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Software Linux

Two Ways To Use GPS With Linux 172

Posted by timothy from the not-the-only-ways dept.
An anonymous reader writes "Whether you're wardriving, vacationing or building a Car PC, a Global Positioning System is a handy tool. Interacting with your GPS via your PC makes for an even better GPS experience. As a Linux user, GPS/PC integration can be somewhat sketchy. Vendors don't write software and drivers for Linux; it's probably safe to assume that the good folks over at Garmin would say something along the lines of "Lih-what?". Have no fear! Using your GPS with Linux isn't impossible! Check out this review over at LinuxForumsDOTorg of two fairly robust GPS navigation programs for Linux."
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Two Ways To Use GPS With Linux

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  • Nice! this is what I've been looking for. Now let's figure out if it'll work with my belkin bluetooth gps.

    • Re:bluetooth gps (Score:4, Informative)

      by Technician ( 215283 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:35AM (#10501008)
      Um, Does your GPS output NMEA? Read the owners manual. If you read the article, then you would know both programs use NMEA from the GPS on a serial port.

      If your GPS provides it then Ok it should work, If it doesn't, then your milage may vary.

  • Not on my boat (Score:1, Interesting)

    by davesplace1 ( 729794 )
    No doubt in my mind that Linux is a good OS, but if I'm out on my boat in the fog I'm going to use the build in OS. GPS is very inportant out on the ocean. Now in my car or on my home pc I will be more than happy with GPS run by Linux.
    • When I was looking for a PDA and GPS, I chose the Garmin iQue over the Sharp Zaurus + compact flash GPS for this very reason. I don't use it on a boat (it's not even waterproof), but it is very important to me that my GPS work well.

    • Re:Not on my boat (Score:5, Informative)

      by Dancin_Santa ( 265275 ) <DancinSanta@gmail.com> on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:17AM (#10500936) Journal
      Linux is perhaps the most stable operating system currently on the market. In fact, in several studies that I've seen, Linux as an embedded system outperforms and crashes less often than dedicated software on traditional GPS systems.

      • Re:Not on my boat (Score:3, Insightful)

        by mirko ( 198274 )
        Yes, but if you were a corporation, you'd establish a failure ratio, then, regarding the guarantee that a dedicated system manufacturer would offer, you'd probably go for this one anyway.
        Why ?
        Imagine you are the owner of a supertanker fleet and they all use GPS to navigate.
        Now, if one of these sinks at Valdez of in Bretagne, you'd have a hard time explaining to a judge how responsible you were not if you went for a self hacked system.
        The same could apply for trekkers who could get lost because of a dysfunct

        • Re:Not on my boat (Score:4, Insightful)

          by HotshotXV ( 710849 ) <dhocking@gma[ ]com ['il.' in gap]> on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:31AM (#10500986) Homepage Journal
          Listen, I'm as big of a Linux fan as anyone, but trusting my coding (or even worse, someone else's) to work on my specific build out in the middle of a fog when it's failure means being hopelessly stranded... That's a pretty frightening thought. At least if something is released commercially and it fails like that, you can sue once (if?) you get back to shore.
          • Of course, this was supposed to be to Dancin_Santa...

          • Re:Not on my boat (Score:2, Insightful)

            by Anonymous Coward
            Ok, so it's back to what's most important - that it works, or that your family have somebody to sue when it doesn't.

            I'll take "works" over "sue" anytime. I don't care if my family have anyone to sue if I don't come back. What I care about is that I DO come back. So I'll take the system that has proven itself over years of using it on my home machine and work servers, over the one that $manufacturer claims works, but specific info is a trade secret.
      • Linux is perhaps the most stable operating system currently on the market.
        I didn't know that Linux is on the market. ;-)

      • Re:Not on my boat (Score:3, Insightful)

        by LWATCDR ( 28044 )
        "Linux as an embedded system outperforms and crashes less often than dedicated software on traditional GPS systems."
        What studies and what OSs? I would say that compared to Palm OS and WinCE you are probably correct. Compared to QNX or one of the FAA certified realtime control OSs probably not.
        Don't get me wrong Linux is a very stable OS and does well in many embedded environments but it is not the most stable OS on the planet. It is a great trade off between stability and flexibility.
        Would I trust it for

    • Re:Not on my boat (Score:5, Interesting)

      by aaza ( 635147 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:36AM (#10501010)
      Uhh, this review is not about hacking your GPS unit to run linux, but to talk to your GPS unit using a linux based program (two, actually: Roadmap and GPS Drive), most likely from a laptop (since a desktop will pretty much limit where your GPS can go).

