University Launches Semantic Web Interface 191
kv9 writes "The University of Southampton has launched a new semantic web interface, called mSpace, that it says will make searching for information online, and learning about a subject, much easier. mSpace is a framework that gathers information sources and presents them to the user in a single window. It can potentially be applied to any subject, provided the basic information is available. The researchers say this means users will no longer have to wade through lists of undifferentiated data when researching a subject."
"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:5, Interesting)
Imagine more than Google
Imagine a better iTunes
Imagine Google on iTunes
Perhaps my early brain development was flawed, because I'm at a total loss to imagine what a "Google on iTunes" would be like or even what that means.
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:1, Troll)
Furthermore, I thought the 2001 tech bubble taught all the companies not to use the word "imagine" in their press releases.
I guess some people learn harder than others.
Color me "annoyed by pretentious marketese".
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:5, Funny)
Oh, it's not a company, it's a *UNIVERSITY* (The University of Southampton, to be exact) -- that explains why they didn't get the memo.
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:5, Funny)
Imaging better drugs.
Imagine PR on drugs.
That's what they were getting at... I think.
Justin.
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:2)
This is your brain on Google
This is your brain on iTunes
This is your Google on iTunes.
Any questions?
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:1, Funny)
Imagine Google on Pickle
Imagine Google on Mustard
Imagine Sandwich on iTunes
Well, I think my subconcious has spoken... time for lunch!
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:2)
Ok, so I probably carried this one too far.
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:1)
a revival of those stupid "This is your brain on drugs" commercials starring famous actors.
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:4, Funny)
Imagine there's no Google
It's easy if you try
All the good stuff is below
The crap above makes you cry
Imagine all the people
Longing for the day...
(With apologies to John Lennon)
EricJavaScript is NOT Java [ericgiguere.com]
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:2)
Okay. [google.ca]
Somehow I don't feel enlightened.
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:2)
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:4, Funny)
well. you'd pay per search. and then they'd come with drm. but you could print them out and scan them in so apparently it wouldn't be a biggie..
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:2, Funny)
Marketing speak sucks.
Re:"Imagine Google on iTunes" (Score:2)
Ah if only!
I was a little taken aback by TFA's implicit assertion that iTunes is an example of a great data exploration application.
iTunes doesn't fit the way my brain works at all, and neither does the mSpace classical music demo.
Score for FireFox users... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:2)
Alas, still just a copy!
Re:Score for FireFox users... Not a perfect score! (Score:2)
This site requires Firefox* for viewing. Click below to have a minimized version of Firefox installed on your computer.
When you leave this site, you will be given to option to keep Firefox on your computer.
If you do not select to keep it, it will be automatically uninstalled.
You will also be given the option to
Re:Score for FireFox users... Not a perfect score! (Score:2)
On the same note I do agree with the last statement. I hate needing ActiveX or flash just to view one stupid page then being bombarded with popup ads that cover the article I'm trying to read.
Yeah I use firefox but many computers I work on (work, customers, Mom, etc) do not.
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:3, Insightful)
If a webmaster starts to shift his focus from IE to FireFox/Mozilla, he is just being as bad as all the other webmasters who give preference to IE users.
Yes, Firefox is all open source and everything, I agree, it should supported. But that does not mean webmasters should just drop development for other web browsers.
We should be encouraging webmasters to make their websites work in all browsers, not one specific.
Just working in Firefox is no better then
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:5, Insightful)
If a webmaster starts to shift his focus from IE to FireFox/Mozilla, he is just being as bad as all the other webmasters who give preference to IE users.
Not necessarily - Firefox, like most other FOSS browsers, is standards-compliant, IE isn't. This is the biggest obstacle to having a website that can be viewed by any browser.
So if this is down to a website complying with the correctstandards, the problem is squarely with IE, and may convince M$ to do it everybody else's way, instead of insisting that everybody else does it the M$ way. . .
So long as the choice is "Should we make our site standards-compliant or IE-compatible?" there can never be a truly universal website.
