A Virtualized Linux System For Windows

getupstandup1 writes "Ulteo today unveiled their Virtual Desktop (screenshots, download) which is a free, full Linux desktop that runs seamlessly on Windows. It's interesting because it's not running under Xen or VMWare, but instead uses the coLinux patch, which they claim allows the system to achieve 'great performance, close to a native installation on the PC.' No need to reboot the system anymore to switch from Windows to Linux." We discussed Ulteo when the Ubuntu-derived distro was announced a year back.

As opposed to... andLinux?

[Briareos]

Is it just me, or did this already exist [andlinux.org]? Doesn't sound that new to me...

np: Saul Williams - Grippo (Saul Williams)

Re:As opposed to... andLinux?

[Penguinisto]

Yep - and for a very long time, too [phatlinux.com].

I don't know...

[tehBoris]

But isn't that project you linked more like Wubi?

Instead of being a Windows port of the Linux kernel (yeah... weird) like and/coLinux is, it is a Windows based Linux installer, which stuffs the whole distro's file system into a single file in your Windows' partition.

Re:

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, Ulteo is kde, andLinux is gnome. Otherwise identical.

Re:As opposed to... andLinux?

[redxxx]

I believe you may have that backwards. I run andLinux, cause it is useful for certain stuff and I can't just run linux, and it is KDE. There is another xcf or something version.

KDE in windows is going to be the better bet down the road for a lot of stuff, because you have to leap through fewer hoops with the filesystem, at least as far as most applications are concerned.

It's kinda amazing being able to get an awful lot of stuff just running apt-get from a terminal, while inside XP. A real VM is far secure of course. Security decent hardware firewalls and no small amount of obscurity doesn't bother me too horible.

Re:As opposed to... andLinux?

[hedwards]

It's kinda amazing being able to get an awful lot of stuff just running apt-get from a terminal, while inside XP. A real VM is far secure of course. Security decent hardware firewalls and no small amount of obscurity doesn't bother me too horible.

I was trying to figure out what the point of this really is.

Running Win apps on Linux is because there isn't a replacement for it or one that interoperates. Running Linux in a VM on Windows is good for things like security, but running Linux apps on Win just because, seems like an odd choice to me. Especially since one can get OO.org for Win, Firefox for win, Thunderbird for win, Gimp for win etc. Ok, so the last one is kind of cludgy. (Or it was last time I checked a few years ago, I'm sure it's much less so now)

There probably are a few which don't have Win versions, but VMs can be had for free, if you're a home or non-commercial user.

Re:

[Korin43]

Windows programs aren't that great. It would be nice to be able to run Gnome when I'm forced to use Windows though (for things like Illustrator).

Re:As opposed to... andLinux?

[andrikos]

OO.org for Win, Firefox for win, Thunderbird for win, Gimp for win etc

Did you mean OO FTW, Firefox FTW, Thunderbird FTW, Gimp FTW, etc?

Re:As opposed to... andLinux?

[loftyhauser]

I'm an engineer/professor, and I teach computational fluid dynamics. I develop, test and run numerical simulations on UNIX systems, but I require a Windows system (for applications, mostly). I've found that andLinux is great for developing the applications on my Windows system. I tend to use command line tools, mostly, which are a pain in the MS world. Have you ever tried building a UNIX makefile code on Windows? And cygwin just doesn't cut it (OpenMPI doesn't work).

Texmaker

[backwardMechanic]

You may like Texmaker [xm1math.net]. It's developed by the guy who originally wrote Kile, but doesn't depend on KDE so runs on anything. I switched because I wanted to use the same editor under Win and Linux, but actually prefer it now.

Re:As opposed to... andLinux?

[PhotoGuy]

I'll vouch for the underpinnings of andLinux and Ulteo, which is coLinux. I've been using it for years (an Ubuntu distro) and it's extremely solid, reliable, and efficient. It's a great way to have your Linux dev world near at hand, while needing a Windows box for other reasons. (In fact, I run my home PBX smoothly in a coLinux service on an XP PVR box.)

I hear so little about coLinux, I feel like it's one of Linux's best kept secrets. It's cool that we're starting to see meta-distributions based upon it.

