Tesla Makes Improvements To Model S 136
An anonymous reader writes "In a lull between product launches Tesla intends to keep making improvements to the Model S according to Elon Musk. Tesla will automatically push software to the Model S fleet that will help the car learn the driver's habits and the navigation system will offer directions to avoid traffic jams. 'This year, Tesla is offering only the single model, the Model S that is EPA rated at up to 265 miles on a single charge, the most of any electric car. The company's next model won't come until next year, when the delayed Model X crossover goes on sale. Musk says the holdup has centered on making sure its signature design element, gullwing doors to make it easier to get in the rear, works properly and is leak-proof. "Getting the door right is extremely difficult," he says.'"
News at 11 (Score:3)
In other news, Linus makes a point release!
Re: (Score:2, Redundant)
Re: (Score:2)
640KM range probably would be enough for anyone.
Re: (Score:3)
While almost impossible to enforce, many studies show that driving for that long without a break is *dangerous*. Sure, you can come up with plenty of scenarios (more than one driver, etc.) but the use cases are rare enough to not be significant. It would still be impossible to have a break exactly where you wanted to (like stopping for gas and then parking by a nice lake for the rest/leg-stretching) but people would get used to it. I use my car so rarely there is no justification for having it but would def
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:3)
Yep and it's a fair comparison too. Every other car company does this to. No sirree there's nothing unique about a car company releasing point updates to improve customer's vehicles after they bought them right?
Re: (Score:1)
Your sarcasm detector appears to be faulty, maybe you should take it into your dealer and see if they have a software update for it :p
Re: (Score:2)
And almost as newsworthy:
Tesla runs out of toilet paper in the men's WC's of their factory!!
Learning Nav system? (Score:2)
Please tell me it's Waze. Best Nav system in the world - it's saved me from more than one ticket...
Re: (Score:1)
Waze is owned by Google now, but it still uses some strange 3rd party text to speech library instead of Google's superior one. Google needs to start busting some heads and get them using the built functionality that Android has. Other than that minor gripe, I completely agree with you.
Re: (Score:2)
Google only purchased this company this past year. Give it some time... I'm rather happy google hasn't swooped in and hanged a bunch of stuff right away.
Re:Learning Nav system? (Score:5, Informative)
I was going to try it out, but they wanted me to grant "irrevocable, perpetual, sublicensable" permission to any location data gather by the app, which is all associated with a unique identifier.
Re:Learning Nav system? (Score:4, Insightful)
Welcome my son,
Welcome to the machine.
Where have you been?
It's alright we know where you've been.
Re: (Score:2)
Only 1 word: OsmAnd. And the data is yours and remains yours. May not be as slick as the commerecial apps. But I use it exclusively on my business trips around Europe. And it works exceptionally well, considering it's open source.
The maps are completely useless where I live and fairly horribly inaccurate in places around where I live. Totally useless. $100 will get you a refurb or last-year's-model garmin with lifetime traffic and maps.
Re:gullwing doors (Score:5, Interesting)
The gullwing doors are going to be his white whale.
If they wanted to do something cool with the doors, they should have gone with electric sliding doors for all four doors. Front doors slide forward, back doors slide backwards. No worries about clearance above the car, or even next to the car, they seal correctly, they don't stop you from putting a roof-rack on it and because mini-vans have been using electric sliding doors for decades all the bugs have been engineered out years ago.
Re:gullwing doors (Score:5, Insightful)
And that right there is the problem. Nobody drives a minivan to look cool. People drive Teslas to look cool. A Tesla that looks like a minivan would not look cool.
Re: (Score:2)
Yes they do. Chevy Tahoe owners drive that oversized minivan hoping they look "cool"
Yes Modern SUV's are all minivans. none of them are capable of real of road anymore.
Re: (Score:2)
.Yes, but (this is crucial) SUV's and crossovers do not have sliding doors. The lack of sliding doors was a conscious, functional decision, where the function in question is "Get people to actually buy it."
Re: (Score:2)
A Chevy Tahoe is one of the few modern SUVs that don't fit what you are saying. They are still made on a full size truck chassis. So unless you're going to tell me Chevy Silverado Trucks have no off road capabilities, the Tahoe doesn't fit your rant.
The majority of other SUVs don't have the same kind of truck based chassis and are basically minivans.
