Google and Facebook: Unelected Superpowers? 243
theodp (442580) writes "'The government is not the only American power whose motivations need to be rigourously examined,' writes The Telegraph's Katherine Rushton. 'Some 2,400 miles away from Washington, in Silicon Valley, Google is aggressively gaining power with little to keep it in check. It has cosied up to governments around the world so effectively that its chairman, Eric Schmidt, is a White House advisor. In Britain, its executives meet with ministers more than almost any other corporation. Google can't be blamed for this: one of its jobs is to lobby for laws that benefit its shareholders, but it is up to governments to push back. As things stand, Google — and to a lesser extent, Facebook — are in danger of becoming the architects of the law.' Schmidt, by the way, is apparently interested in influencing at least two current hot-button White House issues. Joined by execs from Apple, Oracle, and Facebook, the Google Chairman asserted in a March letter to Secretary of State John Kerry that the proposed Keystone XL pipeline is not in the economic interests of the U.S.; the Obama administration on Friday extended the review period on the pipeline, perhaps until after the Nov. 4 congressional elections. And as a 'Major Contributor' to Mark Zuckerberg's FWD.us PAC, Schmidt is also helping to shape public opinion on the White House's call for immigration reform; FWD.us just launched new attack ads (videos) and a petition aimed at immigration reform opponent Rep. Steve King. In Dave Eggers' The Circle, politicians who impede the company execs' agenda are immediately brought down. But that's fiction, right?"
Who watches the watchers (Score:5, Insightful)
Lots of people care (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't get me wrong. I'm in favor of _more_ federal gov't. Civil rights for Black People in the Southern American States only happened because the Federal Government stepped in with the National Guard. Hell, we had outright terrorism in the south up until the late 50s early 60s. Mega corps are just too powerful to be reigned in with any less than a National Government. It's a double edged sword. But it's the only sword big enough...
Just another facet of post 'Citizens United' USA (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Who watches the watchers (Score:5, Insightful)
Sometimes I wonder if democracy is dead.
Sometimes I wonder if I was the only one paying attention in Civics and Social Studies. Cliff notes version:
1) The United States is not a Democracy, it's a Republic.
2) The devolution of Democracies into fragmented self-interests is a problem that's been studied since the time of Athens. It should surprise no one.
3) The United States Federal Government was obstinately set up to minimize the aforementioned trend, but several big mistakes (Reynolds v. Sims [wikipedia.org] and the 17th Amendment [wikipedia.org] top the list) along the way and 200 years of mission creep have undermined most of the protections put in place.
What can we do about it? You've got me. My best suggestion is to pray for the emergence of an existential threat, because that's the only thing that will get the American people to set aside their differences long enough to find the sort of common ground it took to come up with the original Constitution. You've actually got two problems to overcome:
1) The iPad crowd's apathy towards the political process, which is reinforced by:
2) The tendency of those engaged in that process to assume that those who disagree with them are out to destroy the American way of life.
shareholder interests? (Score:4, Insightful)
one of its jobs is to lobby for laws that benefit its shareholders
really? How does an oil pipeline have anything to do with anything Google shareholders care about?
Similarly, how does immigration reform benefit Facebook shareholders, who I assume, would be more interested in reducing immigration - especially cheap-ass tech workers than only benefit Facebook executives in keeping pay of those shareholders down.
Re:Just another facet of post 'Citizens United' US (Score:5, Insightful)
Some of thse billionaires lean right, like the Koch brothers, and some don't like Google's owners.
Google's owners lean right, but talk left. Like many other tech companies, they donate to liberal advocacy groups, while using tax shelters to shift their profits overseas. They are all for big liberal government programs as long as some else pays for them. The only difference between Google's owners and the Koch brothers, is that with Google you get an extra layer of hypocrisy.
Nothing new here folks (Score:3, Insightful)
http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-echochambers-27074746
Actually I would argue that the period after WWII where a middle class emerged was an anomoly rather than a norm. And we Americans got so complacent we lost it and the oligarchy wrestled the power back into their hands. And the only reason that period happened was because 2 world wars and 1 depression temporarily destroyed capitalism's grip over people.
Google Can And Should Be Blamed (Score:5, Insightful)
Google can't be blamed for this: one of its jobs is to lobby for laws that benefit its shareholders,
Yes, they can, and should, be blamed for this. Pro-social corporations should be rewarded for their behavior. Anti-social corporations should be punished. This is a pretty basic part of free market theory and the power of the purse. Stop repeating this sociopath-loving dogma as though it had any relation to healthy free market economics. Public backlash against despotic corporations is a very important correcting force in the free market.
Re:Who watches the watchers (Score:5, Insightful)
Sometimes I wonder if I was the only one paying attention in Civics and Social Studies. Cliff notes version:
1) The United States is not a Democracy, it's a Republic. ...
Oh jeez this again? The classic GOP / Libertarian / Tea weak-minds binary thinking that gets the meaning of both "republic" and "democracy" wrong.
The US is (supposed to be) a democracy. Just ask any living current or ex-President. Look at any respected list of "countries that are democracies". You do the research. It's simple.
The US is a republic. As in, "not a monarchy".
Republics can be democracies or they can be dictatorships, and pretty much anything in between. There is also nothing in the word "republic" which implies "representative". Just ask North Koreans.