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:2)
That's a false dichotomy, what the webmaster should do is a site that is both standards-compliant AND IE-compatible, by using HTML that is correctly supported by IE. That is, of course, if he actually cares about making an accessible website and not a statement.
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:2)
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:3, Funny)
Microsoft developed their own, and decided to frame their browser around it. What's wrong with that? I thought choice was a good thing.
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:2, Informative)
Rubbish. It's actually very easy to code a site to html standards that also works in IE. it means having to duplicate and target some of your CSS, whcih is additional overhead in terms of testing and download, but it's easilly done.
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:1)
I think the problem in this case is that they wanted to use what they describe as "standard" Javascript (rather than standard CSS or standard HTML).
Trouble is, there isn't such a thing as standard javascript in the same way as there is with standard HTML, standard CSS. There is a javascript language standard, and the W3C has a few things to do with how languages in general should see HTML pages (the HTML DOM), but the actual mechanics of how the langugage and browser fit together has been developed betw
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:2, Insightful)
Actually, computer science researchers, such as those at the University of Southampton who developed this, don't have a particular requirement (moral or actual) to develop "for all platforms". They are interested in research - showing something can be done, and publishing details on it when they h
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:1)
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:2)
I've been making web pages since '94, and DOM [w3c.org]+ECMA [ecma-international.org]+CSS [w3c.org] is one of the most powerful things I've seen in quite a while. It's exactly what the web was supposed to be before the browser wars came along and screwed it all up with blink tags and other useless shit.
Take a look at Google Maps [google.com] in a fully compliant browser an
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:2)
It requires a Mozila-based browser like Netscape, Camino, Mozilla or Firefox to run (for standard javascript compatibility).
No, it worked just fine on Opera too, a fairly common browser when speaking "alternative" non-IE browsers.
Re:Score for FireFox users... (Score:3, Informative)
Interesting Subject (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Interesting Subject (Score:1)
With internet radio broadcast it is very easy to listen to various types of music and figure out what you like
This whole "semantic web" thing... (Score:5, Insightful)
What I don't find fine is that this interface doesn't somehow derive meaning from documents and bring that meaning together, it's simply an interface to a hierarchical information store. Do we need a new name for that, or would "a bunch of windows that are interdependent" be fine for people who aren't being poseurs?
Re:This whole "semantic web" thing... (Score:5, Insightful)
In a more functional sense, the pieces are slowly being put into place, but as long as there are a huge number of people with varying mental processes "marking up" the data, the whole thing won't be any more than a labor-intensive way of making new web pages. Where I believe it will work is where you have a trusted source of data that is in a known heirarchical format that can be preprocessed into a set interdependent links. Endeca (sp?) does a good job of this for individual commerce sites (I think CompUSA's search is powered by Endeca). iTunes (or any other music database) and IMDB are other good examples of data sources that could be wrapped with semantic meaning. Perhaps these trusted sources will eventually merge so that a the "seven degrees of Kevin Bacon" could expand to cover the world of music (how many degrees of separation between Kevin and Bach?).
Wow...? (Score:3, Interesting)
The only "innovation" I can see is that you can add + remove individual filters. Which is not, so to speak, going to launch rockets...
I recal looking at a system (in java) that allowed overlay of viewports (little square windows) onto a graphic to add + remove filters (in the photoshop sense in this case). You could drag around these viewports and overlay them to get a venn-diagram like effect with filters (real time, over the web in an applet)
That was while I was a University (so was between 1993 - 1998, probably 96 at a guess). That was simultaneously; similar in concept, more impressive by far and much more of an "innovation" at that time...
I may be missing something, but I couldn't see anything "new" there.
Re:Wow...? (Score:2)
The program you saw years ago was probably based upon some proprietary format.
Don't get me wrong, I also don't see "the semantic web" happening overnigh. But getting people to use more standard data interchange formats, can only be a good thing to do
Great step forward, but big problem (Score:4, Informative)
Hmm, so in this system, there are documents that are annotated with meta-data... and then, you can run a query on that metadata to find documents matching certain criteria. You can narrow down a query, too. So far so ordinary.
