Unofficial Win2K Daylight Saving Time Fix 299
Saturn2003a writes "Microsoft has stated that they will not be offering a patch for the new US Daylight Saving Time for Windows 2000 and earlier. Only customers with an extended support agreement can get a Hotfix from Microsoft. To get around this, IntelliAdmin has created an unofficial patch (source code provided) that will fix Daylight Saving Time on Windows 2000 and Windows NT machines."
My fix? (Score:3, Funny)
I haven't had an issue yet.
Re:My fix? (Score:5, Funny)
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Right on, brotha! [zulunation.com]
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Don't
throw
bloody
spears
at
me !
Re:My fix - avoid vendors that act like assholes. (Score:5, Insightful)
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But they're still an asshole. (Score:5, Insightful)
It's not that W2K is broken that makes M$ an asshole in all of this. It's that they have a patch available for those who have paid for extended support, but they won't release it for the general public.
Since the cost to produce the patch has already been absorbed by M$, the only reason to withhold the patch is to make people frustrated with W2K to encourage them to upgrade. When you can readily fix something, but you don't, so that people will upgrade, well, then, your an asshole.
Re:But they're still an asshole. (Score:5, Informative)
Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)
No, Windows' time code ACTUALLY IS broken (Score:3, Informative)
First of all, it sets the hardware clock to local time rather than GMT, so it breaks other OSs when dual-booting. Second, it puts file timestamps in local time (at least on FAT), so if you change timezones your timestamps can get screwed up. And screwed up timestamps can actually break stuff -- backups, make, etc.
Re:I'll stretch it (Score:5, Insightful)
And now for another episode of, "Good Idea, Bad Idea"
Seriously... downloading patches from a website operated by the government?
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Why would anyone do business with a vendor that treats people this way?
Or at a minimum treats their own products with some respect?
They already have a fix. It's clearly broken. And they're not fixing it!?! It's not like it'd cost them anything to do so. My bet is that they avoid fixing bugs on purpose just so they can charge suckers more for upgrades.
The only real fix is to get a vendor that doesn't act like such an asshole. Anything else is just a workaround.
I'm the LAST person do defend Microsoft, but...Sun also isn't patching Solaris 7 and earlier for the same bug. At some point, you just have to bite the bullet and either upgrade, or (gasp!) change your damn clock by hand. Twice. Big deal.
Re:My fix - avoid vendors that act like assholes. (Score:4, Informative)
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But in the Solaris case, I was able to download the new timezone files from ftp://elsie.nci.nih.gov/pub/tzdata2007a.tar.gz [nih.gov] and extract the contents (the only file I needed was northamerica), and ran "zic northamerica" -- all was taken care of.
Right. But this is coming from nih, not the vendor. So as much as it's fun to bash microsoft, in this case...I'd rather my OS vendor of choice spend development effort on something fairly current, rather than back-porting fixes forever. At some point, ya gotta let go. Thanks for the URL by the way, you just saved me finding it.
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Yeah, right (Score:5, Funny)
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Just put "time" and "date" commands in your autoexec.bat.
Re:Yeah, right (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Yeah, right (Score:5, Funny)
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Wasn't that film about Slashdot effect? I remember how all the hardware gets torpedoed and stops functioning for awhile.
Re:Yeah, right (Score:4, Informative)
It also fixes lots of other problems with DOS that people have struggled with.
Yes, DOS is still useable and in use today by lots of important devices.
and it's.... (Score:4, Funny)
(Sorry...couldn't resist)
Re:and it's.... (Score:4, Insightful)
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The problem with not adjusting the clock is that there are forces that are working to move the clock both forward and backward. In the book "Spring Forward - The Annual Madness of Daylight Saving Time" by Michael Downing, he covers the issue. The back cover of the book lists those who support and oppose Daylight Saving Time (DST).
Some of those in support of DST:
Some of those opposed to DST:
Well... (Score:3, Informative)
Fortunately, the corporate users with a domain will still have a DC as an authoritative time source, and can just adjust the time on one server to keep everyone else in sync.
Re:Well... (Score:5, Informative)
clocks (Score:5, Interesting)
I work for a large clock company and there sending out many (20+) people throughout the country to reprogram the clock controllers so that there DST tables can be automatically updated in the future, nothing like more summertime
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It's not like there are no other options (Score:5, Informative)
This knowledge base article [microsoft.com] from Microsoft describes how to use the Time Zone Editor utility (which you can download from that page) to adjust time zone settings.
If you need to update several computers, it also describes which registry keys to export. You can then import those registry keys in a logon script or whatever.
It's not like people/companies running Win2k are SOL.
