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It's funny. Laugh. Technology

PHBs Getting "Secret" IT Training 516

Posted by CmdrTaco from the get-your-funny-on dept.
An anonymous reader writes "As if all of us aren't already already aware of this, PHBs don't know jack squat about computer technology, and they won't seek any training from their own IT staff because that would be an admission of "weakness" so instead they are getting outsiders to train them in secret." Lucrative work for the secret tutors I s'pose. I guess getting tutored in secret is better than just floundering in ignorance.
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PHBs Getting "Secret" IT Training More

PHBs Getting "Secret" IT Training

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  • That's nothing (Score:3, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:42PM (#7202442)
    I know of a systems admin doing the same! - posted anonymously to protect the guilty.

  • As if (Score:3, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:42PM (#7202443)
    Floundering in ignorance isn't something that happens at /. every day.
    • I guess getting tutored in secret is better than just floundering in ignorance.

      This, of course, comes as no big surprise to me. I have been working with the stupid and ignorant for the last two years, and have seen this exact thing happen.

      But the problem with the 'secret tutor' is bigger than just simple ignorance. One issue is that, most often, the person doesnt even have the prerequisite knowledge to be learning what they are being tutored on in the first place. What their main 'learning' ends up

  • Maybe I'll have my friends pitch my boss. God knows he needs it. He calls DLLs DSL, keeps asking when our co-located server is coming in, and cannot figure out that the latest greatest thing may not actually fit our goals and objectives.

  • The problem is.... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by insertionPoint ( 715729 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:43PM (#7202455)
    I have seen the people that they hire when not in secret. Seriously, I had a guy in two weeks back to train me on my new I-series server. I helped him set it up then showed him how to connect to the internet, then I skipped the training in disgust.

  • Is that one of those old XT portables?

    • I'm not sure of the PC model, but it sure looks like she's wiping off the ink he's just scrawled all over the screen.

      First lesson: "When I say 'write an email' I don't mean it literally. Put down the pen. Put it down. DROP THE PEN!"

      Second lesson: "If you're taking secret computer lessons so your staff don't find out you're a moron, don't appear in an article about it."

      Third lesson: ????

      Fourth lesson: Profit!

      I'm so very sorry.

      Mark

  • This is prime PHB material, but... (Score:5, Funny)

    by stefanb ( 21140 ) * on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:43PM (#7202463) Homepage
    "Really? I'm not the only one who doesn't know what the two mouse buttons are for?"
    There is a reason Apple's sticking to mice with one button. And this is not ment in any condescending way.

    • There is a reason Apple's sticking to mice with one button. And this is not ment in any condescending way.

      Of course they could give two buttons and just default to having them do the same thing via software... It would let those of us with a clue work efficiently and keep it simple for those who can't handle it.

      The one button thing is a triumph of dogma over common sense.
      • You do know that the software happily handles mice with a kajillion buttons, they just ship with a single button mouse.

      • Re:Apple mice (Score:5, Funny)

        by ceejayoz ( 567949 ) <cj@ceejayoz.com> on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:53PM (#7203041) Homepage Journal
        Of course they could give two buttons and just default to having them do the same thing via software

        <PHB> Which one do I press?
        <SecretTutor> It doesn't matter.
        <PHB> What do you mean it doesn't matter?! There are two buttons! Why are there two buttons if it doesn't matter?!
        * PHB throws mouse out the window
        *** SecretTutor was kicked by PHB (fired)
    • And this is not ment in any condescending way.

      Ahh, sarcasm. You left out the bit about spellcheck being on by default, though.

    • "There is a reason Apple's sticking to mice with one button."

      They're promoting RSI?

    • Re:This is prime PHB material, but... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by stonecypher ( 118140 ) <stonecypher&gmail,com> on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:25PM (#7202828) Homepage Journal
      Well, maybe if the tutorials out there spent less time being condescending and more time actively presenting the real paradigms instead of flimsy confusing stuff, it wouldn't be a problem.

      "What's the right mouse button for?"

      wrong: "it's a context-sensitive menu enabling access to control commands"

      wrong: "it's like a scrapbook in which your least used situational commands are gathered and presented for your use"

      right: "it's where your less common controls go. there're even rarer ones in the big menus. it works on pretty much everything. just try it out a lot; as long as you don't pick any menu items, nothing's gonna change, and you won't hurt anything."