      I would agree with not putting Linux on a GPS device, even if it was capable. Embedded systems are fairly hard to hack for a good reason: If you mess it up, it will be a serious problem.

    • The original article is not about installing Linux on the GPS device itself; it's about getting your Linux machine to talk to said device. I know you can't be expected to "RTFA," but at least read the summary...

    • Re:Not on my boat (Score:3, Insightful)

      by killpog ( 740063 )
      Yeah, and I carry a copy of Bowditch, a recent set of charts, an RB sight, and a sextant for when the fool thing breaks... and I know how to use these tools, too.

      • Re:Not on my boat (Score:2, Insightful)

        by Technician ( 215283 )
        and a sextant for when the fool thing breaks... and I know how to use these tools, too.

        I've spent some time on a boat. Umm how do you use a sextant in the fog? I didn't learn that fine point.

    • Re:Not on my boat (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Bagheera ( 71311 )
      The article talks about Linux mapping programs that take their feed from GPS via the standard NEMA protocol, not running Linux ON a GPS. (I didn't see any reference in the article to getting the GPS to talk to the Linux box. I'll guess standard Serial, vs USB)

      But your point is the same. You don't trust the external chartplotter as much as you trust the GPS device itself. Now, to be honest, in fog I'd rather have radar than GPS. While the GPS receiver can tell me where I am in relation to my marks and

  • GPS Drive (Score:5, Informative)

    by AnuradhaRatnaweera ( 757812 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:15AM (#10500924) Homepage
    I use gpsdrive [kraftvoll.at] without any driver issues. The real problem is the availability of maps.

    • Re:GPS Drive (Score:5, Interesting)

      by AnuradhaRatnaweera ( 757812 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:24AM (#10500958) Homepage
      There is a script that comes with GPSDrive which allows downloading maps from some web sites, but those maps are copyrighted by the respective vendors (one of whose name starts with an M ;-)), and the script clearly mentions that the legal liability is with the user who downloads the maps. For the same reason, they cannot be distributed.

    • Re:GPS Drive (Score:5, Informative)

      by Technician ( 215283 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @03:19AM (#10501136)
      The real problem is the availability of maps

      In the early days of computing, friends used to ask me buying advice for hardware.

      My answer has not changed in 20 years. Find the applications you need to run and find the best hardware to run it.

      It's great that Linux is getting support for GPS. That's fantastic and I'm excited. I have a Linux box.

      Taking my own advice, I have an old Win 95 laptop with limited memory (72 meg EDO max). It's my kick about GPS machine. I run National Geographic Back Roads Explorer (great program!) with the State series maps. It not only uses the NMEA information to real time display position, but supports my GPS protocol for waypoint, route and track management.

      I also run StreetFinder & TripMaker by Rand McNally. This gives me the best of both Raster and Vector maps. It includes route finding.

      Because I took my own advice, I have legal maps for the entire 50 states, has Magellan protocol support, and no downloading or compiling needed. (stuck on dial-up)

      The articles wish list included real time routing. In the feature list of the software includes everything in the wishlist.
      "NEWLY UPDATED FEATURES

      New GPS Navigation features!

      No more shuffling discs!

      StreetFinder® users can install the entire street network for the contiguous United States to their hard drive. This data-compression technique means fast directions and route generation to your desktop, laptop, or Palm OS® handheld device.

      Generate clear directions with Highlighted Route Lines
      A wealth of new navigation features for GPS* includes:
      Rotating Maps: upcoming turn instructions face the same direction you do

      One-Touch Rerouting: Miss a turn? StreetFinder® Deluxe gets you back on track.

      AutoZoom for Palm OS®: No need to manually pan for your next driving instruction.

      Voice Prompter: Advance notication of upcoming turns

      Not meant to troll, but wake me when Linux GPS map support is up to snuff. Expecialy wake me when both of the mentioned programs come out in a Linux version! Then I can ditch the obsolete OS on the laptop and use a modern OS.

      A wish list is nice. But I found these programs meet my GPS needs already. When Linux replacements are a reality, and I can ditch the last of my MS stuff, I'll be very interested.

