Is the US Ready For the Switch To DTV?

tonsofpcs writes "On Monday, September 8, Wilmington, NC will be the first television market (#135) to make the switch to DTV by shutting off their analog transmitters. This forum will be posting updates throughout the coming months to keep everyone updated on how the transition works so that we are all prepared come February 17, 2009. So far, it seems Wilmington will still be going ahead as planned, despite Tropical Storm Hanna's proximity."

I have a feeling

Something tells me that after several delays and numerous announcements that the people that are unaware of the switch to digital TV probably wouldn't be too upset about missing out on TV for a few days while they track down an analog->digital converter.

Re:I have a feeling

Over-the-air DTV works terribly. First off, with analog, I could point my antenna in just about any direction and get SOME kind of fuzzy picture that was watchable. In other words, analog was easier to tune in,

With digital the tuning is much more difficult. I have to align the antenna perfectly along the 55th meridian, check the stars, adjust the horizontal azimuth, and get down on my knees and pray the signal is strong enough to not freeze the video (extremely annoying). And if there's a Tropical Storm blowing by? Forget it. The rain attenuates and destroys the signal. Yesterday I was unable to get my normal programming due to Hanna's presence... just a bunch of pixelated images instead of clear video.

DTV also provides fewer stations than analog.

In the Lancaster PA region analog reception provides these stations: 2,3,6,8,10,11,12,13,15,17,21,27,29,33,35,43,45,48,49,51,57,61,65,69 from various sources like my hometown, Baltimore, and Philadelphia. Switching over to my DTV tuner trims that number down to just a few: 8, 15, 43, 49, 57, 61. Twenty-four downto just six.

Pathetic.

The FCC's discontinuation of analog in favor of digital broadcasting is yet another government-sponsored frakup. Good thing I've learned how to stream TV shows off the net. Thanks to DTV, I no longer can watch ABC or CBS stations. Channels 21 and 27 have disappeared off my DTV dial! What a brilliant job Mr. FCC Engineer. I now have LESS choices to watch, not more. /steps off soapbox

Re:I have a feeling

I'm not sure about the US but as I understand it in the UK many digital transmissions are currently transmitted at reduced power to avoid screwing with analogue reception. Once analogue is switched off digital reception should get a lot better.

Re:I have a feeling

The US has similar restrictions, however even after the changeover is complete, many stations will still be operating at 1/10 of their original power (or less). You can find information on specific station licenses via FCC's TV Query [fcc.gov]

Re:I have a feeling

Absolutely correct. This has been sold to broadcasters as a way to save money while transmitting the same content. They can cut power, theoretically, save a ton of money and still get the same advertising revenue.

Unfortunately, as the previous posting observed, the public will pay the price in quality and quantity of stations available to their antenna.

Re:I have a feeling

Wrong. Power for NTSC transmissions are measured as peak power. The sync pulses are at the peak, and the average power is much, much lower.

ATSC transmission power levels are measured as average power, which due to the digital nature of the signal is much, much closer to the peak power level anyway.

Re:I have a feeling

According to the FCC, 99% of stations are already at their full digital power limits. Only a few will be increasing their power in March 2009.

One major change is that most stations will be moving from UHF to VHF, and VHF is less prone to breakup. For example my local WGAL is moving from 58 to 8, which should stabilize the image.

Re:I have a feeling

I suspect what will happen is, somebody will figure it costs more to broadcast a stronger signal, everybody has been getting by with the weak signal, plus the TV viewers have no choice now, so it would make better business sense to keep the weaker signal.

Re:I have a feeling

DTV also provides fewer stations than analog.

Get a different tuner/antenna.

My experience was quite the opposite. Using my original crappy bunny ears, I was able to receive around 5 channels in analog. Switching to digital brought these fuzzy/static channels to full 1080i. Add in a mid-sized powered antenna, pointed the right way and that number goes up to 32 (counting the spanish and shopping channels).

From the suburbs west of Boston I get: Boston, Providence and Manchester. All in far better quality than analog could have possibly provided.

If you want to blame the FCC for something, blame them for selecting ATSC. Why on earth they chose MPEG2 when everyone else gets MPEG4 or H.264 is anyone's guess (greed from patent holders maybe?).

Re:I have a feeling

If you want to blame the FCC for something, blame them for selecting ATSC. Why on earth they chose MPEG2 when everyone else gets MPEG4 or H.264 is anyone's guess

Who's "everyone else"? Other countries? The current UK digital terrestrial TV system, DVB-T, uses MPEG2.

Though I should make clear that DVB-T is only used for standard res transmissions (*) and has been in proper use here since the late 1990s, so it at least has a good excuse for being based on 1990s tech(!). Even though we're only just *now* starting to switch off analogue in favour of this already dated system!

Also, unlike the US where (AFAIK) you're going straight to a single terrestrial digital standard that supports hi-res transmissions which can still be shown by standard-res boxes (albeit at reduced resolution), the UK/European DVB-T boxes won't handle hi-res. So we're getting another new standard for that which probably *will* use the more modern and efficient H.264.

