More Eye Candy Coming To Windows 10 209
jones_supa writes Microsoft is expected to release a new build of the Windows 10 Technical Preview in the very near future, according to their own words. The only build so far to be released to the public is 9841 but the next iteration will likely be in the 9860 class of releases. With this new build, Microsoft has polished up the animations that give the OS a more comprehensive feel. When you open a new window, it flies out on to the screen from the icon and when you minimize it, it collapses back in to the icon on the taskbar. It is a slick animation and if you have used OS X, it is similar to the one used to collapse windows back in to the dock. Bah.
how pretty (Score:5, Interesting)
Linux back in the day looked like hell, but it worked.
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Linux back in the day looked like hell, but it worked.
No it didn't, sound and graphics were a pain in the ass to get working!
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Re:how pretty (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, scientists for one. It might explain why so many of them have switched to OSX as their *NIX of choice. I remember a lot of Linux desktop managers struggled with doing basic things like properly rendering Mathematica and allowing it to accelerate graphics with open GL whereas on OSX and Windows, it just "worked" pretty much 99.9% of the time.
Linux itself (the actual kernel) is very stable, maybe even more stable than the base Windows NT kernel. But as a desktop operating system? There's a reason why most people shell out good money for OSX or Windows, and it is not just because they look pretty (which many Linux desktops do these days as well).
Re:how pretty (Score:5, Informative)
Well, I am a researcher, work with Mathematica, Acegen, C++11, OpenGL, Qt, some Fortran 2003, CEI Ensight and ParaView. I am slashdotting in my Mac but do all work in Linux. Basically, I use the Mac to read and write emails and to listen to music. All serious work is done in Linux.
Actually, after OSX 10.9, most classical software like Xfig, Lyx, Gnuplot, etc became brittle, slow or simply stopped working.
It is difficult to keep a straight face and state that OSX is stable. Xcode crashes all the time, Qt software crashes all the time, visualization software works much better on Linux. Keynote is ok though, but that's about it.
What you are referring to is perhaps the 2006-2009 period.
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I play with the same tools - and I experience no instability like this on OS X. Xeon and Core Ix series hardware.
Re:how pretty (Score:4, Informative)
"It is difficult to keep a straight face and state that OSX is stable. Xcode crashes all the time, Qt software crashes all the time, visualization software works much better on Linux."
I play with the same tools - and I experience no instability like this on OS X. Xeon and Core Ix series hardware.
Agreed. Same here.
If you are having serious instability issues, you have something wrong locally with your machine.
Especially if it is crashing with that "classical" software.
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There's also a reason that so many of the actual scientists I know come rushing back to Linux after playing around in MacOSX or Windows for a while. It's just not as good at SCIENCE. It wastes CPU and RAM for starters. And if you need a graph of 3d animation or other visualization, Linux can now do that just fine these days, much less annoyingly than it was even a few years ago. If you need to do serious work, it doesn't waste the system's resources as much, and it doesn't distract you into playing around i
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Linux itself (the actual kernel) is very stable, maybe even more stable than the base Windows NT kernel. But as a desktop operating system?
Well you just wait and see until 2015, that is going to be the year of the Linux Desktop.
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Most of the Linux desktop evangelists have quietly switched to OSX or sewn their lips shut. There are still a few of them around.
The Steambox is coming out next year though, so that's something.
Also, when everything is working correctly, the Linux desktop is actually a pretty pleasant experience these days, so there's always that.
Re:how pretty (Score:4, Informative)
I'm a working scientist. I have a Mac at home for playing, but work is all Linux. OS X has a very slow filesystem, no working package manager (or rather it has at least four, none of which are much good) and only runs on relatively expensive hardware. Good luck building a compute cluster from imacs. Windows is even worse, of course.
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I have worked for nearly a decade as a sysadmin in a science environment, and I hardly witnessed people demanding to switch from Linux to OS X. For the most part, MOST science software actually happens to work best under Linux distributions. Your Mathematica example is only one piece of evidence. However, the Linux distributions track much better packages like R, Octave, or Latex, which are bread and butter packages in a lot of scientific fields. While I never used Mathematica, I never had any issues with c
Re:There's a reason... (Score:5, Insightful)
If you're visualizing large or dynamic datasets, a hardware accelerated animation adds all sorts of value. Not everyone can produce meaningful conclusions from screenfuls of cascading text.
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> Not everyone can produce meaningful conclusions
> from screenfuls of cascading text.
Blonde, brunette, readhead... [youtube.com]
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Yes, the only possible explanation for me having an opinion that differs from you is that I am ignorant.
As a matter of fact, I have extensively used and continue to use Linux. Every time I have tried to setup Linux as a desktop environment, it has been extremely problematic. Kubuntu, for instance, will not even properly initialize the graphics drivers for my laptop, so it is completely unusable. In the past, any desktop installation of Linux I have created suffered from serious driver and stability probl
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Ignorance means "lack of knowledge". If you are claiming that my views are based on lack of knowledge about recent builds of Linux desktop, then you are claiming that I am ignorant and that my opinion is based upon ignorance.
Everyone has different sets of knowledge and experience. Rather than actually trying to learn about mine (such as asking, "what experience do you base you opinions upon") you summarily concluded that my opinion must be based upon my ignorance. It is profound superciliousness to belie
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Image editing.
Audio production.
Design.
Page layout.
Video editing.
You know, a lot of professions.
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I am talking about the system functionality. What the hell requires sound or serious graphics on a daily basis in Linux?
Most things that people do with their computers, you know like web browsing, watching video, listening to music and then of course professionals want to do things like audio, video and photo editing/production, architectural, factory and product design/engineering/simulation/visualization.
Of course, an admin only needs command line ;)
And most people don't get a computer just to administer it.
