Microsoft Attempts to Woo Students With 'Crowdsourced' Laptops 128
theodp writes "Q. What do Chris Brown and Steve Ballmer have in common? A. They both want you to Beg for It. GeekWire reports that Microsoft is touting its new Chip In program, a crowdfunding platform that allows students to 'beg' for select Windows 8 PCs and tablets that they can't afford on their own. Blair Hanley Frank explains, 'Students go to the Chip In website and choose one of the 20 computers and tablets that have been pre-selected by Microsoft. Microsoft chips in 10% of the price right off the bat, and then students are given a link to a "giving page" to send out to anyone they think might give them money. Once their computer is fully funded, Microsoft ships it to them.' Hey, what could go wrong?"
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UEFI is a pain - 'secure' or not (Score:5, Informative)
There are more problems with UEFI than 'secure' boot. I bought an HP box with Windows 7 and secure boot disabled. The thing wouldn't boot Windows after I installed the drive from my old PC as a secondary SATA drive (believe me, I tried every available BIOS setting). The Windows EFI bootloader insisted on trying to boot from the secondary (MBR-formatted) drive if it was there - even though a live-booted linux CD was fine with it. But if I left a gap in the SATA drive numbers, Windows would boot (and mount the SATA3 dirve as drive F:), whereas my live linux CD didn't even see it as SATA3 (apparently the BIOS didn't report it there with the gap).
Essentially, I was only able to 'use' this drive after I completely wiped it and replaced its MBR partitioning scheme with a GPT scheme. But my point is UEFI has 3 problems as I see it:
1) Secure boot locking out non-signed stuff (why can't it just warn you when you try to boot non-signed stuff and let you continue).
2) Weird implementations producing crazy, inexplicable behaviors. Including inconsistent ability to boot from external media, and some systems actually getting bricked by booting a Ubuntu CD.
3) Forcing use of GPT partitioning, which many Linux distros don't handle yet, and which even Windows doesn't need till you go over 2 TB drives.
Most of this is the result of an awkward transition to a possibly better partitioning and booting scheme, but forcing it on everyone - combined with poor implementations of much more complex firmware. Maybe it only seems intended to make dual booting hell. In any case, it succeeds beautifully.
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GPT has been around for a few years now. Any modern Linux distro who can't handle it is obsolete. The only issues related to the use of GPT in Linux is if you're using tools like fdisk, which doesn't work with GPT. parted on the other hand does, along with grub past version 0.96 (and of course GRUB 2).
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You'd think, but it's not true. Linux Mint 14 was able to install, but the brand new 64-bit PCLinuxOS got confused about the partition numbering and wiped out Mint instead of using the empty partition I set up for it. When I shrank my windows partition, I left the 'HP Recovery' partition at the end, which stayed in GPT slot 4, even though I added new partitions between 3 and 4. PCLOS's installer got way confused about that.
The PCLOS kernel was fine, and booted from a live CD, it was able to see things cor
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frankly if Torvalds wasn't constantly shitting out new kernels it really wouldn't be hard to get your kernel signed and use it in Linux.
So let me get this straight; your against getting security patches and improvements that come with new kernels?
also its not Torvalds that controls when you distro pumps out a new kernel that is entirely up to the distros kernel team all Torvald does that relates is push source code into the mainline trunk in a git.
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Why does Linux need a half a dozen kernels a year when BSD, Solaris, OSX, none of those need a half a dozen kernels a year?
Maybe because it has more active developers than any other kernel, maybe because it is used in more places, supports more features, and more hardware than other kernal.
why can my friend go through 3 Apple upgrades and ALL of HIS drivers work,
Ever consider that might be because apple has so little hardware? They have what 4 lines of computer running OSX that only some of which get changed each year, not much hardware really to support in the first palce, I would be surprised if it didn't have decent support considering.
i take take[sic] 7 year old drivers and run them in the latest Windows just fine, but Linus can't even keep his shit together long enough to allow 2 year old drivers to work, hmmm?
Maybe that is the device manufacturers fault for not supportin
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I never said that the Linux devs can do no wrong, I also never blamed the user and I never said that our devs are better than anyone else's. What I said is that there are more of them and the community is more active as such progress is faster resulting in a faster development cycle.
as for your quoting rms his opinon on that is a non-sequitur as the kernal isn't his and if he had his way it would be gpl3.
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Its something that is trivial to disable if you don't want it
Various reports say it is *not* trivial on many PCs. Maybe you've been lucky, but there have been reports of:
- Need to guess undocumented key to get into setup
- Timing so sensitive that you might have to try many times to hit the key at the right time
- In some cases, you can't get into setup at all without booting windows and accepting the license first (great if you want to get a windows refund, which *is* possible in some countries).
- Many peopl
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I said "it's not so bad, you can disabled it", and then we get many people posting that on their machine they couldn't .... yeah, it is a big problem... Perhaps not for
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Re:Bah, US only... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Uhh..why are you booting from USB? There is your problem, Asus boards really don't like booting from USB, if you want to boot from USB a lot an Asrock or gigabyte would have been a better choice.
