Irish Gov't Seeks To Rein In Cyber Bullying 211
An anonymous reader points out a story on the Irish Times that says "the Irish government is looking for ways to combat 'cyber-bullying' after data indicated that a significant percentage of young children are subjected to this kind of abuse via their mobile phone and popular social network accounts. The industry has been asked to come up with solutions for this problem and a government office is due to publish a guide on the issue in the near future. Surely this is a problem faced by children in all developed countries these days." Add "for the children" to the list of reasons to track the Web-site habits of mobile web users in Ireland.
Just plain bullying (Score:5, Insightful)
The main point here though is that so-called "Cyber-bullying" is just bullying. Various organisations have been sensationalising this issue by prefixing [i]cyber[/i] and pretending it's a new issue. What about when I was receiving phone calls at all hours? Was that cyber-bullying? It was just called bullying in my day.
I really think that this whole issue is doing more to harm the reputation of the internet/computers/phones than it is to resolve the larger issue of bullying. All I expect to see from this is a large set of draconian yet ineffective restrictions placed around communication media and this is something that disgusts me for a lot of reasons.
Re:Just plain bullying (Score:5, Insightful)
I would like something to be done about bullying as a whole, but I suspect that when implemented under the banner of cyber-bullying it will completely miss the point and will likely be doomed to failure. The emphasis on the 'cyber' aspect tells me it'll be cheap and ineffective technological measure when we could be using this opportunity to tackle bullying in the wider scheme.
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Sadly, you are probably correct. However, this problem has been around for a very long time, so it's not probable that anything new will be found for 'traditional' bullying.
However, new technologies raise new opportunities, and concerns, and thus require new responses.
I believe there was a case recently where some poor child committed suicide after being persecuted online. So, yes, I think they should do something specfic about this.
Having said that, as a parent I recognise that the best thing to do is to
Re:Just plain bullying (Score:5, Insightful)
The solution is to stop raising a bunch of rude brats. The parents/teachers need to tell teenagers, "You have the body of an adult (reproduction, et cetera), and now it's time to start acting like one. Abuse of your peers will Not be tolerated." The bullying messages and phone calls are just a symptom, and treating the symptom is not going to cure the disease. You need to go directly to the source and teach teens to act with manners & that insulting other people is Not acceptable.
I too was bullied as a kid, not with internet but with verbal abuse, which led me to keep quiet so nobody noticed me. I never "escaped" that verbal abuse until I found myself in college with an adviser who refused to tolerate such behavior from his students. That's what we need today, but starting at age 13. If we can teach teens about adult behaviors like sex, then surely we can teach them manners too.
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You can't teach manners. Manners are something you learn by watching others you respect.
Bullys typically have respect for no one, they are taught out of fear. Teaching one out of fear means they won't learn by typical methods, because they are always being scared of something.
Typically, a bully has a father that's an asshole. Typically. Or no father at all, and a mother who is a whore. Either way, a simple 2X4 upside the bully's head will work wonders. It DID for me in 7th grade.
--Toll_Free
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P.S.
When my mom was a U.S. high school girl in the 1940s, she had to take classes in Etiquette. I don't know why U.S. schools stop teaching such things, but it's time to start doing it again. It's not enough to just recite numbers and dates. A citizen must also know how to interact with one's peers without degrading them.
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"I believe there was a case recently where some poor child committed suicide after being persecuted online. So, yes, I think they should do something specfic about this."
Two thigns:
First, people have committed suicide after being bullied since before there was an Internet. Such cases illustrate serious problems, but those problems are not technology-related. The "cyber" prefix really is just media technophobia at work.
Second, there's more than one problem in play when bullying leads to suicide. The obvio
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it'll be cheap and ineffective technological measure
Its cheap, and effective: effective in convincing the voters (and themselves) that the government is "doing something".
Also, the Irish government is probably happy to announce anything that will distract attention from the economic problems they will have if Obama cracks down on American companies using transfer pricing to move profits to low tax countries.