Re:gullwing doors (Score:5, Interesting)
No worries about clearance above the car
Because this is a concern for a sports car, when most parking places are designed for vans.
or even next to the car
Gull-wing doors require less side clearance than standard doors.
they seal correctly
So do gull-wing doors, if closed with a proper path. This is the hard part, because the door system can't interfere with other systems, like the roof's roll supports. It's not an intractable problem, but it makes the overall engineering more difficult.
they don't stop you from putting a roof-rack on it
Also a big problem for sports cars, I'm sure.
mini-vans have been using electric sliding doors for decades
...And gull-wing doors have been around for half a century.
Re: (Score:3)
No worries about clearance above the car
Because this is a concern for a sports car, when most parking places are designed for vans.
they don't stop you from putting a roof-rack on it
Also a big problem for sports cars, I'm sure.
Crossover SUV != sports car. They are bigger, taller and commonly used to carry bicycles, skis, and other sporting equipment on their roofs. Crossover SUV's are highly utilitarian which is very unlike sports cars.
Re: (Score:2)
Gull-wing doors require less side clearance than standard doors.
What about height clearance? In a sports car that already has a low roof it wouldn't be a problem, but I can't imagine the same is true for a high riding SUV type vehicle.
Re: gullwing doors (Score:2)
It's quick but not quicker than "any combustion engine". I don't think it's even in the top ten.
Re: (Score:2)
Surprisingly, Tesla appears to be somewhat conservative with their 0-60 times. They claim 4.4s for the P85+ but Motor Trend tested it at 3.9s.
The Roadster is still slightly quicker but it won't leave the P85+ in the dust and that's an impressive time for a 5,000 lb sport sedan
Re: (Score:2)
Manufacturers are often (usually?) conservative with their performance claims. Still, the " will beat the crap out of any combustion engine" is ignorant and easily shown to be false, even when narrowing "combustion engines" to production automobiles.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
Doing a bit more Googling, the current fastest production motorcycle in the world is the Lightning LS-128 -- an electric, and the bike, by the way that ran away with the Pike's Peak challenge last year (granted that air-breathing bikes are at a disadvantage at 14,000 feet). Top speed is 218 mph, 0-60 time is below two seconds.
However that's #1 for top speed. For raw acceleration the current champion (also electric) is the Killacycle. 0-60 in 0.97 seconds.
Cost is an issue on these bikes, obviously, but f
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
That`s a rocket engine not a combustion engine.. still he should have used most 4 wheeled combustion engine vehicules rather than a simple `combustion engine` shortcut while referring to those.
Re: (Score:2)
That`s a rocket engine not a combustion engine.. still he should have used most 4 wheeled combustion engine vehicules rather than a simple `combustion engine` shortcut while referring to those.
Top Fuel dragsters are internal combustion, not rocket engines, though they do burn "rocket fuel" (nitromethane).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Fuel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VF0JwxQqcA
Re: (Score:2)
Oh, one more cool Top Fuel video. This shows the fuel pump for a single cylinder. The pumps can flow ~100 gallons per minute.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGTbQuhhluY
Crazy stuff.
Re: (Score:2)
Actually, the fastest dragster, albeit unofficial, ever was a rocket car powered by peroxide.
Rocket dragsters were basically banned for being too fast/dangerous.
Re: (Score:2)
That`s quite an interesting read :) He still should have limited his scope though, and I don`t think we will see production road cars using nitromethane to that extent for sale anytime soon.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
unless some guys says a propulsion system is faster than "any combustion" engine. That makes this side thread germane.
Re: (Score:2)
Rocket engines very typically ARE internal combustion engines.
The definition of 'internal combustion' is that the pressures from the combustion gases cause the motion. (In external combustion engines, such as steam engines, the heat from the combustion goes through a heat exchanger and the working fluid on the other side of that does the work.)
In a rocket the exhaust gases push directly on the exhaust nozzle, and the interior of the combustion chamber and causes the motion, making it an internal combustion
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Are you saying no one will be able to copy him?
Re: (Score:2)
Granted, these look like they'd be a nightmare in a blizzard or freezing rain, but I'm sure there's some way to engineer a fix. Or, alternatively, they could just make the doors slide vertically. That would have a similar 'cool factor' to a gullwing, except with the advantage of no clearance space needed, and would avoid the potential issues found with the disappearing door. Only issue wou
Re: (Score:1)
Or someone like myself who has driven nothing but Hondas for 17 years and has never experienced any sort of electrical problems whatsoever with them.