Re:

[kesuki]

"Is it just me, or did this already exist [andlinux.org]? Doesn't sound that new to me.."

What worries me, is this runs in 'system managment mode' sounds like colinux is a perfect system to design a 'stealth' rootkit around...

http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/05/11/2044216&from=rss [slashdot.org]

great just great, as if paid hackers needed any help designing and deploying system managment mode rootkits, with colinux they can put a full LAMP server on somone's windows box and they'd never notice, except that their

Re:

[Darkness404]

great just great, as if paid hackers needed any help designing and deploying system managment mode rootkits, with colinux they can put a full LAMP server on somone's windows box and they'd never notice, except that their bandwidth and memory keep getting used up...

It might be better though. With a LAMP server it is traceable, which would make it much easier to take down then say Storm which uses P2P for communication.

Yeah, it's not that new, but...

[Ed Avis]

Indeed, coLinux has existed for several years. And for much of that time there have been distros specialized to use it. But the way these things work is that some new feature starts out in obscure specialist projects and slowly migrates to the larger distributions. When Ubuntu itself picks up coLinux support, that will also be newsworthy.

Re:As opposed to... andLinux?

[nickos]

coLinux is a version of the Linux kernel that can run as a task under Windows. andLinux is a distro which uses coLinux and runs on Windows.

No 3d acceleration

[QuantumG]

Yeah, unfortunately the video output is as snappy as VNC or VMWare. Virtualize the 3d graphics driver already.

Maybe it's YMMV

[dreamchaser]

I didn't find it to be all that slow from a screen refresh standpoint. I haven't tried any OpenGL stuff yet but that I mostly do on a native Linux box, not via virtualization.

I guess "Pick the right tool for the job" is what comes to mind.

Re:

[FLEB]

Who runs 3D accellerated stuff in a VM anyways?

Perhaps if 3D-accelerated VMs were more widespread...

Re:

[beaverbrother]

Who runs 3D accellerated stuff in a VM anyways?

People who want to run linux, play games and not dual boot.

Re:

[bigstrat2003]

Who runs 3D accellerated stuff in a VM anyways?

I'd love to be able to do so. KOTOR 2 doesn't run under Vista for me, so I have to keep an XP install around if I want to play it.

Re:

[QuantumG]

You're the only one who thinks it is a troll.. I think you're just upset that it is +5 and you disagree.

BTW - there is one VM that does virtualization of 3d hardware.. VMWare Fusion. Back when I worked for VMWare they were talking about doing it, but it was always pushed off to the next release. It's for the Mac so I haven't used it, so I don't know how great it is, and there's probably good reasons why it can't be done on Windows or Linux hosts.

Also, the Cygwin/X server (that Ulteo uses) currently uses t

Now, more masculine!

[Champ]

I'm going to have to look into their "application balls" [ulteo.com] -- the applications I have now are all effete and neutered.

Re:Now, more masculine!

[moderatorrater]

Their application balls just don't appeal to me. Personally, their system tray vagina sounds like something I'd prefer, even if it's not all that pretty.

Re:Now, more masculine!

[Mordok-DestroyerOfWo]

That sir, is the most disturbing thing I've heard today. My hat is off to you.

Re:

[EXMSFT]

Your reply is perfectly cromulent

Sweet

[DanWS6]

What games does this let me play?

Re:

[maxume]

Irony would dictate that you consider the options and elect to buy an Xbox 360.

Re:

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Re:

[DanWS6]

I have two boxes. One runs XP which I use for gaming and web surfing, the other runs Gentoo which I use for development as well as a media box/file server. Right now both machines are in the same room so I sometimes use the GUI on the linux box but no KVM and one monitor/keyboard/mouse is a pain. That wouldn't be such an issue if DVI KVM's weren't so insanely expensive.

Firstly, nothing stops you dual-booting both Linux and Windows in order to understand some of the benefits Linux could potentially bring to you.

Yes there is, I have no desire to dual boot. I don't want to do and thus I choose not to, just like I choose not to give up my XP box becau

Re:

[DanWS6]

If those knuckleheads ever finalized the OpenGL3 spec it might get more love from game developers and thus make it easier for games to be ported to linux.