Re:It's not like there are no other options (Score:5, Funny)
Slashdot has enough trouble with grammar without you confusing things. :-P
They can each be both, but the typical cases are "affect" as a verb, and "effect" as a noun. Linky [google.com].
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"Affect" is usually a verb meaning "to influence".
"Effect" is usually a noun meaning "result".
There is a noun meaning for "affect" and a verb meaning for "effect", but they're uncommon. So you go ahead and come up with your clever term, and I'll come up with one for when one uses it inappropriately.
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On the subject of gammer...it's not "savings" (Score:3, Informative)
It's, "Daylight Saving [wikipedia.org] Time," not, "Daylight Savings Time." It's not like we're, "savings teh 1337 daylights." (daylight is singular)
At least the summary had it right.
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It's my date in a box (Score:2, Funny)
Step 2: Change the time on your box
Step 3: Make her open the box.
It's my date in a box. Date in a box bay-beh.
Not Entirely Stuck (Score:3, Informative)
I've got a fix (Score:2, Insightful)
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It had nothing to do with energy until...well, that's another topic.
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Think about it, most kids go
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Since very few people's work or school schedules would change, the extra time in the morning would be a uselessly short interval with a looming workday ahead of it. Plus, in the real world, only maniacs get up before they absolutely have to.
You're getting ~100 extra hours of real-world useful daylight time in exchange for spending 3 minutes per year setting your clocks. It's a net benefit. A lot of people seem to love making contrarian complaints about DST, bu
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I think you missed some very basic realities, like the fact that the sun is shining no matter what time the clock says it is.
Why even set the time back and forth? Why deal with all that? There is definitely substantial lost productivity around the time of the switch. Why not just have winter hours? Is that really so complicated? I seem to have noticed many businesses whic
DST in some countries changes every year... (Score:5, Informative)
holiday happens to occur in the lunar calendar, so every year in our data centers we either
change the clocks manually, or rely on the Domain Controller on changing the time for
the servers and workstations in the domain.
And we don't complain to Microsoft for not providing us a fix for it.
-D
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The thing is, Microsoft has provided a fix, but only to customers with Extended Support [microsoft.com].
I don't know if there is some technical reason why Microsoft is unable to simply make it available to everyone on the Windows Update website, but I suspect this is simply another opportunity for them to keep the old forced-upgrade treadmill running.
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So, the Y2K problem finally shows up (Score:5, Funny)
Why the 3rd party patch? (Score:2)
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There IS an official fix (Score:5, Funny)
Move to Arizona, Hawaii, or anywhere outside the US.
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Yeah but who cares about Canada?
All tucked away down there...
True legacy (Score:2)
MS Entourage 2004 on OS X has same problem. (Score:2)
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=924606 [microsoft.com]
And as always their glorious status of this bug:
STATUS
Microsoft has confirmed that this is a problem in the Microsoft products that are listed in the "Applies to" section. Microsoft is researching this problem and will post more information in this article when the information becomes available.
Which leaves many people who use Entourage in the corporate environment out to dry.
You know... (Score:2)
New Daylight Savings Time rules? (Score:2)
Re:New Daylight Savings Time rules? (Score:5, Informative)
Well, it was passed into law in August of 2005, so it's been around for a while. Here's a link [nist.gov] to the relevant bits. Following is the relevant changes:
It actually got quite a bit of news coverage at the time. It's been on Slashdot several times [google.com] as well.
Cheers
It's For The Customer! (Score:2)
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Win2k (Score:2, Insightful)
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Actually, i think 3.51 takes the cake. It was a solid machine, and was the first OS with the new interface (if installed from the CD as the "experimental" interface.)
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who cares? (Score:5, Funny)
Use UTC, RealTimeIsUniversal=1 (Score:2)
To tell Win2K that the hardware clock is UTC,
Set:
HKLM\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\TimeZoneInfo rmation\RealTimeIsUniversal
Assuming that the hardware clock is local time is plainly a bad idea, and this bug is
unfixed in all versions of Windows.
"2006-07-04: Various Microsoft Windows Vista beta testers have told me that this next-generation operating system still is not capable of running the CMOS clock in UTC. If you are a Microsoft Vista beta tester, pleas
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Not only in the US... (Score:2)
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However, here are the time zones it covers:
It updates Daylight Saving Time (Yes it is Saving, not Savings) in these time zones:
-Alaska Standard Time Zone
-Central Standard Time Zone
-Eastern Standard Time Zone
-Mountain Standard Time Zone
-Pacific Standard Time Zone
Notably absent are the Atlantic time zone, and Newfoundland time zone. So it
The fix (Score:2, Informative)
2. net stop "windows time"
3. net time
4. net start "windows time"
done. Works as long as the locale and tz on ntp server are set correctly.
