Microsoft Has Been Watching, and It Says You're Getting Used To Windows 8 675
Dupple writes "Microsoft's user data shows that users are getting used to dealing with the Windows 8 user interface, reports this article at MIT Technology Review. Despite some of the more scathing reviews of Windows 8, ordinary users are getting along with it just fine, according to Julie Larson-Green, the Microsoft executive who leads Windows product development. Data collected automatically from some Windows users, she says, show they are adjusting to some of the new operating system's controversial features without problems 'So far we're seeing very encouraging things,' Larson-Green says of the large volume of data that Microsoft receives every day from people using Windows 8 who have chosen to join the company's 'customer experience improvement program.' All users are invited to enroll in that program when they first log into the new operating system. If they do so, anonymized information about how they are using the operating system is sent to Microsoft. Referring to complaints from some quarters, Larson-Green says: 'Even with the rumblings, we feel confident that it's a moment in time more than an actual problem.'"
Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't know a single company whose IT will implement Windows 8 on anything. I'm talking everything from tablets, phones, laptops, PC's, or servers. In fact my company said straight out "No" because of all the problems it would entail.
Did they ever fix the lack of command line for windows 8 servers?
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Interesting)
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Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Funny)
Yep, but probably not to Windows 8. I'd sooner deploy Microsoft Bob.
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Insightful)
That'll take a decade, ala Windows XP. By then Windows 10 will be out. So, no thanks.
Get left behind by the business community, you shills crack me up.
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Insightful)
No kidding. The business community stays with what works, until they have to move for a legitimate business reason. "New shiny touchy colory" is not a legitimate business reason.
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Insightful)
You have obviously never dealt directly with a CEO.
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Insightful)
win9, or win8.5 will be out next year. by then they'll maybe have figured out if they really think people want to use 2 apps at the same time. or that people want to use applications instead of cut down appzzzzzzzz.
besides, wolfgang certainly isn't buying more surface pro's because he hasn't bought the first one.
anyways, people who haven used windows 8 for 3 months have used windows 8 for 3 months without switching to apple - what kind of fucking stupid poll is that?!
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Insightful)
I work at a company that does both Mac and Windows apps deployed to customer's desktops. So we *HAVE* to stay current and support all the new Microsoft and Apple OS releases. Windows 8 is the future, it's just that the future really sucks. The only thing keeping my spirits up for now is the hope that Microsoft comes to its senses and makes Windows 8.5 or Windows 9 suck less. Honestly I don't have much hope left, they are still pushing the tool ribbon and pretending it is a success. Microsoft doesn't like to admit it made a mistake, even when the evidence is overwhelming.
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So put them on the metro page. Functions in a similar way: press the windows key and you'll see all your pinned apps for quick and easy access as well as be able to just type the name of any given app you may want.
Prior to the release of Win8, I was highly, highly critical. Thought it was the dumbest thing MS h
I don't have a windows key... (Score:5, Insightful)
Seriously, I don't... I still have my keyboard from 1993 because these new ones stink.
More seriously - I use my computer for work. Not kids, not watching videos, not games, WORK. Windows XP/7 is better at getting work done than Windows 8.
Hopefully microsoft pulls their heads out of their butts on this and allows a quick setting change to "I have no use for metro, thanks."
Re:I don't have a windows key... (Score:5, Insightful)
Seriously, I don't... I still have my keyboard from 1993 because these new ones stink.
More seriously - I use my computer for work. Not kids, not watching videos, not games, WORK. Windows XP/7 is better at getting work done than Windows 8.
Hopefully microsoft pulls their heads out of their butts on this and allows a quick setting change to "I have no use for metro, thanks."
So do I - real work. I do not play games on a PC; prefer a 4:3 aspect if I can get it because no movies, etc. I do not even listen to music. But real work is generally done in applications like Word, Excel, AutoCAD, ERP, etc. Not the Windows operating system, but the apps loaded from it. Beyond loading an app, or managing files, what other real work is done in the Operating system? Very little. And I find Windows 8 about as good for that Windows 7. Plus it loads faster and finds printers nearby.
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Interesting)
Taskbar. Does it have a taskbar readily available at the bottom or side of the screen at all times? Right now, on Windows 7, I have 9 active applications and one-click access to about 40 others. The System Tray holds some more 15 icons out of which 11 allow double-click access to software (the other ones are informative-only). I like this, it helps me quickly get to this or that software without having to perform a few extra steps which take my focus away from what I need to do.
