Cell Phone Purchasing: Drop Down? 207
walnut writes: "There is an interesting story on CNET about the future of cell phones, how the major players Erricson, Motorola and Nokia are beginning to have to face the realization that new sales are quickly tapering off. How they will entice people to buy new phones is becoming a big question."
Re:Cellphones... (Score:1)
With the amount paid for the 3g licences, perhaps they do have something to worry about with the amount of subsidies on Mobile phones: have you seen the REAL price of a WAP phone, not the price you pay in the shops??? As phones get more complex the price for the Operators becomes more as they know they will not be able to get people to buy phones en masse at more than a certain level: WAP phones failed to sell well at first because they were over a hundred pounds perhaps... Not when 'everyone' knew that sooner or later you would be able to get one for free when signing up for a contract, which has already started happening, less than a year later.
yep, i sell them (Score:1)
Re:Maybe They Shouldn't Be So picky... (Score:1)
Foreign Names in the U.S. (Score:1)
I notice this a lot, esp. on Slashdot. I can't believe Americans should all be that dumb.
Huh ? (Score:1)
Simple, innovate! (Score:1)
-Make a phone that is combined with an IPAQ (think Doom deathmatch)
-Make a phone that has orders of magnitude better sound quality.
-Make a phone with all of the combinations listed above.
Last, but not least, sell a phone with exclusive Star Wars action figures glued onto it. People will buy crates!
Re:shouldnt this be expected? (Score:1)
Re:it's only an image thing (Score:1)
Smaller and smaller, more memory, digital, SMS, GSM 1800 instead of 900, second line, faxdata capability, dual band, triple band, address books, games, dictionaries, radios, WAP, GPRS, etc., etc. there will always be found a reason to sell phones, just as people are still buying computers (although I know the analogy is slightly skewed).
As for looking trendy in front of potential employers, if you leave your phone on during an interview and it rings, or show it off to a potential employer in Europe you won't get the job. It is way beyond that. For an example of what I mean, try looking at how you can customise your phone at Iobox [iobox.com] or Genie [genie.co.uk].
planned obsolesense (Score:1)
Re:shouldnt this be expected? (Score:1)
...phil
Re:new technology = upgrades (Score:1)
It's still an entension of the functionality which is what I was trying to point out. OOO loook new features, but you need a new phone
new technology = upgrades (Score:1)
1st its GSM
then WAP, now GPRS and in a couple of years UMTS.
Of course you have buy a complete new phone, can't upgrade the old one.
Thats why the phone co.s are pushing to get 3G out there (and wap/imode/gprs in the interim) so they can keep on churning out phones.
Re:Cellphone etiquette (somewhat OT) (Score:1)
What I'd like is a missile launcher for my car that fires a cell-phone-seeking missile, fires automatically at any call answered while the vehicle is in the left lane.
I'm not even a nazi about driving while gabbing. I'd just appreciate it if the dumb FUCKS would just get the hell out of the left lane so people can pass.
The best bumper sticker I saw was: "do you think you could drive any better if that cell phone were up your ass?"
if it ain't broke, then fix it 'till it is!
Cheapest phone for emergency calls only (Score:1)
Thanks.
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Re:Telcos don't get it (Score:1)
Much as consumer electronics makers now face new competitors from the computing business, telephone equipment makers may find they are not masters of the handset market if they do not deliver PC-like openness.
Re:Misunderstanding in what consumers want (Score:1)
See Jakob Nielsen's July 9 column, WAP Backlash [useit.com].
There is real value in the vision held by many of the cellular providers, but we are a long way from that vision. The vision requires:
Better user interfaces. Doh! We will not triple-tap our way to http://wap.somehorrendouslylong.url.com.
Displays big enough to read and display useful graphics (not video, just maps and such).
GPS integration.
The idea is that when my Bridgestone/Firestone Tires of Death shred themselves, I can whip out my phone and get directions to the nearest service station, then locate the closest Starbuck's for a cup of coffee while they're replaced.
But we're a long way from that.
I've been watching with some amusement as American companies scramble to come up with WAP strategies. In general, these strategies have two key components:
Exclusivity, reflecting the "false Internet" nature of the so-called Wireless Web. If you're on the screen, you're on. If you're off the screen, you're dead. The telephone company owns the screen. Pay up, information providers, or miss out on the Next Big Thing. But nobody really knows whether this next thing is big. Where's the money for the information provider?
Weak content planning, generally spun out of the "we have all this great content, let's give it to them" school of thought rather than the "let's understand what a wireless consumer might need" school of thought. Some newspaper people, for instance, are talking about how great it would be to put classified ads on WAP. I don't think I am going to sit in the park and read the classifieds on my phone.
If I lose my phone... (Score:1)
Now, I can't speak for the levels of service than US phone providers give, but that's what Orange do for me.
And yes, as another poster pointed out, Orange give me minutes back if they drop a call.