      1) Give them a simple straightforward explanation of what it does without jargon or metaphor

      2) Encourage them to familiarize themselves with the control, being careful to note when such experimentation is inappropriate, even when it's never inappropriate

      Not so hard. Out of curiosity, I sat through a biug chunk of the tutorial shipped with my new commodity PC; there were some things I didn't understand, and I wrote software for a living.

      Perhaps hire fewer multimedia visionaries and more teachers next time you guys write intros. :D

      • Re:This is prime PHB material, but... (Score:4, Insightful)

        by stefanb ( 21140 ) * on Monday October 13, 2003 @06:33PM (#7203309) Homepage
        Ugh, seems I've hit a button here :-)

        Don't get me wrong, the first thing I do when getting a new Mac is to get a mouse with a scroll wheel for it, and that usually involves a right-hand button as well.

        The important bit for be is that I can see the difference in almost all Mac apps, I get the most "useful" commands, as opposed to Windows apps where more often than not I get commands on the context menu that are not available anywhere else.

        For a long time, on Macs, you had all kinds of "accelerators", but they were only that: you did not need to memorize obtuse key combinations (different for each app, of course), but you could run most of them with just the mouse (except for text entry). This is completely opposite to my experience with Windows software, where many times, you can activate a function or feature only through a context menu or some key stroke combination.

        Otherwise, I completly agree: making often used functions more readily accessible for the power user is a good thing, and you can use the right.hand-button on your mouse just like that in Mac OS X.

        Oh, and one last thing: "experimentation unless it's 'inappropriate'." Although there's quite a few occasions where there's no undo, Apple's Human Interface Guidelines require (or at least strongly suggest) undo features at all possible levels, so as long it's undoable, it should be OK.

        • Ugh, seems I've hit a button here :-)

          You certainly have. I find nothing more frustrating than MS' seeming inability to get their shit together and write a tutorial that doesn't assume that the user is experienced or stupid. It seems MS doesn't see them as seperable concerns.

          "This is a mouse. If you can't hook your printer up, you've obviously missed the last 20 years of pop culture. Even Scotty from Star Trek figured this out when it was 400 years obsolete, so you must be a putz. First, put your han
    • But Apple has *not* stuck to the one-button mouse! The rest of the things that the second button is used for on multi-button mouse systems have just shifted to mouse/keyboard combinations. (So instead of being able to use one hand in most circumstances, you have to use two on a Mac.)

  • Bear with me please. (Score:3, Informative)

    by Phosphor3k ( 542747 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:44PM (#7202468)
    Could someone please explain to this lowely Helpdesk Technician what the hell a PHB is?

  • Igorance is better. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:44PM (#7202469)
    I guess getting tutored in secret is better than just floundering in ignorance.

    No. Floundering in ignorance is much less destructive than "a little knowledge". A completely ignorant PHB says "make me a system that counts sheep". A PHB with a little knowledge says "make me a system that counts sheep, and it should use an ACID-compliant database and J2EE, and I think XP will be the way to go..."

    • As an IT Director... (Score:3, Insightful)

      by mrscott ( 548097 )
      I don't want my boss to be totally uninformed. I don't like working in a vacuum and I don't ALWAYS have the best solution. At times, believe it or not, my boss has some good ideas even though he's not as technically astute as I am in a lot of areas. Sometimes, being a little further removed from the problem can present a great solution.

  • Obligatory Dilbert quote.. (Score:3, Funny)

    by TheFairElf ( 669537 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:44PM (#7202473)
    Dilbert: "You have to hold the notebook upside down and shake it to reboot, remember?"
    PHB: "Oh right, thanks"
    • "Oh, wow, this is one of those new pagers that clip onto your ear!"

      hehehe
    • That's not a computer, it's the cardboard model that came with your desk.

    • Re:Obligatory Dilbert quote.. (Score:5, Funny)

      by NanoGator ( 522640 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:15PM (#7202766) Homepage Journal
      "Dilbert: "You have to hold the notebook upside down and shake it to reboot, remember?"
      PHB: "Oh right, thanks"

      And the obligatory FedEx follup:


      Woman: Hi, Tom, I know its your first day, but we could really use your help.

      Tom: (with slightly smug smile, pulling on suit jacket) You got it.

      Woman: (walking) We're just in a bit of a jam.

      Tom: (squirts breath spray)

      Woman: (continues, gesturing to roomful of FedEx boxes) All this has to get out today...