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:4, Informative)
Taskbar. Does it have a taskbar readily available at the bottom or side of the screen at all times?
Actually, it does have a task bar. And if you have a dual monitor setup, the taskbar is open on one monitor at all times (and if you don't open some "app" on the second monitor, it is open on both monitors at all times).
Not that I'd recommend anyone upgrade to Win8. I like it, but I also got it free from my organization. I don't really see any must-have features (unlike Windows 7, which had all the nice snap-to functionality that I couldn't get with XP). Sure, it might boot faster, but it has been months since I rebooted my computers. The extended task bar (one on each monitor) is also nice, but I generally reserve one screen for "Metro" apps. Once you know the keyboard shortcuts (Win+C, Win+I, Win+H), it is better than Windows 7 for social stuff (quickly sharing websites, tweeting, Skype). But from a work point of view, it is not significantly better than Windows 7.
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"Personally I keep a list of the top 10 applications I launch (Chrome, Visual Studio, a screen capture utility, etc) right at the very top level of the "Start" menu so I can get to them quickly"
So put them on the metro page. Functions in a similar way: press the windows key and you'll see all your pinned apps for quick and easy access as well as be able to just type the name of any given app you may want.
Prior to the release of Win8, I was highly, highly critical. Thought it was the dumbest thing MS had ever done. As someone who went through the pain of WinME, that's saying a lot. But I've gotten used to it. Still spend almost all my time in the desktop, but I've grown to like the metro apps for things like easy access for my kids. I still think MS made a mistake by not at least making a full-desktop-mode option, but I can live with Metro and find it beneficial in some ways. I certainly haven'y been hampered by it at all.
So put them on the Metro page, WTF? That way, I can jump back on forth from the metro page to the pseudo desktop without the start menu everytime I need to open an app. How efficient is that? Why not allow apps that require the pseudo desktop to have a menu entry on the desktop, unless your fear is that nobody will use the metro apps or the metro page?
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Interesting)
So put them on the metro page.
Why would anyone want to completely change their view so that they can click on a saved app when they don't have to? I installed Windows 8 on my main machine because I heard about some of the non-metro updates/improvements and I knew there were several free/cheap third-party applications that I could install to bring back the start menu.
For two days, I tried to give the metro start menu a chance. At first, I tried to pin everything I use often to my taskbar and metro start page. Unfortunately, I found the task bar was too cluttered for my tastes and I hated having to go back and forth between the desktop and metro for basic things.
I hated how many extra steps they made you go through to shutdown the computer. Of course, later I found out you can just hit Alt + F4 from the desktop to bring up a shutdown menu.
The search in metro was also a huge peeve. In Windows 7, the search was all inclusive. It didn't matter if I was looking for an app, settings, or files. Everything was there. In Windows 8, you have to click a category for anything but applications. Don't get me wrong, I understand having categories. What I don't get is why they don't have an "All" category and why it is not default. When I search for things I go from general to more specific, no the reverse.
The last thing I found immensely annoying was the metro split screen. I have a 23 inch monitor on my desktop. With that much real estate, you have room for two applications side by side. Unfortunately, Windows 8 does not let you do a 50/50 split between two metro apps. Only one-third/two-thirds or two-thirds/one-third. It doesn't make sense on a large screen.
In the end, I got fed up and finally purchased a copy of Start 8. It looks and acts almost exactly like Windows 7's start menu and lets me boot directly into the desktop app. If I actually want to get into the metro start, I just hold down the Windows key for a couple of seconds. I have my top four/five application pinned to my taskbar and the next five/six pinned to my Start 8 menu. If Microsoft added a "desktop mode" for those of us that are using it as a desktop OS and polished their metro interface to remove the mentioned usability nightmares, the OS would probably be widely accepted. without the need to purchase third-party interface apps.
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:4, Interesting)
Personally I keep a list of the top 10 applications I launch (Chrome, Visual Studio, a screen capture utility, etc) right at the very top level of the "Start" menu so I can get to them quickly
Isn't that precisely what the "pin this program" feature on the taskbar is for in Win7?
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Insightful)
The Start Menu is still there. It's just full screen now. And you can fit more than 10 applications to launch on it (or fewer, if you prefer). I've read one complaint that the Start Menu hides the desktop, but I don't care about looking at the desktop when I'm starting a new app. Why would I? And the Start Menu still appears and disappears quickly.