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Insert the card? (Score:1)
All the pay-as-you-talk schemes that I know of in the UK go like this:
1. Buy card (say, £10 worth)
2. Scratch off silvery stuff to reveal long number
3. Call customer services and recite number
4. There is no step 4, you're done.
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If you're talking about SIM cards... (Score:1)
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Wishes granted (more or less...) (Score:1)
Newer offices install their own GSM stations and issue cellphones to the employees - calls within the office are free, since the company own the local GSM network, and when you leave the office you can still be reached - without having to forward your phone.
Re:UMTS anyone? (Score:1)
What has packet mode got to do with anything? It's still a phone. Circuit switched speech and data is still there.
I think you've watched too many marketing videos.
Re:UMTS anyone? (Score:1)
How exactly is a UMTS device different to a cell-phone?
BTW, I have declared myself WCMDA QuakeII world champion. Any challengers?
Let microsoft help make the phones (Score:1)
Oh yeah, They all have the same buttons. You will have to press "send" to stop a call. (What? some of them already do that!)
How it works (in the US anyway) (Score:1)
Talk about a concidence . . . yesterday, the largest local cell phone service provider (all praise Alltel) came to my employeer's campus, offering extremely cheap phones in price, but not so much in quality. Of course, you had to pay for everything on the spot.
I know for a fact Sprint PCS (the provider I use) doesn't make any money off the phones that they sell - they make money off of selling their service. So if Motorola, Qualcomm, Erikson, etc. are worried about making money, they should talk to the service providers instead of concentrating on the end-users.
I think it must work different in Europe, though. I was there a few months ago and everyone had a cell phone. It was crazy. We in the US think we use them all the time, but we really don't, compared with that side of the pond.
- mikeh
Re:They can't improve things (Score:1)
Howabout picture calls? Graphical browsing of the 'net?
...in the US, at least (Score:1)
So simple - yet so brilliant (Score:1)
ps
-- In other news, astrophysicists have announced that they now know what all that dark matter is: it's stupidity.
Re:Maybe the rest don't always want to be found.. (Score:1)
Psss... Wanna know a secret? It's an important one and may change your life. Ready to listen? Pretty much all electrical and electronic devices have this little thing called an "off button" or an "on/off switch". If you look carefully at your cell phone you should be able to find one. Try pushing it -- you'll be amazed at the results.
And yes, you can tell this secret to your friend, too.
Kaa
Re:Ideas (Score:1)
They are. Newer technologies, however, tend to involve such vulgar real-world-electron things like radio transmission. As such they tend to need new physical parts and not just a BIOS reflash.
Phones should be small computer parts
I assume you mean they should be able to interface to your home PC. Most newer models already can.
Phones should be free. Somebody should pay instead of people.
A wonderful idea! But why stop at phones? Computers should be free also, somebody (as in "not me") should pay for them. And cars should be free, too. And houses, and clothes, and
Phones could also be used in the car as the GPS system.
GPS and cell phones are different systems. You can build a GPS chip into a cell phone (Casio already built one into a watch), but why? There is significant power drain and GPS doesn't work well in a city anyway.
A phone could also be a wallet,
Well, I don't know about your wallet, but I would find it really hard to replace it with a cell phone. How would you do this? I am curious.
Kaa
Re:Ideas (Score:1)
Thankyouverymuch. I still value my privacy and have no wish for somebody to own a very complete database of everything I paid money for.
In any case, my wallet holds more than money. It holds various IDs, credit cards, public transportation passes. It also holds a ToolLogic tool set -- now let me see a cell phone do that!
Kaa
phone growth actually _doubling_ in 7 years (Score:1)
describes how overall the industry will continue
to sell _more_ phones, doubling the number sold
by about 2007. more phones == more growth.
and these numbers are just the tip of the iceberg.
we're seeing how much easier it is to 'wire'
3rd world countries with cell infrastructure than
wiring to @ house independently. think of the 5-6
billion people out there. someday they'll all
be connected.
growth slowing? maybe.
overall growth continuing? definitely.
Perhaps they should take a clue from the Japanese (Score:1)
They also don't lock you into a 2 year contract (i.e. you can use a phone for 1 month and then switch to another company no problem).
And want to hear the strangest part? The cel phone companies are making money hand over fist.
Maybe it's about time North America looked to the East for some clues about cel phones. My current phone weighs 8 ounces, has a color screen, and can connect to the internet, display maps of the area you are in, weather information, etc etc.
Re:They should thank the networks as well... (Score:1)
One guy was using on a camp site with a road nearby, and everytime a car went by, the signal quality would degrade to next to worthless.
He gave up in the end.
There is still a long way to go with satellite phone. But for the time being, we will just have to live with mobile phones.