      Tom: (look of astonishment, smug smile returning) Yeah...uh...I dont do shipping...

      Woman: Oh, no no no, its very easy. We use FedEx.com (sitting him down at a computer open to the FedEx.com website). Anybody can do it.

      Tom: (smug smile wider, he cant believe shes asking him to do this) Uh... no... you dont understand: I have an MBA.

      Woman: Oh, you have an MBA...

      Tom: Yeah.

      Woman: In that case Ill have to show you how to do it.



  • I am SO pleased to know that ... (Score:4, Funny)

    by burgburgburg ( 574866 ) <splisken06&email,com> on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:44PM (#7202474)
    the top executives who control the direction of our corporate overlords are acquiring the same level of knowledge of a high school dropout intern whose main responsibility is sorting the mail (but can't really be trusted to deliver it).

    I feel safer now.

    • On a more serious note, it _is_ scary to think that these are the people who are handling some of the most important stuff in the corporate world.

      And this newly-gained half knowledge only makes it worse. Now from being executives who did not know a thing, they would be executives who pretend to know everything.

      Remember, partial knowledge is a terrible thing, indeed.
      • Actually, what would be scary is if introverted computer nerds were handing the most important stuff in the corporate world.

        Remember, we already tried the dot.bomb adventure.

        Now, go change the toner cartridge on the laserjet on second floor like a good, geek, kay?

  • What's a PHB? It's not in FOLDOC. Is it a US term?
    • Duh, after submitting this post someone mentioned Dilbert. Never mind ... move along ...

    • Re:PHB? (Score:2)

      by pbur ( 88030 )
      From Dilbert:

      Pointy Haired Boss
    • If you feel lucky, it takes you right to the source [dilbert.com]...

      Mark

      PS yes, I know the link doesn't actually have the definition of PHB, nor the acronym itself; but that's the sort of response you should give your PHB - exactly correct, yet useless; and preferably inciting a feeling of stupidity for asking you even once, and a dread of admitting they don't understand the answer.

      PPS The above rambling run-on sentence included for any PHBs who clicked the link, in order to make them feel at home.

      PPPS More PS than a
  • I remeber a nice time when at SGI (when they did do graphics) a senior manager asked the head of the support center what GFX was. He didn't quite understand when everyone laughed when he said storage. Well it was funny at the time

    Rus
  • 100 bucks an hour for top-notch training. I'm MCSE-certified, that's worth its wait in roasted peanuts.

    "Ooh, you wanted training on *Windows*? you didn't want to learn Lunix and you don't care about recompiling a kernel? You should have said so when we signed the contract Sir. I'll give you a rebate for the next 100 hours of Windows training ..."

  • no suprise (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Jonathunder ( 105885 ) * on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:47PM (#7202513) Homepage
    "YOU'D BE SURPRISED by what they don't know" says the trainer.

    No one who has ever worked help desk would be.

  • I hate this kind of article (Score:3, Interesting)

    by ManoMarks ( 574691 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:47PM (#7202518) Journal
    Based primarily on the experience of one tutor, they imply that there is this vast underground of executives secretly trying to figure out their e-mail. Facts, people, I want facts! Show me more than one over-priced tutor, or even 10. Anonymous surveys, large industries, etc. That would be real news. Not some journalist interviewing someone they met at a party and calling it news. ++

  • Trained PHB's != Good (Score:5, Funny)

    by greygent ( 523713 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:48PM (#7202526) Homepage
    I guess getting tutored in secret is better than just floundering in ignorance.

    I take it you haven't had the "pleasure" of your PHB embarrassing you by yelling "I know it's your T1 because our network guy teleported into the Baywatch hub and checked it!" at a Qwest network admin during a heated conference call.

    For the PHB's here: It's 'telnet' and 'Bay Networks'.
  • What does it mean when your supervisor openly admits he has no clue what you do for 40 hours a week? I figure it's good job security for me... i think.

    In secret though? craziness! My employer is too cheap to give me any training, so I doubt anyone else is either.

    Best training I've ever done? An O'Reilly book... ANY O'Reilly book.

    cheers-

  • Uh, are you sure that's the reason? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Tom7 ( 102298 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:51PM (#7202563) Homepage Journal
    Perhaps another reason "PHBs" might be heading to other sources than the IT staff is because the IT staff treats them with such contempt?