It really not much of a change if you stay away from metro apps (those are good for 'leisure mode')..
There is no start menu. There is the metro page, but that is hardly the same thing. A start menu would mean that I could have a word document open on my screen and hit the start menu to open another app, without losing site of the word document that might actually contain the credentials I need to enter into the other program. With the metro page, you are jumping back and forth from entirely different screens and then scrolling looking for the proper square on the metro tab.
Maybe that is more efficient on the Minority Report, but it in reality it seems much less efficient than click-click.
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The only people I know who used the search option are IT admins and the helpdesk. I use the start menu in Win7, I use it in Ubuntu Gnome Classic. I have never seen anyone use the search bar from the start menu unless following directions from the helpdesk.
The only thing that I use more than the start menu is the quick launch bar, but I can't fit ALL my applications down there, just the ones I use all the time (browsers, cygwin terminal, notepad++). Honestly I don't even know how to invoke half the applicati
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Funny)
I don't know anyone who used the start menu for anything but search and shut down.
This statement is significant because, of course, the plural form of "anecdote" is "data."
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Insightful)
Not sure what you are going on about with being 'left behind'. I am skeptical many businesses out there refuse to interoperate with other businesses because they are not running the latest and greatest software. I still see, for instance, a great deal of standardization on
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You're right. Windows XP users have proved that by still holdind a high percentage of the OS market. If you don't change the tools you run on your OS you don't need to upgrade. Eventually time catches up and you have no choice.
In our line of business we deal with AutoCAD a lot. We have been forced to upgrade our AutoCAD only because our customers use a newer version and if we don't upgrade we simply can't do our work.
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Kinda the same here. We're running it on a few machines, and while the tablet-UI side of things is largely ignored, the rest of it works well enough. Yeah, there's some stuff that's missing (the GUI for modifying all stored wireless connections, for example), but I like the spatial nature of the new Start menu. It's kind of like being able to pin programs where you like them on your taskbar, but in two dimensions. Yes, I know you could do that with icons on the desktop, but you can't scroll the desktop, and
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:5, Insightful)
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I don't know a single company whose IT will implement Windows 8 on anything. I'm talking everything from tablets, phones, laptops, PC's, or servers. In fact my company said straight out "No" because of all the problems it would entail.
Did they ever fix the lack of command line for windows 8 servers?
I work desktop IT for a company in fortune's top 10. We are not moving everything there (yet) but we definitely are standardizing it for the enterprise and will probably move large numbers (tens of thousands) of users there. Enterprises aren't as scared of 8 as they were of Vista. Roll-out of a new os in a large enterprise takes time and I'm sure once the projects have been worked at various companies many will be moving.
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:4, Interesting)
I work for a University and we manage about 9,000 Windows desktops, mostly Win7 at this point. We are looking to roll out Windows 8 on all new deployments beginning in January or February. All of our early-adopters have been running Win8E for months now and the only issues we have seen have been related to IE10. Most of these issues have been dealt with by using group policy to set compatibility mode for specific sites.
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Wait a minute, you actually, as a company policy, encourage people to use IE except for legacy sites that won't work on anything else? Isn't that crazy? Then they go, do the same at home, and they end up owned. Kudos.
Comment removed (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:4, Insightful)
Wow that info is outdated.
IE 10 != IE 6 by a longshot! It is the most caught up version of IE yet that supports HTML 5, CSS 3, and has great hardware acceleration and loads up sites as fast if not faster than Chrome. It is the only browser that is double sandboxed against hep spray attacks, as well as ASLR, and DEP.
I am not an IE fan nor am I even using it right now (Chrome), but for using shitty ancient web apps optimized for IE 7 and IE 8 is it the only option. Also only IE is enterprise grade with .MSI and group policies and AD integration so you can manage 9,000 easily with different settings for different OUs and groups such as one for faculty, another for students etc.
If you have a problem with this go harass Mozilla for not making Firefox enterprise friendly. Until that time comes we are staying IE only. With the later releases following standards and behaving like Chrome and Firefox it is not a big of an issue as it once was.
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:4, Interesting)
Out of curiosity, what do you expect to gain from replacing Win7 with Win8?
Re:Seeing how most companies won't migrate... (Score:4, Insightful)
Except people who join that program..... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Unfortunately the people who I want most of all taking part in the improvement progr
Re:Except people who join that program..... (Score:5, Insightful)
Because a lot of people have an issue with..