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My kids are in school in Ireland as we speak, and as a parent I have come across a number of incidents where bullying was an issue and in every case the problems were dealt with very effectively under the existing guidelines by the school.
I only point this out, because it appears from your posting that you are suggesting that there is no framework in Ireland for dealing with this and this cyber-bullying measure is the first one - that's not true.
Now, my kids are in primary school - and I do have concerns ab
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My wife is Irish, we visit for several weeks every year. I can see the widespread practice of bullying among Irish children - feeding aggression among adults, who also bully children, perpetuating the cycle.
If Irish people could break the cycle by stopping adults from bullying children (and each other), the "cyberbullying" would disappear, too.
Online expressions are just a reflection of the in-person character of the people. Rehab the characters, and the reflections will follow suit. Treat only the symptom
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The whole you are glad something is being done scares me.
When I was a kid, I got bullied, too. To the point of being put in the hospital, twice.
I didn't learn about the legal system, I learned about a fucking 2X4 piece of wood.
After that, no more bullying problems.
The problem with kids, and this solution, is it breeds pussies. For lack of better terms.
We have kids KILLING THEMSELVES today because someone talked "smack" about them. Honestly, are you THAT F U C K I N G mentally weak, that someone who says
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Re:Just plain bullying (Score:5, Insightful)
and to the parents that don't teach their children how to cope with being bullied.
Bollocks . When mob mentality comes into it, you see how well you stand up against 15-20 people. It's starts with the leader of the cool gang, then it's the cool gang and then it's the people siding with the rest of them to keep on the good side.
It's amazing how one or two bad apples can turn the tables. It is not the Hollywood image of one bigger kid pushing people around - far from it. The big kids, much like bigger dogs, have nothing to prove.
I used to be bullied (Score:5, Funny)
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It's like prison, tell your kid on their first day of school, "Go in there, find the biggest kid in the cafeteria and kick his ass through his teeth." /sarcasm.
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Who said its a hollywood style bullying? You learn or you suffer its true for anything in life. Learn to adapt or go extinct etc... If you prepare your children for life they should not be in that situation in the first place and if they do find themselves in it they should have the skills to deal with it.
There are always going to be people that try to assert themselves by being a bully to someone be it physical or mental.
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I second that bollocks. However, three or four of our bullies were built like Biffa Bacon, one of them used an air-pistol to bushwhack other kids on the way to the sweet shop, and they were the main culprits in a group of 15-20 people. Kids who showed obvious transgender behaviour were basically permenent toast. Geeks frequently got hassled. None of the big kids who *weren't* bullies got picked on.
This is a *basic* problem. In adult life, sociopaths end up running countries, religions, and/or large amoral c
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If there are any adult nearby who observe this behavior, then they should step-in and break-up the clique. And lecture them in detention about why they are adults (capable of reproduction, et cetera), and they should be acting like adults, not insulting their peers.
Re:Just plain bullying (Score:5, Insightful)
Oh please. Adults act exactly the same way.
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And this will make a difference how? last time I checked assholes tend not to listen.
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So what you say we should pump them with tranquilizers or what? I can agree that recognizing who is doing it may help but it can only do this much. I suppose there are many things that one can do - supervising the youth is one thing. The other is supporting youngsters in organizing themselves. That comes handy later too when it comes to fighting pricks in high offices. Of course that can deteriorate into gang fight but that is why you should educate people into thinking global about this and to teach them t
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The best way to fight that kind of mob bulling IMO:
You pick the weakest of that mob. There's always that kind of guy that becomes a bully just to avoid being the victim instead, but that it's not physically strong. Find him when he's alone and beat the crap out of him. No mercy, no remorse. Beat him to a bloody pulp.
When the rest of the pack see that you're not a wimp and that if pushed too far you will stand your ground, they'll leave you alone. It's not a pretty advice, to pick on the weak. But the world
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My initial assumption was that you're unable to beat the big bully (or at least harm him enough to make him reconsider his actions). But if you can face him, please be my guest and make him a new face :D
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If someone start senting your child death threats written on postcards there's already a system. Email and texts are no different.New tech doesn't always need new rules.