    • MOD PARENT AS HIGH AS HUMANLY POSSIBLE (Score:5, Insightful)

      by mrscott ( 548097 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:00PM (#7202635)
      God yes - you hit the nail on the head. When reading some of the posts on Slashdot, I wonder how some of these people can hold a job given their holier-than-thou genius-of-all-tech attitudes.

      Get over yourselves. An informed boss can make better decisions and work easier. And, if you can help them in a way that doesn't involve humiliating them, maybe it will come back and reward you.

      • Re:MOD PARENT AS HIGH AS HUMANLY POSSIBLE (Score:4, Insightful)

        by metlin ( 258108 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:17PM (#7202782) Journal
        Mark this as troll, if you will, but what you're saying is crap.

        Yeah, I have no social skills. I'm what you would call a dork or a nerd. But thats ok, because am not here to be please everybody.

        As far as the holier than thou attitude, yeah, so what? I'm choosy about the people I like and if I'm condescending its because a lot of people who're above me are there not because they're better than me but because they have the "Oh so called Social Skills."

        I don't see the point -- as long as I do my job and get my stuff done, whats the point and the problem?

        All that most "informed bosses" can do is kiss everyone's ass and pretend to know everything. And serve everything as sugar coated lies to the clients and investors.

        I would much rather not pretend to empathize with such people.

        And it is just this reason that I would prefer to be in an academic or research environment. Atleast its mostly free of this hypocritic attitude.
        • I don't see the point -- as long as I do my job and get my stuff done, whats the point and the problem?

          You'll be at the same job doing the same stuff your entire "career", be the first to be outsourced or replaced with an automated tool, etc..

          Lets say tomorrow your job is eliminated, and the boss can keep one person on in another position. His choice boils down to you, or someone he likes and works well with.

          Don't kid yourself, your magical tech skills are nothing. Anyone can do what you do, it's ho
        • As far as the holier than thou attitude, yeah, so what? I'm choosy about the people I like and if I'm condescending its because a lot of people who're above me are there not because they're better than me but because they have the "Oh so called Social Skills."

          I don't see the point -- as long as I do my job and get my stuff done, whats the point and the problem?

          All that most "informed bosses" can do is kiss everyone's ass and pretend to know everything. And serve everything as sugar coated lies to the clie
          • If they're above you, try finding
            out why, and get the skills you need to get to that level.
            ... and some knee pads.

          • If they're above you, try finding out why, and get the skills you need to get to that level.

            This assumes that one is inside a rationally run organization, in which people obtain their position for some reason that makes some vague kind of sense, or at the very least is not massively unfair. I would conclude from the level of rage in the grandparent post that the poster is not in such an organization. I would go further and state that the rationally run organization is an exceedingly rare beast.

            True, I wo

        • If your antisocial attitude affects the organization to a point where your boss feels like he needs to go elsewhere to ask reasonable questions then it's a problem. If your boss has someone else in the organization that is happy to help then great!

          The people above you may not be "better" then you technically, but they may be more capable in areas where it counts with clients and investors.

          I've seen some VERY good, but socially inept and arrogant techs get laid off in the last couple of years while thos
        • I don't see the point -- as long as I do my job and get my stuff done, whats the point and the problem?

          Because the rest of us can't fucking stand working with you. Contemptuous IT people act as if their five years of experience in a limited domain somehow makes them better than people with 30, 40, 50 years' experience in alternate domains.

          Frankly, I don't care if you're the nobel laureate that single-handedly ironed out our disputes with martians over trade rights while solving world hunger with three n
        • >As far as the holier than thou attitude, yeah, so what?

          Oh, the irony.

          >I don't see the point -- as long as I do my job and get my stuff done, whats the point and the problem?

          Its because you will be doing the exact same stuff day after day, until the company finds you not so useful (pick your reason).

          I had two friends who are unemployeed and they had the same attitude, "I'm the smartest one there and I am key to their main product." and "My boss has no idea what is going on, the customer always com
        • You seem to be rather young and without a great deal of work experience, but with a great deal of (maybe justified) ego.

