Nissan Turns to Technology to Stop Drunk Driving 287
StonyandCher writes with a ComputerWorld story about new efforts by Nissan to reduce the danger of intoxicated drinkers through technology. A trio of new features installed in a prototype vehicle demonstrated this past week are designed to minimize the damage a drunk behind the wheel can cause. "The first [system] attempts to directly detect alcohol in the driver's sweat and gear shift lever. A second system in the car uses a camera mounted in front of the driver to monitor eye movement. If the driver is drowsy it triggers the seat belt to tighten and this movement will hopefully snap the driver out of their drowsiness or prompt them to take a rest. A third system monitors the path of the vehicle to ensure it's traveling in a straight line and not weaving about the road, as is common with a drunken driver."
Mandatory? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Mandatory? (Score:5, Interesting)
Companies.
We've been trialling a system which uses special glasses to monitor the eye movements of dump truck drivers in open cut mining. The goal is to identify impairment - not just drugs and alcohol, but fatigue, illness or anything which might affect the operator's ability to control the vehicle.
In the system we use, the monitoring computer has a three-stage alarm, first notifying the driver and their supervisor of the potential for impairment, second stage suggesting that the operator park up at first opportunity, and in the third stage, loud alarms in both the truck and control room. Third stage also throttles back the truck.
Fully loaded, these trucks mass in excess of 400 tonnes, so any accident is going to be significant. How valuable it will be to transfer the technology to cars is uncertain, but I'd say there are plenty of circumstances where the consequences outweigh the costs, even for small vehicles.
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Of course, I am not in the least
Re:Mandatory? (Score:5, Interesting)
It's not an oppositional situation.
The trial was run in very close consultation with the employees. They, and their supervisors understand that the fatigue or impairment the machines are measuring is a hazard to be managed carefully, not a reason for disciplinary action.
The data collected by the system is also useful in planning things like break times and alertness aids like spot quizzes. This is the system, if you're interested;m l [optalert.com]
http://www.optalert.com/johns_drowsiness_scale.ht
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Wake Me Up When Its Cheap (Score:5, Insightful)
On the other hand, the sleep detection system would be a godsend. If the price was right, I would happily get one of those things installed. I don't want it turning off my car in the middle of the highway, but tightening my seatbelt, beeping, or in some way warning me that I look like I am nodding off would be wonderful. Obviously, you would want a way to turn off the damn thing so that it doesn't confuse bobbing your head along to music with falling asleep, but so long as you can turn the thing off and it is relatively cheap, I think lots of people would go for it and get it installed voluntarily.
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This exists for truck drivers. I don't know what the price is for regular consumers, but these units [attentiontechnology.com] have been on the market for a few years. The nice thing about this system is that it warns you about being tired before you start weaving all over the road. The lead time gives you a chance to find a place to rest. The system also lets you see your drowsiness build up
I'm with the Hyperbole Police (Score:4, Insightful)
Aside from issues with your use of hyperbole (which I hope it is), I would like to defend the parent and perhaps shed some light on the actions and decisions of those fully participating in society.
Sometimes when you're a grown-up, you perform certain actions that have an inherent risk. In fact, most of the actions you perform have some level of inherent risk, e.g. eating at a sit-down restaurant can lead to food poisoning, eating at McDonald's can lead to shame and indigestion, et al. Part of being a grown-up though is making responsible risk/benefit analysis about these decisions. Usually this means that you don't have to even consider the possibility (although real) of food poisoning from your favorite restaurant, unless there has been a spate of recent incidences that you are aware of.
When it comes to driving, we have to assess inherent risks due to a variety of factors including but not limited to:
1) The mechanical condition of our car, i.e. how certain our we that are brakes are good and will respond as we expect when we need them to, and also, the condition of our tires and are we going to be driving in conditions where a tire blowout would threaten our life, or the lives of others around us, etc.
2) The weather conditions, i.e. how less competent of a driver are we in heavy rain, or when the roads are icy, or when visibility is very low (fog)
3) Our physical/mental conditon, i.e. are we incredibly angry about something (we usually make poorer judgments when we are), or are we tired? and how tired are we (could be just a little bodily tired from a good physical workout, or could be that we're drowsy due to lack of sleep), etc.
