Gubernatorial Candidate Wants to Sell Speeding Passes for $25 825
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samzenpus
from the pay-to-play dept.
from the pay-to-play dept.
If Nevada gubernatorial candidate Eugene "Gino" DiSimone gets his way, $25 will buy you the right to drive up to 90mph for a day. DiSimone estimates his "free limit plan" will raise $1 billion a year for Nevada. From the article: "First, vehicles would have to pass a safety inspection. Then vehicle information would be loaded into a database, and motorists would purchase a transponder. After setting up an account, anyone in a hurry could dial in, and for $25 charged to a credit card, be free to speed for 24 hours."
Re:Cars Don't Cause Accidents... (Score:3, Informative)
>Cars don't normally fall apart and cause accidents...it is usually driver error.
I agree with that. In all the accident scenes I've been to, it's usually driver error based on a contributing factor. Example, raining driver is going too fast, along with following too close. Snow, driver is going too fast and/or too close. Fog, driver is going too fast. And so on. I've only ever been to one accident where it was based on mechanical failure, and it was seizing of one of the front calipers(brake piston), the car itself was 8mo old.
Re:Cue increase in smothering (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:3, Informative)
Germany has some roads without any speed limit whatsoever, and they're safer than comparable roads elsewhere in Europe.
Well, Germany has no speed limit on some (less and less) highways (Autobahn), where you have strictly divided traffic with special safety measures (side rails etc.). And even there you have a set of supplementing rules for driver behavior on these roads. Without all of this, you can bet your shiny, meaty, a**, you'll see a lot of injuries and deaths due to some morons buying 24h joyride tickets :)
Are Nevada roads that much above US standards? (Score:5, Informative)
As Nevada is one of the US states I've never visited it makes me wonder if their roads are anything compared to European or even German Autobahns...
Until then I'll limit the times I hit 265 km/h (155 mi/h for the old fashioned) to the occasions I get in Germany.
Re:Cars Don't Cause Accidents... (Score:4, Informative)
H rated is the standard tire sold in the US now, which is 210kph/130mph
The base 17 inch tires, the cheapest we could find that were made for our car, were V rated 240kph/149mph
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tire_code#National_technical_standards_regulations [wikipedia.org]
http://www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible.html [carbibles.com]
Anyone driven from LA to LV? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:5, Informative)
While libertarians tend to get all outraged about things like this, there's no evidence that it's as safe to go 90mph on those roads as it is 70mph or whatever the current limit is. Even for roads like the Autobahn, when you do have a wreck, it tends to be pretty spectacular and much worse than the ones we typically get in the US. Beyond that mixing traffic speeds is a real danger. There's a reason why you're urged to keep up with traffic flow even if the traffic flow is going somewhat over the speed limit. It represents a risk to other vehicles to have people that aren't keeping up.
Re:What could possibly go wrong? (Score:5, Informative)
Who says the owner(s) of the car(s) and person(s) present at the accident won't still be the only persons liable if an accident occurs due to speeding? Just because the driver didn't break any laws in injuring someone, doesn't mean the government is "liable" for this. South v. Maryland [endtimesreport.com]; local law-enforcement have no duty to protect individuals, but only a general duty to enforce the laws
Only if the state has consented to this liability. The law that enables "speeding passes" could contain a liability shield for the state, Due to Sovereign immunity [wikipedia.org], the state itself cannot be held liable, unless the state has consented.
Re:Cars Don't Cause Accidents... (Score:4, Informative)
I work at a tyre wholesaler in the UK. You basically have to go out of your way to buy any car tyres now that are below H rated, which is 130mph. The commonest tyres sold are 205/55/16 91V, which fit all manner of standard cars which can get nowhere near the 149mph speed rating of them. You can get that size in H rating, but only with some specific branded tyres (like Michelin energy saver, Goodyear NCT5, Bridgestone ER300, Continental Premium 2). The budget performance tyres we sell most of, (Enduro 916+, Autogrip F107), are actually W rated... 168mph. No car that runs on this size of tyre will ever see that kind of speed... quick cars use lower profile, wider tyres.
The lowest (not truck) speed rating that sells is N (87mph) - they're commercial specification though - high profile, high load rating. I've not seen a standard tyre with a lower than N rating. You'll also sometimes get lower (than H) speed ratings on small high profile tyres (for old small cars), and 4x4 offroad tyres.
Re:Anyone driven from LA to LV? (Score:3, Informative)
90 MPH is pretty much the standard anyway. Seems to work rather fine with cars flying along at 90+ and trucks chugging up the passes at 30 MPH.
Same with the drive from Reno to Vegas. I cruise it at 85 with no problem. The NHP won't usually bother you unless you're going crazy fast. For those that haven't driven that route, US-95 is two lane undivided with short stretches of 25-40 MPH when you pass through the mere two cities and three "does anyone actually live here" outposts that exist on that 500 mile stretch. You will occasionally be stuck behind a convoy of people that can't seem to go faster than 50, at which point your vehicle needs to be able to reach 90+ to pass them. The fastest I've ever done out there was 110 to get around three travel trailers doing a max of 45 between Tonopah and Beatty.
