Leaked Documents Detail Al-Qaeda's Efforts To Fight Back Against Drones 234
An anonymous reader writes "The Washington Post reports, 'Al-Qaeda's leadership has assigned cells of engineers to find ways to shoot down, jam or remotely hijack U.S. drones ... In July 2010, a U.S. spy agency intercepted electronic communications indicating that senior al-Qaeda leaders had distributed a "strategy guide" to operatives around the world advising them how "to anticipate and defeat" unmanned aircraft. The Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) reported that al-Qaeda was sponsoring simultaneous research projects to develop jammers to interfere with GPS signals and infrared tags that drone operators rely on to pinpoint missile targets. Other projects in the works included the development of observation balloons and small radio-controlled aircraft, or hobby planes, which insurgents apparently saw as having potential for monitoring the flight patterns of U.S. drones... Al-Qaeda has a long history of attracting trained engineers ... Khalid Sheik Mohammed, the self-proclaimed architect of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, holds a mechanical-engineering degree ... In 2010, the CIA noted in a secret report that al-Qaeda was placing special emphasis on the recruitment of technicians and that "the skills most in demand" included expertise in drones and missile technology.'"
Or... (Score:2, Insightful)
In July 2010, a U.S. spy agency intercepted electronic communications indicating that senior al-Qaeda leaders had distributed a "strategy guide" to operatives around the world
They may just be making this up to get more funding. Sometimes these "intercepted messages" or "chatter" look just so convenient (often well timed) and meaningless that one has to wonder.
Re:Or... (Score:1, Insightful)
dafuk? some people will find conspiracy in anything.
We're using drones against them, they are trying to avoid getting killed by said drones.
MORE DISINFORMATION (Score:5, Insightful)
Designed to create the belief:
1 - Intelligence intercepts and interrogations are effective at getting information that "protects" "us".
2 - Drones are an effective weapon against "our" "enemies" and not principally dangerous to villagers and local civic functions.
But WHY do you believe ANY public information from an agency that has DECEIT in its charter?
Re:Or... (Score:0, Insightful)
We're using drones against them, they are trying to avoid getting killed by said drones.
The "senior al-Qaeda leaders" and "operatives around the world" contradicts the official position that al-Qaeda has been mostly eliminated by drones and lacks centralized control. Only one can be true.
Re:MORE DISINFORMATION (Score:4, Insightful)
Designed to create the belief:
1 - Intelligence intercepts and interrogations are effective at getting information that "protects" "us".
And you dispute that? People seem to be pretty eager to read them for what you think are ineffective methods.
2 - Drones are an effective weapon against "our" "enemies" and not principally dangerous to villagers and local civic functions.
Pakistani General: Actually, The Drones Are Awesome [wired.com]
You take issue with referring to the ever fun-loving Taliban and al Qaida as enemies?
17 Beheaded in Taliban-Controlled Afghanistan for Attending Wedding Party with Dancing [joemiller.us]
Taliban Hangs Afghan Boy, 7, for Spying [cbsnews.com]
I was one of the Taliban's torturers: I crucified people [freerepublic.com]
How do you think they should be referred to? As the, "Asian gentlemen with a minor beheading problem?" "The life of the party with a suicide vest?" "The local representatives of Crucifier's Anonymous - the 12 step program to kill all your enemies?"
Re:R&D for Muhammad (Score:4, Insightful)
Would work in principle, but I don't think these little planes have either the speed or the agility. If it became a problem, the drones to then be equipped with some kind of heat sensors that could make avoiding them become rather trivial, at which point their best hope would be to somehow train birds to fly into these drones.
GPS spoofing - I don't know for certain, but I don't think it would be difficult at all to add RSA signing to the timing beacons, even if they did it to existing satellites in orbit. Maybe not the older members of the constellation (which are constantly being phased out,) but the newer ones for sure. Something akin to that is long overdue anyways. As far as all out jamming goes, there is already ample technology available to allow navigation in small areas without the need for GPS, just enough to seek and destroy targets in a given area after reconnaissance photography has already been taken (which it presumably has been, unless we're just blindly picking targets.)
Unless Al-Qaeda can secure some automated targeting systems of its own (i.e. unmanned interceptors) their chances of waging a successful war against these drones is rather non-existent.
