Comcast Customer Service Rep Just Won't Take No For an Answer 401
RevWaldo writes: The Verge and other sources report on how AOL's Ryan Block ultimately succeeded in cancelling his Comcast account over the phone, but not before the customer service representative pressed him for eight solid minutes (audio) to explain his reasoning for leaving "the number one provider of TV and internet service in the country" in a manner that would cause a character in Glengarry Glen Ross to blush. Comcast has now issued an apology.
We're sorry we got caught? (Score:5, Insightful)
That's probably what they meant...
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yeah, and claiming that isn't how they train their representatives doesn't make sense either, as i've gone through that exact same conversion with comcast multiple times as i moved around the country in and out of their territory.
comcast is evil... the call center representatives are ignorant megalomaniacs.
the internet is not worth dealing with them.
Re:We're sorry we got caught? (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm not sure if it's identical around the world, but certainly here in Australia, many of these customer service people have their performance measured by how many people they convince to stay or attract. So while they might not be trained to be aggressive or like dogs with a bone (i.e. just don't let go), and companies like comcast can ignorantly claim what they did, for every worker, the reality is there's that KPI looking over their shoulder and they'll go to those lengths themselves to either not get sacked or make bonus.
A worse thing that happens in Australia, and it particularly happens with insurance companies is that they usually hit renewing customers with higher fees. It sometimes gets referred to as the 'lazy tax' where most customers will just habitually accept and pay it, whereas if they shopped around, and called back, they would usually get a fair chunk knocked off their bill for literally no reason except that the company wants the customer to stay. They know that in doing it this way, they make more money because a big enough proportion of people don't question the bill, and those that do, it's better to get them to pay less than not at all. I know that your ISP's and cable companies are notrious for treating their customers like shit (south park covered it well).
Re:We're sorry we got caught? (Score:5, Informative)
Pretty much.
Here's the actual link to the apology instead of a random blog. http://corporate.comcast.com/c... [comcast.com]
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Comment removed (Score:5, Funny)
Re:they don't give a fuck (Score:5, Funny)
I was thinking more along the lines of ...
. /Oblg. South Park - Cable Company [youtube.com]
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Re:they don't give a fuck (Score:5, Funny)
... and the word of this day is: Amateur.
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We need to get this dude (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj2oXMdZ4sk) and this rep from Comcast on the same line.
From AOL having trouble cancelling service? (Score:5, Funny)
We're sorry he so faithfully followed instructions (Score:2)
Re:We're sorry he so faithfully followed instructi (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:We're sorry he so faithfully followed instructi (Score:5, Insightful)
call center employees are being thrown under the bus
but it's a really nice bus that the CEO's are riding...does anything else really matter?
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Fuck the employees. Call center employees I've talked to are always on the side of the company, and will defend it to the death. They're not just working for a paycheck, they really believe the shit they spew. We like to believe that most employees really are just working to make ends meet and feed their families, but it's really not true; most people become emotionally invested in the power structure they're part of. It's the same phenomenon that drives patriotism, defending "your side's" political can
Re:We're sorry he so faithfully followed instructi (Score:4, Interesting)
As a former call center worker (multiple centers), I can tell you unequivocally that that is bullshit. Your average CSR does not give a single fuck about the company they're working for (or the company that their company has a contract with). They're paid to absorb anger and read scripts. There is no intellectual input other than saying what they're told accurately. The first time your manager at the call center chews you out for doing a fantastic job and resolving the problem to everyone's satisfaction, but going over your handle time by 3 seconds, you run out of fucks to give.
For those of us who didn't see it... (Score:2)
How much do guys in Glengarry Glen Ross blush?
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See the movie. It's pretty good and is a perfect portrayal of slimy salesmen.
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That's not a particularly good selling of the movie.
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He can't help it, the leads were weak.
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But check out the film. Think Twelve Angry Men but about real estate sales instead of juries.