      Linux apps need to be as functunal as the MS counterparts to comptete. I'm hoping for the day multiple versions of the mainstream software hit the shelves so I have a real choice.
      • Well I agree with your advice, and I have a windows 98 box at home so my girlfriend can run some programs she wants (Sims 2) - but I am a GNU/Linux user and I don't want to hassle with the interface of another OS for one app. I think its easier to settle for a slightly less powerful (but improving) Linux app, than to have to install Windows and deal with everything I am unfamiliar with it, and of course find annoying. I am even becoming bothered by the one Windows machine I have due to the increasing requ

    • Re:GPS Drive (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Lumpy ( 12016 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @06:33AM (#10501674) Homepage
      Also, GPS drive is NOT havigation. it can not tell you how to get from point A to point B, ESPICALLY from the bitmaps it uses for maps.

      It's a moving map display and is certianly not Navigation in any way shape or form. I have been down that road way too many times.

      the first project mentioned is the ONLY navigation app available for linux, everything else is simply something pretty to look at, or requires a massive amount of attention to use it for navigation.
      • The first project is also not a navigation product. You have to set waypoints/create features to get voice notification. gpsdrive can do the same thing. There are no freely available navigation systems for linux, period.

  • Garmin GPS over USB? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Alexey Nogin ( 10307 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:18AM (#10500938) Homepage
    I've recently gotten Garmin GPSMan 60CS as a gift and so far I was unable to get any Linux programs to talk to it (over the USB cable that came with it). Did anybody have any success with getting Linux talk to any Garmin GPS units over USB?

    • Re:Garmin GPS over USB? (Score:4, Interesting)

      by hype7 ( 239530 ) <u3295110.anu@edu@au> on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:28AM (#10500973) Journal
      sorry to crash the linux party, but also I'd be interested of any reports of it working with MacOS X as well.

      cheers

      -- james

      • Re:Garmin GPS over USB? (Score:4, Informative)

        by cei ( 107343 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:59AM (#10501088) Homepage Journal
        I've got my Garmin Vista talking to my OS X box via a Keyspan USB to serial cable and run the freeware GPS Connect [chimoosoft.com] and its shareware big brother Terrabrowser [chimoosoft.com] to upload and download waypoints.
        • Well, the compatibility list for GPS Connect states "GPS 60cs (serial only)", so it seems I will be out of luck with OS X as well...
          • Read his post - he's suggesting you use a USB-serial adapter. I've had success with these in the past.

          • Re:Garmin GPS over USB? (Score:3, Informative)

            by thogard ( 43403 )
            I've been talking to the OSx guys about this. It turns out that Garmin's idea of USB and the spec don't jive. For example when you ask for the 1st 4 bytes of the config descriptor, garmin USB devices give back more than 4 bytes that are all zeros.

            Its a shame too since the garmin GPS 18 USB is a slick little device. One other thing to consider with Garmin's USB GPSs is they don't look like a serial port. You would expect at least one of the USB channels to look and ack like a 9600 baud NMEA device so it

    • Re:Garmin GPS over USB? (Score:3, Interesting)

      by JanneM ( 7445 )
      Well, I use a Gramin Geko, though that one has a serial cable that I use over USB with a serial-to-USB converter. It works. See if you can access it over the ttyUSB device?

      • Well, I use a Gramin Geko, though that one has a serial cable that I use over USB
        The GPS side is the one that matters - it seems that Garmin GPS that I have provides a choice of protocols to use over the serial cable, but insists on using their proprietary protocol over the USB cable.

        • Re:Garmin GPS over USB? (Score:3, Informative)

          by neonstz ( 79215 ) *
          The GPS side is the one that matters - it seems that Garmin GPS that I have provides a choice of protocols to use over the serial cable, but insists on using their proprietary protocol over the USB cable.

          Well, they have at least made the protocol specs available [garmin.com].

          • Re:Garmin GPS over USB? (Score:4, Informative)

            by robertlipe ( 86631 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @11:07AM (#10503445) Homepage
            As the author of GPSBabel [gpsbabel.org] (and more to the point, the author of the Garmin USB module) I'd like to pop that bubble.

            Garmin has gone out of their way to not document the WIRE PROTOCOL of the USB units (60C, 76C, 96C, VistaC, Quest, 26xx, etc.) but to instead document the API into their underachieving Windows driver.

            An earlier version of the spec pretended to be a protocol spec. I contacted them with a number of discrepancies betweeen my observations on a protocol analyzer and that specification. Within a few weeks, a new version of the spec appeared that removed the pretense of being a protocol spec.

    • In the summer of 2000 I used a program called Garble to talk to my GPS (Garmin GPS II+), its Freshmeat page [freshmeat.net] looks like it hasn't been updated since almost that time. I vaguely remember talking to the author shortly after the summer and (s)he was too busy and was dropping the project (I could be wrong). This program worked perfectly with my GPS, but it read lat/long data from the serial port. I don't know how hard it would be to hack this program to use the USB port instead.