The big problem, though, is that it's hard to be sarcastic enough. Business has already provided various document annotating and indexing systems, and various databases in which to store the results, and various query systems with which to retrieve them / report on them. Now, a bunch of students have done the same thing in miniature and to them it's all terribly much more interesting than those grubby real world systems. Great for them -- problem for me.
I mean, power to them and all, but after the first n Big Honkin' Advances In The Semantic Web, the ordinary Joe like me is left really scraping the barrel for ways to be sarcastic about it. It's all been done -- nothing I can offer that hasn't been modded +5 (70% Funny 30% Troll) in a dozen Semantic Web articles in the past. So I give up, okay? I can't keep up. There, I said it.
I hope you're happy now.
Re:Great step forward, but big problem (Score:3, Interesting)
While there are several approaches to accountability already present in the field, such as counting links to the data (like Google does), or having smart, professional, attractive moderators (like Slashdot does [1]), none of them are perfect yet, and I believe this is a problem that
Re:Great step forward, but big problem (Score:2, Insightful)
I'd applaud if it has been done: if there's a site or space i can go to right now that will let me easily explore information spaces, see interconnections, associations, that looks to do that not just with a lonely database but with a www of data, that would be awesome.
where is it?
thanks
"provided the basic information is available" (Score:5, Insightful)
Waddia know, we still need librarians after all!
Re:"provided the basic information is available" (Score:2)
Mozilla browser only? (Score:3, Interesting)
Hey, shouldn't that be (Score:2, Funny)
I mean, we all know there's only one location in England, right? Er, Britain. Or is it the UK? Mebbe I'm thinking of the Commonwealth.
Anyway, those = London
France = Paris
Germany = Berlin
"Here" = Michigan?
Re:Hey, shouldn't that be (Score:1)
Re:Hey, shouldn't that be (Score:1)
Ah, but there are a few Commonwealths in the US, so you can't be thinking of that. (Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, and Virginia - maybe more?)
Sounds familiar.. (Score:1)
Does this too tie all libraries everywhere together? Certainly it must do so and more to earn the right to be a successor to L-space, as can be gleaned from its name...
If so, one must be careful so you don't end up in the past and find yourself sleeping off the counterwise wine you just drank.
erm .... (Score:1)
t
They've reinvented Turbogopker VR! (Score:4, Interesting)
Meatball Wiki page on GopherProtocol [usemod.com]
A copy of the Gopher FAQ [mysteria.com]
MacOrchard page with TurboGopher VR [macorchard.com]
and then... (Score:2, Insightful)
not google, again (Score:1)
And when you reach the end of the database:
Re:not google, again (Score:2, Interesting)
Part of the project is to allow wiki-like connections to the info views for publishing related content. Or using talkback like pings to talk with brokers/aggregators so that mspaces can be generated dynamically, and fed dynamically based on available rdf.
This is very much a start - a look at what might be/come something (more) useful, not as the done deal
That said, we hope that for the interim, by having a dump out to google on a topic you've already identified of interest th
For god sake.. (Score:2)
Re:For god sake.. (Score:2)
Nobody's done it because it's not economically feasable.
Buzzword Bingo (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Buzzword Bingo (Score:2, Interesting)
"standard javascript compatibility" (Score:1)
The site says it needs "standard javascript compatibility." The should consider supporting "standard browser compatibility."
Re:"standard javascript compatibility" (Score:3, Informative)
Re:"standard javascript compatibility" (Score:2)
Microsoft should consider supporting "standard browser compatibility!"
I, for one, applaud them for supporting standards instead of Microsoft.