OTOH I hear about plenty of electrical problems in vehicles of all kinds from people that abuse the shit out of their cars.
Re: (Score:2)
I remember hitting the rear window defrost and have the hatch open on a less than 5 years old car.. And yes that was reproductible (and fixable..) but still showed a very bad design.
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
If they wanted to do something cool with the doors, they should have gone with electric sliding doors for all four doors.
I would like to see doors go sliding, but so far that means a dramatic weight increase. Not worth it. Normal doors aren't that bad.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
OK if the doors are leak proof, but will they drip water/snow/dust inside when you open them after driving in rain/snow/dusty weather?
Because regular doors don't ever do that?
Congratulations, your post is the silliest anti-Tesla whine ever.
Re: (Score:2)
Regular doors don't do that because they open outwards away from the car's interior, and none of the roof moves away. It could definitely happen on the Toyota Sera.
Re: (Score:2)
I don't think it'd be that much of a problem. When you're rolling no snow accumulates on top. Opening doors in a driving rain or snow will cause problems regardless of type of door although it'll be worse with a gull wing. The whole point of gull wing is coolness over practicality anyway. If people want to be practical they can get a mini-van.
Re:gullwing doors (Score:5, Insightful)
Regular doors don't do that because they open outwards away from the car's interior, and none of the roof moves away. It could definitely happen on the Toyota Sera.
Where on earth do you live? I'm in the lower Northeast, and rain and especially snow and dust indeed does get in the car when you open the doors - except the rear hatch - ironically the door most resembling the gullwing door. I mean, if only gullwing doors had this issue, we wouldn't need any other type of doors at all. Only the gullwings would allow anything outside the car, inside the car.
Re: (Score:3)
I guess you don't live in a snowy place? Opening regular doors does indeed drop snow from the roof into the car. Sometimes I remember to sweep the door seal off with a forearm, sometimes I don't. If I don't I need to remember to brush the seat off.
Re: (Score:2)
I guess you don't live in a snowy place? Opening regular doors does indeed drop snow from the roof into the car. Sometimes I remember to sweep the door seal off with a forearm, sometimes I don't. If I don't I need to remember to brush the seat off.
As long as it has regular front doors it's not that big a deal, open it the traditional way, grab snow brush/ice scrape, wipe off rest of car and then open the gull wings. If it was all gull wing, it'd be different as you could get a lot of snow blowing into the opening as it falls off the opening door or from the rest of the roof. It's not a good winter feature, but it's not a killer problem either assuming they can keep the seals closed and the doors don't freeze in the winter.
Re: (Score:3)
Re:gullwing doors (Score:5, Informative)
Have a look at how a properly designed gullwing door [arabamoto.com] is designed.
When the door is open there is a huge drain to direct water etc. from the roof to the ground (around the actual doorway).
Also when the door is open, the far end of the door is hovering outside the range where water etc. could drip inside the car.
In addition (unlike traditional car doors) when the door is open, it's hovering above the gap, acting as a roof, so that the actual rain doesn't get inside the car either.
Re: (Score:2)
In addition (unlike traditional car doors)
...they had to mount the doors on that SLS AMG on explosive bolts so that you could still get out of the car if you managed to invert it.
Re: (Score:2)
Hard problems are hard? (Score:2, Interesting)
And that's somehow news?
Well, at least we got it straight from the horse's mouth.
But it's not like gullwing doors are new or anything.
Some Tesla fanboi will probably mod this -1 for saying something negative about Tesla. Go ahead, you won't hurt my anonymous coward feelings.
Smart! That was one of the key... (Score:4, Interesting)
mistakes in the Delorean. Really bad in northern climes where the seals would freeze, locking you in the car. Notice I said "one of", the Delorean had a lot of other issues, too.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Those were mostly solved by the third movie, though...
Re: (Score:2)
true they replaced the motor with a steam engine.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
All car doors have seals. Wouldn't this be a problem on any car?
It should only be this much of a problem on vehicles with complex hinges that open all at once, instead of from one end to the other like normal doors.