.
why would anyone cancel comcast? (Score:5, Interesting)
where else can you get hundreds of channels of TV i hate and crappy internet for one low price of $200 a month?
what else would i do if i didn't have 400 channels of TV? how else would i watch commercials?
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where else can you get hundreds of channels of TV i hate and crappy internet for one low price of $200 a month?
what else would i do if i didn't have 400 channels of TV? how else would i watch commercials?
We changed comcast TV to the lowest package that you can get - just the local stations, and if we want something else we watch Netflix. Even with just the local stations there is still too much crap on TV.
However if we could have gone a la carte for less price than a package, then we would have carved out the crap. Of course that will never happen.
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where else can you get hundreds of channels of TV i hate and crappy internet for one low price of $200 a month?
what else would i do if i didn't have 400 channels of TV? how else would i watch commercials?
We changed comcast TV to the lowest package that you can get - just the local stations, and if we want something else we watch Netflix.
You're not really paying a cable company to provide you with content you could get for free OTA, are you?
I've thought about signing back up for cable so I can watch Animal Planet (big fans of Caesar and Jackson in my household), but they won't let me de-couple the $30-50 fee for "local broadcast channels."
So fuck 'em.
Re:why would anyone cancel comcast? (Score:5, Funny)
where else can you get hundreds of channels of TV i hate and crappy internet for one low price of $200 a month?
$200 a month? That is a heck of a deal. I've got the $99 Cox Bundle and that costs about $250 a month.
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i like sports too, but hate ESPN since it's mostly college sports which i don't follow
but the NY Yankees and Mets suck this year. the knicks will suck for years to come. Nets are so so. same with the Giants.
only reason i'm paying is i'm on a bundle and i ran the numbers and it's cheaper than buying a la carte cartoons for my kids that netflix doesn't have
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I play hockey. I also like to watch hockey. I don't live near Canada.
Please explain how you'll solve my problem.
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In an area with good over the air reception the signal is not compressed heavily as it is over cable. Here, Comcast is the worst, followed by the satellite services. FIOS has the least compression but I still see it on some fast moving stuff.
Over the air can be as good (to me) as BluRay.
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it's not a problem where they got rid of the analog channels on cable like time warner in NYC. as soon as time warner got rid of the analog channels they got more bandwidth for internet service and the picture quality is better now
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No, OTA is also compressed video (you have to compress it).
It's just that in a 6MHz channel, most OTA stations only broadcast one channel, so it gets the full 20Mbps available of that channel.
In a c
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Explain this one, I don't get it.
It's the dirty little secret of cable TV: Pixel resolution and compression are two different things. You may be getting a channel in 1080, but by the time a cable company delivers it to your TV, it's be recompressed so much that it being 1080 doesn't matter anymore. You see it most when things in the picture are moving, they get blocky, and in aliasing around things like text on the screen. They do this to fit more channels into the available bandwidth of their network. Over-the-air from local stations isn'
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About 4 or 5 years ago, all the broadcast TV in the US changed over to a digital format, and the digital format includes HDTV broadcasts. If you have an HDTV and an antenna, and you live in a place where you can receive the signals, you can get the HDTV of all the broadcast networks over the air (OTA) with no cable.
It has been reported that Comcast re-compresses the digital HDTV streams, cramming them into a smaller digital channel in their cable system, in order to fit more channels in. This leads to reduc
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Cable services re-compress signals in order to cram more channels into whatever transmission capacity they have. Sometimes they even monkey around with the size of the frame. This is all to save space/bandwidth.
What you get off of an antenna is the pristine version of whatever that broadcaster sent out.
The worst company in the world (Score:5, Insightful)
nobody ever won a war with their customers (Score:4, Insightful)
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Well, some managed to bribe the referees.
For reference, see copyright.
Re:nobody ever won a war with their customers (Score:5, Funny)
Why am I cancelling? Because Comcast has assholes like you in customer service!
Re:nobody ever won a war with their customers (Score:4)
don't understand why this is not more widely understood.