      I used Garble because back

    • I assume you mean th GPSMAP 60CS; I have the same model. I gave up on the USB cable and purchased the Serial/AC Adaptor combo. My main reason for this choice wasn't laziness, but the fact that the USB cable DOES NOT PROVIDE POWER to the unit. The serial cable, on the other hand, does. Weird choice on Garmin's part, I think.
    • try it with gpstrans (set interface protocol to Garmin/Garmin) or in NMEA mode with gpsd.

      If it doesn't work with gpsd, email the mailing list and it'll probably be sorted in a day or two. they are pretty on to it.

      http://gpstrans.sourceforge.net/
      http://gpsd.be rlios.de/

      • As far as I can tell, both presuppose that you have already managed to convince your OS to present GPS to the software as a /dev/xyz that acts like a serial device. The problem is exactly that the Garmin GPS is not willing to talk serial-over-USB, they expect some proprietary way of talking over USB.

  • Text of the article (Score:2, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward
    GPS Review
    Posted by jeremy1701 at Wed Sep 22, 2004 12:23 pm

    Review of Two GPS Navigation Programs in Linux

    GPS's, or global positioning systems, are becoming more and more popular every day. With awesome standard features, increased map detail and dropping prices, it's no wonder why. Add to that the the growing popularity of treasure hunting games like geocaching and it's easy to understand the popularity of this little gadget.

    There are several programs available for Linux that will interact with just abou

  • Software? Drivers? PROTOCOLS! (Score:5, Informative)

    by MavEtJu ( 241979 ) <[gro.ujtevam] [ta] [todhsals]> on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:22AM (#10500951) Homepage
    Vendors don't write software and drivers for Linux

    Who cares about software and drivers. Open protocols and open standards, that's what we need!

    • Open protocols and open standards, that's what we need!

      And this is what we got. NMEA should be supported by nearly all receivers. It defines how gps data should be transmitted via a serial link. Even most USB units only use a USB2Serial chip, so they just appear as new serial ports.

  • I believe the success of GPS has always been the fact that it can reliably give you your position at any point in time. To achieve this, the battery _HAS_ to last long enough.
    I'm all for linux, but when it comes to GPS I have always been sceptical.
    At work, we are developing a device for the police department. It's a portable device based on the ARMVI CPU that runs WindowsCE; the OS does quite a good job. The question is, I guess, can the linux software live up to those needs?
    When in its active state, GPS

  • This is news?? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Wapiti-eater ( 759089 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:29AM (#10500982)
    Us ham types've been doing GPS navigatin not only of our own vehicles, but others as well for over 12 years now! I use a package called 'Xastir' [xastir.org] and an on the air protocol called APRS [aprs.org].

    Basicly, take a GPS receiver and a laptop (Not just linux, xastir will run on Windows too), a TNC and a VHF radio - use pretty much any map you'd care to use (local or online), current weather information, satallite imagry, NWS alerts, warnings, etc, etc, etc... See your track - find your way, see forest fires, floods, tornadoes, hurricanes....
    The only limit is imagination

    Just wanna check on someone? Use your web browser and visit Findu [findu.com] - plug in their callsign and see where they're at.

    And no, you don't need a ham license to play along. Just to feed data into the world wide Information System.

    Kinda neat to zoom in on 'the old country' and watch my firends in the UK on thier way to work as I'm get'n ready to call it a day, then keyboard to keyboard messaging with 'em along the way.....
    And no air time fees
    • OH, yea - and an AMAZINGLY broad platform base..

      From: Xastir Features List [eskimo.com]

      TWENTY-ONE+ SUPPORTED OPERATING SYSTEMS/VARIANTS
      1) FreeBSD
      2) Mac OS X
      3) Linux: Caldera, Debian, Lindows, Mandrake, RedHat, Slackware, SuSE...
      4) Solaris: 2.5, 2.6, 7.0, 8.0
      5) Windows + Cygwin: Win95, Win95b, Win98, Win98se, WinME, WinNT4, Win2000, WinXP.

      Then there's the seven languages and over 124 map formats....

    • Don't forget UI-View (Score:3, Interesting)

      by ivi ( 126837 )
      Another Amateur Radio moving-map tool - this one
      capable of displaying -multiple- moving GPS-
      carrying symbols across the screen (not just one, that represents yours) is UI-View

      Great for tracking various emergency service vehicles at an incident.