Re: (Score:2)
"normal" car doors open all at once too. Not quite at the same rate, and the seal is much shorter, but the problem is still the same.
SOME of them do that. Most of them clearly do not. Look at the hinge to determine which your vehicle is, but most of them have just one pivot point. And so, in fact, the force being exerted to break the seal is extremely uneven.
Re: (Score:2)
Is the problem more of leverage and gravity? A normal door is basically balanced with respect to gravity and most of the opening force is away from the hinge. A gullwing door has to fight gravity and the opening force is closer to the hinge. I'm sure the gullwing has struts but the door would have to be open at least a little for them to work.
If my wife had let me buy that SLS Mercedes instead of a house I'd have more first hand experience.
Re: (Score:2)
Gull-wing doors on an SUV? (Score:4, Interesting)
Is it me or is this a really stupid idea? Just making the doors gull wing prevents you from putting: luggage on top, ski racks, bike racks on roof, etc. You know, the kind of things people would do with an SUV or crossover...
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
I bet 90% of SUVs are driven around town only and never have those things on their roofs.
Re: (Score:2)
Is it me or is this a really stupid idea? Just making the doors gull wing prevents you from putting: luggage on top, ski racks, bike racks on roof, etc. You know, the kind of things people would do with an SUV or crossover...
All those things would reduce the mileage on the vehicle. Maybe the gullwing doors are a clever plot to prevent people from ruining the aerodynamics, and thus the mileage, of the vehicle. Being electric this is a very important factor.
Re: (Score:2)
Their target market is the school run and people who like to be higher up while driving, not people who actually use an SUV for it's original purpose. There are lots of luxury SUVs like that on the market, which focus more on comfort and luxury than the utility aspect. The only time those people go off road is when they get a wheel on the pavement while trying to park.
Re: (Score:3)
Those are called minivans. I dont care how they want to twist it... It's a minivan without sliding doors.
Re: (Score:2)
Skis go inside (my A8 has a bag which can be made to protrude into the rear seat area and hold skis) and bikes go on the back, where the air is already turbulent and they will cause less drag.
number of ski pairs (Score:2)
When you travel as a group of several skier/snowboarder in the same car, the equippement don't necessarily all fit in the back's ski trap.
You either have to pushdown one of the back seats (and lose one place for one gang member), or you put all the skis and snowboards on the roof (at a small mileage cost but you still have enough room for the whole team).
Re: (Score:2)
When you travel as a group of several skier/snowboarder in the same car, the equippement don't necessarily all fit in the back's ski trap.
If it doesn't fit four pairs, then it's shit. The car fits four people, the bag should fit four pairs of skis. Bikes are harder. You can't get more than two bicycles on the back of a car gracefully. If you manage to get four back there they'll stick out like a shopping cart.
Automatic software updates (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Automatic software updates (Score:5, Informative)
(Other options also include a polling mechanism where the car phones home for updated periodically when stopped, or a combination of the two where they push an "update is availible" flag, which signals the car to phone home and download/install it once it's stopped/charging).
Re: (Score:1)
They way it works in reality is the update gets pushed to the car whenver. The next time you get in the car it tells you that an update is available and warns you that you cannot use the car while the update is being installed. It then suggests that you update the car the next time it's plugged in at 2am (or something like that). You let it know if that's okay, or if you want to schedule for another time, or bug you later, or if you just don't want the update at all.
I've had a couple updates in my Model
Re: (Score:2)
The updates are batched by Tesla so not all cars are updated at once. In case there's a problem with the new SW, that limits the number of affected vehicles.
Once the VIN has been tagged for update, the car downloads the new SW (over 3G or WIFI if available) and stores it locally. A prompt is shown on the main screen that new SW is available. Options are "install now" or "schedule install" (midnight is pre-selected), or "do not install now".
Re: (Score:2)
Not only... (Score:2)
Not only a Slashvertisement that links to an article with practically zero content... but largely a dupe [slashdot.org] to boot.
Lots of updates coming (Score:3)
Re: (Score:3)
You know that "m" has a fairly specific meaning WRT distance, right? :)
Re: (Score:2)
Like this.
http://www.teslamotorsclub.com... [teslamotorsclub.com]
When you have a roof rack, you lose the ability to park in tight spaces.
Fins and chrome all over again. (Score:2)
Re: (Score:3)
And here's the giveaway...