Problem is, we aren't Comcast's only customers. Also the meaning of "customer" changes when a monopoly is in place (which is very much the case in many areas - Comcast may provide the only viable internet or subscription TV).
Re:nobody ever won a war with their customers (Score:4, Insightful)
Because customers don't immediately respond to questions like "why should we discontinue your service?" with responses such as "because I have informed my credit card provider that we are no longer doing business together, and they will refuse all further charges and will charge back any they don't refuse, at cost of $35 per false charge to Xfinity Inc."
Very typical of them (Score:5, Interesting)
They've done this to me. They interurpt you, they refuse to let you speak until you scream. They just keep talking. They make excuses, they contradict themselves. They are just unbelievable.
This recording is a great example of how Comcast representives are trained to talk you. Obviously, a monopolist can just abuse you and treat you any way they want.
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it all sounds familiar.
i was waiting for "what are your crimes?"
Had to stop after a minute... (Score:2)
I listened to this earlier today. I had to stop listening after about a minute because just listening to it made me angry enough to want to break things and kill people (not exaggerating).
Had I been the caller, I'd have been frothing at the mouth at this jackass. Or I'd have hung up before I threw the phone, and called back to talk to someone else.
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And there is no good reason to make it public, either. If I want to stop doing business with anybody, I do not have to give them a reason.
They aren't really interested in the reason - at least, the CSR doesn't give a single fuck about it. I'm sure management is interested in the numbers, but even then I doubt they care too much. The CSR was just using it as a ploy to make it harder to cancel.
Had it been me, I would have said this:
"If you continue to refuse to cancel my service, I will be forced to take lega
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I actually don't see what would be wrong with just explaining that you didn't feel that the service was a good value, and that you feel they don't display respect for their customers.
What's wrong with it is that it opens a time-wasting conversation that doesn't need to happen. Comcast doesn't care why you're dropping, they just use the question as a ploy to engage you so they can give you a sales pitch.
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But did you LISTEN to the audio...? I don't think a jury in the world would convict him.
(yes, i'm kdding, but hot damn that was awful)
Same business model, different business (Score:2)
Exactly like the slimeball "sales manager" at a car dealership who tries to sell you the extended warranty and other overpriced crap after you've agreed to a price. He demands that you justify your refusal, because he knows that if he can get you on the defensive, he can bully you into submission.
I once tore up a negotiated deal in front of one of those. That wouldn't work in this case, because this customer was already cancelling service, but it might be fun to say "Why I'm cancelling is none of your damne
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... it might be fun to say "Why I'm cancelling is none of your damned business."
He did actually say that. Repeatedly. If you haven't listened to the audio give it a try. Bet you can't make it through the whole 8 minutes. I got pissed off beyond belief after about 2.
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That's way too polite. I've once told a Comcast rep something to the effect of the following:
Re:Same business model, different business (Score:5, Funny)
But that's boring. There's so many more fun responses you could give. CSRs don't argue as much with "crazy" customers so it even makes things easier for you (plus, it messes with their statistics). .666. I refuse to support any company with such obvious anti-christian leanings."
"That information is classified."
"The stars are in alignment. The prophecy must be fulfilled."
"I'm moving to Elbonia."
"The NASCAR team you sponsored keeps losing, so I'm switching to a winner like AOL."
"I got assigned an IP ending in
"I finished reading the whole internet, I really don't see any point in keeping it once I've read it all."
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"I got assigned an IP ending in .666. I refuse to support any company with such obvious anti-christian leanings."
Brilliant.
...and (Score:2)
It's very simple: (Score:4, Informative)
Just move (Score:5, Informative)
I had little or no problem cancelling Comcast recently when I moved. I used the phrase "moving out of the Comcast service area" when they asked why I was cancelling, and they put it right through. Had a little more trouble returning their boxes, however.
Ha! (Score:2)
Corporate doublespeak (Score:5, Insightful)
We are very embarrassed by the way our employee spoke with Mr. Block and are contacting him to personally apologize. The way in which our representative communicated with him is unacceptable and not consistent with how we train our customer service representatives. We are investigating this situation and will take quick action. While the overwhelming majority of our employees work very hard to do the right thing every day, we are using this very unfortunate experience to reinforce how important it is to always treat our customers with the utmost respect.