"This application is going to send off 'some stuff you don't understand.. bla bla tech bla' to servers somewhere you don't know." They automatically mistrust a program that sends off unknown information when presented with the choice.
What Microsoft says. "Send anonymous usage details to Microsoft servers"
What the user reads. "Send your porn viewing habits to god knows where and who"
Re:Except people who join that program..... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Except people who join that program..... (Score:5, Interesting)
Several potentially good reasons:
Perhaps they don't actually care if MS produces a quality product or not. If it does, great, if not they'll just buy something else. Why do MS's homework for them?
Perhaps they feel it would be casting pearls before swine? No matter how many times they participate, they'll get the same old crap in return.
Perhaps they fear the data might be too invasive and they'd just rather not.
The second option there is, BTW, a commonly cited reason for not voting. If you abstain from an election because you see no candidates you actually support, you remain perfectly entitled to complain about the state of the nation.
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If I just passively accept whatever punche
Re:Except people who join that program..... (Score:4, Insightful)
I'd say "That's not Microsoft, that's the government." except the government doesn't ask your opinion. They assume that because the country is ostensibly a democracy, you asked for it.
Frankly, I don't understand Microsoft's strategy with Windows 8 unless they are laying the groundwork for Metro to become the only choice, instead of the clumsily-tacked on new default. Let's face it, the OS/Office money fountain is drying up, and MS is having a hard time breaking into new markets because they still think it's the 1990s and they can do what they want and everyone will accept it ("Yeah, it sucks now, but in a few more versions it will be good." doesn't cut it any more).
That 30% cut Apple gets from every app sold probably looks like the only way to move forward. I'm sure MS wants everyone to get used to Metro and the apps it provides so they can start phasing out everything else over the next few years. Then they will have more of a monopoly than ever.... assuming anyone still uses Windows by then.
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I'd also doubt it factors in the people who have upgraded to Windows 8, used it for a couple weeks, and downgraded back to Windows 7, or those who refused to upgrade int the first place.
Frogs Get Used to Temperature of Boiling Water (Score:5, Insightful)
In the end?
Still tastes like chicken.
Seriously. If this is the best language of encouragement that Ballmer can choke out of his throat, then you know there is a Vista-sized hole in Microsoft's delivery.
I know! Why don't we all get used to Ubuntu Unity and Libre Office? "Even with the rumblings, we feel confident that it's a moment in time more than an actual problem."
Re:Except people who join that program..... (Score:4, Insightful)
To be fair, I was pretty rabidly anti-metro about 2 weeks ago, and my dislike is waning a bit. I still miss the old start menu, and every time metro comes up i hit "escape", but the new search is OK and it seems like the use of RAM as cache is better this time around.
"Getting used to" doesnt mean that Im happy that things changed, however. One "gets used to" a chronic health ailment; that doesnt mean youre happy that you got it to begin with, it just means youre learning to deal with it.
Prisoners are getting used to being sodomized (Score:5, Insightful)
I am not saying that Windows 8 is even remotely similar to prison rape (though some might suggest there may be some similarities, I am not saying that) but the very notion that a party or group is getting used to something does not mean they like it or want it.
I supposed I could have said "taxes" or any other thing people generally don't like, but I wanted to be a little edgy... a little dramatic.
So yes. We acknowledge Microsoft is shoving their things [Windows 8 in this case] through our [choose an orifice] and we acknowledge that we presently don't have much choice in the matter.
Re:Prisoners are getting used to being sodomized (Score:5, Insightful)
That sums it up. Nothing in the article about people liking or preferring the New Windows Order. Just the limp pronouncement that people who must use Windows are finding ways of grinding through the experience.
Re:Prisoners are getting used to being sodomized (Score:5, Insightful)
I think it's more like stockholm syndrome
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome [wikipedia.org]
Re:Prisoners are getting used to being sodomized (Score:4, Funny)
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Re:Prisoners are getting used to being sodomized (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't confuse "ignorance about alternatives" with "desire to purchase".
Many users only "see" Windows. They don't know about Linux, and consider Mac OS as "those things that aren't Windows that other people have".
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No, but the fact that they went out to the shops and bought it, when they could just as easily have bought something else, does tend to suggest that some of them might have wanted it.
That's pretty funny, since I did exactly that by purchasing Windows 7, and yet I was never asked to join this program to tell them I purchased Windows 7 over 8.