Re:

[eldepeche]

I bought a Radeon X800 for my new computer because it was the second-highest-performing video card with Free drivers. (The X850 cost way way more.) With every distro I've tried, I need to make at most one xorg.conf tweak, and all the games based on the Q3 engine work perfectly. I've never even tried the non-free drivers just because everyone complains about them constantly.

Re:

[Gogo0]

The problem i had when i kept trying to switch to linux (1998-2000) was that i was dual booting with windows to play games. whenever i had a problem in linux and couldnt fix it within a day or so, i would simply go back to windows, or if i booted into windows to play tribes (which was often) then i simply wouldnt leave and ended up deleting my linux partition because i never used it.

what made me finally switch to linux (2000) was when i learned from a friend that tribes ran in linux under wine. i blew aw

Re:

[bigstrat2003]

I dunno. I don't run Linux because I can't effortlessly run my games on it. I don't wish to dual-boot an OS, and Linux, for me, has no advantage whatsoever over Windows. I don't really see how "can't run games" isn't a valid reason.

Near native performance

[Anonymous Coward]

It's interesting because it's not running under Xen or VMWare, but instead uses the coLinux patch, which they claim allows the system to achieve 'great performance, close to a native installation on the PC.'

Doesn't VMWare (and most modern virtualization programs for that matter) run near native already? All the new major processors have the virtualization extensions built in. (I didn't mention Xen because it doesn't run on Windows)

In fact, wiki has a list. Look under the "Guest OS speed relative to Host OS" column: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_virtual_machines#More_Details [wikipedia.org]

Most are native or near native.

Re:

[Darkness404]

Doesn't VMWare (and most modern virtualization programs for that matter) run near native already?

Yes, But I think that this doesn't virtualize the entire OS just a part of it which would make it run faster.

But...

[Kingrames]

Does it have native support for wine?

Re:But...

[HappySmileMan]

I hope so, Firefox now works great in Wine, so I can run Firefox in Wine, on Linux, on Windows, and if I have that copy of windows running in a virtual machine on my MacBook I'll be a god.

Re:

[mwolfe38]

Thats not bad, but I prefer doing all of my work on the command line in a cygwin instance of windows xp guest on an ubuntu host running windows hyper v through wine.

Re:

[Joebert]

At least untill your battery dies 5 minutes later.

Can it use your 3d card? stuff on the usb ports?

[Joe The Dragon]

Can it use your 3d card? stuff on the usb ports? firewire? other add in cards?

Re:Can it use your 3d card? stuff on the usb ports

[drinkypoo]

In order: no, no, no, no.

I've run colinux, it provides you a console and a virtual network interface and that's about it. The console has some slow graphics.

The only one of those I know how to actually get you is to run Cygwin's OpenGL-equipped X server, and then use XDMCP to connect to your colinux VM.

Worst of both worlds

[HangingChad]

Why on earth would anyone want to run Linux on a Windows box? That's like building your house on a dung hill.

Though I suppose it comes in handy for accessing those Linux only web sites. ;)

Re:

[Spy der Mann]

Though I suppose it comes in handy for accessing those Linux only web sites. ;)

Or linux-only apps (And here I thought Linux meant freedom).

Re:Worst of both worlds

[Vectronic]

But... isnt a house on a dung hill, better than just standing on a dung hill by itself?

Especially since, you can make the air seem a little more fresh with freshners, take a shower, get out of the sun, etc.

Re:

[drinkypoo]

But... isnt a house on a dung hill, better than just standing on a dung hill by itself?

Actually, in this case putting the dung hill on top of the house [wikipedia.org] makes the most sense. You get the benefits of living in a house that's not built on a dung pile, and you still get the benefits of the dung pile!

Re:

[gnuman99]

No, wine is not the same as building a dunghill on your house. It is like making your use look like a dung hill to a few select visitors.

To accomplish a dung hill on your house, you have to run Linux native and use KVM with hardware virtualization support to build the dung hill.

That's exactly what I do. I get the benefit of a solid house, as well has ability to go to the dung hill when absolutely needed.

Re:

[Joebert]

But... isnt a house on a dung hill, better than just standing on a dung hill by itself?