If you read this carefully, they aren't sorry for the content, merely the delivery.
Once the user cancels, you have lost (Score:2)
Companies don't want to hear this, but that's just the way it is. People are lazy. They don't go around and call you to fake-cancel their accounts hoping to get a better rate. The few that do are well known and blacklisted. So when a long time customer calls you and cancels, you might want to test the waters and ask for a reason, maybe he got a better deal that you can still beat (though if you did that with me, my reaction would be to cancel on principle because you ripped me off all the time, if you can l
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(though if you did that with me, my reaction would be to cancel on principle because you ripped me off all the time, if you can lower your rate now, why couldn't you before? And I certainly have zero reason to continue business with a company that very obviously has no problem with ripping me off)
Presumably, if you're paying a particular rate in exchange for service, that's because you believe that the service has at least that much value to you. As long as that's the case, then the company providing the service isn't "ripping you off."
As a customer, there's going to be some upper limit to how much you're willing to pay for a service. For the company, there's some lower limit to the price that they can afford to offer. Obviously every customer would like the price to be set at that lower limit --
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They don't go around and call you to fake-cancel their accounts hoping to get a better rate. The few that do are well known and blacklisted.
I looked around for a bit, and couldn't find a source for this. Mind providing one?
Burn in Hell (Score:2)
Comcast can burn in hell. I really really hope the merger with TWC is blocked.
Customer service in a nutshell. (Score:2)
Imagine Customer Service as the Early Space Program.
You have Astronauts and you have Monkeys.
Astronauts have problem solving skills that can ultimately sink or swim a mission. They hear orders from mission control but can offer suggestions or even take direct action based on spacecraft feedback if necessary for overall success. They're the guys you send to the moon and back to get moon rocks.
Monkeys see a red light on a console initiated from mission control, which corresponds with pressing a red button on
Easiest way to cancel service from any ISP... (Score:5, Insightful)
Me: "Hi, I need to cancel my service."
Rep: "Oh? [insert marketing speak that boils down to 'Why do you want to cancel our awesome service?']"
Me: "I'm moving out of your service area and I'm already set up in my new place."
Rep: "Oh. Okay then."
Doesn't matter if it's true or not. There's not really much they can say to that. They might fish for details about where you've moved to. Just don't be stupid enough to bite.
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You shouldn't have to lie to cancel service.
Why do you want to cancel?
Because I fucking do.
But why?
Because you shits don't get that when a customer wants to cancel, you cancel.
But why?
This is your official notice that I've cancelled. I've recorded it. Send me a bill for anything past and I'll take you to court.
Goodbye.
What I have done (Score:2)
Gather all the equipment up.
Go the local service office at the busiest time of the day.
Wait in line.
Turn all the equipment in and cancel on the spot.
The is no "customer retention service" there.
Poetic justice for an AOL employee? (Score:3)
Not just Comcast (Score:3)
Another way to end the call (Score:3)
1) "Because every time I call you guys, you try to get me to change. You give me a run around and refuse to provide the service requested.
2) "Because whenever I turn on the TV, it tells me to carve up people that don't do what I tell them to do. So my psychiatrist told me to stop watching television."
This hits close to home (Score:2)
I recently moved out of Comcast's service area and am in the process of trying to have improper charges removed. Fortunately I live within a reasonable drive of their SA, where there is a physical office. Thus, I was able to employ the tactic of actually meeting a rep face-to-face. Like I said, I'm still in process though. She said I'd get a check. Both of us were very polite, because of being in person. She even did as I asked and printed a screen capture of her terminal, gave me her name so I would
Comcast Internet good, customer service not (Score:2)
Not 8 minutes (Score:5, Informative)
This same article was recently posted on Techdirt. The call wasn't 8 minutes. The RECORDING was 8 minutes. There was 10 minutes of call prior to the recording even starting.