Re:UMTS anyone? (Score:1)
In a sense it's a cell phone, however it's designed to work in packet mode with a massive bandwidth (up to 2Mbit/s). Since those phones are due about 2 years from now they'll probably be more like pocket-multimedia-internet-devices than cell-phones.
Re:Good reason not to implant cell phones in head (Score:1)
Heh, not only that, most of these people are too stupid to realize that cell coverage is spotty if not nonexistent in a lot of wilderness areas. Oh well, natural selection at work, I always say. ;-)
No thankyou. (Score:1)
Having one and just turning it off when you dont want to be reached doesnt make much sense if you have will just have it shut off 99% of the time. Then again, I unplug my phone (dont have an answering service, altho I do have number presentation (good for both sorting out calls you're not interested in, and calling back people if you feel like it)) and procmail email to somewhere around blackholing.
The fact is, I've had enough of people reaching me. I do not want to encourage it. I have enough to do with my time to last me 96 hours per day, and a cellphone just compounds that.
Dont call me. I'll call you.
I would buy one if... (Score:1)
(please dont stone me!!!)
I would buy one if...
I could telnet into my home machine and send
PS. I dont give a %&*! about phone calls.
Re:I would buy one if... (Score:1)
Actually dont listen to me,
I boycotted Metalica on popex [popex.com].
I hardly count as average.
Re:I want... (Score:1)
you've got to be kidding (Score:1)
The wristwatch and radio business also seem to be doing well in spite of the fact that most people in the US already seem to have N.
Why should the market for cell phones be different?
Re:Cheapest phone for emergency calls only (Score:1)
The problem is how to empirically test this. The way I would do it is to carry it around, wait for a moron speeder weaving in and out of traffic, tailgating, and cutting people off (mean arrival time about 5 minutes around here), and use the phone to call 911 to turn in the moron's plate, location, and direction of travel. Once you've done that, you will know for sure it works, and maybe have gotten the aforementioned moron a well-deserved traffic ticket.
Re:Make them affordable! (Score:1)
Different standards were chosen for different reasons. Of course Au picked GSM which basicly works for almost 2% of the land area but it covers nearly 85% of the population. The just pulled the plug on the US analog style system which covered an additional 5% of the population that isn't covered now and about 2% more of the land as well as all the touristy areas along the reef which isn't covered at all now. Just for a simple compairson, the reef is 345,000 sq km while the entire UK is almost 245,000 sq km.
Re:Well, for a start.. (Score:1)
-sid
Re:I would buy one if... (Score:1)
Re:Cellphones... (Score:1)
Same goes for cellular phones. Would you honestly be able to use 1400 minutes in a month on your cell? You'll be doing a lot of recharging.
>You get minutes not used rolled over into the >next month (muchlike Fido started doing in >Canada) The competition is fierce enough that they have to keep increasing the number of free minutes.....
Re:shouldnt this be expected? (Score:2)
From: vp@firewall.nokiaa.com <Julius VIP Woston>
Subject: recent dip in sales
Bob,
I dont need to tell you what kind of filthy lucre we'd be swimming in if we could sell a single phone to every other adult male in China. I am mandating you to start lobbying the government there to reduce the severity of their drug laws.
If you are successful, we would at least get a phone into the hands the dealers, there. I know for a fact that they are envious of their western counterparts in that regard. The rest will follow.
Say hi to Jenny and the kids for me.
Modern mobile phones have a pretty short lifetime (Score:2)
The battery doesn't hold its charge, you've dropped it so many times the cover is all scratched, etc, etc.
And certainly here in the UK you can get a new one from your service provider every 12 months anyway.
Surely this is a none-story?
Re:Make them affordable! - They are (Score:2)
My roommate is considering dropping his land line and getting his wife a cell phone. For $40/month she gets 600 day minutes, and 1000 weekend minutes, and the weekends are all long distance included. That phone also includes caller ID and voice mail. His land line service is $50/month, after you add in the options included in the cell phone (except voice mail!). He doesn't use the land phone for 600 minutes a month, and his wife makes a lot of long distance calls to family out of state (weekends). So it would be cheaper for him to drop the land line phone. (He is a carpenter and needs a cell phone for work)
Cell phones are not cheaper for people who make a lot of local calls from one location.
Paying for incomcing calls isn't quite as big of an annoyance as you think. Most plans have first incoming minute free. (so wrong numbers don't cost you anything) Also because you pay for that time phone Spam is illegal. I don't get calls on my cell phone about new siding for my home (and I rent), and the like.
For me a land phone doesn't make sense. Since high school the longest I've lived at one address was just over a year. My cell phone number hasn't changed for several addresses. When I move again it won't change either. Yes I pay more for it, but I still won't go back. (I wish they would lower prices, but they have us users)
$80 + $30/month (Score:2)
Telcos don't get it (Score:2)
1. The Internet is hard to control. If you want to put up content, and can afford the bandwidth, you are in business. No government licensing or lack of spectrum can stand in your way. To phone people, this is total anarchy. They don't grok it.
