Storm Causes AT&T Outage Across Midwest 213
dstates writes "AT&T left users across several Midwestern states without cellular phone service yesterday. The outage apparently resulted from a power failure at a Michigan switching center and spread to affect level3 Internet communications. The powerful windstorm also left 400,000 users without electricity. Interestingly, except for a few reports in Chicago and Indianapolis papers, AT&T has managed to keep this out of the mainstream media. Widespread communication failures also followed Hurricane Ike in Texas earlier this year. With the increasing trend for users to drop landlines and rely only on cell phones, this is becoming an emergency preparedness issue." Yes this included me. Still does. At least my office still has power — maybe we'll just camp here tonight. :)
Roaming? (Score:5, Insightful)
The problem isn't the cell phone network per-se, but rather the inability of these providers to peer with each other. AT&T may have been down, but what about T-Mobile, the other GSM provider in the United States? When a major failure like this occurs that locks out only some cell phone users in a given area, the problem is not technology but politics.
Why, given how critical cell phones are during an emergency, this is allowed to continue is beyond me. Congress seems to care more about protecting corporate profits and reputation than providing a robust cellular network for its citizens. Hey, homeland security, are you listening? Fix this.
Re:Roaming? (Score:5, Interesting)
AT&T/Comcast/AT&T burned a LOT of bridges when they became Cingular. I used to be able to roam almost anywhere, and if a roaming tower was the best strength I connected to that. After cingular got involved they pissed off a lot of other carriers. Now my phone refuses to talk to any nearby roaming towers but tries to connect to that single AT&T tower about 12 miles away that gives me barely any signal. I have to hack my phones to disable this configuration to get decent cellphone service out of them.
Re:Roaming? (Score:5, Informative)
AT&T/Comcast/AT&T burned a LOT of bridges when they became Cingular. I used to be able to roam almost anywhere, and if a roaming tower was the best strength I connected to that. After cingular got involved they pissed off a lot of other carriers. Now my phone refuses to talk to any nearby roaming towers but tries to connect to that single AT&T tower about 12 miles away that gives me barely any signal
I don't think that really has to do with burning bridges. It has to do with AT&T not wanting to pay money for you to roam. It costs them money every single minute that you are using another carriers network.
I used to have a T-Mobile phone (had to ditch them for Verizon when I moved in with the GF -- no signal at her house) and they did the same thing. They would disable roaming on AT&T/Cingular in areas where they had coverage. Even if you were in a zone with no T-Mobile service you couldn't hop onto Cingular. To be able to roam on Cingular you had to drive out of the county where T-Mobile had native coverage -- then you'd be able to connect to and use the Cingular network. If you were within the county where they had native service but happened to be in a dead zone you were SOL -- roaming wasn't allowed.
I have to hack my phones to disable this configuration to get decent cellphone service out of them.
I'm surprised that worked. With GSM your home network decides whether or not you will be allowed to connect to that roaming partner based on the location area code [wikipedia.org]. If that LAC indicates an area where they have native service they probably won't let you connect to the roaming partner. If it indicates an area where they don't have native service then you stand a better chance of being allowed to use that roaming partner.
Re: (Score:2, Redundant)
Does this kind of situation explain why we in North America are a little bit "behind" Europeans and Asians when it comes to the "cell phone" and exploiting its maximum potential?
I hear the "cell phone" elsewhere in the world is capable of so much more than simply making calls and texting, which are the bulk of what we use cell phones for over here.
Re:Roaming? (Score:4, Insightful)
Does this kind of situation explain why we in North America are a little bit "behind" Europeans and Asians when it comes to the "cell phone" and exploiting its maximum potential?
No. All this situation relates to is which networks you are allowed to roam on. Europe works much the same way. If you have Deutsch Telekom phone you probably aren't going to be able to connect to and use Vodafone's network in an area where DT has native coverage. Why should they pay Vodafone a per minute rate for you to roam when they have a native network in the area where you happen to be?
I hear the "cell phone" elsewhere in the world is capable of so much more than simply making calls and texting, which are the bulk of what we use cell phones for over here.
*shrug*, we have a smartphone market. I haven't been in Europe for a few years but the last time I was over there I was actually disappointed with the state of 3G. It's probably better now but when I was in Europe their 3G offerings weren't any better than ours.
Japan and South Korea are different animals -- they are a full generation ahead of Europe and the US and people use their phones for all manner of things over there. That's as much cultural as anything -- how many Americans don't even see the point of SMS let alone internet browsing? Most people I know with phones regard them as phones and don't care about the extra features.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
there are major cultural differences between Japan/South Korea and the U.S. to be sure, but there are also fundamental socioeconomic & technological differences as well. these things are inextricably tied to one another i think, so you really can't discuss one without the other.
one major point of divergence is Japan's more progressive approach to public infrastructure. whereas the US favors privatization and deregulation, the Japanese government takes a more pro-active approach in promoting technologica
Re: (Score:2)
Answer: "Not enough" since we're getting inane txt-speak commercials about it.