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I agree with this and all the other posts in this thread you wrote. Sometimes people who were bullied are reluctant to talk about it. You are, I think, corageous to be so open about it - I know I still feel it's hard to talk about this kind of experience.
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When mob mentality comes into it, you see how well you stand up against 15-20 people.
1 handgun will disperse an angry mob of 20 very fast.
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Sounds like politics.
Re:Gangs vs. BigGuys (Score:2)
Are there regional specialties to bullying?
I never had real trouble with gangs. In my youth it was always the scary Lone Wolf. Built like a Coal Loader and psychotic to boot. My best defenses were always playing the clown and doing his homework.
Re:Just plain bullying (Score:5, Interesting)
if you cant learn to stick up for yourself as you are growing up god forbid when it comes time to step into the real deal where people are cut-throat just put a nicer face on it.
Let's have a Skinnerian look on this: rewarded behavior is repeated, punished behavior is not. Behavior that elicits no response, either good or bad, is not repeated, but that's learned slower.
To make bullying stop, you either have to not respond at all, or to punish the bullies. How could you punish them? Beat them up? I've done that a few times, doesn't work; plus, you get punished for it when people tell on you. Call them names? They don't care. Break their stuff? They'll enact their revenge. They're always better armed than you, because there are more of them. When ever you try standing up for yourself, they tread on you some more, and the "justice" system treads on you as well.
Then you can do nothing. That makes you an easy target, and it means you effectively don't mind them calling you names, punching your lunch out of your hands and onto the floor, breaking your stuff and being violent towards you.
You're saying that people should either fight an unwinnable war, or let themselves be conquered without offering any resistance. Right?
Re:Just plain bullying (Score:5, Insightful)
Disproportionate retaliation works great.
I remember a few grades below me there was one of those overgrown douche-wads who tended to push round the others because he could. Well one day he went after a weedy little guy who happened to have balls like church bells.
The ambulance took the dickhead away with a 5 inch strip of skin missing from the side of his face and since the teachers heard the full story all the little guy got was a few detentions.
Big guy stopped hassling others and nobody ever fucked with the little guy every again.
We also had a case where a gang of 8 guys attacked some of my friends, I'll give the full story if anyone wants but it ended with a mob or 70 chasing them across the quad. We had plenty of fights at our school but gangs of tough guys attacking individuals simply wasn't tolerated by the students themselves.
School is basically like prison with less rape and more monotonous labour.
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Less, but not zero... hehe.
Re:Just plain bullying (Score:4, Insightful)
It has to be back-of-the-head violence, in their sleep violence, weaponised violence, scarring violence.
Sad, I know.
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"rewarded behavior is repeated, punished behavior is not"
Haha, oh how 1950.
You can't really just say that with out following up on what punishment and reward is.
There are people that go into prison many times because that is the reward, to them.
There is another option:
Intelligent resistance. Use your head, use social skills, learn to understand what the real goal is, and when you have won.
There are ways to destroy someone utterly.
Give some false information to the college they hope to get into, plant some w
Ironic you've posted anonymously (Score:3, Interesting)
It's ironic the person who says bullying doesn't exist and you should learn to deal with it hasn't got the courage to post with even a slashdot identity, but as anonymous coward.
Suggests they are too scared to stand by their posting, are frightened of being bullied?
Re:Just plain bullying (Score:5, Insightful)
I can't agree more. On the risk of sounding jaded/damaged, I have the following comments:
As someone that got bullied in the Netherlands I can vouch for the fact that the solution shouldn't come from outside. After many years of psychological and physical bullying (I still have a skull fracture scar to show for it), I decided to fight back at the age of 13. I did this in such a way that I immediately got left alone for the rest of my school years.
