the US: witness the proliferation of a third rush hour around lunchtime in many parts of the country. Typically, those lunch jaunts are to destinations less than a mile away from the workplace.

Re:Obesity?

[caerwyn]

Walking 1/4 of a mile to the bus seems a little long? Really?

This is why public transportation in the US has such a hard time. Distances beyond the car in the driveway are simply to arduous for the common man, so either fares have to go up (to pay for all the extra buses since each one takes so long making so many stops) or people just take cars anyway because they can't handle walking a bit.

Re:Obesity?

[blind biker]

The massive dependence on cars did contribute to the huge obesity problem the USA now faces. I visited Irving, TX, a few years ago (my first visit to the US), and was astounded by the complete lack of opportunities to walk, and the utter, complete dependence on cars. There were a couple of eateries/restaurants on the other side of the highway, from our hotel, but there was no way to legally cross the freeway (though the restaurants were just across, clearly tempting the hotel patrons to come over and eat). The only legal way was to take a car, drive around and park it on the other side. Walking anywhere was strictly forbidden. Everyone drives cars, and nobody goes anywhere by foot.

The US wasn't this dependent on cars since the 1900's. It was a gradual process, which brought with it a culture of non-walking, non-cycling, going-everywhere-with-a-car. I would be surprised if you told me this hasn't at least contributed to a culture of obesity.

As for New York: it doesn't exist in a bubble. It's surrounded by a country with which has a dynamic exchange of people and mentality. The fact that its obesity rate is below the national average by 3%, is an indicator that it's on a better path than the rest.

Re:Obesity?

[Locke2005]

In Singapore, you don't see gum because it is illegal. It is illegal because they actually have high-traffic outdoor escalators in the city, and they were spending way too much money cleaning the gum off of them. So to save money, they just made gum illegal. Graffiti is a cultural artifact. I don't think gum falling out of people's mouths is.

Re:Obesity?

[David Greene]

I couldn't give half a rat's ass how much it costs or saves, personally. Cars = freedom. And freedom is more important than any other damn thing.

Define "freedom." I could just as easily state that our auto-oriented culture traps us into lives spent waiting on the freeway, keeps us in polluted transportation corridors and compels us to fight wars we otherwise would have no need to fight.

You need those roads paid for regardless, unless you think stores are stocked my magic fairies

Where exactly did I say we do not need roads? We need both roads and public transportation. We need choice. Isn't that required for freedom?

Re:escalators too

[onkelonkel]

Allow me to disagree. Where I live we have a rapid transit system that many thousands of people use every day. Almost all the stations have escalators. People who want to ride stand on the right, people who want to walk up, they walk on the left. On the rare occasion someone is blocking the way, you politely say "excuse me" and they politely let you by. It all seems very simple to me.

My estimate 60% walk 40% ride. I note that the escalators are wide enough for 2 non-morbidly-obese people to pass without touching. Personal observation: skinny people mostly walk, fat bastards always ride.

Re:Obesity?

[xaxa]

You might want to look at some statistics [who.int] ;-).

Though to be clear: several European countries do have a big problem with obesity -- the UK and Germany are worst.

Re:Obesity?

[spasm]

I did a project a few years ago in San Francisco where we were trying to map where old bus stops had been - we knew the blocks but not the precise locations. Turned out to be surprisingly easy - look for the sudden increase in black smears of decades old gum on the sidewalk where there's currently no bus stop or other obvious reason for bunches of people to be hanging out. That's where the bus stop used to be, about 80% of the time. We're talking bus stops that got moved or removed in the early 70s, and nearly 40 years later it's still clear as day. The only thing that really threw us is where the sidewalk had been jackhammered out for some reason since the bus stop existed.

Re:escalators too

[some_guy_88]

I'm not one of the morons I see at the airport standing on the left side of the moving sidewalk.

If they are at an airport, perhaps they've come from a country like Australia where we drive on the left side of the road and subsequently stand on the left side of escalators and overtake on the right.