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:5, Informative)
Those German highways without speed limits are dangerous and demand the driver's full attention because there's almost always a car nearby that is going much faster or much slower than you are (except when traffic is really dense, of course, in which case this degenerates into a massive stop-and-go where you're constantly changing from standstill to speeds up to 100km/h and back in a constant, rather tight cycle). It's quite stressful to drive on these roads for a couple of hours.
I've driven those roads. They were no more stressful than any given highway in the US. If anything, they were less stressful because slower traffic stayed in the right lanes. The big problems I have during my daily commute in the US is when several lanes try to stay at (or below) the speed limit and there's a backup of others heading in to work used to going 10 - 15mph above the limit trying to find a way around them.
To add to my German roads experience - I drove a lot of small country roads as well. Two lane roads that are about as wide as one and a half US lanes. No speed limits. Occasional blind hills and turns. Farm equipment occasionally on the road. The only accidents I knew of involved either a drunk driver or black ice. As the police say, "speed was a factor." But then, any speed would have been a factor in those cases.
With that in mind, I knew that when a speed limit was posted, there was a damn good reason for it (and it wasn't to "save the children" or fund the local law enforcement). I paid attention to blind spots in the road. I knew to watch for black ice and moderate my speeds in colder months. I watched for tractors. And I got the heck out of the left lane as soon as I was done passing while on a stretch of Autobaun (one time I looked in my rear view mirror when I saw a flash of headlights, didn't see anytihng, looked back down and saw tail-lights in the distance - dude was really moving). I never had an accident and never had a close call in 3 years of driving there. In all, I'm pretty convinced speed isn't the demon the US likes to make it out to be - beyond the fact that any speed is unsafe in the right circumstances.
Um. German autobahns are like any motorway (Score:3, Informative)
Take a look at any speed limited (typically ~70mph or ~120kph) motorway in Europe, take a look at German Autobahn without speed limit... Same. I would hardly describe them as special. I'll also point out that the unlimited autobahns are not 100% unlimited or separated from other autobahns. They are simply sections of the regular autobahn which are without speed limit, and those sections have no worse Killed or Seriously Injured figures than any other section; once you get past 50mph it doesn't really make a difference, you are mince anyway.
There is really nothing terribly strange about it. Lane discipline and driver alertness are generally good because unless you are doing 150mph, there *will* be someone coming up behind you at 150+.
Having said that... 80mph, 150mph. How much time are you really saving? I mean, how often do you do Berlin to Frankfurt, and wouldn't you rather use an ICE instead? At least you get to relax and do something other than stare at motorway.
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:5, Informative)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_oil_crisis [wikipedia.org]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_oil_crisis#Conservation_and_reduction_in_demand [wikipedia.org]
To help reduce consumption, in 1974 a national maximum speed limit of 55 mph (about 88 km/h) was imposed through the Emergency Highway Energy Conservation Act. Development of the United States Strategic Petroleum Reserve began in 1975, and in 1977, the cabinet-level Department of Energy was created, followed by the National Energy Act of 1978.
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/drivehabits.shtml [fueleconomy.gov]
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/images/speedVsMpg3.gif [fueleconomy.gov]
While each vehicle reaches its optimal fuel economy at a different speed (or range of speeds), gas mileage usually decreases rapidly at speeds above 60 mph.
You can assume that each 5 mph you drive over 60 mph is like paying an additional $0.24 per gallon for gas.
Re:Unrelated News (Score:3, Informative)
I believe that's what the $75 lawyer fee was supposed to take care of.
It's called "pleading to a non-moving violation" and around here (the midwest) it's what you do when you get a speeding ticket, unless you don't know any better.
You pay a bit to a lawyer (who probably does little other than this kind of shit all day, every day) who talks to some pal of his at the courthouse and files some bit of paper and ta-da! moving violation becomes non-moving violation, you pay a fine that's very, very slightly higher than your ticket would have been, the court doesn't have to bother with you any more, and your insurance provider doesn't hike your rates. All very routine. Might (might) not work if you're doing 90+, but 80-85 in a 70? No problem.
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:2, Informative)
I drove smaller, non-Autobahn roads in Germany with no speed limits. Some of them 2 lane country roads that would have been 1.5 lane roads in the US [...]
No you didn't. All standard two-lane roads in Germany have a default implicit speed limit.
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:4, Informative)
Where did I say that roads with speed limits are inherently safe?
Have you been driving in Germany yet? If not, my guess is that the kinds of situations you get on the highways there are hard to imagine. Seeing one car pull out behind a truck going at 100km/h while there's another car going 160-180km/h or sometimes even faster approaching from behind and getting far too close far to fast is normal. Very often, the faster going drivers are reckless enough to brake at the very last moment to come down to the slower speed with some 5 or 10 meters to spare between the bumpers and staying that close behind.
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:4, Informative)
That's all true, except that the maximum safe speed is far detached from the specified speed. The specified speed on the federal highway system, and which virtually all states have adopted in order to get their share of highway funds was adopted for fuel efficiency, not safety.