Wikipedia Front-end (Score:1)
dev thoughts (Score:5, Informative)
Re:dev thoughts (Score:2, Interesting)
When Bach and Handel show up in the Classical Era (they were Baroque) and the interface looks like it could just be showing results of traditional SQL queries, then naturally our attention is focused towards the manual tagging of information and so it looks like the project is showing us nothing new: "See, someone mis-tagged Bach and he is showing up in the wrong list box
Re:dev thoughts (Score:2)
Yes, it is innovative. (Score:2, Funny)
I, for one, welcome our new 3-pane semantic browser overlords.
mSpace is indeed cutting-edge (Score:5, Informative)
McGuffin and Schraefel's paper of mSpaces, polyarchies and zzStructures [toronto.edu] won the ACM Hypertext Conference's award for "Special Research Distinction for Excellent Presentation of Theoretical Concepts."
Schraefel is not only a good programmer, doing very cutting edge information technology stuff, but she and her team have managed to design a useful piece of software that uses it. Since when can the Academic world do this kind of thing?
*sigh* People diss Nelson when he comes up with incredibly good ideas [eastgate.com] and quality computer science [utoronto.ca]. And now, when people like Schraefel produce a usable product, they get dissed too. Before you go snarking about how the Semantic Web won't come down from heaven and die on a cross for us, make sure you know what the Semantic Web is [ftrain.com]. Just like Harpers, this is a perfectly cool example.
What do I think about the Semantic Web? I will admit, I sometimes wonder if it's safe [tamu.edu].
Re:mSpace isn't cutting-edge (Score:2, Informative)
if you have an n dimensional space - which music is - how do you represent it so that meaning can be gained from it?
take a projection through an n-d space, flatten it, temporary hierarchies come forth.
that's what's happening with the current view. change the slice/projection by changind that attributes/dimensions selected. new hierarchies, new relationships. what do you think?
and actually in this case we're not using an ontology - tho having one
Good news for me! (Score:2)
Downloaded the system - looks interesting (Score:5, Informative)
This project looks very useful if you already have RDF data that you would like to publish. There is a PDF paper (that I have only read the first 10 pages of) that looks good. Anyway, I might use this on a demo that I am (slowly) working on.
Metadata and meaning (Score:4, Interesting)
1) The metadata sink. Creating an "mSpace" around classical composers is one thing. Doing the same on "quantum mechanics and philosophy" is another. As you broaden the concept, you have to depend on a more-refined framework of contextual and categorical distinctions. Eventually, you may be creating more metadata than data.
2) The metadata reflection problem. Metadata, in that it is not the data itself, cannot possibly reflect every notion, category of thought or context -- many of those things depend on the user's own interaction with the data (e.g. what you find "funny" I may find "dumb."). And, as often mentioned, metadata may in fact be missing, ouright misleading or incomplete.
IMHO, though metadata projects such as these are intriguing, the true "holy grail" of classifying data is understanding context. Thus, why worry about metadata when you have the data write there in front of you? Even a statistical anaysis of word/phrase frequency over say, 100 pages returned by Google on "quantum mechanics and philosophy" can yield concepts and connections without any metadata creation/foundation at all (i.e. the user analyzing the key words/phrases can make those connections on his/her own).
Clearly I'm biased, as I work on software [mesadynamics.com] for OS X that does just this, but still, I honestly believe that creating more data, just to describe what is an increasingly massive corpus (the web), is the wrong solution to the "understanding" problem.
Bach to the future (go for Baroque)? (Score:2)
So I click on Baroque, click on J.S.Bach, and...
Wait. There isn't any, oh well, I guess they have a really small playlist. Trundling on, let's open Classical...
First entry is Bach.
And not C.P.E.Bach, either. J.S.Bach.
I guess this is an attempt to illustrate "I may not know much about Classical Music, but I Know what I like when I hear it."
Right?
Re:Bach to the future (go for Baroque)? (Score:2)
I'm not sure I see what's different between this and other incremental wizard-type interfaces like the one at ATI's website for figuring out the model of video card you have and what drivers you need... other than the audio effects I can't here.
Also helps (Score:2)
There was an effort at Cambridge University in the 1960s (called the CLRU, Cambridge Language Research Unit) to do exactly this.
that's the easy part (Score:2)
Basically, all these people have done is done a nice demo using modern DHTML, b
Re:that's the easy part (Score:3, Informative)
As opposed to easy, it's also effective. so why aren't more sites doing this? It's like the mac osx watson tool (RIP).