Only untill you realize it's a piece of crap & try to sell it.

Re:

[rastoboy29]

Actually, I would find it nice when I want to use one of the many free applications on Linux that are not available on winblows.  k3b comes to mind...

Re:

[smchris]

I suppose that means running XP on qemu is being anally retentive.

Re:

[rrohbeck]

Why on earth would anyone want to run Linux on a Windows box? That's like building your house on a dung hill.

Sounds just as bad as running Windows on top of DOS.

Konami unavailable for comment

[Dwedit]

The Ulteo Logo looks like a dead ringer for Konami's old logo.
I guess this means you need to press Up Up Down Down Left Right Left Right B A to get the thing to boot properly?

sweet

[RJBeery]

I can't wait to run WINE on it..

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Re:

[r_jensen11]

I know the parent was trying to make a joke, but there is some truth for the "application availability of Linux"

Erm, isn't this backwards?

[Keck]

I tend to prefer having the MORE stable OS be the one with direct hardware access, and the flakier OS standing on the other's shoulders. Vmware is the only way I've run windows at home at all in many years, and it works out just fine for me.

Re:

[corychristison]

I've found that even WINE is holding it's own now.

Photoshop CS2 now runs great under WINE. And with it's recent 1.0 RC1 release it's gaining more and more support as it drags its feet to the finish line.

I know it will never be finished, but it sure works great for those few programs I need (Photoshop, DVD Shrink, and, well, that's about it.)

Re:

[Keck]

Good point! I've used it for a few random shareware apps here and there; a .swf unpacker, etc. I did use crossover office for quite a while, too, on boxes where I didn't need a full windows installation in a VM.

is this just anti-wine?

[RiotingPacifist]

Does it translate linux api/abi calls to windows ones or is it doing something else to avoid being an emulator?

You're DOING IT WRONG!

[EXMSFT]

Oy vey. Talk about a solution in search of a problem. WINE exists because there is a huge amount of Windows applications that would be ideal to run on Linux. What on earth is the point of this? Am I just missing something completely obvious?

Re:You're DOING IT WRONG!

[Kirkoff]

There are a bunch of linux/x apps that I use at home I'd love to be able to use on my windows box at work. Think of stuff like Kate for text editing.

Vs. Cygwin

[Beezlebub33]

I have to use Windows on my work computer, but I need to run some unix apps, primarily C++ apps that I compile using g++. So, I use Cygwin. Is this a potential replacement, and if so, why?

Re:

[tangent3]

Yes, and definitely I would say it seems that coLinux was made with being a better alternative to cygwin/mingw in mind. I've been happily using AndLinux (Kubuntu + coLinux distro) running on my Windows XP for C++ development.

I've been waiting for this

[TekPolitik]

I've been waiting for this, because what I have always really wanted was to combine the application compatibility of Linux with the operating system reliability of Windows.

Re:I Spend Three Weeks..

[mwolfe38]

I'm not sure which is worse, trying to get ubuntu installed through virtual pc or relying on slashdot for all of your technology advice.

Re:I Spend Three Weeks..

[secolactico]

Indeed. Everybody knows that we come to slashdot for legal and romantic advice.

Re:

[Joebert]

Though, not necessarily in that order...

Re:

[couchslug]

"Indeed. Everybody knows that we come to slashdot for legal and romantic advice."

If I took that advice I'd be pounding my pud in prison...

Re:I Spend Three Weeks..

[Anonymous Coward]

go to doctor and have your subpoena replaced by a normal sized poena.

Re:

[Bryansix]

Well it works now. Plus I didn't reply on Slashdot. I researched this well enough. I WAS going to use VirtualBox but I couldn't get it to compile. Dependency hell consumed me.

Re:

[VGPowerlord]

Three weeks? It took me three seconds to find this article [wordpress.com] using Google... three weeks ago!

Re:

[Bryansix]

Ya, I spent a week trying to compile Virtual Box too. If I was at home I would use the non-free version which is compiled already but this is at work so I needed the GNU version. Eventually I gave up on VirtualBox.