So yes, you are right, as long as you totally and completely ignore everyone who purchased something else, then of the subset of people that purchased Windows 8, all of that subset purchased windows 8.
Why is that at all insightful or useful information again?
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What world do you live in? Virtually all game developers for Windows still support XP.
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Re:Prisoners are getting used to being sodomized (Score:4, Funny)
Expect a bunch of swearing and cursing as you work through the internet looking for drivers for that one last elusive bit of hardware, or to get that damn network running.
Funny, that's what I do with Windows...
3 month rule (Score:5, Insightful)
Anyone really surprised?
Give any big change 3 months and it will get accepted if you don't give in as the change forcer.
I've seen it at work too many times to count. Manglement makes a decision that upsets everyone and lots of people talk about how they are going to start looking elsewhere for employment and the sky will fall and this is terrible, but after the 3 month gripe period, everyone accepts the changes and life moves on.
It's how things work.
Re:3 month rule (Score:4, Insightful)
That doesn't mean that they like the new situation more than the old one. And while at work there may be some good reason why you have to adapt to a management change because the primary concern is the well being of the company and not yours, pardon please if I put MY comfort ahead of that of MS.
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Manglement makes a decision that upsets everyone and lots of people talk about how they are going to start looking elsewhere for employment and the sky will fall and this is terrible, but after the 3 month gripe period, everyone accepts the changes and life moves on.
True, but why exactly is that?
Because it takes about three months on average for the vocal and confident employees to find other employment, get fired, or can be otherwise forced to leave (that option usually takes longer). One place I was at had a 43% turnover in the first two months, but I can't speak for what happened after that, because nobody I really knew was still there.
What the management is then left with is a staff of indecisive and often inferior employees that are easily intimidated by
Mold-breaking (Score:5, Interesting)
So, now I've learned that behaviour instead, I've swapped back to Windows 7 with its sensible desktop UI
Warm feeling (Score:5, Insightful)
Oh, that gives me such a warm feeling inside...
Canonical Has Been Watching... (Score:5, Funny)
Canonical Has Been Watching, and It Says You're Getting Used To Unity
Re:Warm feeling (Score:4, Informative)
I'm guessing you've not used Visual Studio, SQL Server Management Studio, MS Office, Windows 8 or any other MS product. When you install an app that has ties to the "Customer Experience Improvement" stuff, there is a handy balloon at the bottom of your taskbar which invites you to click to opt out. If you dismiss the balloon, the icon in your systray stays there showing that you're collecting data.
I'm not sure how much more upfront you can get. Honestly. (And I opt out immediately for anything I use.)
Actually, it's off by default. It's an optional opt-in program [microsoft.com].
It's not terrible (Score:4, Interesting)
I've noticed a couple different things:
1) It makes me a lot more selective about putting things on the taskbar and desktop.
a) I put things I really do use out there, so things are highly geared to my workflow
b) Things I find I'm not using get punted
2) The windows button finally has purpose. You can hit that button, start typing an app name and then space/enter to launch. I find I'm mousing less actually.
In addition, Windows 8 hasn't come with the alternating-release-something-new instability problems we've gotten used to. It's every bit as solid as 7 and has better integrated security features. Win, win in my book.
Re:It's not terrible (Score:5, Informative)
The windows button finally has purpose. You can hit that button, start typing an app name and then space/enter to launch. I find I'm mousing less actually.
This is Windows 7 functionality isn't it?
Re:It's not terrible (Score:4, Informative)
More like Vista in 2007.
Or Mac OSX's Spotlight from 2005 or '06.
(Excluding 3rd party utilities/launchers since they're not part of the out-of-the-box UI).
Re:It's not terrible (Score:5, Insightful)
The windows button finally has purpose. You can hit that button, start typing an app name and then space/enter to launch
So... It's just like DOS except you have to hit the windows key before you type the name of the program you want to launch.
The more things change, the more they stay the same...
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So... It's just like DOS except you have to hit the windows key before you type the name of the program you want to launch.
It's completely unlike DOS, since DOS didn't do a full-text search on all app names. It just let you type specific command names. If you didn't know that creating a directory is "mkdir" or "md", good luck guessing.
In Start menu/screen (not just Win8 - the feature has been there since Vista), you can type things like "resolution", and it will automatically find the control panel item that lets you adjust that.