          I was like you once. Then, I happened to marry a wonderful woman, a successful entrepreneur who had saved her money until she could start her own business, then struck out on her own. She was quite succesful, and not just because of the high quality of her products, which she designed herself and made in-house. She was that successful because she has great people skills and could teac

        • His point, while put in a rather sneering, ranting tone, is well-taken. It is a fact that most PHBs don't get there because of merit. They get there because they went to the right prep school, Daddy knew the right people, their frat brothers (whom they used to drink a fifth a weekend with) helped them, etc. Also, there is some credence to the notion that B-schoolers don't know their ass from a hole in the ground. [uic.edu] As a former one myself [wsu.edu] (before I saw the light,) I can tell you that they have as many clas

        • Yeah, I have no social skills. I'm what you would call a dork or a nerd. But thats ok, because am not here to be please everybody.

          You don't have to please everybody - but you will find that your life goes a great deal easier if the people around you like you.

          If you recognize the fact that you have no social skills, then, if you are technically minded as you say - why don't you point some of your intellect towards social skills? I used to be in the same situation - a geek in highschool (and still today) I

        • Yet another software cowboy (Score:5, Insightful)

          by TRACK-YOUR-POSITION ( 553878 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @09:10PM (#7204573)
          Yeah, I have no social skills. I'm what you would call a dork or a nerd. But thats ok, because am not here to be please everybody.

          That would have worked a few years ago, when computers were still a bold new frontier. Think about the Old West--at first rugged individualist cowboys and adventurers are rewarded, because the place was so empty that ability to deal with nature was more important than ability to deal with your neighbor. In fact, people probably went out west because they couldn't stand their neighbors back east.

          Think about how much of America was built by people who couldn't stand their old neighbors. Even the native americans must have really hated China at some point.

          Then, as things began to get crowded, the same sort of business men and politicians from back east began to rise above everyone else, and the cowboy lifestyle began to decline.

          It's the same with computers--first it was dominated by nerds like you (and possibly me...) who were really good with machines. But as there got to be more and more of us, and as the machines got more and more reliable, then yet another frontier starts to close, and making people happy once again becomes more important than making machines go.

          Now, the mature thing for folk like us to do is to either find a new frontier, or accept the world as it is, and try to improve our social skills as best we can.

          Yet before I do that, I'd like to take a moment to shed a tear for the death of yet another frontier, yet another chance to make the American dream a reality. The American Dream, by the way, is that one can improve one's own lot in life simply by doing a better job, through physical or intellectual effort, rather than by kissing the asses of whatever feudal lord happens to be dominating our lives at the moment. That individual worth could somehow beat out nepotism and favortism. A sweet, yet elusive dream

          And before I allow Stockholm syndrome to completely overwhelm me, I lament how much of humanities effort is wasted in the collective solipsism advocated by so many people who reply to you--the opinion that physical reality outside humanity is of less importance than social reality within humanity. A society which believes that itself is the most important thing in the universe will experieince very limited growth.

      • Imagine if the owner of a pro football team not only didn't know a thing about football, but refused to listen to the coach and players about football matters (which they are paid a lot of money to be experts in), and insisted on calling the plays himself and made the calls based on what he'd heard his son's coach yell out out on the sidelines of his junior league game.

        If such a thing were tried in the NFL, people would fall over themselves laughing. But it is precisely the situation many IT staff find the

        • The key difference there is the line of business. In the NFL, you damn well better have people that know what they're doing to make the right calls.

          The same is true for tech companies. I wouldn't expect too many executives at Microsoft or Cisco have trouble with technology. However, that's their line of business.

          Now, take Krispy Kreme. The executives there had better be able to make decisions regarding delivery, production, etc. Sure - they might rely on technology to get some of this done, but their
    • Perhaps another reason "PHBs" might be heading to other sources than the IT staff is because the IT staff treats them with such contempt?

      Or because if the IT staff keep buying hard-to-use equipment?

    • Nah, the good techs have learned how to hide their contempt of the masses after a few years. The ones that let it show don't last long. Replaced someone like that, very good at what he did, but drove the fucking user's nuts. That was how I got his job.

    • Perhaps another reason "PHBs" might be heading to other sources than the IT staff is because the IT staff treats them with such contempt?

      Or maybe they don't trust IT know what they're doing. When Sobig went around, my IT Director wanted me to disconnect our Macs from the network. I'm going to go to this guy for training?

      At first I thought that we needed a word for the IT version of a "PHB". Then I realized we already had "MCSE".

  • "Better to be a fool for a moment, than a fool for life." Hopefully, they'll learn it's ok to ask questions, and we will learn it's better to receive ignorance, and pay back in wisdon and intelligence.

    This excludes of course, people of hubris and people who make mistakes over and over without trying to improve.
  • Better an outside resource than someone on the boss's own IT staff anyway, I'd say.