What [tivo.com] are these commercials you speak of?
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Because the native network is not as strong of a signal, and it would be a better service for the customer? Seriously, if the companies were FORCED to allow this, they'd either 1) continue eating the cost or 2) improve signal in the affected area. If they did 3) raise rates and do nothing else, they'd quickly lose customers to the provider with better coverage.
Raising rates is the likely outcome of a mandate like that. I doubt many people would switch to the provider with "better coverage" because "better coverage" is very subjective. Yeah, AT&T might have better coverage inside Wally World than T-Mobile but if T-Mobile works everywhere else do you really see many customers switching over it?
I'm not a fan of Governmental mandates but if you want to impose them on the wireless industry I can think of much more important things to fix than mandated roaming.
Re: (Score:2)
Except this is a larger area than a single store. If i can't get reliable coverage in half my county, people ARE likely to switch. It's actually the reason I'm on Verizon. I hate them, and would rather use pretty much ANY other provider... but none of them have close to the coverage of Verizon.
So your proposal is to mandate that other carriers be forced to let you roam on Verizon's network so you don't have to do business directly with Verizon? Obviously you've decided that the coverage Verizon offers is more important to you than the other reasons you hate them -- otherwise I assume you'd be doing business with someone else. What's the problem here? If you don't like Verizon switch to T-Mobile -- they are the anti-Verizon in terms of pricing plans and customer service -- but you'll "pay" for
Re:Roaming? (Score:4, Informative)
Nokia phones can get set to have a preferred tower ID. I get into them and set the preferred tower id to a roaming tower that gives full strength at my house. I used to have a blackjack, but got rid of it because it cant do that.
the preferred tower setting overrides it somehow and it works. I've been doing this for the past 4 years and they still have not canceled my account.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Then your network must allow roaming in that particular area. With GSM the network that you connect to (even if it's the native network) contacts your home location register [wikipedia.org] to find out if your phone is allowed to connect to that particular part of the network and what features are enabled on your account.
If your provider saw fit they could disable roaming and no amount of hacks to your device would override it.
I've been doing this for the past 4 years and they still have not canceled my account.
I doubt they ever would, unless you are predominately using the roaming partner instead of your
Re:Roaming? (Score:4, Informative)
There are two things at play here: The ability to control network selection on the handset, and what the cellular networks allow you to do.
On GSM devices, there's a flag on the SIM card that tells your phone whether or not to show you the "manual network selection" menu. With AT&T, their SIM cards are configured to disable this menu when you're in the US, but enable it when outside the US.
However, on many devices, you can force them to ignore the SIM setting and have manual network selection enabled always. With Motorola phones, you can do it via SEEM editing, and there's obviously a way to do it on Symbian as well. This is what Lumpy is doing.
Shakrai, what you're talking about is the actual roaming agreements between providers. This also affects network selection. Providers can specify which phones are allowed on their network. Legally, all phones must be allowed to associate with all GSM towers to provide 911 capability, but they can be limited to just that. For example, when I only have T-Mobile coverage, my AT&T BlackBerry shows "SOS" where the signal bars usually are.
AT&T and T-Mobile have been doing this for a while. They had roaming agreements where specific cell sites would allow the other operator's phones in areas where the other operator's coverage was spotty.
So when Lumpy uses manual network selection on his phone, which he had to enable by modifying something, the rules that the operators set forth on their networks still apply. If he tries to associate with a T-Mobile tower in certain areas, he will most likely get locked out, but in other areas he may not.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
My t-mobile phone roams onto AT&T quite frequently. It's a blackberry pearl. This is in an area with t-mobile coverage
Then T-Mobile allows roaming in your area. Typically they don't in areas where they have native coverage. Go to T-Mobile's coverage map [t-mobile.com] and key in zip code 13760. Look at all the dead zones and notice where the roaming coverage is. Then go to AT&T's coverage map and look at their coverage in the same area.
T-Mobile won't allow you to roam on AT&T around these parts until you get out of the county where they have native coverage -- even if you are in part of the county where no coverage exists. T
Re: (Score:2)
AT&T didn't "become" Cingular, they bought them out. I'd been happy with Cingular for years; never any dead spots, never any roaming charges, then AT&T bought them and the service became nonexistant while my bills went through the roof. I think they might have bitten off more than they could chew when they bought Cingular.