      It's from the UK... A cost-free 16-bit demo is
      available, bur it's maybe 10 UK Pounds for 32-bit
      Windows (only!) version.
      • Uh, not to start a tiff, but yea - xastir tracks multiple targets/objects too. I show over 12K in my list at the minute.

        UI-VIEW is the most popular Windows based client - so far...

        UI-VIEW has a great user base. Considering it's author recently passed away, very good support from the user community. The registration scheme for the 32 bit version has been changed since Roger's passing on. See UI-VIEW Homepage [ui-view.com] for more info on UI-VIEW, see This site [myby.co.uk] for current info on how to register for full function.

  • Standards rock. (Score:4, Informative)

    by wertarbyte ( 811674 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:31AM (#10500988) Homepage
    Most GPS receivers will deliver their signals in NMEA format, which is an accepted standard. Most of the USB units even only contain a pl2303 chip or another form of USB2Serial driver and work just fine. I bought mine on eBay, just plugged it in, and hotplug did most of the work. It appeared as a new USB serial port, so I could gpsdrive without any problems.

  • Pharos GPS-360 (Score:5, Informative)

    by KidHash ( 766864 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:33AM (#10500992) Homepage
    Slightly related, someone recently posted to the Full Disclosure mailing list, with a guide [neohapsis.com] for how to get the Pharos GPS-360 (as sold in the "Microsoft Streets & Trips 2005 with GPS locator" package) working under linux. Might be useful to some people

  • Any cheap bare-bone GPS chips available? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by intelligent poster ( 599525 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:40AM (#10501028)
    I am a starving student and all these GPS receivers seem out of reach (even the cheapest seems to be over 150$). Is it tough to build one on your own? Anyone with relevant experience? Any pointers would be appreciated.
    • are you looking for a full soft/hard package? I have definitely seen some affordable chips... I think it may take some finagling, but I think with enough intelligent guidance (maybe you can get a Prof of yours to get together a grant, maybe a Grad Student), and some perseverance, maybe a librarians whits, you'll come out ahead...
    • You might look at getting a Palm Streetfinder GPS off of ebay. You can get them real cheap. It is easy to addon on a serial port cable to the GPS then you can hook it straight into your PC. Here is a url on how to do that: http://www.chadphillips.org/zaurus/palmgps.html
    • The GPS Lite mouse from deluo.com is $60. I have an older mouse from Deluo, and it works reasonably well under Windows. I've been told you can get the old one to work on Linux as well, but then there is no routing software available (let alone turn by turn voice guidance).

      If you don't need turn by turn, and have a Windows laptop, you could also get a package with a GPS mouse + Streets and Trips 2005 for $85 (after rebate on amazon).

      Dara

  • Other Linux GPS software to check out (Score:5, Informative)

    by nadaou ( 535365 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:42AM (#10501033) Homepage
    gpsd: serve up realtime GPS data
    http://gpsd.berlios.de

    gpstrans: download/upload Garmin data
    http://gpstrans.sourceforge.net

    gpsbabel: up/download & convert GPS data
    http://gpsbabel.sourceforge.net

    v.in.garmin + GRASS GIS 5.7: download GPS directly into serious mapping & analysis software
    http://grass.ibiblio.org/grass57/manuals /html57_us er/v.in.garmin.html
    http://grass.ibiblio.org

    have fun, don't get lost.
    • NMEA [wikipedia.org]
      /. [slashdot.org]

      gpsd: serve up realtime GPS data

      here [berlios.de]

      gpstrans: download/upload Garmin data here [sourceforge.net]

      gpsbabel: up/download & convert GPS data here [sourceforge.net]

      v.in.garmin + GRASS GIS 5.7: download GPS directly into serious mapping & analysis software here [ibiblio.org] here [ibiblio.org]

      thought I would clean these up a tad

    • Also check out pygps, which is a gps-driven map viewer. It's similar to gpsdrive, except that 1) it's written in Python, so it's portable, 2) it's written with handhelds in mind, 3) it supports UTM maps, and 4) if I can ever find a user community that cares enough for me to integrate it, I have code to do real-time map downloading via any kind of wireless IP connection.
      -russ

  • NMEA (Score:5, Informative)

    by The_Pey ( 532136 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @02:43AM (#10501035)

    I don't want to torpedo the purpose of this whole article, but Linux isn't as far out in the cold as you might think. Most GPS programs out there use the NMEA protocol which is handled over a common serial port. The article poster seems to imply that Linux is left out in terms of drivers, but the fact is that most GPS units support the NMEA protocol. That includes Garmin, Magellan and others. If you have a common DB9 serial connector and the right cable, you can get any number of GPS units to work with any number of programs.