2. PCs are hard to control. Even with non-open software like Windows sometimes coming under suspicion of supporting interfaces for law enforcement and intelligence agencies, and Intel messing around with snoopware in its CPUs, PCs are still powerful machines totally under the control of their individual owners. Telcos, OTOH, have a long history of actively enabling their national authorities to snoop.
3. Because of this lack of understanding, telephony products have stinted on supporting privacy, customer control, and anonymity. Imagine if a phone company offered a product about which they could say: It is open, absolutely private with no "back doors," possibly anonymous if you want that, and you can combine it with any software or service offering you desire. Hahahahaha. Suggest this in a telco, and off to the loony bin with you. But this can be said of PCs and the Internet. It illustrates the depth and breadth of the chasm telcos have to cross.
4. This also spells doom for phone/PDA combos. They do not embody PC-like control. With phone/PDA combos, you are exposed to the telco view of privacy (at their discretion) and contol (none).
5. The real answer is that convergence will happen when your phone is a PC, with all the attributes of a PC, and "phone service" is just a wireless Internet application.
6.In fact, for "phone service" to become an Internet application, it is more likely that our concept of a phone call will change (like voice chat, maybe), than that the Internet will start behaving like the telephone network.
Re:Well, for a start.. (Score:2)
Re:it's only an image thing (Score:2)
anyway, I can't say I'm surprised about sales dropping down. after all, once you have a cellphone, you don't need another unless the first breaks *or* you're changing for 'image' reasons. and when the best reason to change is 'image', as far as I'm concerned, it means that the field has become yet another plain old commodity. i may want to have one or not, but what's clear is that once i do have one i'm not going to buy another for a very long time.
Re:Maybe the rest don't always want to be found.. (Score:2)
Re:you've got to be kidding (Score:2)
There are limits to how small the phone can be. You need a certain level of transmitter power to communicate with the cell site. Higher bit rates require higher transmitter power. You need a battery large enough to power the phone for a reasonable period of time. The phone needs enough surface area for a usable user interface.
Re:Just some toughts (Score:2)
My first phone (GSM-1900) had a SIM card. It was replaced with a CDMA phone that did not have a SIM card when the service provider switched from GSM to CDMA. Activation of the new phone was a pain in the butt. I had to spend 30 minutes talking to a customer service representative who had me enter long sequences of undocumented commands that configured the phone. I doubt that I could swap phones without a lot of grief.
Already available (Score:2)
Re:A few solutions (Score:2)
does not seem the case here in Austria... (Score:2)
Seeing that most people here take mobile phones as some kind of fashion I do not see why there should be a large number of unsold phones (at least here)
Re:Microsoft can lead the way (Score:2)
Uh...no they don't. I only buy knicknacky stuff at Radio Shack with cash, and every time they (or anybody else) says "Can I have your fleem number?" I say "Of course not." This usually freezes them for about 3 seconds, after which they go ahead and finish the sale.
Apparently, this is kind of rare, but I suspect it is more common in the geek community. So, does anybody out there really hand over this kind of info any more?
Cellphone etiquette (somewhat OT) (Score:2)
I have to agree that this is rude. Rude of the mother to call during class and rude of the pupil to not turn the ringer off. I don't necessarily think it has anything to do with cellphones, however, it's just a symptom of rudeness in general. I hope that it's just us Yanks that behave this way and this is not a worldwide phnomenon, but I have my doubts.
But there is starting to be pretty severe lashback against cellphone usage here in the States. There are lots of bumper stickers that carry messages such as "Hang up the phone and drive" and I think I heard that one state outlawed driving while talking on the phone. This is in contrast to Europe and Asia, where I gather that a cellular phone is something of a status symbol.
[1] I mean no offense to smokers; I'm only paraphrasing the article.
Good reason not to implant cell phones in head (Score:2)
Actually, as a side note I've read that cell phones are becoming a real problem for the forest service, because people are now doing more challenging things than they would otherwise, just because they know they can always call for help!
Everyone just try and remember that helicopter ride home is not free. Cell phones can be nice for real emergency use, but too many people use them as a crutch.
Re:Waiting for 3G? (Score:2)
Re:Waiting for 3G? (Score:2)
30 cents a minute.
2 hours reading Slashdot.
That comes to $36 dollars to enjoy reading a lot of useless opinions in a cramped format.
I make a lot, but not that much. If you've got other bills to pay, this is useless.
Reversal (Score:2)
Now everyone, and I mean EVERYONE has a cell phone, and a pager, and all of them have tons of nifty options and cost practically nothing, and gosh by golly its just so damn cool.
I don't have one anymore. Or a pager. I've come to somewhat despise the fact that more people seem to have cell phones these days than watches.