Re:It's not terrible (Score:5, Insightful)
I've noticed a couple different things:
1) It makes me a lot more selective about putting things on the taskbar and desktop.
a) I put things I really do use out there, so things are highly geared to my workflow
b) Things I find I'm not using get punted
2) The windows button finally has purpose. You can hit that button, start typing an app name and then space/enter to launch. I find I'm mousing less actually.
In addition, Windows 8 hasn't come with the alternating-release-something-new instability problems we've gotten used to. It's every bit as solid as 7 and has better integrated security features. Win, win in my book.
LOL!!
Type the name of an app and then hit enter. Welcome to DOS. Are we suddenly back in 1992?
Much Like ... (Score:5, Insightful)
Microsoft Has Been Watching, and It Says You're Getting Used To Windows 8
Much like a kid who has broken his arm "gets used to" a cast or sling. Much like a cow who has been electrocuted many times by a fence "gets used to" staying away from it. Much like someone convicted of a DUI "gets used to" riding a bicycle.
'Even with the rumblings, we feel confident that it's a moment in time more than an actual problem.'
Under what circumstances, exactly, would someone who works for Microsoft ever say anything contrary to that? Anything could be going on, good or bad, and that is exactly what they would say to dismiss criticism.
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Under what circumstances, exactly, would someone who works for Microsoft ever say anything contrary to that?
Depends, what's Ballmer drinking these days? ;-) Though I suppose it's an open question on whether he works 'for' MS or against them...
Steve Ballmer AKA Colonel Kurtz (Score:5, Funny)
10% day 1 fail rate nothing to boast about (Score:5, Insightful)
It's mind boggling, only 90% managed to use the start screen and charms on day1.
So in that 10% are folk that failed to work out how to get the login prompt from the completely control free boot page. And people who failed to shutdown their PC making up the bulk of it - since that needs the charmless bar.
Just to install ClassicShell or fire up the desktop to use it with needs use of both the start screen and charms. So even if you never use them again you still count as a MS success in these stats.
Any other company would be panicking over a 10% fail rate just starting up their software, not claiming it as a success.
Users will put up with just about anything (Score:5, Interesting)
Many moons ago we got a new intern in the office. He was young, naive and hopelessly clueless about the corporate world. We took a liking to him immediately.
Of course, this meant that we had to play pranks on him. Because that's what you do to people you like, right?
Our best prank was what we did to his computer. We wrote a small program that ran in the background and drew a dot in the center of the screen on top of whatever was running. This dot grew bigger over time; at first it was just one pixel wide, but after a week it was over twenty.
One morning, just over a week after we'd secretly installed it onto the intern's computer, he called me into his cubicle and asked me if I had ever heard of "dead pixels on a CRT". I said no, holding back the laughter, and politely suggested that he try reinstalling his graphics card drivers. He declined, and said that was too much effort and he would just live with it.
The intern was fully prepared to live with this large, expanding, black dot in the center of his monitor. It was nothing but sheer annoyance, but he was willing to ignore it.
At this point we caved and uninstalled the software.
That experience taught me that users will put up with just about anything. As long as it doesn't outright prevent them from doing their job (eg, the network card has died), they will find some way to soldier on.
Re:Users will put up with just about anything (Score:5, Funny)
I suppose your office mates put tripwires outside of handicap access ramps?
With friends like you, who needs enemies?
of course not. they made the ramp 1 degree steeper every week.
my sample pool is different (Score:3)
Most the people in my IT group at work are windows users. most of my friends and relative are windows users. No one likes windows 8, several have downgraded new gear because they hated the 8 so much. At work they say its the new Vista, useless rubbish that should be shunned, and that hopefully "9" will be a release Redmond gets a clue again and puts out something useful.
That's pretty funny when the die-hard windoze fangals/fanbois I know can only bad-mouth the windows 8. Microsoft has failed its own customers, driven dissatisfaction upward, regressed the state of the UI art.
"getting used to it"??? (Score:5, Insightful)
You can probably "get used to" almost anything when you aren't given a choice. Heck, you can "get used to" chronic back pain too...
But that's a far cry from meaning that a person actually prefers it
Upgrading from W8 to W7 (Score:5, Interesting)
The sheer number of friends and relatives bringing their shiny new computers to me (The resident geek) begging me to upgrade them from Windows 8 to Windows 7 says otherwise...
I suspect most of these people did not voluntary opt into Microsoft's "Track Me" program either.
