Bullet Train Derails In China 184
chrb writes "Xinhua is reporting that a Chinese bullet train has derailed, resulting in two of the train's coaches falling off a bridge. This comes only a few months after officials at the Railways Ministry expressed concerns that builders had ignored safety standards in the quest to build faster trains in record time — a claim that was subsequently retracted."
Collision (Score:5, Informative)
Compare to Japan's Bullet Train (Score:5, Informative)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shinkansen#Safety_record [wikipedia.org]
Not a "bullet" train (Score:3, Informative)
From TFA:
Feh. Amtrak, and even some commuter trains in the Northeast, routinely exceed 110-125mph.
Re:Compare to Japan's Bullet Train (Score:5, Informative)
Contrary to the South Park episode, Japan and China are in fact two different countries
Re:Collision (Score:4, Informative)
The standard system for the US and, as far as I know for most of the world, is called "block signals". These red/amber/green lights show if a train is in the section of track ahead and has been used for over a hundred years. Have the designers in China abandoned this?
Re:11 Dead. Missing from summary (Score:4, Informative)
At least 11 people have died and 89 people injured
You would think this important information would be in the summary to give perspective on the disaster.
The number of deaths isn't what makes it interesting to Slashdot -- the Oslo shooting + bombing (rightly) didn't get reported here. This derailment leads to a discussion of safety standards of high-tech systems, especially in emerging countries, and how technology could have prevented or caused the crash, hence it's newsworthiness.
Re:Not a "bullet" train (Score:5, Informative)
From TFA:
Feh. Amtrak, and even some commuter trains in the Northeast, routinely exceed 110-125mph.
Commuter trains in the UK tend to go upto 110mph, but average nearer 50-60. Eurostar from London to Paris peaks at 186mph (186.1 according to the iphone gps), but only averages 136mph.
The Acela Express might peak at 150, but it averages 70mph.
Re:Collision (Score:5, Informative)
Some slower but WAY busier lines also need to get away with the old block system, in order to reduce the spacing. In Paris, the two primary suburban lines (RER A and B) use what is called 'permissive' spacing, (SACEM on A, KVBP or KCVP on B), in order to reduce space between trains -- SACEM can space trains under 5 meters apart under stressed conditions.
But the key point of these advanced signalling systems is that the train-spacing software MUST be perfect. Not just "bug-free, we tested and deployed and ITIL'd the thing to death" but "mathematically proven bug-free". And even that doesn't cut it. Read up on how the SACEM hardware works, for instance. Or on the "Methode B" used to design the SACEM and the SAET (the latter of which powers automatic lines such as M14 and now M1 in Paris. SAET can safely take even a 110 year-old manually driven train within the robotic shuttle traffic, and get everyone safe there).
Back to China, perhaps the strike broke some communication line, making the position of the stopped train 'unknown'. But if that happened, someone much worse must have happened as well.
Perhaps, by cutting corners everywhere, they've also cut on the provably bug-free programming which one MUST use to build the train-spacing software. THAT, if that happened, is criminal.
Perhaps they've cut corners on brakes. Or whatever.
Hopefully for them, that's a fixable bug....
Re:Bad summary (Score:3, Informative)
I don't like the summary - from the article: A Chinese high-speed train derailed Saturday when it was hit by another express, state media said, throwing two carriages off a viaduct and killing at least 16 people.
When I wrote the summary a few hours ago the information regarding a lightning strike and collision was not available.