    That being said, what is troubling is the "any number of programs" that I mentioned above. There really is not a large community of developers working on consumer mapping applications. If you look hard enough, you may stumble across some gems here and there, but for the most part the Linux scene is noticably lacking.

    Tuxmobil's Page [tuxmobil.org] is a good place to start looking at different apps.

    • On a side note, for those of you who don't have a DB9 connector, I have successfully used a Keyspan Serial PDA Adapter [keyspan.com] in interfacing my Garmin GPS with a Mac or PC.

    • Re:NMEA (Score:2, Informative)

      by Wapiti-eater ( 759089 )
      Screenshots of only one package that's out there and available now...

      Screenshots [wetnet-mafia.org]

      And those are from an older version: 1.0.2 - current release is 1.4.1

  • An observation. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by rincebrain ( 776480 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @03:19AM (#10501140) Homepage
    This past summer, a friend of mine took it into his head to build a caseless PC.

    This plan was to have two modes; a mode for work (IE: throwing it in his backpack), and a mode for play (mounting it on an RC car he built himself).

    He began finished the latter while I watched him, utilizing his own hacked together power setup to provide rechargable battery power to the device for a period of time he has yet to test fully. He then proceeded to install Linux on a 128 MB CF card, using an IDECF converter [I was amazed it existed, but there you go], and a few small utilities for run. A 500 MHz processor powered it.

    Now, the relevant part of this is the RC car it was on. He wanted to control the car using the motherboard mounted on its back. He wrote a simple program to send pulses along a parallel converter of his own design to the various wheels, as they responded to pulse frequency by operating specific ways...pretty standard.

    Then, he wanted to use a GPS to make it drive around the campus. He wrote his own software for the GPS device another friend of ours provided, NMEA-0182 with a few vendor extensions, IIRC. The device sent over serial, and it was a fairly simple bit of work to make it interpret the coordinates properly...the hard part was mapping the area. =)

    The point of all that is, good GPS devices usually use a standard output interface, and protocol. And it is, honestly, not that hard to write your own program to interface with it. I still have the source code to the program he wrote...it's easily under 1000 lines, and possibly under 500.

    So, if you'd like to use a GPS device to steer your projects...write your own software. =)

  • Uhm... duh... Which part of 'RS232'.... (Score:5, Informative)

    by B747SP ( 179471 ) <slashdot@selfabusedelephant.com> on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @03:39AM (#10501179)
    All but the least-decent GPS receivers speak RS232 and at least the NMEA protocol out of the box. I use the Garmin eTrex standard [garmin.com], bottom of the line GPS with FreeBSD all the time, but I'm not doing anything clever that won't work with Linux or any other *nix.

    I hand-built serial cables using plugs I got from this guy [pfranc.com] (Elsewhere on that site there's links to folks all over the world selling the same plugs for a range of different GPS receivers). Apparently even the tiny little Garmin Geko 201 [garmin.com] and Geko 301 [garmin.com] (but not the 101 model) also speak serial - and they're tiny cute little things they are!!!

    My little eTrex has a menu with a whole bunch of different 'languages' that it will speak (and/or receive) via the serial port. According to the manual (warning: pdf) [garmin.com] (page 45) it speaks NMEA 0183, a bunch of proprietary Garmin stuff and a couple of flavours suitable for differential work. I know from fiddling with mine that it also speaks a 'plain text' (they're all plain text, but this one is more so) format that is quite human readable and probably quite easily parseable with some perl.

    Another imporant point about GPS and Linux (*nix in general is time). GPS requires incredibly accurate time to operate, so by implication GPS receivers make excellent clocks. Last time I checked xntp [ntp.org] had support for NMEA (GPS) as a time source.

    A quick freshmeat [freshmeat.net] (if 'google' is a verb, then surely 'freshmeat' can be one too!) will tell you that GPS on *nix is nothing new!!! (Not all of those returns are gps nav related, but there's a lot of stuff to parse gps sentences, moving maps, program receivers, all kinds of goodies!

    • I have the Geko 201. It's a superb little device. It speaks a Garmin protocol that Garmin published here [garmin.com]. There are a number of utilities for Linux that implement this protocol; I use gpspoint. [dnsalias.net] The only hurdle is the proprietary serial connector which costs a low double digits $$$; I hacked mine together with a glue gun from a couple of wires.