As to the actual topic, the statement "With the increasing trend for users to drop landlines and rely only on cell phones, this is becoming an emergency preparedness issue" is igno
Re:Roaming? (PS) (Score:2)
The wikipedia article I linked was not correct in many aspects. For instance, it said "The hardest hit areas were in the commercial area around White Oaks Mall and along Veterans Parkway". Actually the area by what is known to locals as the "Wabash Curve" in a line to south 9th street were the hardest hit, and a stretch of Dirkeon Parkway on the far east side of town. Dirkson was closed for weeks, as it was covered in utility poles.
A commercial building by the Wabash Curve (which no longer actually exists,
Re: (Score:2)
Or, as part of the community which builds Wikipedia, YOU could fix it.
Re: (Score:2)
Nope. I gave up on editing wikipedia a long time ago, and it just keeps getting worse.
When I found I had a cataract, of course I hit wikipedia and looked up "cataract surgery". It was helpful, but the device that my doctor was to implant in my eye in place of its occluded lens wasn't listed, even though the FDA had approved its use three years earlier.
So I edited the entry, and added the acommodating lens, which my surgeon had implanted. Wikipedia mentioned the single focus IOLs that had been used since the
Re:Roaming? (Score:5, Informative)
They are trying to fix it [datacenterknowledge.com], much the same way that Sarbanes-Oxley fixes accounting problems. Communications providers are required to keep an 8 hour power backup on all sites and 24+ backup on 'important' sites like switching centers or something along those lines. The idea is that storms like those that hit New Orleans would not cause the problems that they did. This storm is exactly the thing this measure by the FCC is supposed to fix... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Legislators (Goodbye FCC) do NOT know how to run businesses. Some perhaps, but on the whole they are terrible business advisers and this legislation only proves it in the aftermath of this storm. I hold a harsh opinion of this situation because AT&T should have had backups in place to handle this situation. All Communications providers deal with such things and AT&T has enough history to know what to do... shame on them.
Re:Roaming? (Score:5, Insightful)
BTW, besides those rescuers you see on television after a storm, remember that there are ordinary heroes sitting in a truck babysitting a generator, or climbing poles, or renting a snowcat to get to the tower site so that your phone will work when you want it to. They are suffering the elements, usually alone, and bear the responsibilities of ensuring your comfort with little or no thanks. They are up all night watching the weather, planning and preparing to go babysit that tower(s) so your phone or pager will work. They work almost tirelessly for the simple comfort of knowing that when the shit hit the fan, the equipment they are responsible for did not fail. They are little appreciated on a normal day, and unseen during the emergency, but it is their dedication that you count on and not the system or the company.
Re:Roaming? (Score:5, Interesting)
I wish I had mod points for you. I used to work for a WISP and had the "privilege" of climbing towers in god-awful weather after storms to restore service to our customers. It's scary enough to climb the things in normal weather. Doing it Upstate New York in January after a storm has coated the tower with ice is absolutely horrible.
The worst part was that was my first job and I only got paid $10/hr to scale the friggen things. Looking back on it I wasn't making nearly enough money to be risking my life like that. At least our customers were appreciative though. That helped more than you can imagine.
Thats all a nice homespun story and all but.. (Score:5, Insightful)
.. if "the company" didn't pay them, they wouldn't get out of bed. Lets not pretend they're up those poles out of the kindness of their hearts.
Unsung Heros (Score:3, Insightful)
Exactly right!
Most bean counter types don't have a clue why they have all those over priced techies on the payroll, and when cost cutting comes along, they make an easy target.
I don't have to go around in bad weather fixing crappy equipment, as I'm a Network Analyst, but the details could easily fit my job.
Most of the time, I'm watching, monitoring, tweaking, updating, and so on. That's my job when the shit isn't hitting the fan. Most of the time I can avert disaster by seeing the shit before it hits the fa
Re:Roaming? (Score:5, Insightful)
Several years ago, I was driving across the country from Florida to California. I was only a couple days behind a hurricane that had made a mess. No, it was way before Katrina.
Every hotel along I-10 for hundreds of miles had utility trucks from all over the place. I usually drive at night to avoid traffic, and I know these guys need to at least get a little bit of sleep. I know the utility guys get sent out from all over the place to fix problems induced by bad storms. It never really hit me that it wasn't just a few hundred sent, but an entire army. I would stop at hotels, and they would tell me that they were completely booked up because of the utility guys. Not just their hotel, but every hotel in the city. "Try the next town, 50 miles down the road." It's not like they were hogging the rooms, they were stuffed in. One guy per bed, and a guy or two on the floor. This is our civilian army, that keeps things working after a disaster.
Unfortunately, all the general public knows is "they don't have my power on yet.", even though it is an army working hard to repair everything. People like instant gratification. They think it should be a light switch fix (hit the switch, it works).
It's a job I wouldn't want. High voltages, dangerous weather, and long hours.