Take the biggest bully. Hurt him. A lot. Publicly. Even if you end up on the losing end of the fight at large, it's over. People might think you're a psycho, but it beats being bullied. Turning to a mobile operator to "prevent" bullying is sheer nonsense. The wankers will always find a way. It's not an Irish problem and it's not a problem of technology. It's about me sending my kid to self defense classes as soon as he's old enough.
I've found that those that excel at violence really don't need to use it.
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Hah!
Like they feel sorry in person.
total bullshit.
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The guy that bullied me in person was sorry afterwards. I made sure of that.
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Traditional bullies never felt sorry for their victims either. But cyber-bullying certainly lowers the bar for the lack of self-esteem required.
What really makes cyber-bullying worse than regular bullying, is that the victim can't identify their attackers.
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I'm sorry, would you like to come back to earth, where the rest of us live?
Bullies feel bad. The only bully I knew that felt bad was the one I hit upside his head as hard as I could with a piece of wood.
Also got me out of being fucked with by people with IQ's smaller than their dick size.
Grow a pair, grow up, and learn to deal with your problems, instead of thinking it's everyone elses problems to deal with.
That's what got the world into the mess it's in now, nobody takes responsibility for themselves or th
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Here-here. It always makes me shudder on how ineptly this "new type" of bullying is handled. Rather that trying to prevent it, I say it should be allowed to happen, and then handled using conventional, existing laws
If you put all your effort into preventing "cyber" bullying, you're missing out on the greatest gift those bullies can give you: Immutable, public and permanent evidence of their wrong
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The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is... (Score:3, Insightful)
The writer says, "Surely this is a problem faced by children in all developed countries these days." I would think that it's actually worse here because people seem to become more and more rude in real-life with every passing second.. and the (falsely) perceived anonymity of "hiding behind" a social networking engine or a mobile phone tends to exacerbate the issue.
Another part of the problem is that most Irish kids are shuttled to and from school in big feckin' SUV's [which should be banned in this country anyway..especially UK-made Range Rovers], and rarely actually socialise with other kids outside of school. This lack of socialisation isolates kids from seeing the pain inflicted by their actions. If they don't see the pain caused, then they have no empathy for the "victim." Here as in the U.S. children are almost completely isolated from adults in the name of "keeping them safe from perverts" and never learn any social skills from adults either.
In true American style, the Irish, instead of addressing the problems being generated by people, want to enact idiotic, ineffectual regulations and monitor the tools these people use. This approach will not work.
Why are the people in charge always so fucking stupid and clueless?
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Perhaps because the people who put them in charge (being a democracy and all that) are even more stupid and clueless? After all, half of the population have below-average IQs [slashdot.org].
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Half the people have under median IQs you mean.
Not average. For an extreme example, 9 people have 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104 IQ respectively and #10 has 150. The average IQ in that room would be 105, and 9 out of 10 would have below average IQ.
You keep using this word.... (Score:2)
The GP would be correct if the population was evenly distributed. This is not likely in a population of 10, but is probable in a population of 5,000,000.
(This obviously doesn't apply in Cork, where they're all thick.)
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Sorry, I didn't understand a word of that.
Maybe you could take the potato out of your mouth!
Re:The problem with cyber-bullying in Ireland is.. (Score:4, Informative)
Yes, that would be true for that particular sample, but the IQ of a population is defined in terms of the distribution of intelligence [wikipedia.org] - and 100 is defined as the median intelligence. Since intelligence follows a normal distribution, median coincides with mean (average), and half the people have below average IQ.
Your sample represents a skewed distribution, but if we take your numbers to be the score an arbitrary intelligence test used to rate IQ, the median score is 123. So to have a 100 IQ, you'd have to score 123, placing the lower 9 in your group firmly under the wire.
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Thank you.
Not that I'm normally mean or anything, but what's the use of a subtly insulting joke if those it insults, don't understand what the terms that one employs mean? That's as good a reason as any to use the more generally understood and colloquial term.