In combination with all these inherent risks we weigh the benefits of the drive:
Are we returning home from a long absence to those who are worried about, and are deeply missing us? Or perhaps we are just going out for a drive because we have nothing better to do(people who don't know about /. still do this, I've heard). Or, as an extreme example, we're rushing a loved one to the hospital, where every minute counts towards saving their life
In the end, almost every mature adult consciously, or unconsciously, makes this risk/benefit assessment before driving, and very few let their decision to drive be governed absolutely by any criteria about the circumstances of themselves their vehicle, or their environment.Re:Mandatory? (Score:5, Informative)
I've seen balloons, blown up before the drinking.
Re:Mandatory? (Score:5, Insightful)
That's like, premeditated fucktardery...
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Buy yourself a portable breathalyzer [amazon.com] if you're not able to control your drinking. Not only will it let you know if you're too impaired to drive, it can also be great fun at parties. The person with
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Accurate... (Score:2)
And this new Nissan system will be? I can't imagine sweat sensors can be more accurate than breath. Some people sweat more, it varies with the weather, etc., etc.
Besides, I'm sure the real drunks will figure out how to change gear with a kleenex or something.
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I've seen a website refer to this as "coma/death" before, but I'd love to be corrected.
It's not absolute scale. There differences between people to begin with, and you build tolerance for alcohol, so heavy drinkers can be just moderately drunk at .4 even though a person not used to it could be in coma or even dead.
/driver_has_18_times_legal_alcohol_limit/ [boston.com]
http://www.boston.com/news/odd/articles/2006/05/23
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2005/01/04/drunk-bul garian-050104.html [www.cbc.ca]
The latter is close enough that I bet many have had >1.0 and lived, especially since he wasn't even passed out.
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How quickly does topical alcohol evaporate? (Score:2)
oh no (Score:5, Funny)
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If you really have to build heat into your tires, use your brakes or spin your tires. Of course, the only time you ever need to do this is when racing...
What About Bartenders or Waiters? (Score:4, Interesting)
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Re:What About Bartenders or Waiters? (Score:5, Insightful)
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More seriously, I think there is still value in a system that requires a deliberate attempt to subvert it. A person getting into a car and driving after possibly having too much to drink could argue that they thought they were under the limit (0.05% here in Australia). A person getting into a car and deliberately circumventing a system that has already told them quite clearly that they
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A person getting into a car and deliberately circumventing a system that has already told them quite clearly that they are over the limit could not, or certainly could not nearly as easily.
Suppose the system was out of alignment? It isn't maintained regularly, and is likely to be even less reliable than the breathalyzers are. If I had something like that that acted up (or I was diabetic), damn right I'd circumvent it.
Hmmm (Score:4, Funny)
Sorry Nissan, only my wife touches my gear shift lever.
Badum, tiss!
Thanks, I'll be here all week, enjoy the buffet, don't forget to tip your waitress.
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Now instead of drunk drivers, we're going to have drunk drivers that get their wives (or their kids!) to do the shifting for them.
Probably a bad idea. (Score:4, Insightful)
Probably a bad idea. It will encourage drivers to drive drunk. Experience with ABS systems on cars indicates that it encourages drivers to brake more aggressively. This seems more of the same.
Drowsy driver detection systems have been around for a while, mostly on large trucks.
We're in an annoying period where vehicle control systems can help a bit, but aren't yet good enough to reliably drive cars automatically. That's getting close, though. A few more rounds of the DARPA Grand Challenge, in tougher situations, and we'll be there.
Re:Probably a bad idea. (Score:5, Interesting)
ABS compensates when the driver brakes too hard, but does not discourage the driver from taking such action in the future. A drunk-driving detector won't compensate for your poor driving while drunk, but it will instead warn you of your impairment to discourage you from continuing to drive. Those are two very different concepts.
Re:Probably a bad idea. (Score:4, Insightful)
One beer... I'm pretty sure I'm sober enough to drive.
Two plus... I'm not sure, better not chance it.