These drones are pretty fucking scary to be anywhere near the receiving end of, and if you ask me, the fact that being in Al-Qaeda puts you in their crosshairs is a pretty good deterrent to recruitment - or at least it should be to any sane person (but the religious viewpoints of its members sort of rules out sanity.) I think at best this might be their way of saying "we're doing something about the drones" when in reality they are probably making approximately zero progress, but saying they are making progress might be good enough to help with recruitment efforts.
Re:Why are they called cells? (Score:5, Insightful)
Bad people have cells.
Good people have teams.
Useless people have focus groups.
Self-serving parasites have Six Sigma groups.
Re:Or... (Score:2, Insightful)
Mostly =/= completely.
Re:MORE DISINFORMATION (Score:5, Insightful)
"Al Qaeda" is a term of convenience. The Libyan "rebels" were 70+ % Jihadi "Al Qaeda".
The Syrian "opposition" is 80+ % "Al Qaeda" [talkingpointsmemo.com] - funded by Qatar [longwarjournal.org] and Saudi, for the same regional purposes, with a generous assist from these CIA heroes, [telegraph.co.uk] that you rush to defend.
http://syriareport.net/fsa-al-qaeda-fighting-under-the-one-flag/ [syriareport.net]
http://www.cfr.org/syria/al-qaedas-specter-syria/p28782 [cfr.org]
http://rt.com/news/qaeda-militants-kill-fsa-commander-979/ [rt.com]
They laugh at your ignorance, and they count on it.
Re:Who leaked the documents? (Score:5, Insightful)
That's a good question.
The answer is: It doesn't matter. Just be grateful.
Did you not think the enemy would adapt? Would you be better off not knowing what your government is up to, or what challenges it faces? We're not talking about the Enigma machine here, you know. The only surprises that came out of these leaks so far is the unlimited power that our government believes it has over our privacy, and the extent to which they will go to hide what they're doing from us citizens.
CIA training didn't cover drones? (Score:2, Insightful)
I guess the CIA training offered to Al Qaeda, back when they were our guys, didn't cover drones.
Fear (Score:5, Insightful)
We're supposed to be afraid of these douchebags? We're supposed to fear their engineering "prowess"? Is that what this is supposed to mean?
They make underpants bombs that won't even work under the best of circumstances. I grew up in the Cold War. I feared Russian engineering, because they actually could lob a *nuclear* tipped missile over the North Pole or from a submarine (they never solved the "launch from under water" thing, though). And the both the Bush and Obama administrations were calling these underpants bombs "sophisticated." Bullshit. Complete, utter bullshit. You know what's sophisticated? Over-the-horizon radar. ICBMs. Nuclear submarines. Tsar Bomba even if it was impractical.
What is not sophisticated: IEDs. ANFO bombs. Flying planes into buildings. These are not sophisticated. These can be pulled off by people of average intelligence and just enough insanity to believe in their bullshit cause.
"But they have a world-wide network of engineers!!!1111ONE@#$@#$R"
What a lot of crap. All the engineering in the world isn't going to help you if you can't implement your "master plan" and the only logistics that they seem capable of is ground fightin' and IEDs. Bring down drones? There are governments that have been throwing money at this problem and Iran got just *one* drone to show for all their work, and it's even disputable that they got it by jamming GPS (which is possible if you've got a loud enough transmitter and a crappy enough receiver). That's not much of a return on investment.
When all you have is a bunch of mentally-ill (because this kind of religious devotion is mental illness) engineers and suicidal foot-soldiers, you really don't have a lot of bright people. You have dolts. Dedicated, but not too bright. Because if they were bright... well... I'll leave you with this apropos quote:
--
BMO
FACTUAL REPORTING (Score:4, Insightful)
Thank god. The CIA makes SURE that the TRUTH is out there! Like, way, way out there...
In Dec. 2012 it was reported Said al-Shihri, supposedly an "al Qaeda number two", was killed.
It was the third time, according to "official sources", informed by Intelligence, the US reported they'd killed him
And another Three-fer was Abu Yahya al-Libi, which the US claimed to have killed 2 times before they yet again claimed to have killed him in June 2012.
Damn! This US intelligence is SO GOOD it kills "Al Qaeda" guys THREE TIMES!