And then there are some that thought that post was all about statistics.... >:->
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Here! Who the fuck do you think you are spouting that kind of shite! I was raised to sit up straight, and be polite, and peel me spuds before aeatin' 'em. I'm as polite and well mannered a Irishman as ever you'd meet. So feck off with yourself!
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Irish kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.
American kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.
British kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.
German kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.
French kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are what lead to common-decency.
ALL kids are taught NOTHING about manners, and manners are w
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In true American style?
Remember, anonymous asshole, we came from your country to escape the persecution your pretty much talking about now.
So, anon ass, seems Irish and English bullying have been going on longer than whats that? AMERICA HAS BEEN IN EXISTANCE?
Stop with the veiled assinine attempts at throwing stones. Yes, it's a major problem, but it's not a problem for legislation, it's a problem for people to grow a pair of nads and actually take some personal responsibility.
In true American style, you c
This is a realworld issue, no need for the cyber (Score:2, Redundant)
tag. This isn't like paedophiles preying on targets, using the internet as the means of finding their victims in hopes of targeting them in real life.
This is the opposite. The bully already knows his victims, and uses the internet just as another avenue to further that bullying.
I don't know a definite answer, but attaching cyber to it seems nothing but a way to get people's fears up to pass stupid laws.
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TattleText(TM) (Score:4, Funny)
Well since filtering and heuristic analysis is probably impossible, I suggest TattleText(TM). The poor child can simply forward the offending text to a central authority. The central authority can then call the bully's mom.
Problem Solved.
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
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When my dad was bullied at an early age back in the 1950s, he and the bully got into a fight and the bully got beaten up.
I agree with most of what you said, but you have to face the fact that many (if not most) of the children that are bullied are wannabe nerds with low or no athletic advantage over the bullys. There are many cases where the school has to take some kind of measure because the kid can't stand up for himself.
This makes me think of all those comedies where the nerds beat the *blip* out of the bullys in the end. But, infortunately, this doesn't always happen in real life.
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Most of the bullies I faced in school were bigger than I was, but that didn't mean I couldn't hurt them. Bullies go for the easy targets. If you prove you're not an easy target, he won't mess with you, even if he COULD beat you.
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The bigger boy then came to my friend and said: 'Can you help me? They'll beat my ass as soon as I leave your store'. My friend laughed and said: 'You're bigger, go there and beat up the shit out of them.'.
The boy looked at my friend's face, almost crying, and said: 'Yeah, but... I'm a pathetic loser and they'll beat me even if I'm bigger.'.
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You assume you have to win. If you break a bullies nose every single time he gives you shit then how long is it going to keep up even if you get hurt worse?
The fucking "curl up into a ball" shit only makes things worse.
Worst of all is school policies where you aren't allowed hit back even when attacked. all you may do if you want to avoid suspension is wrap your arms around your head and hope the kicking stops soon.
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My school had that policy.
When I hit the bully in the head with a 2x4 piece of wood, they wanted to haul me in for a friggin military tribunal it seemed.
At that point, my mother brought in my 2 instances of being put in the hospital and copies of the NUMEROUS letters she had sent to the principal and school board.
That pretty much closed it up. They decided it wouldn't be worth it to go to court and be shown for the incompetent fucks the school admins and board actually where.
You want to stop being bullied,
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Re:Learn a lesson from America (Score:4, Interesting)
I agree. I was bullied a lot during school and it stopped when I actually threw the guy on the teachers desk. Sure, during the next break I got some but the fact that I didn't run away actually did the rest. Never had a problem again.
Bullying is just to easy. The consequences are minor and the work involved is negligible. Since you can't do anything about the work it takes, change something about the consequences.
What I never understood was that often teachers took the side of the bully. I always assumed that probably the parents of those kids weren't much better and the teachers were just afraid.
I, for one, will teach my kids that when someone tries to bully them they have to retaliate decisively, brutally and make sure everyone knows that crossing them means physical damage.