Not just Comcast (Score:3)
This is nothing new or unique to Comcast. Anytime you try to cancel service with anybody these days you get the hard sales pitch. No one wants to take "no" for an answer anymore. Customer service departments are really sales departments. Notice that you can never unsubscribe to anything online, you have to call a person.
Cancelled DirecTV and it sounded like the other guy was ready to cry because I was leaving. Asking what he could do to keep me around (well given that I was down to two shows I watched, he could have dropped the price to $10/month).
Cancelled the local newspaper and they gave me the hard sell too. Finally insisting they gave in and kept the deliveries until the current payment period ran out. Except that it didn't quite work, they didn't quite realize I had unsubscribed. When the payment period ended they left voice mail saying that my credit card was not validated and could I call them back to give them a good number, then a got the mail bill saying "First Notice" that I hadn't paid. Unlike their customer support website, the bill actuall had an email address so I sent an angry letter (I sort of regret it) and promptly had things cleared up.
And again, this is not new, it's been around for a long time. I cancelled ebay once, after a single purchase, and was told that cancelling my account would also mean me losing my buyer rating... A lot of online sites hide their unsubscribe information. Push a couple buttons on the remote and I can add HBO to my service for a month, but I have to phone up in person to get it cancelled again.
Easy solution ... provide a better excuse (Score:3, Insightful)
Don't tell them you're transferring to a competitor. That gives them all the excuses to 'save' your account.
My father was canceling his cable Internet service and reconnecting with another provider. I knew about all these tricks they use to retain customers. He had tried calling before and was put on hold, transferred, then spoke to someone for a few minutes and was again put on hold. He ended up hanging up the phone in frustration.
My solution to him was provide a different reason to cancel.
Told my father a better excuse. The next call lasted less than 1 minute. No transfers, no retention reps. A CSR cancelled the service. The reason: carpal tunnel syndrome. As soon as he said he can't use the keyboard/mouse anymore they immediately cancelled no other reason needed.
Hope this helps others! :)
Need a new service (Score:3)
What we really need is a corporate breakup service as part of a credit/debit card. They can send a nice letter like
Dear Comcast, We are sorry to inform you that John Smith wants to end his relationship with you. He feels that you're growing in different directions and the chemistry isn't the same. In short, he's just not that into you.. He wants to see other cable providers.
Then to avoid any boiling rabbits and such, they should refuse all further charges from them to their ex-customer's card. As a premium service, they should also file a restraining order keeping the ex's marketing department at least 500 feet away at all times.
Re:105 megabits per second (Score:5, Funny)
I mean granted, maybe some people here can tell me how a single family home can use that much bandwidth (downloading several dozen torrents simultaneously?), but my family doesn't even use half of our 30 Megabit/second bandwidth.
Two words: Minecraft Server.
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marketing gimmick for nerds to think they have a big penis
just like giant SUV's, graphics cards that give you 10,000 FPS in some game, etc
i was visiting some family with comcast and netflix on their 5mbps service was better than my 20/2 time warner at home. same with youtube. and same result with other family i have with cablevision.
comcast has a direct connection to netflix and is youtube HD certified. cablevision has open connect. having an ISP that links directly to your content will give you better resu
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It's not about average usage, it's about instantaneous usage. Most of the time my connection is pretty idle, but when I want to download something big (e.g. multiple gigs) I don't really want to wait around for it. That's what I'm paying for - not having to wait.
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It's not about average usage, it's about instantaneous usage.
For some of us who play peer to peer games, it's not really about bandwidth usage but how long it takes to get the packet from here to there and back. It's about latency. Generally higher bandwidth means lower latency, but it's not a hard and fast rule.
If you are just downloading or streaming stuff, it's all about bandwidth then because a latency of even a few seconds won't matter much.