I have used ASUS boards exclusively for almost a decade, from early Athlons, to an Athlon64, to a Core2 notebook, to both an 1156 and 1155 Core i5, as well as a few replacement boards for dead computers repaired for friends. I have never had an issue booting from USB, ever.
While that's anecdotal evidence, your claim contained no evidence, so I guess my point is... ummm... neener neener?
Seriously, I've never had an issue with ASUS products, except for Steam suddenly (and mysteriously) breaking my ASUS wifi
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except that you have to agree to the MS TOS to get into the BIOS, but hey, what's a little legal agreement that violates your rights? /facepalm
Re:Bah, US only... (Score:4, Insightful)
So don't buy the machine.
Hopefully more linux users will start buying linux machines or bare OS machines and we can get some actual reasonable statistics.
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So, what you're recommending is that Linux users buy from a smaller and more expensive range of computers? And that anybody who wants to try a Linux distro can acquire one of those first?
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So I will go buy a machine from a linux only seller.
I highly doubt dell would comply, as redhat would push back on the server and workstation side.
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They are windows 8? (Score:5, Insightful)
Then I don't think anyone wants one. Begging and debasing yourself for a computer makes sense, if you really need one. Doing it for a computer that suffers from delusions of being a tablet? What's the point?
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jeeze, at least hold out for a Mustang if you're gonna whore yourself out.
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That's my impression as well! To the question "Hey, what could go wrong?"... The answer is "Windows 8"!
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can we do the opposite though? (Score:5, Funny)
Remove Windows 8 from a laptop we already bought
Make Windows 8 and 8.1 (so basically 8.2) not suck so badly
or just beg for them to stop begging us to beg them for Windows 8 machines.
Windows 8 ? Urrgh (Score:5, Funny)
Who in their right minds wants a Windows 8 laptop ?
I'd rather have a damp pizza.
Spam (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Spam (Score:5, Interesting)
And microsoft then sells your list of contacts to marketers or uses it themselves to spam.
Re:Spam (Score:4, Interesting)
The funny thing is, this is for college "kids"... in other words -- grown fucking adults.
When I saw the shitty Slashdot blurb, I assumed this was going to be for disadvantaged children or something. Instead, it's for those poor unfortunate ADULTS who are so disenfranchised and disadvantaged that they're attending (through one manner or another) tens of thousands of dollars for college tuition and related expenses, but need to beg and spam people for the $600 for a laptop.
Ridiculous.
Re:Spam (Score:5, Insightful)
That those same loans would cover in fact. I know, I bought a laptop that way once. I had no working computer and needed it to do my university homework.
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The funny thing is, this is for college "kids"... in other words -- grown fucking adults.
Wow, with an attitude like that, you must've been a fucking hoot in your college days. Were you BORN an old man or something?
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Not to mention a perfectly usable PC
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The funny thing is, this is for college "kids"... in other words -- grown fucking adults.
Since when is the average college student anything even remotely resembling an adult?
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Since when is the average adult anything remotely resembling an adult?
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If people are willing to sell their friends out for another silly turn at crushing some candy, I worry what they will do to save actual money!
Forward this to 10 friends and get a free laptop!! (Score:5, Interesting)
This almost reminds me of all those e-mails from way back when that say if you forward the e-mail to 10 or so friends, Bill Gates will send you a free PC. I'm already very suspect of any e-mail asking for money, even if it is from someone I know.
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Re:Forward this to 10 friends and get a free lapto (Score:5, Interesting)
I can already hear the Internet scams popping up right now.
You go to some family get-together.
Uncle: Hey Jimmy, I got that message about the laptop you wanted. I donated $300 for you!
Jimmy: Umm, I never signed up for any laptop nor did I send you a request to donate to buy one for me.
*crickets*
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The way that Jimmy seemed already prepared with that statement, not caught off guard at all, makes me think he was in on it.
Also, the sound of crickets imply this "get-together" was at night and outside, a park perhaps? It's seems that the Uncle suspected Jimmy the whole time, too, considering the time and place the event was setup. The uncle may have wanted to meet at a place with no witnesses, to confront Jimmy, lynch him, and then later dispose of his body.He probably invited you along to "get your hands
I'll tell you what could go wrong... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:I'll tell you what could go wrong... (Score:5, Funny)
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Last place gets Windows 8 RT?
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Crowdsourcing is interesting... (Score:5, Insightful)
...but it really doesn't help when this kind of project tries to get people to turn it into spam. Want to drive your early 1980s Vanagon through China on the Silk Road, and write a book about the experience? Good project for crowdsourcing (but didn't make its kickstarter goal). Want to record an album with your band or film a documentary on something super-nerdy? By all means give it a shot.
Poor student wanting to buy a device Microsoft picked for you? Just makes the whole concept of crowdsourcing look like what it is: begging. The appeal of crowdsourcing, in my opinion, is that if the project succeeds, something fun, interesting, or exciting gets brought back that the people who helped it happen get to enjoy. Not just the person who gathered the funds.
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It is, in the purest linguistic sense. Just as the Microsoft strategy is.