I've come to learn that I don't NEED to be reached when I'm out shopping for 30 minutes. Nothing really seems to be THAT important. More importantly, I don't usually WANT to be reached when I'm not working. Thats MY time people. If you need me for something, just send me an email. Just as easy as a phone call, and I'll get to it when I have some time to kill.
When I first got a cell phone, I used it primarily for business related reasons, and the ocassional 30 second "hey I'll be home at 5" kind of deal. Sometime when you're bored, find someone talking on a cell phone (shouldn't be too hard) and eavesdrop. 9 times out of 10, they're probably in the middle of a 30 minute conversation about pointless gossip that really wasn't so cruicial that it needed to be discussed while the cell phone customer was picking out maxi pads in the grocery store (I would recommend hanging out in a different aisle tho)
Remember when cell phones didn't have a "style"? They were built the way they were to be the most space efficient. Now they're designer brands.
In any event, I've been without a cell phone for 2 years now. in all that time, I can't recall any time where it would have come in handy.
-Restil
Re:you've got to be kidding (Score:2)
I mean, this is just one idea.. there are many ways to do it of course. To TALK, you only need a microphone and speaker, which can be very small. To dial, you need a little more, of course.
Re:Modern mobile phones have a pretty short lifeti (Score:2)
Also both my nephews have broke or lost phones at one time or another. I think the demand for more phones will pick up if they can get people on pay-as-you-go to switch to contract if they break or lose one. However with so many spare phones about that could be trickier then it sounds.
The simple way is new standards such as GPRS and new features on phones that entice people to upgrade.
Bob.
Re:A few solutions (Score:2)
MP3 player (with remote control) [slashdot.org], radio and TV [cnet.com], videoconferencing [slashdot.org], multiplayer games [wirednews.com], and emergency beacons [cnet.com].
Re:Maybe the rest don't always want to be found.. (Score:2)
Yep, my opinion exactly (apart from walking with your girlfriend
Companies seem to be having more and more trouble with the concept of a employee being a human being, not a "component". Witness the increasing encroachment on communications during working hours (it used to be accepted that employees couldn't stop being family members during working hours; they would have to contact doctors, schools, be findable in case of emergency and so forth, in cases where the privacy of the employee would be important to them; increasingly, regardless of how awkward it is, or how much of the normal business day they work, employees are expected to *accept* that any email or phone conversation will be monitored and they will be penalized if they are not using "company resources" for business purposes only.
At one of my previous jobs (which was one of the reasons I left) I resisted giving them my landline number for some time; I was eventually dragged into an upper manager's office and was told I *had a duty of care* to the company that included being reachable out of office hours if needed; needless to say, there was no extra pay or benefits for this "duty" and it didn't show on my contract. You may also safely assume that the few calls I received due to this weren't exactly life threatening - upper management types who couldn't access their email (forgot their passwords *again*) or needed to "do a power breakfast" and therefore needed information sorting out overnight so they could pick it up at the office and go straight to the meeting. I don't work there anymore.
I am a computer geek, check my email every 3 minutes, cary a palm, etc. but I like to "disappear" sometimes.
I am as much of a geek as I can be given I am married - and therefore have demands on my time.
Last week, my friend got a call at 2am in the middle of the forest while camping, one of his companies servers needed rebooted and the tech didn't know the command!! I don't want that..
I wouldn't be *too* surprised to find companies starting to dictate which holidays their employees can or can't take - based on reachability and ability to make it either back to home base or to someplace they can remotely administrate. Decent skilled techs are getting a scarce resource, and the cheaper but semi-skilled paper MSCEs which are so attractive to HR and Upper management fall apart when left to their own devices.
Am i the only one who is offended by the idea of new mobile phones with GPS and blue-tooth in them being able to send you digital cupons as you walk by the store?
More because they should not *know* you are walking by their store, and by knowing that they are likely to want a tighter "target" than that - only people who are walking towards their store, and have been in (list of competitors) store in the previous day so are likely to be shopping for similar goods.
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Re:A few solutions (Score:2)
Actually, cell phones make perfectly logical secure login devices, i.e. a device which contains a PGP private key and authenticates it's self by signing data with that key. I would only need one password (the password for my phones PGP private key file) and I would ONLY type this password into my phone, which would then tell my system that it's really me who wants to login. No hacker could get my password because the system dose not know my password, it only knows a public key to authenticate me. Hey, you could feed all you email through your cell phone too (for PGP encryption) while your at it. I suppose you need some new way for the computer and phone to talk to one another (like infared). Anywho, the importent bit is that only you and your cell phone ever know your password and only your cell phone knows your public keys.
Economics (Score:2)
How about realizing that since there are a finite amount of people, there is a finite amount of cell phones that can be sold? Or for that matter, that since we live on an isolated planet with finite resources, that our economy cannot keep growing forever?
Bloody economists.