School is like the world during the cold war. You need to demonstrate your power just enough so you never have to actually use it.
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I actually had a brilliant principal when I was in elementary school. She never approved of fighting but she treated it as an issue with two sides and made sure to know both sides. Pity more people don't use that approach.
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Except a few cases where I overreacted but kids will be kids.
Kids will be kids? I lost an eye!!!!
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Kids will fight that is a fact. It can't be stopped. I'm not saying not to pull them apart, I'm saying it;s less serious than 2 adult fighting
I was never a bully, bu
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School is like the world during the cold war.
In Soviet Russia, the cold war is like school.
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I, for one, will teach my kids that when someone tries to bully them they have to retaliate decisively, brutally and make sure everyone knows that crossing them means physical damage.
Yep. I taught my son how to make a proper fist, and how to swing with his whole body. I also taught him to aim for the nose. If he hits it'll hurt like crazy. If he misses, he'll catch an eye or mouth and it'll hurt like crazy. Finally, I taught him that he will never get in trouble with me for defending himself or his siblings.
This came up exactly one time, and he took my advice. His teacher told me what happened and I explained that he was following my instructions. She nodded and said that the bul
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They tried that way with me, after hitting someone in the head with a piece of wood.
My mother brought in the letters she had written to the school and the board. That pretty much closed that problem. The incompetents that buried their head in the sand decided it was easier to deal with a bully firsthand, than have some lunatic mother bully them around.
Incidentally, I was never bullied again. News of the attack on my went from school to school within the district, and when we moved, it was known I wasn't
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.
Real-world examples seem in order here.
Because in searching Google they are mighty hard to find.
The arrest of the victim, one suspects, is most likely to happen when h
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read the comment below yours.
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This is about the kids who do not have it within their power to fend off bullies, and end up being systematically abused for years, or even their entire lifetime.
Your Dad's solution was correct:.confront the bully, preferably in a very public way, and force them to feel what it's like to be humiliated, or at least make them fear that they will face retaliation instead of complacency if they target you.
Fo
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Man, this post should be modded +10 He Gets It.
Seriously. Putting the video of beating a kid up on utube is over the top. It not only makes you a bully, but sets you up legally as you are now premeditated.
All you have to do is kick the living fuck out of one of the bullies once. Even if you get the crap beat outta you, you will gain the RESPECT of those bullying you (respect and fear have a fine line. Typically, those that bully others don't understand or want to recognize that fact). Once you have res
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If you're too weak to even harm the big bully, pick one of the weakest bullies (those that are always around the big bad guy) and beat him. Hard. Bloody. The rest will take the hint that even if they can beat you, it's going to cost them a broken lip at the very least. Then they'll leave you alone.
with an iron fist (Score:5, Funny)
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Ah... my shoddy mastery of the English language made me read the headline as 'Irish government seeks to reign in cyber bullying', which to me seems to be a much more attainable goal.
No it's not. My govermnet holds that postion with an iron fist. USA! USA!
Here is the issue (Score:4, Insightful)
If the same behavior - one kid bullying another or saying unkind things - was occurring in a non-electronic medium, we usually would consider it the sort of thing where it's a matter for the kids to settle among themselves, or at most, by the kid's parent talking to the bully or the parent, which then usually stopped it. But now, we're going to add the ISP, school authorities, police and courts into the mix and create a tempest in a teapot.
The most someone can do electronically is say things; they can't strike you, or hurt you, or do anything to you unless you accept their comments about you as valid. Kids have had nasty cliques against other kids for dozens of centuries. We need to allow kids to learn to toughen up a bit, if we coddle them too much, they won't get through the real world, and when something comes along that mummy and daddy can't protect them against, they're going to be in a lot worse trouble.