Re: (Score:2)
The really stupid part of all of this? We're still using 19th-century techniques, stringing utility lines overhead rather than laying them underground where they would be unaffected by most weather.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Of course there are actual people doing the work, and "the work" may be very difficult or dangerous. But my business relationship is with the company, and it's up to that company to hire sufficient people to do that work. If something goes down, then that implies that they did NOT hire enough or the right people... or that $#!% happens, and things went down anyway despite their efforts. If it happens rarely and I get apologies, I assume the latter. If it happens frequently and I get blown off, I assume
Re: (Score:2)
Do landlines work any different?
If I get landline service from one provider and it's switching center gets knocked out during a disaster, can I then make calls through another provider?
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
I don't know about landlines in the US, but in Europe most of them are in the ground. A storm doesn't really bother them.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Crap, I just made a similar post above before I saw yours. If I'd seen yours first I'd have modded you up.
That is exactly the problem; because we built our infrastructure back when everything was bleeding edge first-generation technology, the world has passed us behind. Our internet infrastructure is still based on ARPANET-era lines in spots, our ISPs are still using first-generation broadband and because of municipalities granting monopolies they are raping us on pricing (I paid for unlimited internet that
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Roaming? (Score:4, Informative)
We're staying with relatives on a farm south of Chicago. All the AT&T phones lost their ability to dial out, yet they could receive incoming calls. Our T-Mobile phones were fine.
You're right, this is a case of corporate power struggles trumping customer service, as any of these phones should automatically fail over to another GSM network. In an emergency, dialing out is essential.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
You're right, this is a case of corporate power struggles trumping customer service, as any of these phones should automatically fail over to another GSM network. In an emergency, dialing out is essential.
T-Mobile has been known to enable unrestricted roaming during natural disasters. During non-disasters they limit the areas that you can roam based on where they have native service. If they have native service in your city you will never be allowed to connect to AT&T no matter how crappy the T-Mobile signal is. During some natural disasters they've removed this restriction and you can connect to AT&T (and other GSM providers) at will.
Comes in handy if the T-Mobile network goes down or is congeste
WPS & GETS did not work either (Score:2)
WPS [ncs.gov] and GETS [ncs.gov] did not work from my cellular phone during this time. This was quite a severe outage, and caused 'No Service' for a very wide area locally as well. I did not determine if it was due to the tower being without power though, most sites have 8-12 hours of standby power at most.
Re: (Score:2)
This is why GSM providers here are required by law to carry a call to an emergency number, no matter what provider the caller has. They're also required to give an emergency call a line, no matter what and no matter what strain is already put on the network. The only exception to this is that you may refuse emergency calls if your network is already working at maximum load AND only carrying emergency calls (pretty unlikely, but imagine a 9/11 situation).
This is why you may see the info "emergency call only"
emergency calls do whatever it takes (Score:5, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
Ah, at least on the Motorola RAZR v2, if you remove the SIM card, the phone will not be able to dial or perform any functions. It will simply stall at "Insert SIM card," and not boot.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Roaming? (Score:5, Insightful)
I would love to see the part of the Constitution that says "Congress shall provide a robust cellular network for its citizens."
Don't worry -- someone will come along sooner or later and twist the interstate commerce clause until they manage to come up with that interpretation. Remember, all parts of the Constitution should be interpreted as liberally as possible, except the 2nd amendment of course. That clearly provides for a collective right and doesn't apply to the states.....
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Interstate Commerce is such a huge loophole. It's used to pretty much neuter the powers of the state governments as Congress sees fit. Pity the Supreme Court didn't nip that in the bud back in the day; nowadays the Supremes would probably be loath to do it because it would cause chaos.
Re: (Score:2)
Seriously though, isn't it wonderful anti-gun nuts can't even make that weak argument anymore.
Oh, just wait. At the very least we've probably got another assault weapons ban [change.gov] coming back. You really would have thought that the Democrats would have learned by now.
If All You Have Is a Cell Phone... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
You could always rent a Sat-phone. They go for something like $50 a week. Expensive to buy (About $2,000), but good for a weekend in the hills where you won't get signal.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Least with my HF rigs - only infrastructure I depend on for communications are the laws of physics and the presence of time/space.
Interesting in this consumer society where paying a bill insinuates the right to whine. Kudos to those that do rather than gripe.
Office camping party! (Score:2, Funny)
Camping at the office is a time-honored tradition here in Minnesota, and now that the offices have internet access it's WAY more fun! ;)
Will AT&T repay me for the days my service was (Score:5, Interesting)
First Question of any contract: Any contract in which any of the party is unable to fulfill the terms of the contract will be is liable to either NOT collect remuneration of the said contract for that quantity, OR reimburse the amount for that period.