And to be honest, I'd have thought MPEG-2 would be horribly bandwidth-hungry for hi-def and a pointless choice given that more advanced codecs are now available and the existing boxes wouldn't support it either way (even if the original MPEG-2 DVB-T standard would have).

Anyway, are your FCC/ATSC *really* using MPEG-2 for hi-def? If that's true, it makes no sense at all.

UK is *very* different

My experience with digital TV in the UK is going from analogue at 4.5 channels (5 was not available in about half the places I went) to digital with far too many to count. The signal strength, picture and sound quality went through the roof with the transition too. Plus, no messing around with tuning at all, it just pulls channels, names and schedules out of the ether.

If your experience is typical, the FCC has managed a frak-up of truly epic proportions.

Of course, with all the new channels there's still nothing on worth watching, but that's a problem with the culture, not the technology.

Re:UK is *very* different

I know exactly what we're talking about; terrestrial Digital Video Broadcasting(DVB) through the air. The stuff you breathe, with antennae and no cables or dishes.

The only tuning you have to do is press autotune and the rest just happens. I've never had to fiddle around with the antenna on digital TV. Same with Digital Audio Broadcasting(DAB), though I have more signal problems with that.

I love the fact that a self-confirmed resident of Pennsylvania, USA has the audacity to tell me how my TV works from the other side of the Atlantic. You may have seen pictures of the boxes; I've owned and used one. This is why I think the FCC has conducted such an epic fail, if what you've said is accurate.

Are prisons ready for the switch?

Mandatory TV Conversion Creates Complications For Prisons [slashdot.org]

Will they broadcast a notice?

How hard would it be to broadcast on all common channels in the area a fixed pattern that says something along the lines of, "TV broadcasts using your current equipment are no longer available. Please conatct... blah blah blah".

Seems that would be better than just turning it off. Maybe just run it for a week or so.

Re:Will they broadcast a notice?

I can't speak for other markets, but here in Portland at least one station recently ran a prime time demonstration. They said "Right now we are going to turn off the analog transmitter for 60 seconds. You will know if you are affected if your picture goes away."

That's pretty smart IMO, and they should start doing that more often, perhaps every evening as we get closer to the switch, maybe even several times a day.

Prisons not ready

Numerous stories [google.com] mention that prisons are not ready for digital television, and prison administrators are worried.

Generally, inmates pay for their own television sets and (for some reason that escapes me) are not eligible for the $40 coupons.

Prison administrators say [tennessean.com]"the tube does more than fill year after year of idle hours. It provides a sense of normalcy and is a bargaining chip that encourages good behavior... At Indiana's Wabash Valley super-maximum security prison [a psychiatrist said], far fewer behavior problems were reported among inmates in isolation after they were given small TVs. 'You don't want to be managing prisoners who have nothing to lose,' Kupers."

I expect the test will show that, in fact, prison inmates represent only one example of what will prove to be a large population of forgotten Americans... the people who don't answer telephone surveys because they don't have telephones, the people who don't shop at Best Buy because they don't have cars and the nearest Best Buy can't be reached by public transportation, etc.

I will grant that the amount of publicity being given to the DTV switchover on our local TV stations is so large... at least during the times of day we watch and on the channels we watch... that it's hard to imagine people not knowing about it, but there is always that twenty percent of the population who can't name the President.

Indeed, I'm astonished at the poster who asks "Will they broadcast a notice?" since our local stations have been doing that continuously since February. Either his are not or he, like those twenty per cent I'm talking about, didn't notice.

recession

House in foreclosure CHECK Credit Cards past due CHECK Car Repossessed CHECK TV ready for Digital....not a priority

Some commentary on my switch...

I live in a valley...

next to an HD-only transmitter.

Needless to say, analog *anything* has been an issue. Last spring, sensing there may a be rush later, I got our two coupons from Uncle Sam, and cashed 'em in. A few points on my experience:

o Direction and gain are definitely more of an issue. Since we barely got anything analog clearly on bunny ear/loop, we got next to nothing with digital.

o With digital, it's all or nothing. Either you have clear signal, maybe with some artifacts, or you have black screen.

o *The* most annoying thing is that sounds cuts first.

o So, I did what any self-respecting tinkerer would do. I build a grey-hoverman antenna out of foam board, packing tape, tin foil, and picture hanging wire - all from from Walgreens (U.S. pharmacy) :-D. http://www.digitalhome.ca/ota/superantenna/ [digitalhome.ca]

o Obviously, with such rarefied materials I have a less-than-precise design - that works... really well.

o The GH antenna is highly directional. Since digital is crystal-clear, we put up with adjusting the thing in the bay window.

o We get 9-12 clear channels now, instead of 4-5 distorted ones.

o It's best to put it in an attic, or outside. Be sure to ground it, etc. The higher, the better - generally.