You want to do something against physical threats, fine. You want to do something against extortion ("give me your lunch money or else"), that's something that should be taken care of. But if you're going to treat mere communication of meanness or cruelty as more serious than mere taunts in the absence of an actual threat of violence, then what you're effectively doing is treating words the same as actions. A dangerous path that ends up usually producing stupid overreactions, as a number of incidents here on Slashdot have been reported, where some kid is given an assignment to write a story or some report, but does so in an edgy or unconventional way, is considered a criminal or terrorist and is treated that way for doing nothing more than doing his classwork as he was asked to do it.
I remember one I did. We were asked to give a report in class on how to do something. Well, having read once how too many people cut their wrists the wrong way, I decided to be edgy and unconventional, and write a report on the correct way of how to commit suicide by slitting your wrists. When I stood up to read it, the kids in the class thought it was great, and the teacher even pointed out I drew in examples of how to correctly position the wrist so you cut the vein properly. (Most people bend the wrist inward; that's wrong, you should bend the wrist so it is pushed outward.) And that's all that happened (other than I think I got an A for being thorough). The teacher understood it was simply a student doing a report he knew would be different in order to have fun in class, not some "cry for help" of a depressed kid who was planning to kill himself.
Today, if some kid had done the same thing, I suspect that instead of taking it as the joke it was, he probably would have been called to the principal's office and maybe gotten detention for it, or possibly have to go see a shrink before being allowed to go back to school.
I think the previous one is backward (Score:3, Interesting)
Most people bend the wrist inward; that's wrong, you should bend the wrist so it is pushed outward.
It's been so long since I've done the report, that I think I wrote it backward in the example above, most people bend their wrist forward which pushes the vein inside and makes the suicide attempt less likely to be effective, you're supposed to bend your hand so the hand leans down so the wrist is bent inward, allowing better access to the veins to be cut.
I mean, I wouldn't want someone trying to commit suicide to use the original example wrong, have it fail to work and then sue me for giving them bad advi
Re: (Score:2)
Brilliant. That's exactly the problem. Well said.
Leaving it alo
Are there no harassment laws existing? (Score:3, Interesting)
The article mentioned how someone bullying someone else by causing their phone to ring "all hours of the day and night."
We have laws in the U.S., at least, that make it illegal to harass someone without a legitimate purpose of communication, by either excessively calling them or otherwise disturbing them for the purpose of making them upset. If they have this, then the victim of someone being called at all hours already has legal protections to stop this sort of thing if it's occurring, and no new laws are needed. If they don't, then perhaps this is what should have been done.
In fact, I like the way they're written here. If you call me, and use foul language to insult me, I can have you arrested for harassing me. On the other hand, if you call me, and irritate me so badly that I curse you out and insult you with the most degrading and harshest profanity I can think of, you can't do anything to me. Which makes sense: I didn't call you, you called me; if you disturb me, then you have to put up with my response to you. If you hadn't called me and bugged me, you would never have gotten the insult in the first place.
These are just attempts to grease the skids for more draconian restrictions on the Internet, using the boiling frog analogy. You can't drop a frog in boiling water, he'll jump out, but gradually increase the temperature and he'll sit there and allow himself to be boiled to death, or so the analogy goes. Make a huge grab for people's rights and they will squawk; nibble away in little pieces and they'll never notice until they're all gone, and by then it's too late, unless the "canary in the coal mine" starts screaming Chicken Little style at the beginning and refuses to allow even the first bite. (Talk about mixed metaphors!)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
There are real world rules and playground rules. On the playground you should be able to get into fights, even bad fights, without immediately being a criminal. Children have to learn. Bring lawyers into it and you give more power to the bullies because they are the ones who will be actively trying to use an
The great enabler (Score:3, Interesting)
Bullying is bullying, whether it happens by means of computers or not, and it is never a pretty sight. The thing about computers and the internet is that they enable people to have a far longer reach and a greater impact; and it doesn't just enable "the good guys", unfortunately. So when they talk about cyberbullying, it isn't just some lame excuse for imposing new censorship, there is actually a very real problem. In the days before the internet, bullying in the school at least stopped when you got home; but now it is on your telephone and on the internet, and with the use of simple scripts you can make it go on non-stop without any effort at all.