    Using myself as an example, I'd be the last one I'd want teaching technology to someone else. I may be a sharp admin, but I'm a lousy teacher.

    Took me a while to realize that, but it's true.

    • Well, nothign wrong with answering simple questions, eh? You aren't teaching theory, you are pretty much teaching how to put the building blocks of knowledge into something useful.

      The power button isn't hard to teach. Shutting down any machine, isn't hard, and writing down how isn't hard either. If you can draw a diagram showing layout and write documentation on how to maintain things, I'm sure you can explain that you aren't a great teacher, but here is how you do X.

  • All Dilbert jokes aside, which would you rather have, a technologically-impaired boss who recognizes his/her shortcomings and works to remedy it, or one who doesn't care and just keeps faking it?

    Now what I'm curious about is how you'd figure out which of these consultants are the "good" ones, both in terms of being good at how the latest technology works and being able to explain it to the layperson. After all, when all your clients demand the level of secrecy described in the article, it's not like you

  • At least this is personalized instead of a one size fits all. I just barely mised SAP training one place that tried to get to this level of user. The only problem is it was comptuer based, so once you loged into your own computer and launched this program from the network, it would teach you how to use the mouse to start programs. This was mandatory, and you had to do each step, didn't matter if you always use alt-f4 to close windows, you still had to prove you could do it with the mouse, (hit the X, th

  • ass backwards. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by joe_bruin ( 266648 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @04:53PM (#7202585) Homepage Journal
    a good manager hires people that are knowledgeable in the field that they work. very likely, they will be more knowledgeable than the manager himself. the manager must then rely on input from these skilled people to make informed decisions. that is, if the boss doesn't know if A is better than B, he should ask the employees and find out.

    if the boss does not know anything, and is embarrassed to ask more knowledgeable employees, that boss should be fired. making decisions based on your secretly-aquired knowledge that may be incomplete, wrong, or totally inappropriate for the given situation, is probably the worst thing you can do.

    now, if the boss is an idiot, and the employees are idiots, well, you're probably going to be seeing some blood sucking consultants eating your company's money pretty soon.
  • Is it just me, or can anyone see a great opportunity for some extra profits with a properly-located hidden videocamera here? "Pay up, or we send this video of you trying to insert your business card in the CD-ROM drive - not to mention wandering into the server room and asking what the pretty lights do - to the board?"

    Note that you probably couldn't just e-mail the board the relevant clip, because the board would be just as clueless about technology...

    But then again, $750 a month for a couple of hours tr

  • It's nice someone is getting training, but what does PHB stand for?
  • It is getting to the point where these clue-less management types are just getting in the way of progress. With all the brainpower of the average slashdot reader (you in the back -- quiet!), someone must know some sure-fire methods of getting people fired. Especially fools with half the intelligence. Manipulating emails, erasing data under their login -- small potatoes, I know, but what does the ambitious geek do to get ahead in this businessperson's world?

    I mean, we can all wait 10-20 years for these peo

  • BOFH (Score:4, Funny)

    by wowbagger ( 69688 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:02PM (#7202651) Homepage Journal
    Am I the only one who sees Simon's fine hand in this matter?

    BOFH fodder, indeed....
    • Yeah. I can see his hand clutched around the tape eraser that he just used to knock-out the trainer. Having people who could see through his BS is not a good thing for his long-term employment. In fact, I kind of hope that Simon gets around to writing on the subject.

  • Secret is stupid (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Technically Inept ( 715181 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:03PM (#7202658) Homepage
    Shame at your own ignorance is the very thing that keeps illiterate people from getting help reading and guys from asking for directions. A smart company makes the education process completely transparent, which results in a greater willingness to attempt self-improvement.

    Consider GE, which instituted an internet mentoring program (Word doc) [duke.edu] for its top executives, including former CEO Jack Welch.

    What GE did need, however, was a system to train its top management in the wonders of the Internet. It didn't do much good to preach the values of e-business if the people making the big decisions in the corporation didn't know how to use the tool.

    To alter the situation, GE started a mentoring program for nearly 1,000 senior executives. Younger members of the GE staff, proficient in the ways of the new electronic world, were assigned to teach a senior executive how to use the Internet.

    You don't need a computer expert to teach computer basics, and the upside is that the lower level employees get executive mentorship, and the executive employees learn these tools while keeping connected to employees down the ladder. This, to me, is a much more sensible approach than seclusion, shame, and secrecy.