Re:

[Spy der Mann]

Don't give up. VirtualBox is DEFINITELY worth it. I run Windows on it and everything works except videogames (that's what Wine is for ;-) )

Here's an installation guide for Ubuntu, they tell you how to compile from sources.

http://www.howtoforge.com/virtualbox_ubuntu [howtoforge.com]

Re:

[Spy der Mann]

Oops, you meant compiling on windows? ^^; I understand you man.

Re:

[Darkness404]

Ummm.. If you are running Ubuntu, they have the GPL'd version in their repos. If you have any type of Debian-based system it might work and you could always try alien if you have an RPM based system. If you are using Gentoo.... You should be used to compiles that take a week or more :)

Re:

[Bryansix]

I'm at work. I support a Microsoft environment. I don't like it but that's what I do. So That's what I have to run.

Re:Just wondering

[moderatorrater]

Linuces. The 'x' is only the nominative singular form, for everything else you use c + ending.

Re:Just wondering

[thePowerOfGrayskull]

So Tux becomes Tuces? :D

Re:

[Larryish]

Nope, two becomes Toonces

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rdLOrOLJiA&NR=1 [youtube.com]

it was though...

[samjam]

it was though, a perfectly cromulent word.

Re:Just wondering

[AlexBirch]

You're right, so your post is like fex, and when you post a second time you have feces.

The Humorless Language Nazi Explains it All

[fm6]

Whenever people hear a word that ends with "s" (or that sounds like it should), they assume that there's some silly grammatical rule that they need to know about. There is a rule, but it's so hard to follow, you shouldn't even try.

Here's the rule: a lot of words that end with "-us" (not all of them! more on that in a moment) are borrowed from Latin. In that language, a noun ending with "-us" is a singluar form (dominus, lord; servus, slave) that takes a plural form ending in "-i" (domini, lords; servi, slaves). In theory, it's more "correct" to use foreign inflections with foreign words. So instead of "octopuses", "styluses", and "circuses", people say "octopi", "styli", and "circi".

No, wait, nobody says "circi", do they? It's the "correct" usage, because it's a Latin word, but the established usage is "circuses".

The other examples I gave are commonly used, but are in no sense "correct". "Octopus" does not come from Latin: it's a Greek word, and the Greek plural is "octopods". "Stylus" is Latin, but it's misspelled Latin: the Romans spelled it "stilus". It got changed to "stylus" because somebody thought it was somehow derived from the Greek word "stylos". But it's not, so the "correct" way to refer to that thing that comes with your PDA is "stilus" and "stili".

But to heck with being "correct". It's the tar baby of the literate. Just use the rules you learned in grade school and be done with it.

Re:The Humorless Language Nazi Explains it All

[hedwards]

But to heck with being "correct". It's the tar baby of the literate. Just use the rules you learned in grade school and be done with it.

What's correct is what the vast majority of people do. That doesn't mean that using words like alot is really proper, but with the number of people misspelling that one, we may as well just admit that the spelling has changed, it would save an awful lot of red ink.

These sorts of arguments pop up frequently, and really as long as people can tell what is being said, there isn't really a good reason to argue too much about it. The speakers of the various languages will figure out a spelling, which will then be declared archaic and replaced with something knew. It's been happening for millenia.

Really, we ought to be migrating towards rules which are like the ones in grade school, except easy to understand and predictable. Some irregularities are going to crop up. But those should really be reserved for times when the alternative can't be pronounced.

Re:

[fm6]

What's correct is what the vast majority of people do.

Incorrect! If that were true, all the common idioms that most people use would be "correct". Most people use double negatives, but try putting one in your English class essay!

In theory, "correct" English is the language used by the most educated people. But since those people can't quite agree as to exactly what it is, it's pretty much a myth.

...as long as people can tell what is being said, there isn't really a good reason to argue too much about it.

But a key purpose of the rules is to facilitate communication. If you don't get at least a little anal about grammatical rules, it's darn easy to be misunderstood.

Re:

[ZerMongo]

Except Linux is a name, and thus not subject to normal endings. E.G. Phil Falux's family is not the Faluces. It's the Faluxs. Thus, Linuxs is probably the most correct form, though Linuxes wouldn't be in very bad taste.