      For laptop-side work I use viking [gpsmaps.org], a very nice GUI based program for managing waypoints and tracks. It's not so much useful for street navigation as it is for tr

  • The Question now is; (Score:2, Interesting)

    by okmijnuhb ( 575581 )
    My laptop has no serial port, would I be able to run the USB to serial converter that I now use in Windows?

    • Re:The Question now is; (Score:3, Informative)

      by pe1chl ( 90186 )
      Usually: yes.
      I have some USB devices and they all work with Linux. In fact, with Linux they worked plug-and-play while for Windows 2000 I needed to install the drivers that came with them.

  • NMEA (Score:2, Insightful)

    by zxv ( 815649 )
    I dont see why this is news. Most GPS devices uses NMEA which is trivial to parse.
    • NMEA is the lowest-level protocol used by these devices. In fact, even a bare GPS receiver module talks NMEA.
      When you have a GPS handheld, there are many more things that can be done via a PC. Download waypoints, tracks, upload maps, etc. This is not done using the NMEA protocol but with some proprietary protocol specific to the GPS unit manufacturer.

  • Galileo? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by tarunthegreat2 ( 761545 )
    Slightly OT but wouldn't the purposes of OSS be better served if they could find some kind of input into Galileo, the competitor to GPS? GPS is kinda dependent on the US-Military, and when Galileo comes on line it won't be....

  • You can use multimap (Score:3, Interesting)

    by DrSkwid ( 118965 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @04:42AM (#10501315) Journal
    I used the NMEA output of my usb gps to drive multimap requests

    mutlimap takes lat/log coordinates so it really is a no brainer


    http://www.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?lon=-4.14 55 3105809694&lat=50.956740380761

    hehe check the street name :)

  • GPS and USB hotplug (Score:2, Informative)

    by zcougar ( 123972 )
    Some instructions, how to start gpsd automatically when connecting USB GPS receiver. There is also described how to start Kismet server automatically.

    http://wiki.version6.net/Kismet hotplug [version6.net]
  • Are there any boot-from-CD GPS navigation distros out there? I have an old PII laptop which would be great for navigaiton, except that the HD doesn't work relaibly. It'd be nice to be able to burn a cd with a bunch of maps and bootable distro that automatically logs in and brings up GPSDrive. Also, (ianal,b) in states where it's illegal for the driver to be able to see displays which are unrelated to vehicle operation or navigation, it might be useful to be able to show that the computer is running from

    • Re:KnopGPS anyone? (Score:3, Informative)

      by minialed ( 744608 )
      GIS-Knoppix (http://www.sourcepole.com/gis-knoppix/) comes with a set of pre-installed GIS (Geographical Info Systems) software and utilities including GPSDrive.
      http://www.freegis.org/browse.en.html?category=o s&os=Linux is an excellent resource fo GIS, GPS and related tools including many for Linux &c. A.

  • To each their own? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Lee_in_KC ( 816490 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @07:50AM (#10501986)

    Just how much money do the Linux users here thing they contribute to the bottom line at Garmin or Magellan? The offerings for Linux (Linspire, etc) ready for the consumer are noticeably lacking. It's going to stay that way for quite a while. When someone says "there is no software for Linux" invariably thousands of geeks on here (I use that term in the fondest manner) will say "oh I just hooked up my transmogrifier to the digital mitzoplexer and then filtered that through Google. Simple!". Well it's not simple folks. Until you realize that the consumers (you know, those folks paying for things) drive demand, things will not change.

    A lot of folks here see a good idea, take it, write their own spaghetti code and tailor it to how they want it and then call it good. The folks in Redmond see a good idea, dumb it up to the least common denominator and wham . your Grandmother has one in her Lincoln Continental. See the difference? There's money in developing code that's "good enough" so long as you address it to your market.

    I've seen some pretty cool work with in-car PCs and some using Linux [dashpc.com]. These are packaged with the consumer in mind, even if they are not quire ready yet. That's what's going to catch on. Just because there are open standards does not mean you all need to write your own. That's the surest way to obscurity.

    • The applications are the smallest piece of the puzzle. The thing preventing linux GPS adoption is the lack of map data useful for navigation. Even vector maps are only so useful when they don't indicate which streets are one-way.
    • Are you assuming there is some point to not being obscure?

      If I hook up my transmogrifier to the digital mitzoplexer and then filter that through Google and get what I want, then, no offence, but I couldn't care less that your grandmother doesn't, and probably won't have one in her car, I have one in my fernazerator, so there. If I feel like releasing it so others who want to tinker with it can, then I will. I don't hope to become rich and famous - just sharing with others who have similar interests. If

  • Garmin Publishes interface... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by tonywestonuk ( 261622 ) on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @08:02AM (#10502047)
    it's probably safe to assume that the good folks over at Garmin would say something along the lines of "Lih-what?".