    • Re:Secret is stupid (Score:3, Informative)

      by swordgeek ( 112599 )
      As a GE employee, I can comment on this.

      The mentoring program worked. The execs learned stuff, got their green or black belt certifications, and got a raise. The underlings as usual got FUCK ALL for their efforts.

      GE is a model company in many ways, but treatment of their employees is absolutely NOT one of them.
  • "Yes dear? Why is there lipstick on my underwear? Well you see, I've been out getting secret training..." *THWACK* *SNIP*
  • "Okay boys, listen up. This is our new secret weapon. It's called Windows 2004. Anyone gives you lip, just install it on their computer, and watch the sparks fly"

  • This seems to be giving a lot of power to the instructors and companies giving the training. Imagine a scenario where the PHB of a critical web server cluster were to go to IT training, "Sponsored by Microsoft."

    Now that the PHB has had his secret training, he thinks he knows how everything works, and tries to start a mass migration because of what was fed to him during his training.

    This is slightly scary...

  • Some fat bitch gets paid $50 an hour to tech my boss how to point and click his mouse and check his email?! How do I get a job like that?!
  • My largish company has a tradition of important IT architectural decisions being made contrary to the advice of all the internal technical experts. I have often wondered how these non-technical managers could justify repeatedly making the worst possible technical decisions. This article is one such possibility but I suspect that more likely venal and ulterior motives are involved. I imagine my CIO thinking she's "in the know" when she gets "personal" emails from Bill telling her how bad linux is. Oh,
  • Don't PHBs instinctively click on all attachments?

  • slashdotters are equally clueless (Score:4, Flamebait)

    by puzzled ( 12525 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:14PM (#7202752) Journal


    I find it funny that a group that collectively has trouble with personal hygiene, getting a date, ever getting a second date, finding something to talk about besides computers, etc is down on high level executives.

    So they don't know computer applications. They know finance, marketing, operations, negotiating, and a host of other things that mostly don't have anything to do with computers, but do have a lot to do with ongoing success.

    One of the happiest, best paying environments I ever worked in had me reporting to a division controller responsible for operations accounting related to stores doing $200M in sales annually. She was almost helpless on all sorts of things computer related, but she could sign purchase orders faster than I could type and when HQ IS weenies got under foot her head would spin around, she'd spit nails, etc, etc, and they'd go back to guarding their silly little mainframe, while our mighty intranet continued to win the hearts & minds of the people in the field.

    Instead of poking fun at them, maybe you should study them - they *are* the ones with the money/power/cars with power windows that work - you might just learn something.

  • ok, now I *understand* some people might still live in a cave and think programming the VCR is black magick, but here's my thoughts on this.

    having worked under DIRECTORS OF IT that fit this profile, it leads me to ask the question. . . In a typical business model, shouldn't the boss not only know his employee's jobs, but be able to do them in most cases!? or atleast be savvy enough (i.e., we run Netware, yeah Netware XP) to hire a contractor. I'm not even going into the mcse stuff either (1 pci NIC + 1 dri

  • Reminds me.... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by MojoRilla ( 591502 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:21PM (#7202808)
    When I was fresh out of college in 1991, I interviewed at Anderson Consulting (now Accenture, I believe). They showed me the typing room where all the secretaries were typing things. I thought it was a little primative.

    When I talked to the partner, I asked where his computer was. He said that he had one sent up if he needed to do a presentation or something.

    I could tell he just didn't get it.

    Needless to say, I didn't get the job.

  • It's called "coaching"... (Score:4, Informative)

    by swb ( 14022 ) on Monday October 13, 2003 @05:26PM (#7202834)
    ...and is more common than you think in management.

    My boss told me that when he took his first CIO job (moving from an operations management job) that not only did his boss encourage and pay for an IT "coach" to give him a crash course in IT, he said it was pretty common for execs to use "coaches" for all kinds of things, including a fair amount of touchy-feely management subjects.

  • 'Secret Training' is nothing more than 'can you teach me this, while I fuck you?"
  • A lot of us techno weenies don't know jack about how to deal with some of the other realities of a company you know. There's a reason why in modern society you don't fix your own car, build your own house, grow your own food, etc. And there's a reason why in a modern company everyone doesn't know everything about each task, speciality, or knowledge collection that collectively defines a type of worker, a work group, division, etc.

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