Re:Supplemental rules: the money (Score:3, Informative)
Actually, the rule is that insurance won't cover you if you are committing a crime at the time. Because it is a crime (and not just a traffic violation) to be driving in excess of 25 miles and hour (wasn't 35 miles an hour a couple years ago??), and most highways are 55, is where you get that 80mph from. If they make it legal to drive up to 90 mph, insurance will still cover you under most currently policies. In fact, they will cover you up to 115 mph.
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:1, Informative)
No. A hell of a lot more engineering has gone into the high speed autobahn than any US interstate highway. Grade and bank become such an important safety factor at these speeds that a significant portion of the autobahn is actually raised off of the ground to accommodate these needs even though there are no obstacles or cross-roads in these areas.
Additionally, the cost of building and maintaining the autobahn is staggering compared to U.S. highways (factor of ten? couldn't find a source besides the documentary I watched recently) and Germany has basically been over-budget and deep in debt on the autobahn since it was created. Another important consideration is that these high-profile, anomalous examples account for an extremely low percentage of actual roads (the autobahn accounts for less than 2% of roads in Germany), which is not very comparable to the US interstate system. Additionally, there ARE still speed limits there. For areas under construction or that do not have adequate traffic. In the event of a crash that leads to death or injury, those exceeding the advisory speed limit of 80 mph can still be held liable by the courts.
Its easy to say that the blame lies with "crappy drivers" because driver error factors into nearly every crash (97%) because even if road conditions are NOT safe, it is still the responsibility of the driver to perceive these conditions and reduce their speed or increase their following distance or otherwise be more alert to the road. But crappy drivers are less likely to cause accidents that lead to death and injury if we impose and enforce a law that restricts the speed at which they can travel. You can argue speed limits and traffic tickets do not reduce accidents, but by that logic should we simply lift driving under the influence laws because they cannot prevent the nearly 40% of traffic fatalities that occur each year?
Crappy drivers including those who choose to drive while impaired ARE a serious problem and one that demands our attention. Think about what these individuals do when they get in their cars. They set the cruise at about 2 mph under the speed limit to avoid ending up on highway patrol radar. What do YOU want their cruise set at? 53 mph or 88 mph?
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:5, Informative)
Statistics on the other hand will show that the number of fatalities varies to the square of the speed of the vehicle involved in a collision.
Highway statistics show no consistent relationship between speed and fatality. That's probably because once you reach a speed that kills you, it doesn't matter how much faster you go. Higher speeds do seem to increase driver alertness, but of course you also have more stopping distance.
What we do know is that Germany has much higher highway speeds, yet much lower highway accident rates (1/3 of US) and lower absolute number of fatalities (1/40 of US at 1/4 the population).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limit [wikipedia.org]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autobahn [wikipedia.org]
http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/policyinformation/pubs/pl08021/fig7_5.cfm [dot.gov]
So, stop pulling statistics out of your ass.
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:3, Informative)
Beyond a certain point, it doesn't matter how much more kinetic energy you have, you're dead anyway. Accident avoidance--fatigue, alertness, total travel time--become dominant.
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:3, Informative)
I think government crash tests should be conducted at the highest speed you might find on an interstate, so 80+mph. Currently frontal offset crash tests are conducted at 40mph in the US.
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:4, Informative)
I remember that interview also had the information that at least back then, they determined the speed limits for entrance and exit ramps not with measurement of the radius of curves, slopes of embankments, and equations, but by driving a mid-level Ford sedan to every single ramp and driving around it in circles over and over, slightly faster each time. On the first pass where the tires slipped, they'd halve the speed they were traveling, round to the nearest 5 MPH and post that as the speed limit.
I wish I had the source to point you all to. I think it was from a collection of some "answer person's" newspaper column from the 70's and 80', but I don't recall.
Re:Eh? No. (Score:4, Informative)
Speeding is travelling to quickly for the prevailing conditions. That speed may or may not be above the speed limit, whatever it is set to.
The speed limit is not "the safe speed". It is the legal limit of speed. Just because you are legally permitted to travel at up to 30mph on a street, doesn't mean it's safe to do so.
A minor nitpick, but.. "speeding" is exceeding the legal speed limit, which may or may not be the POSTED speed limit. Legal definitions do exist for this, and "speeding" usually means something. In some states, speeding is merely exceeding the posted speed limit. In many others, there are additional limitations on speed which define speeding differently.
In California, there are three ways you can be "speeding":
Because "speeding" is legally defined, somebody (in CA) can not be "speeding" unless they are meeting the above criteria. In CA, you're legally speeding if you're going 65 mph on a highway at night in the rain and fog with 50 feet visibility unless you can demonstrate that this was safe.
Nevada also has the basic speed rule [state.nv.us] so "the safe speed" is also "the legal limit" as long as the safe speed is equal to or below the posted limit.
As a native of Nevada... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Cue increase in accidents (Score:5, Informative)
There is a much smaller percentage of licensed drivers in Germany than in the US (which is near 99%). And the drivers that are on the Autobahn have much more training and are far more skilled. Sure, they have less accidents, but not even remotely for the reasons you think.