Re:A few solutions (Score:2)
Re:The idea of a mobile phone (Score:2)
In your point of view, this may be a false assumption. To me, it is the reason I don't have one. Yes, I can turn it off, but I don't want to have to deal with people (family, friends, mainly bosses) saying, "I called you 20 times. Stop turning off your phone."
I personally feel no need for one. I represent a lot of people who don't want one for the same reasons. If I'm not at home or at the office, I don't want a phone ringing. It's that simple.
This isn't an assumption, this isn't me talking people out of getting phones, this is a personal opinion.
Re:Economics (Score:2)
How about people who *don't* need to be in contact 24/7? How many bazillions of dollars are they going to spend on marketing to alter the ways these people think?
They're getting into serious social engineering to sell possibly cancer-causing technology. Which, to me, is about as evil as evil gets. Not quite record-exec evil, but that's just because I'm a musician.
The other day on NPR they actually stated "A major problem with Osteoporosis was recently discovered... not by doctors, but by economists."
Doctors have been stating for over a decade now that osteoporosis is a *major* health issue in this country, but noone (read: the insurance companies) listens until it affects the bottom line.
Health doesn't matter. Mental health doesn't matter. All that matters is the bottom line.
Repeat after me:
"The economy, of course, is of utmost importance."
why not just introduce a new standard (Score:2)
oh, wait. they're already doing that. it's called 3G.
red flag: Ashok Kumar quoted (Score:2)
He is wrong an unbelievable number of times. (Monkeys spouting things off at random get things right occasionally)
He is also incredibly biased. He used to be a big E-Machines hyper until they went with a different underwriter, wherupon he switched 180 degrees, and started blasting E-Machines. A quick web search will quickly verify this.
So much for the "chinese wall" between the analysts and underwriters at the big accounting firms.
Re:A few solutions (Score:2)
Works for the automobile industry
UMTS anyone? (Score:2)
How about throwing in a new standard every couple of years and make old phones obsolete?
Currently, most of us use GSM for our mobile telephony addiction. In 2001-2003, the new third generation networks are going to be deployed. This creates a huge new market, as the early adopters will buy the new multimedia-enabled phones immediately, and, after a while the average joe will trade his GSM for a GSM/WCDMA double standard phone. The drop in pure-GSM phone sales will then be matched by the increase in smart phones sales and in 3rd generation phones.
Another niche to be explored is the travellers' one. (Software reconfigurable) phones that work in the US and Europe/Japan will be very nice for people that don't like to own a couple of phones and like to travel light. A terminal with cdma2000 and WCDMA and maybe GSM will make me drool anytime... ;-)
adaptMake them affordable! (Score:2)
Another problem is that most service plans require you to pay for incoming calls! Not only are people bothering you, but you're paying for it. That really adds insult to injury. The rates I saw seemed to run around 30 to 50 cents a minute for local calls, with 15 cents a minute extra for long-distance. This was digital service in the MidWest.
I don't think that cellphones will get too far beyond the gadget-freak crowd until service gets quite a bit cheaper. I'm just not willing, right now, to pay more than double for phone service, just to make it easier for others to bother me. I rarely have to make a call when I'm not near a land line, so the added convenience is just isn't worth much extra money for me.
Nels
They can't improve things (Score:2)
Without a new network to sell to people, all the mobile phone companies can do is to produce smaller models and maybe integrate in more features BUT as most people won't be subsidised to buy these phones they are not going to sell many unless they have a killer app (how many of us would swap to another phone if it was running a Free Flashable OS?, or if it incorporated a 128Mb mp3 man, WAP is not a killer app, it'll just get let them eeek out a few more millions). The mobile phone companies will be back to pulling in the cash as soon as significant numbers of newer model phone requiring networks appear...until then they have a quiet time.
Re:Economics (Score:2)
Oh, good point! Personally, I'd never buy anything twice. When these "computer" things started becoming popular, I went out and bought an IBM Personal Computer XT. Eventually I decided I'd need a hard drive and a modem, so I bought a 10 meg hard drive and a 2400 baud modem. Of course, the hard drive only has 128k of non-damaged clusters now, and it makes a noise like a baby elephant screaming while riding a dirt bike down a wet road, but it's still enough to boot io.sys, msdos.sys, and command.com. Then I put in a floppy disk and run RIPterm and dial into a BBS, use their internet link, and run lynx.
Don't try to sell me a computer! I already have one!
Re:Waiting for 3G? (Score:2)
Re:Modern mobile phones have a pretty short lifeti (Score:2)
-legolas
i've looked at love from both sides now. from win and lose, and still somehow...
Embedded and virtual phones (Score:2)
Wireless datacom (using the celluar nets) is already starting to gain some momentum. There are a lot of applications for this sort of technology
...the vending machine that calls the distributor when it's running low on something...the parking garage that calls the warning sign on the edge of town when its full...the sensor in the basement of your apartment building that calls the manager when the furnace breaks down...