Will AT&T send me a check for the days my service was out?
Because last i checked, weather is not a cause for NOT fulfilling a contract. For the same reason i cannot claim weather for not paying my mortgage.
Question is, will AT&T refund the amount for the period of outage.
If not a class-action suit can be filed in coordination with other users.
Re:Will AT&T repay me for the days my service (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Will AT&T repay me for the days my service (Score:4, Insightful)
The inability for AT&T's datacenter in Michigan to have power backups that can last more than a day should hardly be considered a natural disaster.
I'd love to see something happen in terms of getting money back, but somehow I doubt most subscribers care enough to push for it.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
If the facility had the roof blown off due to the 60mph+ winds we had, and caused a safety hazard due to exposed wiring, etc.. I certainly can see a case, but this is all conjecture. Unless you (and I don't) have facts to support your postulation, we can go on feeding the echo chamber more and more!
Re: (Score:2)
No, I don't know for fact that they don't have adequate power backup. I do know for fact that they didn't loose their roof. I also know, as I live in the general area, that other than a few trees down here and there, power was the only problem.
I certainly didn't see anything about trees falling on datacenters in the storm reports I've read through. I have, however, read about many many people being out of power because of the winds.
Re: (Score:2)
Nope. Does not stand in ANY court of law.
A contract is a contract is a contract between humans.
Any court will first overrule this piece of crap and rule AT&T is liable to compensate for loss of service contracted for.
Declaration of War, Dealings with enemy and illegal items for contract are the only ones NOT enforceable by a court.
All others are strictly enforceable whatever be the cause, including but not limited to storms, rains, snow, hail, sleet, fire or loss of life of employees.
Not that am heartle
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
That's fine. If a tornado ripped through their datacenter, I could see that being Force Majeure. Failure to have a backup generator (or other power protection mechanism) is not force majeure and you would be hard pressed to find a judge that would say otherwise. Failure to have power for any reason is considered a predictable event that any datacenter operator should be able to deal with for 24 hours.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
They won't send you a check, unless you happen to have a balance in your favor when you terminate your account. Call your carrier and request a credit because of a service outage - if you are polite and a good customer (e.g., pays on time) they will give it to you...even if it was due to weather.
Making AT&T pay... (Score:4, Informative)
A Credit is NOT the same as a check.
Reimbursement needs to be in the same terms of original contract.
You don't give them CREDIT for providing you service. They take your money: period.
Similarly, ask for a check or money order sent to your address. If they refuse, sue them in small claims court for violating a contract.
Why should you accept CREDIT when they don't accept yours?
A Credit is just an interest-free loan to these guys.
Refuse to accept unilateral changes to your contract and demand the repayment from them in check or cash.
Better yet, do the following:
1) Send a registered letter to their local office demanding financial compensation for the days not in service and quote the contract. Give them 7 calendar days to pay (not working days).
2) Wait for 7 days and when they don't respond, file a complaint with small claims court. Ask the clerk to send a notice to their local exchange in telephone directory with another 7 calendar days to respond.
3) They still wont respond for $5 or $10.
4) Enter a default judgment. Tell the judge they insulted him/her by deeming this court to be beneath their status (appeals to vanity and not logic). The judge will be furious on their own to consider MAXIMUM enforcement.
5) Get the judge to declare that AT&T is in default of a debt to you. This is very important. Because this disassociates the original contract from the debt. In other words, in the eyes of law, AT&T is indebted to you for the said amount as if they borrowed money from you (in a way true).
5) Now the judge will ask what do you want to do: Request that the judge allows you to seize their assets for payment of this debt. Get a bailiff order.
6) Call your close friends/relatives and state there (from a pay phone or get somebody else to call) to gather at the local AT&T office for a fire sale.
7) Get the Sheriff and a deputy. Go to the AT&T office and paste the order to their door stating their assets are being seized for discharging a debt. Throw every employee out. Ask any protesters to be considered as disobeying a judge's order.
8) Ask the sheriff to seize their equipment and conduct an auction at the doors with Sheriff and his officers as guards.
9) Your friends and relatives should have arrived by now. Make them bid 10 cents or 20 cents for iPhones, telephones, routers, computers, etc., and sell it to them at that price.
10) Finish the sale within 15 mins enough to collct your debt. The longer you delay, the exponential the probability that some retarded employee will call a AT&T lawyer who gets the judgment suspended.
11) Now you have a nice collection of worthy items for the $10 you were owed by AT&T. Plus AT&T credit is screwed because you had a lien and auction of their property.
If you had owed 30 cents on a mortgage that was overdue, ANY bank would do the same to you.
Re:Making AT&T pay... (Score:4, Funny)
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Most people accept corporate overlordship without questioning. Iam not one of them.