Bashing it back into shape, rather (Score:5, Informative)
I wanted to try it out, so I put it on my (non-touch) laptop. The Metro UI is an abomination. I wouldn't even want it on a touch tablet ("live tiles" compare very badly to Android's widget, notifications are a joke...), on a PC, it should be taken out and shot.
Which, luckily, you can do easily with http://classicshell.sourceforge.net/ [sourceforge.net], and get back the Desktop shell that the IT gods intended.
Apart form that, the new features are:
1- Remote Desktop server...
2- and that's it. Not even ReadyBoost for SSD, nor some tiered storage like Apple has started doing.
3- and after Jan 31st, you won't even get Media Server.
MS is trying to force-feed Metro UI to their Desktop users, hoping to use that familiarity to get some traction on phones and tablets. The problem are that Metro UI 1) makes no sense on non-touch machines, and 2) lacks severely even on tablets and phones.
Wow, no kidding MS? Gosh! (Score:4, Insightful)
Call me a skeptic but somehow the very fact that MS feels the need to say this, shows people are NOT picking up Windows 8. Yeah, so early adapters of the new MS vision who are so in love with the company they allow it to see everything they do, are sticking with it... and? Fans of a dog food company eat their favorite companies dog food. Doesn't mean it doesn't tastes like... well like nothing actually, animal food lacks spicing.
If Windows 8 adoption was really good, MS would be crowing about actual sales figures. They are not. For the truth NEVER listen to what a spokesman says, listen for what he doesn't say.
Basically, people that haven't given up on Windows 8 or refused to even start using it or didn't mind MS watching over their shoulder, haven't given up in large volumes. Damned by faint praise? If this is the best press release they could come up with, the truth is far more dire.
Want proof? Go back in history and read MS press release on Bob, ME and Vista.
this reads like a backhanded complement (Score:3)
But *who* is getting used to Windows 8? (Score:3)
What Larson-Green fails to take into account is that technically experienced users (1) are still running Windows 7, and (2) turn off Customer Experience Improvement Program anyway for privacy reasons.
In addition, most corporations will turn off Customer Experience Improvement Program via group policy, for the same reasons power users do. (Even if it's not supposed to be personally identifiable, why risk sending more personal/corporate information to Microsoft than you have to?) So CEIP turns out to measure little more than the responses of technically inexperienced users who buy cheap OEM systems – a shrinking demographic.
Microsoft needs to remember that business users and power users, not the dumbasses who buy $299 eMachines, are its real customer base.
for the sake of argument... (Score:3)
1. It's self selecting, and selection is based practically on a positive view of Microsoft products;
2.it might be too small to be representative of the whole, and no data on enrollment is available in the article.
moreover, the article says:
"[...]The data collected by Microsoft also show that people are becoming more familiar with the new features over time, says Larson-Green. She previously led a redesign of the Microsoft Office interface that, in 2007, replaced text-based menus with a more visual “ribbon interface,” an initially controversial change that is now widely accepted as an example of good design. “Two days to two weeks is what we used to say in Office, and it’s similar in Windows 8,” she says.
So my quick summary: Microsoft wants me to believe that a group, selected according to criteria and methods that would have my statistics professor at the University screaming that I am a confounded moron, is right in believing that windows 8 does not have a usability problem, and therefore I am also a confounded moron because I use windows 7 with the XP menus. Ah, I did not mention that there's no word on how would I use touch on my installed screen base, which does not have a touch interface.
Re: (Score:3)
"...something something something Dark Side! Something something something complete!"
Re: (Score:3)
"Using Windows leads to fear, fear leads to anger, etc".
Re: (Score:3)
No no...
"Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to using Windows for mission-critical applications."
If that's not "suffering," I don't know what is.
Re:"Good, Good... (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Poor Sample Pool (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, if the population being measured does not include the 'tech-savvy', the results suggest a pretty successful transition.
Re:Poor Sample Pool (Score:4, Insightful)
Well, if the population being measured does not include the 'tech-savvy', the results suggest a pretty successful transition.
Let's face it, the most conservative grouches who most venomously oppose anything new in UIs and desktop environments are usually the "tech savvy" and them nerdier they are the more potent the venom. Just take one look at the angry tirades over Gnome 3.... Ok, so they changed Gnome, learn to like the new UI or fork the old one, it's not the end of the world. I'm a Mac user but I actually kind of like the new Windows UI, it's different and innovative. Microsoft deserves some credit for not taking the path of least resistance and aping somebody else's UI like Google did.