New standards will always sell some new handsets, but growth in the medium term seems destined to come from untapped, unsaturated markets.
Not that satisfying (Score:2)
Linux for Phone ?
I like this idea
I was actually thinking of FPCGAs in order to update the processors themselves.
For example, most phones contain an ARM [arm.com] processor.
Their is a patented technology which allow the use of an ARM as a soft modem's platform.
I was then thinking of the ability of rewriting the CPU's internal logics in real time in order to embed such features without the user even notices it.
We would then have an enormous potential here.
Imagine: an evolutive BeoWulf cluster of apparently-looking phones that would in fact allow any of the permanently connected users to share his unused bandwith with the other people whose phone would have the same technology. BTW, the processing (unlike bandwidth) power coul also be shared in order to help each other in case he has a tremendous amount of data to (un)encrypt, hence the BC
I know, it is not a good idea to mention a BeoWulf cluster in a Slashdot comment as it usually gets moderated down but I think this is not off-topic here.
Concerning the hefty discount you mention, I still think it is viable to just give the phone away (along with its communication) and actually gain some money this way.
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Ideas (Score:2)
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How about providing customer service? (Score:3)
As far as the phone devices themselves are concerned did they even consider that I might not want to replace EVERY accessory if I buy a new phone? The power connectors are different, the headset plugs are different, the batteries are different - and these are from the same man'f'tr.
They will sell more phones when more people can use and afford the service plans.
Re:Maybe the rest don't always want to be found.. (Score:3)
This used to be my argument for not owning a cell phone. Well, now that I've had one for a few years, I know that it can be turned off or set to silent mode - and I do this. If I don't want to be reached, I won't be reached.
Technology should enable you to do things. If it forces you to a faster, less managable pace of life, then it's not working for you but against you. You said you got a call at 2am in the middle of the forest while camping.. Then you said "I don't want that.". Well, leave the phone at home, or turn it off. Hell, with any decent phone, you can set profiles to only let through certain numbers so that you can be reached by your friends but not by work if you want.
They can thank the wireless providers... (Score:3)
Wireless penetration in other countries is larger than in the U.S. The price per minute in the U.S. is still around 25/cents/minute unless you buy a very large bulk of minutes each month in advance and use or lose them. I've heard in Israel, for example, airtime is around a U.S. penny a minute.
It's also difficult for existing customers to upgrade their phones without paying through the nose. The carriers should realize the old model of trying to give away the phone to get customers doesn't work unless you are trying to jump start a market. It's already there. Lower your air rates across the board and charge a higher fee for the phone itself.
I mean, just try going into a cell store and tell them you want to buy a phone without activation and see what kind of looks you get...
Divergent markets could be more of a problem (Score:3)
One of the biggest challenges facing the mobile phone operators is the continued non-adoption of global standards in the States. From one hand this means the States is the world's wireless backwater, but from the other the most valuable single market is too important to miss.
If the States creates its own standards yet again then this will increase development costs for the phone manufacturers.
However as it is estimated at 2 years at least before the States get a sniff at 3G it could be that the rest of the world will be too far ahead.
They should thank the networks as well... (Score:3)
Most people don't realize the real costs of a cellular phone. I started out with a Nokia 2110i myself and after 3 years I wanted something more so I bought myself an Ericsson SH888 which I still own (mainly due to its irda & modem facilities) and I don't see myself changing phones very soon. I have all the access I need with my Psion series 5mx. I can easily send/receive SMS, email, fax. I can browse the Inet and all of that without any hassle like cables etc. What else would you need?
And then there is allways WAP. IMVHO a pathetic way to try and sell even more phones which I'm pretty sure will fail alltogether. The whole Gopher concept seems to have failed horribly on the (cheap) Internet, do you really think that it will re-live on another (expensive) medium? I don't think so...
If they really want to innovate they should move on IMHO. A lot of people start complaining about radiation emitting from phones so pick up the oppertunity and go on. Like you could see at the last CeBIT; sattelite phones with the size of an old(er) cellular. Who needs GSM antenna's when you can directly use a sattelite (which could send to some relaystation which could spreaden the signal using another frequency band)? If you want to make more money on phones I personally believe thats where to get it. Offcourse it needs investment (I don't keep up with the developments but I doubt that these products are 'consumer ready') but thats the case for everything nowadays.
Microsoft can lead the way (Score:3)
In the future we can expect such wonderful features as:
1) A method to locate your position. Ostensibly for 911 services, phone companies will soon realize that they can make money by selling the service of blipping adverts from companies in your vicinity. Some bright soul will come up with the idea of having a signal emitted, say, your grocery when you're near. The grocery will then grep its records (Based on that discount card you have,) realize that milk you bought two weeks ago must be pretty rank, and pop up an ad on your phone reminding you that now would be a great time to get some new. No doubt they'll take a patent out on this idea, despite its obviousness. I'd consider this a great project for a high school programming class.