Re: (Score:3)
It's not that I actually believe your story - but you tell it well.
Re: (Score:3)
this is slashdot, motherfucker! (Score:2)
No wireless. Less space than a Chevy Nomad. Lame
Re: (Score:2)
Re: Horrible in a rollover (Score:1)
They're a bad idea until they're not - just like everything else Elon has done. The man has super powers.
Re:All the improvements could want except... (Score:4, Interesting)
I don't understand why we keep following elon around like lost puppies when he really doesn't do anything for the average person.
Well, he's making a lot of advances in electric car technology and is dropping strong hints [bbc.co.uk] that he plans to share those with the rest of the industry on a fairly generous basis. Selling premium-priced cars to the rich is a good way to bankroll that - in 5-10 years time the rest of us may well be benefitting from this work. I can respect that.
What he hasn't done yet is created a compelling alternative to the gas-powered car. The Tesla has a very clear niche where it might be practical if cash were no object: private garages and long, regular commutes of 50-100 miles: long enough to make you want to travel in a luxurious car, short enough to fall comfortably within the Tesla's range, home-based so you can recharge overnight.
I'd be OK with that if the Tesla website didn't try and push things like economy (no, you're not going to save money unless you conveniently ignore the extra cost of the car - but if you have that sort of money why would you care?) and how easy it was to make a road trip (...just start driving, then have lunch at a supercharger! On the newly-localised British site this advice is followed by a map that shows no superchargers in the UK)
I think they're on the verge of getting there: make that mileage '250 miles minimum)' rather than 'up to 265 miles (unless you get stuck in slow traffic and need lights, heat or air con)' and have supercharger stations every 50 miles or so (otherwise your useful range gets reduced because you have to recharge early or detour to charge) and you might have a viable care replacement.
There's also a scaling issue with chargers: I was looking at (non-Tesla) chargers in the UK and, superficially, its not too bad. Look closer, however, and most of those stations only have 1 or 2 bays - often one slow and one fast (with different connectors). Arrive there and find the bay in use (with the owners off having lunch somewhere), or out-of-order, and you'd be stuffed. You'd have to be so cautious about how soon to recharge that it would decimate the useful range of an EV.
Re:All the improvements could want except... (Score:4, Insightful)
What he hasn't done yet is created a compelling alternative to the gas-powered car. The Tesla has a very clear niche where it might be practical if cash were no object: private garages and long, regular commutes of 50-100 miles: long enough to make you want to travel in a luxurious car, short enough to fall comfortably within the Tesla's range, home-based so you can recharge overnight.
Exactly. It's an executive car - but that's a good place to start. Advance the technology and make it available to the early adopters to get the ball rolling. The biggest single obstacle to making long-range electric cars available to the masses is the price of the battery pack. The reason a Nissan Leaf is relatively affordable is that it doesn't have the huge battery pack needed for long range.
Now that Tesla has taken care of building the cars, and the charger network is expanding, it's on to scaling up the battery production, and that's where the upcoming Tesla/Panasonic battery factories step in. Aside from reducing battery costs and increasing production for the cars, they should be useful as storage for charging stations as well.
I know there's a lot of impatience (I want my electric car NOW, and Superchargers on every corner!), but starting a car company from the ground up isn't easy, especially when you're taking over a century of auto industry tradition and standing it on its head. I'm glad to see the progress that's already been made, even if it's still a long time before I could afford to go electric.
America needs more businessmen like Elon Musk and fewer like Donald Trump.
Re: (Score:1)
but starting a car company from the ground up isn't easy, especially when you're taking over a century of auto industry tradition and standing it on its head.
I'm sure Preston Tucker would agree with that thought.
Re: (Score:2)
When I buy my next car, however, I do know it will probably cost between $50K-$100K, and involve several weekends worth of Excel and making Pugh charts, because I don't drop that cash on a whim.
Strange. Although my annual income has less digits in it than yours, I've put by enough savings to easily drop ~$70k on a car without needing finance, yet I would only worry about running costs if it ran on single malt and was lubricated with white truffle oil, because it is completely bloody obvious that the running costs are trivial when you could get a pretty nice car for half the price, and insignificant c.f. the value a new car uses when it rolls of the forecourt (...actually the BMW i3 range extender