Democracies can be direct democracies, like ancient Athens or a current-day New England Town Meeting or California ballot initiative. Or they can be representative. There is nothing in the word "democracy" that implies "direct-only".
"Democracy" and "Republic" are orthogonal concepts, they are not antonyms. Even when the US Senate was appointed, it was appointed by state legislatures which were comprised of elected representatives, who were elected by democratic elections. As opposed to being appointed by the monarch or being passed down via aristocratic houses.
Actually nowadays we are closer to that, with the money=speech nonsense and an increasingly distractable and distracted public who will vote whichever way paid media brainwashes them to do. House Clinton, House Bush, House Kennedy, and the upstart House Paul.
You may flip the order of the following words around, depending on what you want to emphasize, change some from adjectives to nouns, but all these terms are needed to properly define what the US system of government is:
Constitutional Federal Republic governed as a Representative Democracy,
or a
Federal Constitutional Representative Democratic Republic.
Choose your emphasis, but you cannot leave any of those terms out without misrepresenting how the system is designed.
Leaving any of that out is at best, ignorant point-missing. Usually it is deliberate agitprop.
The sky isn't blue, it's where birds fly. What you are saying is every bit as nonsensical and more dangerous.
Re:What the hell is this article? (Score:5, Insightful)
You either let people keep what they build or you society will go backwards.
Any absolute statement about topics like government or economics are almost guaranteed to be absurd (notice I said almost guaranteed).
Free market capitalism is great. It has created the most powerful economies the world has ever known. Even state run economies have only been successful when they take full advantage of global free market capitalism.
But capitalism still needs to be kept in check. You can't just take advantage of its benefits and ignore the perils. Nothing is free. Capitalism is used because it is in the best interests of society, not to benefit only the best and brightest. When situations arise that are no longer in society's best interests, it is our responsibility to react. We have had to break up other monopolies in the past to keep competition strong, and we will have to do it many times in the future.
Breaking up Standard Oil and Bell Systems did not collapse capitalism, so I really doubt that breaking up or nationalizing a few tech companies will destroy it either.
(note I am not commenting on whether anything needs to be done about Google or Facebook, just that saying we should do nothing no matter what is a silly argument)
Re:Who watches the watchers (Score:5, Insightful)
And you will replace "careerism" with incompetence. Can you imagine having a House of Representatives where no one has more than one term's experience? In the end you would literally hand over all power to bureaucrats, lobbiests and staffers, who would be the only ones with any long term experience. You would, in the end, make things worse, not better.
Strangely rooting for Microsoft in 2014 (Score:4, Insightful)
I was an anti MS zealout and linux fan boy back in 2000. Hence why I choose my name. I was trying to find a post where I rant about MS after the DOJ sided with MS where I threatened to quit IT if MS won!! etc
But today it is different. Mainly because I prefer 3 mobile players rather than 2. 2 search engines rather than 1. Yes it is still bad for competition but this hatred for Microsoft stealing and monopolizing everything is so 10 years ago.
It is like being afraid of IBM today. Weird.
Even if you Android and Linux full time a 30% marketshare for Windows Phone will ensure Google wont get too evil and incredibly lazy and wont' set W3C standards to its own version of IE6 in Chrome. Apple is pretty small outside the US and Canada. No one in China even knows about the iPhone and Android is like Windows of the 1990s in PC's over there with 95% marketshare in the smartphone market.
Many slashdotters are still mad at MS and refuse to touch a win based OS. Fine, I feel the same about Sony. However things change and any company whether it is IBM, Microsoft, or even Google can be evil. Remember when Apple was cool again a decade ago and Steve Jobs was a nice guy who could do no wrong with opensource? Gee look what happened when Apple got power? YIKES. Not so cool and hip anymore.
I think competition where no one can set the standards is what is needed. Another facebook may come along someday if it can do something people demand. Myspace was all the rage too you know. I still wonder how facebook beat myspace?
Google search ... that is heard to beat. They are too powerful and the cost of entry is too great to compete. Google though in its current state is nimble and quick to update. Once it settles down to an ugly corporate behemonth with MBA's afraid of change where cost accountants run the show it will then become vulnerable if and only if someone can make a superior product with much much limited resources.
Re:What the hell is this article? (Score:4, Insightful)
But crack their wrists when they abuse their power and fewer will abuse their power.
Take over or break up companies that get "too big" and they amazingly will manage to exist right under the "too big" line and constantly lobby / use lawyers to find way to get bigger.
Unfettered corporate power is turning the U.S. into an oligarchy. This ends badly for a long time for many citizens and then finally ends badly for the oligarchs too. It's not a good path to head down.
they are not unelected (Score:2, Insightful)
The customers voted by opting to use their products (or by letting to be used as such), thus giving these companies their power.
Re:Who watches the watchers (Score:2, Insightful)
Republicans are currently attacking the 17th Amendment because they're scared of changes in demographics that will marginalize their right-wing views, and if they can strip the right to vote on Senators away from the People, and return it to the State Legislatures, then they can elect Senators based on gerrymandered State-level district lines, instead of by popular vote within the State.
Why do you hate Democracy, and why do you hate the Constitution?
fucked up (Score:2, Insightful)
Google can't be blamed for this: one of its jobs is to lobby for laws that benefit its shareholders
And it doesn't strike you that this is just completely fucked up? That corporations think it's their job to fuck over the very society that made them possible in the first place?