I think what separates what people are usually referring to as "crowdsourcing" and just general begging and fundraising is that generally people are expecting some kind of return on their investment when they go someplace like Kickstarter, even if it is just the privilege of purchasing the album/book/film or tickets to the film/whatever. It's more about being part of a project that the donor feels is worthwhile from but may not other
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Re:Crowdsourcing is interesting... (Score:5, Insightful)
This is worse than begging --- this is *lobbying*. You're not asking for the computer you'd particularly want given the whole world of available choices; you're working on behalf of Microsoft to provide advertising for Microsoft so that people will give money to Microsoft, and in return you get a crappy device that's not what you and your family/friends would have decided to spend the same $X00 on in the first place.
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How about they go to the library or computer lab?
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I would imagine most college students have jobs.
I had one and it barely paid my rent and food. I had to use money from my loans to buy a laptop at one point.
Work study of 40 hours per pay period, times 26 pay periods means at minimum wage means a yearly wage of around $7000. If you can work 40 hours a week while in university either you program is not challenging enough or you simply do not sleep.
The idea that most college students to do not work is just silly.
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I worked about 40 hours while at Jr College, the program was extremely challenging, mostly physics, math, chemistry and of course general education. It helped that my job gave me the flexibility to take off a few days to study for tests and finals. I was making about $12 an hour installing tires and batteries (and later selling them, or running the job schedule) at Sears, the skin on my hands is still cracked in some areas due to all the incidental battery acid contact. When I transferred to university,
Re:How about just giving them the laptops? (Score:4, Interesting)
$12 an hour would have been a fortune to me. I was working for $5 and spending 100+ hours a week in the labs. Working off campus was not much of an option since I could never really get the flexibility I needed out of other employers. The lab was only open a set of hours, and I was not going to hurt my grades for their meager wages.
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Re:kinda pointless given a few facts (Score:4, Interesting)
1. microsoft already enjoys lock-in at most universities and private colleges. shit like outlook and sharepoint has unfortunately shoved years of well-maintained unix to the roadside in an effort for universities to seem more cutting edge. protracted multi-month outages (ahem, University of Kentucky) requiring expensive consultants drive alongside patch tuesday now in the race to time best wasted.
I can only speak for what I see at my university; but I don't think this is really as prevalent anymore. I think too many schools got burned by experiences such as the one you refer to.
Now Microsoft does still try to do this, but they don't have the leverage they once did. On our campus Microsoft did schmooze the previous president to get Live included as an offering; but with the students Gmail is king and Dropbox is queen. The only people I know using Outlook and the other MS cloud options are some staff members for whom it's been the only email they've ever known.
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each desltop basically exists as a $500 PuTTY workstation.
That's not such a bad deal considering how much dumb and X terminals cost back in the day.
I looked... (Score:3)
But I couldn't find the MacBook Pro running Windows 8 via Boot Camp.
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But I couldn't find the MacBook Pro running Windows 8 via Boot Camp.
Get your dirty hands off my macbook!
(It's for testing, it's the only Windows 8 install I have, I swear!)
I am beging MS to add modern mix and start 8 to th (Score:2)
I am beging MS to add modern mix and start 8 to the base os in windows 8.1 or newer.
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maybe if he'd said "bitch slap and choke your GF" that would have made it clearer?
"Microsoft like Chris Brown wants to bitch slap and choke your GF." It would have made it more entertaining to say the least.
Oil economy sign of collapse (Score:2)
Enter the Gift economy
need more hardware choice and why is cpu speed hid (Score:2)
need more hardware choice (to many systems with an small 128gb SSD) and why is cpu speed hidden on so meany of the systems. Also most of the system only have Intel video.
they contribute 10% (Score:2)
they contribute 10%
why not just let microsoft foot part of the bill, and then you pay for the rest yourself (assuming you can afford it)?
is this better than not having any laptop?
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I just got an email ! (Score:1)
It's from a Nigerian prince asking for help for a laptop.
Here we go again (Score:3, Insightful)
Microsoft with another new half baked idea.
Painful to watch and execute me too ad campaign.
A day late and a dollar short.
Say what you will about them, the fuckers are consistent.
I LOVE THIS IDEA! (Score:2)
Please let me know when Porsche adopts this model.
Sweet! (Score:5, Insightful)
That 10% discount is almost as much money as you could save by forgoing Windows for something useable and free.
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That 10% discount is almost as much money as you could save by forgoing Windows for something useable and free.
It's also as much (or less than) you could save by simply shopping around at other computer retailers online instead of buying from Microsoft's partners in this I bet.
Micro-who? (Score:3)
Not such a bad idea. (Score:2)
Aside from the Win8 issue. I don't see how this is a bad idea. Graduating highschool students do this all the time. They tell their relatives and friends of the family that they are graduating or whatever, everyone sends them a few bucks and then the graduate can use this money to buy something. I can totally imagine sending out and email to everyone I know saying my kid needs a new laptop for college and to chip in just a few cents or whatever you can afford.
Ha! (Score:2)
Windows 8: so bad, they can't even *give* it away!
How low can you go? (Score:2)
Begging for Windows 8? That's got to be a real case of scraping the bottom of the barrel.