Press coverage (Score:2, Funny)
I was going to notify the press, but I couldn't get any calls on my cell phone to go through.
It is easy to keep that out of the news (Score:4, Funny)
They are major advertisers and can pretty much control what is reported about them most of the time. All they had to do was make a few calls... oh wait...
Not a conspiracy (Score:5, Informative)
AT&T has managed to keep this out of the mainstream media
I'm in Arizona, and I saw that AT&T service was down in the midwest from multiple sources, before I finished my first cup of coffee. If there's been any lack of information reported about this, my guess is that's because the press is more concerned about hundreds of thousands who are without power in below freezing conditions, rather than a few people who can't make phone calls.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
At first, all but relatively local sites quit responding, them eventually DNS quit resolving altogether. Tracerouts to some IP addresses I knew all stopped at a router *.washington.level3.net (which I figured is Washington DC). About 4-5 hours later, everything started working again.
I still wouldn't have associated this with the AT
What about the recent ice storm in the Northeast? (Score:2, Interesting)
Natural disasters seem to be all the rage lately.
A few weeks ago, the U.S. Northeast was hit by a major ice storm. At the peak, ~1.4 million people were without power [reuters.com] across Massachusetts, New Hampshire, Maine, and upstate New York. FEMA declared emergencies in several areas, and each state declared emergencies and disaster areas in additional areas. Like a lot of people, I lost power for several days, which means I also lost heat and water (not on municipal water or on piped gas). This guy [tordevries.com] had the pr
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Welcome to Canada - we see that all the time in Montreal; it's actually quite beautiful, until it gets heavy enough to snap trees, down powerlines, make sidewalks and roads unnavigable.
Re: (Score:2)
New News and Wireless Service (Score:3, Insightful)
The summary is full of *very* misplaced expectations regarding wireless service.
A. There was never an expectation that the service would ever be plain old telephone service (POTS) quality. Thinking otherwise just sets you up for disappointment. Telco's pretty much hate POTS because it was designed and regulated to be extremely reliable. Get a POTS line and move on.
B. ATT doesn't care if individuals go without service. A few hundred thousand users having downtime for hours is nothing because it can be blamed on an "act of God." They care if they have to go before their regulators because that costs campaign contributions.
C. I have a bank of dial-up modems as the very last line of defense in our NOC for just this reason. We deal with messages, so it would work in a bad situation. Not ideal, but I'll take it and our customer's PHB's are generally pleased we think that carefully.
POTS is good. Long live POTS.
Infrastructure! (Score:2, Insightful)
90 day profit margins have run the USA for the past 8 years - so the Minneapolis I-35 bridge collapses, New Orleans and the Gulf Coast are totaled and now we are looking at primary communications breaking down.
For more than 50 years telephone carried its own power. If your power line went down odds were that you still could call for an ambulance/fire over your telephone.
Today - we still have the weasels who claim that they are making the "homeland" safe against terrorists - but not storms!
We need infrastru
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
I-35 is an INTERSTATE HIGHWAY created by an act of Congress and signed by President Eisenhower. The Feds have the duty to maintain the INTERSTATE HIGHWAY SYSTEM.
Re: (Score:2)
The New York Times - my original home-town broadsheet - has changed from the days when it engaged in reportage and today when it kisses the ring of the VP and his minions. They sat on the Wiretapping story through the 2004 election season and they also gave that worthless minx Judith Miller carte blanch to feed disinformation about the Iraq war as proffered by Scooter Libby & Dick Cheney.
I dropped a 30+ year subscription to the NYT because of such garbage - and I hope that they lose the new building th
Re: (Score:2)
You mean the EAS that DOESN'T WORK on massive nets? http://www.slate.com/id/2157395/sidebar/2157437/ [slate.com]
Interesting (Score:2)
That's why I still have a landline (Score:2)
I rarely use it. Actually, I never do, thinking about it. But one thing is certain: It will work in an emergency situation. It is independent from the local electricity (powered by the telco, don't ask me the details), cables are down in the ground (so even a citywide fire would do little harm to them, provided the switching boxes last, which they should do, being in fireproof environments), whatever insanity happens I will most likely get to hear a dialtone when I pick up.
Call me paranoid, but considering
Re: (Score:2)
Oh c'mon, we're having a serious discussion here and you start with some made up crap. Everyone knows that the phone isn't where you're looking for aid in a zombie attack, you have your shotgun ready and a few trusted friends who happen to live (of course) right around the corner or veg' away on your sofa anyway.
I certainly don't have the landline for zombie attacks. That would be like using garlic to scare off Werewolves, you have to use the right tools for the right occasion.