Re:

[ChameleonDave]

Thus, Linuxs is probably the most correct form

I can't believe that got modded Insightful. What sort of illiterate moderators do we have on here?

English words ending in x add es to make a plural. Do you say "boxs"??

It is a proper noun anyway, so if you need a plural, you should say "distributions of".

I also hope there was no seriousness in the suggestions that plurals in -ces and -ii would be appropriate.

Re:Just wondering

[_KiTA_]

index => indices
linux => linuces
I think

I prefer the incorrect Linuxen, if only because I can then imagine giant penguins being used as cattle.

I would include a sound effect (i.e., Mooooo~) here, but I have no idea what kinda sound effect Penguins do. Perhaps...

SEGFAUUUUUUUUT~~~~

Re:

[Spy der Mann]

I would include a sound effect (i.e., Mooooo~) here, but I have no idea what kinda sound effect Penguins do.

The correct sound is Quork! [hackles.org], it seems.

Re:

[secolactico]

but I have no idea what kinda sound effect Penguins do. Perhaps...

Last penguin I heard was singing Boogie Wonderland, so who knows...

Re:

[mdfst13]

index => indices

According to Merriam-Webster, indexes is also a valid spelling [merriam-webster.com]. In fact, indexes is listed prior to indices, which suggests that it is the preferred spelling.

Cecil Adams has an interesting discussion of Latin/English pluralizations hidden in a discussion of the proper plural of penis [straightdope.com].

Re:Just wondering

[Achromatic1978]

In fact, indexes is listed prior to indices, which suggests that it is the preferred spelling.

Either that, or that the dictionary is in alphabetic order, as is the norm for dictionaries...

Re:

[EvilIdler]

Some list words in decreasing order of popularity, though.
At least my Oxford's does that.

Re:

[Plaid Phantom]

Linuxoj?

Re:

[fm6]

Some prescriptivists with a Classical fetish in the past have promoted words like "cacti", but the reality is that "cactuses" is perfectly acceptable modern English.

In general, I agree with you [slashdot.org]. However, "cactus" is sort of different because it's not Classical Latin, it's Scientific Latin. If you said "cactus" to a Roman, he wouldn't have thought you were talking about a thorny succulent, because he never would have seen one — it's a New World plant. In Classical Latin, "cactus" refers to the cardoon [britannica.com].

The modern usage comes from Linnaeus's [britannica.com] arbitrary appropriation of the word to describe a quite different family of plants. So your prescriptivist would be a

Re:Other way around, please

[Darkness404]

I don't think this will happen in as much depth as you are hoping. While Linux is 100% free and open source, it makes porting it to a proprietary OS easier then doing the reverse. WGA and other things don't help.

Re:

[Spy der Mann]

This is why there's a ReactOS project. In a month or so they'll have version 0.3.5 running.

Re:

[Petaris]

I want to run Windows safely inside a sandbox inside Linux.

Why not just run it in VMware, Xen, or //s then? If you want to sandbox it anyway then you may as well. And now there is cool stuff like VMware's Unity for Linux (VMware Fusion for Mac has had this for a while and its nice, though I don't use it often) which lets you make the apps look like they are running without the virtual machine.

Just a thought,

Re:

[Koiu Lpoi]

Now, I just got this from a quick google search, but it looks like it's already out [ubuntuforums.org].

If so, I may just have reason to try Linux again.

Think up some better lies.........

[budword]

GIRLFRIEND and WoW. Haha. AND, girlfriend who PLAYS WoW. This is slashdot buddy, we know you are making it up.

Re:

[BrentH]

You know what I do these days is running Ubuntu inside a (seamless) virtual machine in Windows. Windows has to be native for the games, and it doesn't matter how often Windows is borked, the Ubuntu VM image is on a different partition and as soon as I've reinstalled windows I can load that image up and *boom* my entire desktop with all my sweet little apps are there again without reinstalling anything. Best of both worlds. The only thing better (aside from Linux supporting my games ;)) would be virtualizab

Re:

[TexasDex]

I've had a try at setting up a torrent for it: http://linuxtracker.org/index.php?page=torrent-details&id=5665e3caf528c853645efe633113c6bab9042718 [linuxtracker.org]