Re: (Score:3)
learn to like the new UI or fork the old one
Let me know how well that works for you on a Windows desktop....
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Poor Sample Pool (Score:5, Insightful)
First of all, I'm not sure what bundling has to do with it. I mean, as opposed to all the Windows 8 user data they're getting from people who didn't have Windows 8 installed on their PC?
Secondly, surely if the user data was skewed to less-competent users then a more representative sample would should an even quicker rate of acclimitisation?
I'm sceptical of the kind of coarse-grain user data they're surely getting, and the conclusions themselves* but I genuinely can't tell what your point is here.
*That people are able to comfortably use Windows 8 within a few weeks shouldn't be a cause for celebration, that should be the level below which everyone in the project gets fired. The cheering shouldn't start until your design changes are shown to have led to improvements that are worth the cost.
Re:Poor Sample Pool (Score:4, Insightful)
Secondly, surely if the user data was skewed to less-competent users then a more representative sample would should an even quicker rate of acclimitisation?
The headline says people are getting used to it, not that they like it.
Case in point, my mother's got an old laptop that doesn't have a multitouch touchpad. I am able to use it, but I find myself cursing the lack of features like two-finger scrolling. If I use it for any prolonged period of time, I remember how to use edge scrolling instead... I still miss the convenience of two-finger scrolling, etc., but I adapt to what I'm given. As soon as I'm back on my own laptop again, I breathe a sigh of relief.
As to Windows 8 users... the non-technical users are the ones who are least likely to have the option to go back to what they prefer, so they adapt to what they have. That doesn't mean they like it, it means that they don't have a choice in the matter.
Re: (Score:3)
Windows 8 Tutorial in 12 minutes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_E1UxI5I_jo [youtube.com]
I share those videos with most people who purchased Windows 8. Answers the vast majority of questions for most people.
Re:Poor Sample Pool (Score:4, Insightful)
I just watched the first of those two videos.
I have had Windows 8 for about two weeks now, and I tell people that I hate it.
I agree with the GP here, that the problem is that it is not intuitive how to do anything.
I purchased Windows 8 Pro Upgrade and installed it. Aside from a single post-card sized piece of paper, it comes with no documentation what-so-ever. There are a few cues on the screen the first time, and that's it. I probably learned more from watching just that one video that from playing around with Windows 8.
My question is, "Why couldn't Microsoft provide a decent tutorial for new users?".
Re:Poor Sample Pool (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Poor Sample Pool (Score:4, Insightful)
The fact that this is an article tells how poorly thought out some of their design decisions are.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2012202/how-to-shut-down-windows-8.html [pcworld.com]
It's not difficult, but it's definitely not obvious or intuitive.
Re: (Score:3)
I would suspect that the tech savvy will have more trouble with the new interface simply because there is so much for us to relearn about it.
I doubt this. I'm not as savvy as many people here, but in the course of my life I've must have learned around 100 different GUI/UI schemes. Tech savvy people learn about the conventions and metaphors of UI, the universal bits, while non-savvy people learn the specific bits (click this, for this to happen). I don't have a problem with learning new UIs anymore. Sure, there is a learning curve, and my productivity suffers for a week or two, but generally I haven't found a UI I couldn't use after a bit. T
Re:Poor Sample Pool (Score:4, Insightful)
Regular unsophisticated users get along just fine because they aren't emotionally attached to things like user interfaces. It's only the whiny IT crowd who has a problem.
Regular unsophisticated users bumble along doing things by rote memory or by really bizarre roundabout routes because they don't know the most efficient way to do things. The "whiny IT crowd" like to be able to get to the features they want without dealing with bullshit like the ribbon bar (which according to TFA the designer of said bar also designed Windows 8).
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
There's a difference between "learning something new" and "making an ungodly mess of a previously clean interface". In our UI design classes we were told that when users have more than 7-9 options in one section of a menu, it starts to become less efficient. The ribbon is a mess that you really have to "learn" where everything is. With good menus you don't have to learn shit, you can just find what you want by looking at the headings. The few times I've had to use the ribbon bar, things have been in weird p
Wrong Sample Pool (Score:4, Insightful)
"Less sophisticated users" aren't getting along fine. They struggle to use it and/or call for help because bad user interfaces (and arbitrary vendor changes) interfere with the creation of an accurate mental model of how the software is supposed to be used or what it's capable of. The confusion created in their mind is real.
Re:that what they call it? (Score:4, Insightful)