History? (Score:3, Informative)
If Microsoft's patch will cause Windows XP (or Vista) to show the WRONG time for files saved near the DST change dates/times in years past, then it is NOT A FIX. This DST change has very, very deep effects on every single program that processes ANY dates/times before 2007 in the US. Program that went back before the current DST settings have already dealt with this (or decided to be wrong), but for those of us with no data older than Windows itself, we've never had to worry about this...until now.
For example, a power company wants to compare the power usage trend for, say, 5-6pm (when a large portion of people get out of and home from work) during late March for the years 2005-2008. If their software doesn't know to account for two different DST rules, then two of those years will be comparing the wrong hour of the day. And, FWIW, I chose this example specifically because it lends itself much more to local time than to UTC.
So, to patch this correctly, Windows will need to know which set of [at least two] DST rules to use (based on the year) when translating ANY time from 'system' (i.e. UTC) to 'local'. I don't see that happening, so I don't think that even the XP and Vista users will have a working OS, at least in the sense of correct time translation from UTC to local in the USA.
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It doesn't. But that is because MS Windows has never done this correctly, even when the DST date does not change.
Unix systems with a modern timezone library keep history about DST changes, and they can even be prepared for future algorithm changes as soon as they are decided, instead of having to be patched at exactly the right moment (after the la
Oh dear. (Score:5, Funny)
As long as the patch can be uninstalled.... (Score:2)
But hey, I guess they just gotta learn the hard way, don't they?
Not Surprising, Microsoft Doesn't Care.. (Score:2)
What about Linux? (Score:2)
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I bet you could do 5 minutes of research on your own and figure it out though.
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You get what you paid for. (Score:2)
I'm guessing on the price, I couldn't find any one keeping history on Microsoft products. unlike Apple products where there are mobs of people tracking every piece of trivia.
official (sortof) fix (Score:4, Informative)
Every version of Windows has a "resource kit", though Microsoft only supports Win98+ so you may need to hit old download sites for those ancient versions of Windows. You can download the resource kit from http://www.microsoft.com/windows/reskits/ [microsoft.com]. Download this if you do not have it already.
Once the resource kit is downloaded and installed search your disk drive for tzedit.exe and run it.
Select your timezone from the list and click edit.
You'll have two boxes "Start Day" and "End Day" change these from what they are to what they need to be for the new change.
Click Ok, then Close.
To make the settings take effect restart, or select Date/Time from the control panel, choose a different timezone, save and close then repeat selecting your correct timezone this time.
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Warranty - and safety - are also the reasons I went with a Kia Sportage. Manufacturer support counts for a lot, the sense that they will stand behind their product. That's also why I've been an OSX user for the last few years. Microsoft would have to make huge changes for me to go back. Apple simply does a better job. There's a bonus, too; old Windows machines make great linux-based servers. :)
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Warranty - and safety - are also the reasons I went with a Kia Sportage. Manufacturer support counts for a lot, the sense that they will stand behind their product. That's also why I've been an OSX user for the last few years. Microsoft would have to make huge changes for me to go back. Apple simply does a better job. There's a bonus, too; old Windows machines make great linux-based servers. :)
I used to own only American cars (one Chevy and two Pontiacs ('93 and '99). The Chevy (Lumina) transmission finally quit at like 260k miles, and I didn't see a point in fixing it (but damn, I loved that car!). The two Grand Am's were alright, but nothing to write home about. After having to towel out my last Pontiac every time it rained, I was finally in a position to spend a little more on a Honda, and it'll take a lot to get me to go back to American cars. I've even gotten a new second Honda so my wife d
1 question (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Hm... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Hm... (Score:4, Funny)
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But the big picture here isn't being seen.
Wi
Re:Hm... (Score:5, Insightful)
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I know MS uses issues like this to push upgrades and to reduce their costs. I know that opening up their Win2K source would the equivalent of opening up lots of XP code, because the base is so similar. H
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I don't deny that Microsoft has ulterior motives for withholding the fix to the public.
Your analogy is flawed (Score:2)
Re:GMT (Score:5, Funny)
Remember this moment, people: 80 past 2 on April 47th, the moment Microsoft finally kicked Windows 2000 to the curb.
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"3 piglets, 1/16 of stone and a horn after Matins, on 3 Sunday after Xmas"
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When was the last time you saw a 1K executable on Windows? The only one I can think of is the bootloader.
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Those are rare, and the dumbing-down that is popular in operating systems will not make that better.
Running a "regedit
Re:Umm... is this really a problem? (Score:5, Interesting)
There is a reason why every system clock in an Active Directory system is synchronized. If the server's clock is off from Atomic time, so will all of the clients.