Re:MORE DISINFORMATION (Score:1, Insightful)
The Taliban has already attempted a bombing in New York City. Thankfully the bombing failed. The terrorist was captured, put on trial, and convicted. I believe other Afghans have been checked up on for possible misdeeds as well.
Besides trying to overthrow the Pakistani government, and retake Afghanistan, there are now hundreds of Taliban fighters in Syria. They are becoming a menace across the world. They might even make it to your land - Canada.
Al Qaida declared war on the US and took the Taliban with them for the ride. Have you ever blamed them for any misdeeds or murder?
Re:What's The Payoff? (Score:5, Insightful)
To be fair, Bin Laden's original vision was at least partly to strike back at us for killing muslims almost kind of for fun and practice. Including children. When you start murdering children based on their nationality and religion that does tend to make people mad. How would you feel if some Muslim country started bombing buildings and indiscriminately killing thousands including innocent children in the US? You'd probably be pissed off. Maybe not enough to blow yourself up, but if you did you wouldn't be doing it because you were "psychotically violent". This idea of evil arabs who are just evil because they were born that way is laughable. These people have good reason to be mad and want revenge and every drone strike we make just increses that anger and desire for justice.
Re:CIA training didn't cover drones? (Score:4, Insightful)
The US and UK worked hard with what they had.
Don't forget Combat Search and Rescue (Score:4, Insightful)
Throw in the fact that when you shoot down a drone, you don't lose a pilot that cost years of expensive training that could easily run into a fair fraction of a million dollars to replace
Don't forget the Combat Search and Rescue (CSAR) team that may be sent into harms way if we hear from the pilot once he is on the ground. For example when an F-16 pilot went down in Serbia, O'Grady, the rescue force included 2 CH-53 transport helicopters, 2 AH-1 helicopter gunships, 2 AV-8 ground attack jets, their crews and 51 Marine infantryman. The AH-1's took missile fire but successfully evaded. The CH-53's were hit with small arms fire.
Re:MORE DISINFORMATION (Score:5, Insightful)
I was one of the Taliban's torturers: I crucified people [freerepublic.com]
How do you think they should be referred to?
Well, let's take a look at your facts. According to this story, the Taliban, if that's what this man is referring to, were supported by the U.S. to fight the Soviets. So at that time, they weren't our enemies. They did the same brutal murders (of Najibulla, for example) and the U.S. smiled and patted their heads.
Now they switched alliances and they're "our" enemies.
I don't think dividing the world into "good guys" and "bad guys," depending on whether they're committing brutal murders on our behalf or against it, is useful.
For that reason, I don't think the term "enemies" is useful either. Historians don't use that word.
Re:MORE DISINFORMATION (Score:2, Insightful)
You live in a dreamworld - populated by State Dept phantoms and CIA-fed ghost chasers.
If what you say weren't a farcical, Emmanuel Goldstein fiction, then maybe if "we" didn't kill their babies, they'd stay at home?
Re: MORE DISINFORMATION (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:MORE DISINFORMATION (Score:5, Insightful)
Unfortunately, everybody does it.
If you want to punish everybody who has committed torture, fine. Henry Kissinger is on the list.
If you want to be selective, I don't buy that. You're not against torture. You're just using it as an excuse to justify your political goals that have nothing to do with torture.
Re:FACTUAL REPORTING (Score:5, Insightful)
I wonder how much better the US would be if it were to stop intelligence surveillance of terrorists completely as some people have been suggesting.
Who has been suggesting it? I think it would be a bad idea, but monitoring 300M+ "terrorist suspects" suggests that they should narrow it down a bit.
Re:MORE DISINFORMATION (Score:4, Insightful)
yep, the syrian president is corrupt and terrible, but in a nearly ironic fashion his opposition is al qaeda. That's why we should have stayed the fuck out. The closest thing to a *smart* decision was russia's ethically questionable decision of playing the neutral party and selling weapons to both sides, giving them both a: a profit and b: ensuring that this escalating civil war ends quicker.
the US decision to support any side in Syria is explicitly the wrong decision.
Re:I guess they're not happy (Score:5, Insightful)
... They use bombs to target only random innocent people and that is so evil it's hard to comprehend, so getting targeted by drones even when hiding their cowardly asses behind their women and children is completely fair in every way.
Wait, let me get this right. You are saying since they kill innocent people it's okay for us to kill innocent people?