Radio Shak is already well positioned to do this (With batteries, not milk) since they already know your name, address and phone number as well as what you bought and when.
Of course, other people might also want to know your positions and movements. That suspicious spouse, stalkers and law enforcement will all benefit from this service. Remember: Deploying 911 hardware: $1.5 billion. Average cell phone: $45. Fingering the "Real Killers" from their cell phone locality records: Priceless.
2) Bluetooth: Now your cell phone can be 0wn3d, too. PDAs and other small devices don't have a lot of room, and the last thing the designers ever worry about is security.
Re:Well, for a start.. (Score:3)
Want a Nokia 7110 on One2One, but have an Erikson? No problem, pop the SIM out, and stick it in the 7110. Same network, same number, diferent phone.
If the US would/had settled on a single network standard, instead of the (Three?) systems they currently have, You Too could experience the benifits of such a system. As it is now, you sound pretty screwed.
Maybe the rest don't always want to be found.. (Score:3)
I am a computer geek, check my email every 3 minutes, cary a palm, etc. but I like to "disapear" sometimes..
Last week, my friend got a call at 2am in the middle of the forest while camping, one of his companies servers needed rebooted and the tech didn't know the command!! I don't want that..
Am i the only one who is offended by the idea of new mobile phones with GPS and blue-tooth in them being able to send you digital cupons as you walk by the store?
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If God Droppd Acid, Would he see People???
Thrift stores (Score:3)
Hell, I was even given one AMPS analog (a really lightweight Motorola) and one PCS digital phone from my mom and stepdad because they hadn't liked the plans with which they got the phones, or something like that.
So does anyone know how easy it is to re-use such phones? (in
A few solutions (Score:3)
1) feature boom: Introduce more & more features, so everyone will want the latest model (what? they already do that?)
2) baby babble phone: Lower the difficulty of usage, so that even babies can start using them (now there's an unexploited market)
3) Lower the quality: Let them automagically break down after 'warranty period + 1 day' (what, they already do that?)
How to make a sig
without having an idea
Re:Waiting for 3G? (Score:3)
Exactly! And what is this crazy stuff I keep hearing about "e-mail"? Why would I ever want to use clumsy $2000 computer to send messages to people when I can fax, write or call them? And these "automobiles"...for godsakes, can't people just walk or ride a horse?!
No matter what the invention, a lot of people will initialy think its useless, but maybe it isn't. Time will tell.
Unholy Trinity (Score:4)
Sometimes I amaze even myself.
.02
My
Quux26
Well, for a start.. (Score:4)
With those tiny smart-cards, it's trivial for anyone to trade in old cell phones for new ones, and it breaks the current phone companies monopoly, since currently there's a pretty darn high barrier of entry to switch phone providers (you have to get a new phone if you want to switch from ATT to Verizon).
For $30 US a month, you can get 2000 minutes in Hong Kong. Cheaper service means more customers, which means a larger market for cell phones.
it's only an image thing (Score:4)
I wish I could remember where, but I heard somewhere that in some places like Japan (I think), people get a new phone every 6 months for no other reason except to have the latest phone.
Maybe the bulk of new cellular technology markets are just going to stay in the regions of the world where image is so important in that way. To be honest I hope that never happens here. I hate mobile phones enough without them draining my bank account even more so I can look trendy in front of potential employers (who incidently can go to hell if they judge me on my phone. :)
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you've got to be kidding (Score:5)
When there is a device that allows you to talk to your friend, wirelessly, and see your friend in clear, sharp color picture, who will want an old crappy GSM phone anymore? When the phone transfers 10Mbps data and is online 24/7, who is going to use modems, ADSL or cable modems or even ethernet anymore? When the phone is small enough to embed into a shirt button, who will carry around the now-considered-small zippo sized phones? The only obstacle is price, and that too is dropping fast. I happily use my GSM phone to connect my Palm Pilot to the net to read and write email, check news, weather, sport scores and stock prices.
There is also a long way to go for software and services - ideas.. What if the phone knew where you are so it could tell you that, around the corner, your friend is sitting in a cafe? What if the phone could tell you that there is traffic ahead so you should get of the freeway or you will be stuck in the jam for 45 minutes? What if you could do your banking using the phone and order tickets? What if the phone had a Java virtual machine and a TCP/IP stack? All this already exists but isn't well integrated or conveniently usable yet (too expensive, too bulky, too slow etc.).
Quite soon we see that "phone" is not relevant anymore. We're talking about a whole new generation of information devices. You don't have to be Einstein to see that this is what - at least Nokia - i shooting for. Just look at their 3G pages, "media screens" etc.. Sun is talking about information appliances, Nokia has cooperation with Palm and Psion..
With low-power processors like the Crusoe, small computers like PDA's and phones will be used for *much* more in the not-so-distant future.. To say that "we're running out of features" is absurd.