Now
One beer... It lets me start, I'm sober.
Five beers... It won't let me start. Yay, I can rely on this.
Three beers... Eh, I'll give it a shot. Hey, what do you know? I guess I'm more sober than I thought. Let's drive!
Whilst it's true that it's not exactly the same concept as ABS which compensates without discouraging, it does have a huge drawback in terms of giving people the sense that they can pass responsibility off on to a machine to determine if they're too drunk rather than erring on the side of caution.
Of course, the flip side is that many people don't err on the side of caution. It was an eye opener for me, moving from a country where drink driving was a major no-no to one where just about every person I meet seems to have a story about how they got pulled over after having "only had a few" and how unfair they felt it was. For people who err on the side of excess, this system will rein them in - great. For people who err on the side of caution however - and I desperately want to believe there are more people like this - it plays in to all kinds of behavioral psychology weaknesses to encourage them to stop playing it so safe. If that is indeed the larger group, it probably does make things worse overall.
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Yeah, that's the training; if you need to stop urgently, depress the brake and let the computer worry about static vs. dynamic friction. That's what it's for.
Some will abuse that technology by cutting people off and braking. That's not a problem with the technology. The problem is that some people are jerks.
Jerks will similarly try to abuse this technology with such measures as rubber gloves, sung
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There will never be self-driving cars in America (Score:2)
Self-driving cars will never happen, at least not in the foreseeable future. The problem isn't that the technology and software won't be able to do it - it's that product liability will make it infeasible. No human or computer can always prevent a crash caused by another car running a red light. Yet almost certainly the computer's manufacturer would be sued in that sit
Re:Probably a bad idea. (Score:5, Insightful)
As a volunteer ambulance driver I've performed that service for many people.
Sadly, not all of them were the ones who were taking the risk of driving drunk or fatigued. They just got in the way of someone who'd made that choice.
Isn't Hand Sanitizer... (Score:2, Insightful)
The other two options sound more effective to me.
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Yes and no (Score:5, Insightful)
Maybe I should just get into restoring cars that were made before the integration of microprocessors
Re:Yes and no (Score:5, Insightful)
Shit... (Score:3, Funny)
This looks like a legal nightmare to me.... (Score:5, Insightful)
In addition, as the auto manufacturers start trying to determine if the driver is drunk or not, this might put them at a legal risk for any false positives or negatives. IANAL, but I'm assuming that the manufacturers of those breath analysis devices that the court forces convicted drunks to put on their cars are somehow indemnified or otherwise held blameless should the user find some way to defeat them. Because this is something ordered by the court, they may be exempt from legal liability. I'm not convinced that any car manufacturer would be so lucky if they start putting them on "production" vehicles. There are plenty of hungry lawyers ready to start some type of class-action suit on behalf of injured third parties. To this end, I say keep up the good work lawyers, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
Just another case of "more nanny state, less personal responsibility."
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You could make pretty much the exact same lunatic nanny state arguments about speed limits, or speed bumps. And there's other laws, widely accepted, which are a much stronger infringements of personal liberty - seatbelt laws, for instance. Or motorcy
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Drivers that are dangerous (but sober) are pretty easy to spot by other drivers - the cops don't go after them because stupidity is difficult to prove.
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I be there are plenty of parents who would like to have a system like this in a car they buy for their kid tho.
Drowsy Driving (Score:5, Insightful)
The other day, I was traveling down I-90 in Mass and I was pretty tired. At point point I think I closed my eyes for around 5-10 seconds, and snapped out of it and was half-way into the next lane. I stopped, got out and stretched, and finished my drive with the windows down (which did a good job of keeping me awake). Ok, sure, I *shouldn't have been driving in the first place*, but if the automatic system would have snapped me out of it when it saw me going into the next lane, or saw my eyes closed, that would have been a big help.
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You could pay a driver from that .. (Score:2)
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It was probably top gear who once tested the difference in drunk and tired driving on an oval test track. In that case, driving drunk still managed to keep lanes, but driving tired rea
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCsIdYUIHp0 [youtube.com]
Notice that they mention that it doesn't work in fog or on snowy roads! As others mentioned here, that makes it actually a higher danger for those who will solely rely on the system (as anyone will do after using it for a while).