And the other thing about doing things on the internet is that it is more anonymous - it is so much easier to be cruel to a person you don't have to watch, unless, of course, you get a kick out of seeing others in pain, and it is a lot easier to avoid getting caught. At least right up to the point where some kid chooses to end their life, which is a problem on the increase.
I don't think the schools or service providers can do anything about the problem on their own. It is something that requires the whole of the community to work together against it; and that is yet another thing the internet has has an influence on: there isn't a lot of community feeling left. On the up-side, however, the internet could potentially be used to mobilize the community against this kind of thing.
People keep droning on about the nanny state and how everything would be better if the government just stayed out of everything; but how would that be better, when nobody in the community are willing to get off their soft arses and solve the problems? We get a nanny state because we, with our inaction and unwillingness to take part in a community, ask for it. I think it is verging on the contemptible to whine and complain about state interference when people don't even try to do it better themselves.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Bullying is bullying, whether it happens by means of computers or not, and it is never a pretty sight. The thing about computers and the internet is that they enable people to have a far longer reach and a greater impact;
Greater impact?
Your ability to ignore jackasses is much greater on the internet.
On chat? put em on your ignore list.
Emailing you? block list.
Saying things about you on a message board? same as if they're saying something about you in the newspaper.
it isn't just some lame excuse for imposing new censorship,
yes it is
there is actually a very real problem. In the days before the internet, bullying in the school at least stopped when you got home;
HAH!
they could call you, they could mail you letters, they could hang around outside your house, they could mess with you in any number of ways.
but now it is on your telephone and on the internet, and with the use of simple scripts you can make it go on non-stop without any effort at all.
When was the last time you came across a bully who could code and used it to bully people?
Be realistic.
Re: (Score:2)
*" of how people relied on various communities " not "of how people various communities "
Re: (Score:2)
I am not going to go into every little thing you write and refute them; you don't seem to be the kind of person that would try to consider things calmly and rationally.
When was the last time you came across a bully who could code and used it to bully people?
I don't know - can you code? Seriously, though, bullying isn't just reserved for those who are weak of mind; and anyway, writing a few lines in a scripting language isn't exactly rocket science. All it takes to be a bully is that you derive satisfaction from doing it; it could be as simple as having found out that being rude and making sure t
Hey kids (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
It seems pretty unlikely that their is a button to prevent people from writing negative stuff about you on the internet, and then sending the links to all of your peers.
I find it more likely that you don't know what bullying is (which I suppose is a good thing. hint: spam is not the same thing), and didn't read the article, and barely understood the summary. But that didn't stop you from posting. I do that too.
"child porn" excuse has failed, and now this ? (Score:2)
little. since most of the kids wont inform anyone that they are bullied, out of shame.
same goes for internet. internet is no different than 'real' life.
seems like another bullshitty excuse to try censorship.
Re: (Score:2)
"
little. since most of the kids wont inform anyone that they are bullied, out of shame. "
Actually, I find that it's out of uselessness.
No one takes action against the bully, ever.
Bullying (Score:2)
A bunch of people used to always give me a really hard time until they realized I'm the most chill person on earth
Problem solved, back in the 80s. (Score:2)
Didn't pretty much ALL of us watch Back to the Future?
Didn't we see how to deal with Biff?
Fuck him up while he's trying to rape the girl you love. At that point, the entire future changes, music taste changes, and the bonus is, you get a time machine.
So, nerds, get some balls!
wait, I beat up a bully in jr high school.. WTF is MY time machine.
DOC!!!!
--Toll_Free
Sticks and stones may break my bones (Score:2)
but something something something.
Just call it terrorism (Score:2)
Here in North Carolina if you make a public threat and more than one person hears it, it's considered to be terrorism. So why not extend that to online. Make a threat or insult online and it's terrorism. A straight up felony. We really don't need the quaint 18th Century notions of free speech. The risk of offending or scaring someone is just too high.