As for the "hard part", you don't hand code the browser for each domain. The framework lets you through any semantic model at it you want. if you have an ontology so much the better. it is a general browser. the d
Re:that's the easy part (Score:2)
Unless I miss some functionality in the "mSpace model", it seems to me lots of software already has something pretty close. You get most of the functionality when you combine reorderable columns with lexicographic sort (you need a few more display hacks to get context at every level, but that's available in many interfaces through
Re:that's the easy part (Score:2)
But if google was smart, it would actually give me the list of the "las
Bad for the REAL semantic web (Score:2)
Other semantic web browsers/apps (Score:3, Informative)
Chandler:V ision.htm [osafoundation.org]
http://www.osafoundation.org/Chandler_Compelling_
Haystack:
http://haystack.lcs.mit.edu/ [mit.edu]
Why this will be a disappointment (Score:2)
The demo, tellingly, is a sparse winter tree with no leaves. None of the classical pieces I clicked on led anywhere. Do you think this will be any different when released into the wild?
Classical music, you might think, would be a good example of where it really would work because copyright expired for these long before the corrupt american media associations bought their oppressive laws. However copyright still inheres in individual performances and recordings, so no joy there.
I can see how
Re:Why this will be a disappointment (Score:2)
Late comment on faceted metadata (Score:2)
What I still am not so sure about (and is why I want to read the articles and the code I downloaded - THANKS!) is the following perceptions I had (possibly erroneous) on first glance:
- It is not clear how an semantic web ontology is being used, presumably there is rdf with some r
Re:slashdotted already? (Score:2)
mspace.sourceforge.net (Score:5, Informative)
there are plenty of links in the mirrored article [mirrordot.org] to other resources.
must be in the upstream (Score:2)
Silly me, imagined for just a split second that the trans-atlantic link had gotten slashdotted
Re:Why bother with University? (Score:1)
Re:Why bother with University? (Score:1)
What university did you go to?
Hmmm (Score:1)
While my course mates and I were pulling all nighters and putting huge amounts of work into our degrees with 12 exams a year, the humanities with english studies students were doing ohh 4 hours a week with 1 exam a year if they were unlucky enough to pick the wrong subject.
You can see why there is a feeling that BA's are easy.
It isn't the lectureres that spread it, it's that the Science and Engineering students notice the Arts students doing practically nothing.
Re:Why bother with University? (Score:1)
Try reading it in that context and see if you get more out of it.
Re:Why bother with University? (Score:1)
I'd have to agree - that sentence scores very highly on the iron-o-meter
Re:Why bother with University? (Score:1)
LMAO Yeah, after this sentence in the middle of that indecipherable block of text, I'm guessing this must be a joke.
Not to mention: What about astrology, the most rediculious of the sciences!
Re:Yeah... (Score:1)
Or, if you knew a little bit you could find out where it sits with the rest of the stuff.
Re:Yeah... (Score:1)
Re:Yeah... (Score:1)
Well, if there is an advantage (Score:2)
Or more precisely, not having to do so much authoring to get more information delivery bang for the buck.
The Itunes example is a good one. You don't need something like Itunes or even a playlist manager to play, or even organize your music. You could write a web page with links to all your media encoded as file URLs. In fact, you could do all kinds of things with the web page idea that you couldn't do with ITunes; except you never woudl because it isn't worth the trouble just t
Re:I don't get it... (Score:1)
Re:I don't get it... (Score:1)
Re:Beautiful UK women, part 2 (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Plagarism (Score:1)
A lot of /. stories are 'written' this way. I know whenever I submit I include quotes from the article, but I at least attribute them properly.
It's easier to do it this way than actually reading the article (something even the submitters obviously don't do) and finding those most salient points which deserve to be highlighted and will draw attent
Re:Oh yeah, this works well (Score:2)