It apparently takes 2 weeks to fix a tower (Score:2)
A storm, not Storm... (Score:2)
A major reason not to cancel POTS service (Score:4, Interesting)
You cell phone users just don't get it, do you?
One of the major reasons why they want you away from your landline service is that they don't have to comply with the state or fed rules, tariffs, and laws forcing them to maintain POTS service even through the worst of weather.
Lose a cell tower? Fine, two weeks to get it back up.
Lose a phone line, depending on your state, from 12 hours to a working week in compliance with PUC regulations (in Texas it's 5 days, then Austin gets froggy).
Business landline goes down, 3-5 hours, as fast as a tech can get on site after getting pulled from a lower priority job.
Business cell service breaks, ok, duh, you get the point now?
What is $15-$25/mo for basic POTS service that is there when you need it in comparison to $60+ cell service that is still not as dependable as we like it to be?
I'll keep my POTS service and call forward from it to my cell, keeps the telemarketers at bay.
Cell phones with no battery chargers? (Score:2)
I've always wondered what do people do that have dropped their landline service for cell/VOIP/Cable only service when they have a multi-day power outage? We've seen these outages after Hurricanes in the South/texas areas as well as ice storms in the midwest and northeast. In the recent ice storm (~2weeks ago) in NewEngland, all hardware stores had large signs up out front that said 'No Generators', I even heard of one guy that drove from NH to CT to get a generator.
Re: (Score:2)
It's crazy how many people who live anywhere (city or country) who don't have a maglite/crank radio/space blankets/stash of emergency food.
Re: (Score:2)
A 12V car charger will do nicely. Most phones come with one, and even if yours doesn't they're widely available and don't cost much. The charger is low current, so you don't need to run the engine while charging.
The bigger concern is the cell company's infrastructure. I can't believe they fought the FCC's run time and maintenance requirements. Because the cell phone system is part of the 9-1-1 communications infrastructure, I'd expect at a minimum NFPA 110 Class 24, level 2 [generac.com] compliance (24 hours run-time be
Re: (Score:2)
Ice storms and winter weather are nothing new (Score:4, Interesting)
And neither are technology problems.
In 1998 Maine suffered the worst ice storm in decades. Power, telephone, and cellular service were affected. Yes, cable TV also.
In Gray, Maine, I was without power for 11 days. My sister in Searsport was without for 17 days, 2 of which were unnecessary - her house was about a quarter-mile in the woods, and the crews missed her line. She had power restored a few hours after calling in and reporting she was still out, and could see lights on at neighbors' houses. Darn.
Among the events that would inform the Midwest utilities:
1. Bangor Hydro-Electric, serving North-Central and Downeast Maine reported virtually 100% loss of transmission lines and 100% of customers affected. Central Maine Power reported most customers affected north of Portland, and most transmission lines down. Both utilities reported to major customers that restoration would take weeks, and they pretty much beat thet estimate. Not bad for rebuilding either 70% or 100% of their transmission network. BHE in particular had to replace completely many miles of hi-v transmission line, with poles snapped off. Availability of basic equipment like insulators became the limiting factor. In light of this, customers such as Verizon and cell carriers were told they were genuinely SOL.
2. The Verizon maintenance supervisor for the state had just relocated from Cape Cod, where he survived a similar event a year earlier. He immediately commandeered all generators, battery packs for SLCs etc, and emergency equipment from Mass, lower NY state, and beyond. Upstate NY was also affected and could spare nothing. His actions permitted his team to keep swapping the batteries out of SLCs, recharging them, and swapping to keep basic phone service running. He also asked for and got fuel from the Maine National Guard to keep the trucks and generators running. Most gas stations were down for lack of power.
3. As is the nature of winter storms, power lines suffer the most because they are highest on the poles. Telephone is next, and cable TV is usually lowest and suffers the least. Cable companies didn't bother much for restoration, since TV is the luxury you give up when the generator needs more gas than you have. Thankfully, this also meant most telephone service survived, and all they had to do was keep their gensets running. 'That's All'... It was a massive effort.
4. Cell service then was TDMA and CDMA, and NAMPS. It was good, despite the problems of the carriers having to do their own bucket-brigade battery swapping. They did terrically.
5. From my observations, quick action by carriers to put plans into action, clever thinking, and looking beyond the usual boundaries of support saved the day.
6. And one saving grace - the NBC affiliate in Portand broadcasts on Channel 6. Audio was available on most FM radios, way down on the band. When HD kicks in, this will be lost. No replacement I see.