    This may be the case, however, they are very open with the interface/communications protocols for their GPS's - If you go here [garmin.com] you can download documents detailing the protocols in a platform neutral format, meaning that anyone with just a little programming experience can easily make programs to interface with their GPS's, on any platform, Linux included. To be quite honest, I can't think of another hardware vendor, that is so open with the specs. Usually, Companies require you to jump through hoops (NDA agreements/ etc) to get hold of this information, or have to resort to reverse engineering, etc. And, if you can't/dont want to program, then there's a few projects already made for you on sourceforge!

    To sum up, Don't knock Garmin, They might not produce Linux drivers, but at the same time, they do go out of their way to make it easy for others to do so should they want to.

  • Typical Linux application (read this and admit it) (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @08:52AM (#10502389)
    Difficult and confusing to install? Check!

    "Although Roadmap is not the easiest to configure and install..."

    Lack of features found in commercial grade applications? Check!

    "It would be nice if Roadmap could compute trips and give you step-by-step voice directions, but it doesn't have that feature..."

    Broken stuff in the app that confuses users? Check!

    "There appears to be support for starting and stopping gpsd from within the program when it loads, but it doesn't seem to work with the either the pre-compiled binaries or the source."

    Now just throw in spotty or nonexistant support, and morphing into total Abandonware once the author graduates from college, and we have a real Linux app here!

  • I got one of those tiny DeLorme Tripmate USB GPS receivers, which was bundled with Windows software for ~ $120. I knew my chances of running with MacOS X or Linux were slim, but I needed it for a big roadtrip. And, yup.. I was right. DeLorme will not release any information on the hardware to enable driver development on Mac or Linux platforms.

    The only option is to buy the bluetooth dock for it, which costs more than the GPS unit. I know this works with my PowerBook. I think it coul be made to w

  • roadnav (Score:2, Interesting)

    by mrfibbi ( 695943 )
    I'd reccomend checking out roadnav [sf.net]. Not very mature (still only in 0.2), but it uses vector data, plots directions, and has a beautifully-generated map.
  • So, I recently took a trip through part of Europe and took a number (~35) of GPS readings. Is there any decent (GPL) software that will take all those points(LAT, LONG, Date/Time, Alt.) and give me a map of the area I covered? Presently, my plan is to use mapquest's LAT/LONG service and a bash/perl script to pull the various maps and overlay them until I get something useful. Fun as a project to see if I can, but time-consuming.

    Thanks
    Joe B

  • What's so special? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Andy Dodd ( 701 ) <atd7NO@SPAMcornell.edu> on Tuesday October 12, 2004 @12:01PM (#10503914) Homepage
    NMEA 0183 is a standard that nearly every GPS unit conforms to as far as communications with other devices.

    Interfacing GPS devices to Linux boxes has never, EVER been a problem. It's almost impossible to find a GPS receiver that doesn't speak NMEA 0183, Rockwell binary (Documented), or Garmin binary (ALSO documented, has been fully supported by gpsd under Linux for YEARS.)

    Now DOING something with that info from the GPS is a different story... There is almost no decent mapping/navigation software for Linux. About the only semi-decent software is Roadmap, which uses the TIGER/Line dataset in the US. GpsDrive is pretty well polished, but not much more than a toy thanks to lack of vector map support. :( GRASS is very powerful, but not suitable for your typical "I want to get from point A to point B" navigation.
    • RoadMap doesn't do routing, due to lack of info on one-way streets in the TIGER dataset.

      And I used it not too long ago, it was extremely unreliable and difficult to set up. 90% of the time, it would say, "no map for area found" even though I'd RTFMed and loaded all maps and index files for the state I was in and all surrounding states.
  • Electronic Admiralty maps/software are currently Windows only. Anyone know of Linux stuff?

  • I honestly don't care about pretty moving maps. I like street-address-level route plotting. I'd prefer it on a linux-based PDA. I'd even pay what a comparable Win32 program would cost, or run one under wine if it were compatible with a card-based GPS receiver.

    The GPS in my car just does voices, text and arrows, and I'm just ducky with that. However, without routing, IMHO, GPS is useless on the road.

    IIRC Navte(ch|q) uses an open format ( SDAL [navteq.com]) for its routing database, you have to buy the CD/DVDs. Does

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