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As a general rule, higher bandwidth connections are "faster" end to end, this is NOT universally true, just normally. Consider the latency of sending 100 bytes over a 2400 baud modem verses the same latency noted on a gigabit link (extreme example, I know). It will take a LONG time to transfer that 100 bytes over the modem link then receive a similar reply just because the physical layer takes so long. Higher bandwidth will lower latency.
How much difference is this physical layer delay considering say 10B
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You don't know how he uses it or what his income is or if he's even paying for it (work might reimburse it) so how could you possibly know if it's a waste of money. Maybe he needs to download gigs of data for work... Also download speed isn't the only aspect of a connection, perhaps they wanted higher upstream bandwidth or lower latency.
Re:105 megabits per second (Score:5, Insightful)
I had a 150Mbit connection and i found uses for it all. Having that much extra headroom is very useful.
Just because you can't find a way or can even fathom why someone would want that speed doesn't mean there aren't good uses for it.
I really don't understand the need to say no one needs more than 640k of memory. It plainly makes you look dull.
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TL;DR: I don't need it, therefore no one does.
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TFA says he's a producer at AOL. Seeing as how he's an AOL employee, he probably needs a lot more bandwidth than you do, as you're someone who probably just works in I.T. Go figure. I don't understand anything about AOL either.
Obviously he needs way more bandwidth than he can get via an (AOL) dial-up modem, which explains why he's been with Comcast for the last 9 years.
Someone that works from home might opt for a larger package to obtain greater uploading bandwidth. I did that to advance from 1.5 to 6 Mbps
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I'm seeding a couple of torrents and they use up my 500mbps connection quite well (current upload speed 52MB/s).
Re:105 megabits per second (Score:5, Insightful)
If I am hearing correctly, this guy was signed up for 105 megabits per second... Do you know how hard it is to use 105 megabits/second?
Sigh.
Slashdot, how far you have fallen.
Re:Only sorry they got caught (Score:5, Funny)
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Oh? How much are you going to pay me to use your service?
Well, that's what I'd have asked...
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Their apology was sincere. They even offered to continue his service at a 'special rate'.
Sounds to me like an admission that they're overcharging everyone else.
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Re:So... (Score:5, Informative)
Sadly, then the company will send your unpaid bills to a collection agency who will hound you for payment and which will ruin your credit score. The burden will be on you to prove that you told them to cancel your service and they didn't. It won't be impossible, mind you, but you'll need to fight to clear your credit because some company refuses to stop billing you in the hopes that you'll just send them more money because it's easier than trying to cancel.
Re: So... (Score:3, Informative)
Actually...if you use a credit card, and dispute the charge after you tell them you want to cancel, it goes a bit better than that.
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Sadly, then the company will send your unpaid bills to a collection agency who will hound you for payment and which will ruin your credit score.
Some people made the point that they can't ruin your credit score because they never extended credit -- a loan of money -- to you.
Re:So... (Score:5, Insightful)
"This call may be recorded for quality assurance purposes" means that you have their permission to record it, too, even in California.
"Cancel my account."
"I can't do that unless you give me a reason."
"I'm recording this conversation, so I have proof that the account has been canceled. If I receive any more invoices, the next phone call will be from my lawyer, or the police."
Click.
The better method, though, is to do it in writing, by registered mail. End of equation.
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That's why you don't tell them until after you've told them to cancel the account. If they reserve the right to record it - which they did before the human came on the line - there is no expectation of privacy, and you don't need to tell them. You only tell them at the end to reinforce that you can prove you did.
Re:So... (Score:5, Informative)
The correct hard ball approach is: I am recording this call and forwarding to my local cable franchise authority.
This is the entity that your local franchise must go through to offer service in your area and they are the ones that set rules like the number of seconds you may be placed on hold until you get a human without them having to pay a fine.
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The correct hard ball approach is: I am recording this call and forwarding to my state attorneys general
FTFY. Large companies generally aren't afraid of most government agencies, due to regulatory capture [wikipedia.org]. But tell them that you might be in touch with the office of an ambitious politician with subpoena power and suddenly they become very helpful.
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