It appears that AT&T is caught here with a central switch/datacenter that is stranded. We'll dissect their planning, no doubt, but ultimately they needed to plan for a week of power failure. I know that sounds preposterous, but my hospital clients at the time were even parking water trucks in the lot in case power outages resulted in public water supplies failing. Diesel tankers also came in. One hospital had backup privileges with a sister facility in Pennsylvania, and we would have transferred back-office processing there and flown/driven key personnel for a week to keep paychecks, billing, and patient care data current. Fortunately, my old stomping grounds were no longer my business. That hospital was out for 5 days, and ended up with a National Guard generator on site. The Guardsmen went without power for their armory to do that, sleeping in trucks and tents. Fortunately, it was not that cold for January. If it was 10 degrees colder, a lot of people would have died, never ready for that sort of trouble.
I escaped to friends in New Hampshire. Yes, I'm a wuss.
AT&T should own up to bad planning, despite the unusual weather. Redundancy is crucial, expensive, and worth it.
Re: (Score:2)
People are used to this now. Standards are lower! (Score:2, Interesting)
That's some phone (Score:2)
Wow. I knew there was a lot of buzz about the new Blackberry [vzwshop.com], but I didn't think it'd be enough to move all of AT&T's Midwest customers to Verizon. :-)
Pictures of damage from the Dec 11-12 Ice Storm (Score:2)
In case some are from warmer climes and don't know what the fuss with ice storms is all about, here are a couple of damage scenes for your perusal. Basically, ice builds up on all external surfaces of a structure until either (a) the weight of the ice causes the structure to collapse, or (b) the surface area of the structure is increased to the point that the wind in the storm blows the structure over.
This is the KC1XX amateur radio contest station [me.com] in Mason, New Hampshire, after the storm. More than 1.5 i
Not conspiracy, but AT&T has not been forthcom (Score:5, Insightful)
I would argue that the OP has a point. I am a doctor, was on call (I'm not kidding), and missed several important messages due to my cellphone going out (my blackberry just silently stopped receiving all work mail, all internet functions went dead, full 3G signal but "tunnel failed.") Granted, there is a lot of redundancy in communications, so my pager later started going off with a lot of people saying "where are you???", and I then called them on a landline.
I thought it was my phone, rebooted 3 times, and only today did I find out that it was a national outage (saw here, confirmed all over the net.) I think AT&T should just have sent a free txt saying "We are having problems" or made an large scale announcement via voicemail, which would have helped me (and others) plan. I was about to get a replacement phone from a friend and plug my SIM into it.
The point is we start to rely on these devices, and blackberries, for better or worse, are used for very important things in business, health care, and otherwise.
Re:Not conspiracy, but AT&T has not been forth (Score:4, Insightful)
If AT&T's service was down, how would they send you a text or voicemail?
Re: (Score:2)
I knew somebody would claim this impossible, but both SMS and voicemail were working, at least in my area. Incoming calls seemed to go to VM and then I could retrieve it (I was driving, so might have been simply out of range). Outgoing calls worked for me. All 3G internet / WAP was down.
This morning service is back to normal, and there was no announcement SMS nor notification of recent downed services from AT&T, therefore, before I knew about all this I was still aiming to replace my phone. Hence my
Re: (Score:2)
Outgoing calls work because the tower doesn't have to phone home to make an outgoing call. Incoming calls don't work because the tower near you has to contact the primary tower in the city where your cell phone's phone number is registered to tell it that the phone is currently hanging off a different tower. What is probably happening here is that the inter-tower communication is not working. This is probably because of the same trunk line failure that is causing the data to not work. In other words, ch
Re: (Score:2)
Via companies whose towers aren't down? Yeah it would cost them money, but it's the responsible thing to do.
Re: (Score:2)
In the aftermath of Ike, the most reliable mode of communication I had (I have no land lines) were text messages. I wasn't surprised. I experienced the same thing during Katrina. And I had seen discussion of this elsewhere - to include Slashdot.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
If you listen to the ENTIRE "our offices are closed" message, you are given an 800 number to their after hours call center.
That's where the message about the outage was.
Wrong place, if you ask me, but there it was.
All I lost yesterday was EDGE and GPRS, presumably 3G, as well, but I have no way to know for sure.
Incoming and outgoing calls both worked fine for me all day. Everything is working now.
Re: (Score:2)
Is it fixed for you yet? I had no problems with SMS yesterday, and I made one call (turns out the place was closed, so no one answered). AT&T seemed to be working fine for me yesterday, so maybe your phone coincidentally is having issues.
Re: (Score:2)
Ummmm... The huge cost difference?
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
I worked during the last strike. I was doing repair line duty. And then we had those massive storms in the midwest and my life was very miserable for four days. It was really really depressing talking to all of those people.
Re: (Score:2)
I live in Indiana and the ATT&T trucks have been out in force. Mostly just sitting in their vans, next to switching stations, drinking coffee and eating doughnuts. Now it makes sense.
That's undercover cops, dude. Hide the hookers, dope, and roulette tables.