o Note that there are two ranges for VHF DTV, high channels and low channels. The Grey-Hoverman seems to do well with UHF DTV and high VHF. Most DTV seems to be UHF.

o Only some DTV is HD. Stations were given sub-channels. Some use only the main channel and switch back and forth between HD. Others put SD on one and HD on the other. Others use all for HD, with different content. The public television stations, strangely enough, seem to be making the best use of the sub-channels.

o The other prominent build-able design is called a Yagi. It consists of connected bow-ties, rather than zig-zag elements. The Yagi design is nice, because its gain is roughly even across UHF. The Grey-Hoverman seems to have better gain than the Yagi on some ranges, but cuts out in others. Check the frequencies of your local stations and compare them to the two antennas' gain charts before deciding.

o Why the range of channels for me? Well, in a valley the signal has echoes. Some echoes are stronger than others. Sometimes the amp makes the two echoes the same strength. In that case the converter box cannot lock in. Thus, if your location is subject to echoes (hills, valley, etc.), design your wiring to allow the easy removal of your amplifier.

o Also, atmospheric conditions seem to have an effect. On clear dry days we don't do so well; on wet or humid days, I think we could get New York City, if we wanted (we're in southern N.E.).

o Finally, going digital with a converter has one interesting benefit for you OSS fans. Since the Neuros OSD is still SD, converted DTV works nicely with it. I don't have one yet, but they are now on Amazon, and I am strongly considering getting one.

Govt/Retailers only making half-hearted effort

Not to sound overly cynical about the whole issue, but I do some contract work for a big box retailer. Folks come in all the time seeking the $50 digital to analog converter boxes. Yet the individual stores typically only receive about a eight units a week and sell out within a few hours! Add to that, the overly complicated process of requesting $40 coupon/rebate certificates to defray most of the cost. Then let's not forget that the typical person seeking these boxes does not read Slashdot, is on a fixed income, and uses 'DTV' and 'HDTV' interchangeably, not really understanding the definition of either. So why such little supply for such high demand? Why the bureaucracy? Why the readily confused acronyms? Because the push to DTV allows corporate interests to make use of the prime spectrum currently allocated for analog broadcasts while the retailers get taxpayer funded advertising that essentially tells a gullible public that the path of least resistance is to go out and buy a new LCD or plasma television - The stores just happen to have plenty of them, and gee aren't they pretty! As far as corporate/government corruption is concerned, this is small potatoes compared to many examples seen here on pollution, war profiteering, and eroding civil liberties. However, the callousness I've observed in the push to sell you a bigscreen television--err I mean a converter box, if you really insist; is really going to hit hard in Middle America. I'm wondering if while mobs of social rights activists and anti-war protesters have had minimal effects on Washington, what will happen when a few million pensioners find themselves without access to television?

Re:Despite Tropical Storm Hanna?

This is going to happen in February, why on earth should a tropical storm delay it if it's still September? For that matter, why would it be delayed at all? Is there something mystical and magical about tropical storms that we don't know here?

The use of TV as a warning mechanism for evacuations / seeking shelter. If you turn that off fro those still on analog you've added to the complexity of an evacuation.

Re:Despite Tropical Storm Hanna?

Well for one, it would be nice to see those red boxes when the weather man goes "there is a tornado warning for the communities within blah blah blah..."

EBS isn't worth a shit. All it does is replay a canned warning message with the counties under the warning, and at the end of the message it says tune to your local channels for more information...

What irritates me about the switch (which I still see as completely without merit - unless you are a telecommunications company or a DTV manufacturer), is the fact that they keep saying "If you have cable or satellite, you need not to worry about the conversion. Only people who uses traditional off-the-air television have to make the switch". Even worse is when your local cable company advertises that to avoid the switch just get cable...

Problem being that when the cable goes out (and it does during a hurricane) you are screwed and must resort to listening to the weatherman on the radio who continues to say "if you look in this area of the screen..."

Re:

Monday, September 8, Wilmington, NC will be the first television market (#135) to make the switch to DTV by shutting off their analog transmitters.

Re:I've had cable for almost 30 years

I've had cable for almost 30 years. They could shut off all broadcast TV as far as I care

Phew, on behalf of all Slashdot readers who were fraught with worry over how this would effect you, thanks for letting us know we can sleep easy.

Re:

I just tell people:

"If you have cable, dish, or FiOS television, then you need not worry about the over-the-air transition. It does not affect you."

Re:Short Answer

It is not called trolling; it is called elitism. ... and it is wrong. Your "demographic" probably leaves out the majority of those affected, those who shop at Walmart and purchased Chinese-made NTSC sets. Walmart got slapped a few times in the recent past for selling non-DTV capable sets - we're talking months ago.

See? It's possible to introduce a demographic you're not a part of, without a snide twist of the knife. All seriousness aside, there's plenty of bad stereotypes that could be made with the Walmart crowd (meth and prescription addiction anyone?). (I suppose even acknowledging the possibility of this counter stereotype is the same as saying it, but I'm trying to draw a distinction).

Good luck with your views