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If one is looking for a technical solution a better one might be self-piloted cars
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Why is this kind of lapse so much more socially acceptable than driving while intoxicated? Come on people, spell it out for me.
Most people I know would admit to driving while tired/falling asleep. And yet nobody would admit to driving drunk, even if they've done it.
Easy method to beat this.. (Score:2)
Practical Joke (Score:2)
A new defense? (Score:5, Funny)
In a straight line, eh? (Score:3, Funny)
I used to like Nissan... (Score:2, Informative)
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I have magical powers (Score:2)
Enjoy.
I don't want... (Score:2)
Technology and the future (Score:2)
Now they just need to add a detector... (Score:2, Insightful)
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That's easy to do. Mobile phones can be detected with devices which are trivial to build. The phone system can tell you when every phone was on a call.
It should be a standard part of accident investigation. Get a chart of time on calls and correlate it with the time of the crash.
I can only imagine... (Score:2)
legal eagles (Score:2)
this system will no doubt require all 3 matches to slow the car and warn you that you might be in danger. weaving, plus eye movement and alcohol in your sweat no doubt indicates your. it won't just stop the car if you use hand wipes, all you geniuses spouting that are full of it.
the problem will start when some fucking moron manages to fool the system and has a crash a
Fuel on your hands (Score:2)
Mal-2
This is excellent (Score:2)
If this works as advertised, it would be a wonderful way to deter the dangerous and all-to-common crime of DUI.
Of all these ideas, the eye movement cameras are the strongest indicators of impairment, but sound difficult to implement correctly. Sluggish, jerky eye movement and poor tracking is the single strongest indicator of impairment I look for when evaluating whether a drive
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I agree totally with your argument. A drunk driver crashed on to the footpath close to my home just a couple of months ago. Luckily no pedestrians were hurt.
But once this type of system is implemented it will only be a matter or time before we hear the story of the drunk girl stranded half way
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If you can't hit a button within
oh great (Score:2)
My two cents (Score:2)
Tighten the seat belt? Wouldn't an airhorn be more effective?
Does anyone trust a self-tightening seat belt?
Whatever happened to people taking responsibility for drinking?
No thanks, ill pass (Score:2)
I also dont appreciate my car spying on me. And for the record, i dont drink at all.. let alone while driving and i still think this is a bad idea.
seems it'll need more than that (Score:2)
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I remember reading it when it came out - was just curious to re-read it...
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Alcohol-containing oral rinse solutions? (Score:3, Interesting)
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Drunk drivers will frequently react late to course corrections and do so in a more sudden manner. Driving a straight line isn't necessarily the problem that incorrectly reacting to a turn is.
I could be wrong about this, but if somebody is sober enough to have the two cases confused it is unlikely that t
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The car will not allow the sanitizer to evaporate.
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ABS, traction control, collision avoidance hardware, side-curtain airbags, and the like are all optional equipment. Just try buying a base model entry-level car--it likely won't have anti-lock brakes. Two examples: Ford Focus, Nissan Versa.
Now, if you mean that you can't get an upscale car without these features, then yes. Damn Audi for mak
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> crap.
Funny you should mention that, because when I still lived in Sweden, I had a Saab 9-3 150 bhp TurboDiesel car with Airbags, Seatbelts, ABS, traction control, anti-spin, side-curtain airbags and another feature you don't mention: Adaptive steering. Meaning that depending on the steering the driver was doing and the position, speed and lateral movement of the car, the car would decide to help steering
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About 10 years ago, I was in a 100+ MPH head on collision with a drunk driver who was being pursued by the local police. I was driving a Pont
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If you honestly don't know whether you're over the limit... you're over the limit.
Rubbish. If you have a high tolerance for alcohol, it's easy to be over the limit without realising it. Not everyone is tipsy after a couple of beers.
Further, being "legal" is not a guarantee, either. I know many people whose physical and mental abilities are noticably and quickly impacted after relatively tiny amounts of alcohol (a single glass of wine) that would not put them over the legal limit (0.05 in Australia).
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