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no.. they were pretty simply to get working 1996.
after that however.. dunno what the fuck went down. even 3dfx cards(voodoo1/2) were easy to get work in linux.
however, I'm just having flashbacks to os/2 warp when they talk about windows animating out of things etc.. those transitions don't matter shit.
Re:how pretty (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:how pretty (Score:5, Insightful)
Controls that you can actually see before you activate them.
Re:how pretty (Score:5, Interesting)
Ah. Mystery meat navigation. Got to love it.
The real killers with Windows 8 and 10, though, are
1: Edge detection. Edge detection only works well on single monitors. It really doesn't work at all if you run a VM in a window.
2: Apps that automatically go full screen, and many of which don't even have a windowed mode. That's a huge productivity killer, and source of errors. It kills drag/drop, but even worse, you can't have source and references visible at the same time, nor copy/paste between multiple windows.
3; No activate without auto-raise. Which now is auto-raise-and-zoom. Why won't you let me type in or paste into a window that isn't on top? It makes no sense. Do people really like to bring an entire IM session to the foreground, and, depending on the program, obscuring everything else, just to type in "ok"?
4: Inconsistent menus and windows, self-organizing depending on use. It's a support nightmare when you can't tell someone how to do something, because the menus and windows are going to be different on each user's machine. You have to shoulder-surf people to support them.
5: Dumbing down DPI support. In W7 and to a smaller extent W8, you can set the DPI correctly and control the physical (as opposed to pixel) size of what you display. in W10, scaling changes on you as you try to work. it doesn't matter if you actually want a 10 dpi font to be, you know, 10 dpi in size. No, what matters now is how to scale a random amount to fit a full-screen window with huge unused borders, and your own settings be damned.
It's like they have looked at Gnome 3 and iPads, and taken all the worst "features", making an unparalleled productivity killer.
Eye candy doesn't make up for that. Sorry.
Aero was at least semi-useful, as you can see other windows through the borders. But W8/W10? It's looks for the sake of looks. And bad looks at that.
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1: Edge detection. Edge detection only works well on single monitors. It really doesn't work at all if you run a VM in a window.
It works fine on multiple monitors as you have that couple of pixels at the top to "catch" the mouse as you move between displays. It also works in VM windows if you do manual mouse capture, obviously it isn't going to work if you do automatic mouse capture.
2: Apps that automatically go full screen, and many of which don't even have a windowed mode. That's a huge productivity killer, and source of errors. It kills drag/drop, but even worse, you can't have source and references visible at the same time, nor copy/paste between multiple windows.
In Windows 10 they can all be run in windowed mode.
3; No activate without auto-raise. Which now is auto-raise-and-zoom. Why won't you let me type in or paste into a window that isn't on top? It makes no sense. Do people really like to bring an entire IM session to the foreground, and, depending on the program, obscuring everything else, just to type in "ok"?
It's there, and it's simple to configure it [blogspot.com.au]. Most people don't want that as default behavior.
4: Inconsistent menus and windows, self-organizing depending on use. It's a support nightmare when you can't tell someone how to do something, because the menus and windows are going to be different on each user's machine. You have to shoulder-surf people to support them.
Yes we should eliminate customization so everything is the same on every system because allowing people to cus
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Fine - if you know that they're there.
Perhaps I should patent "having a couple of pixels that perform some action, and are visually distinguishable from other pixels that perform other actions, or no action."
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Office menus? Careful, they'll take that as an endorsement of ribbons. We replaced everything with ribbons! See? No more menus!
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Indeed. I turn off all animations they waste time and resources.
Counter-intuitively, and contrary to the label "Adjust [Visual Effects] for best performance", turning off animations on Windows Vista and above will make your system slower because it disables hardware acceleration.
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnew... [msdn.com]
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I thought they'd turned off all extraneous 'eye candy' to get a slim, lean, 'clean', look that was very efficient... and so I fully expect them to start making some tiles translucent in the next release, and then with shiny graphical highlights too.
Maybe one day they'll make buttons that look like buttons so you know where to click!
Re:how pretty (Score:5, Insightful)
As long as you can still turn them off. Just one more thing to add to the post-install de-crapification checklist.
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I couldn't care less about how pretty it looks...I want it to WORK PROPERLY.
These days the issues with operating systems (Windows, Linux (incl. Android) or OSX) are more related to the user installing malicious software than the actual operating system working incorrectly. Actual operating system crashes - even those that stem from bad kernel-mode drivers - are few and far between these days on any of the modern operating systems, we've come a long way from the days of Windows 9x, MacOS and the early versions of Caldera.
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Kernel 2.4 was usable, but 2.6 solidified Linux as a really great OS, and its just getting better.
but as far as UI, on linux it feels like its a dime a dozen because we've had compiz for so long, we can just make any effect we really want, and none of it really seems new.
or just bring
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Now it's reversed
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Technically, the most accurate description for a usable operating system and interface, is as invisible as possible, whilst allowing the user to, configure the system, search for files and launch applications. In addition rather than pointless prettiness the operating system and graphical user interface should incorporate applications in the base package that the bulk of people use, so office suite (spread sheet, word processor, simple relational database and, vector drawing tool), calendering application,
Linux was pretty if you wanted it to be (Score:2)
Rob Malda had an popular web site for the Enlightenment application ePlus when Slashdot started which is why a lot of people who used
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If Windows 10 is running slow, your setup is *really* old. For particularly large values of old.
I want (Score:2)
wobbly windows. Where ARE my wobbly windows??
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Don't forget the flames.
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Will Microsoft ever learn? (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Will Microsoft ever learn? (Score:5, Interesting)
My computer has had CPU and GPU cycles to burn for the past decade, and while my machines are typically reasonably powered, they're not exactly considered monsters either. For all the complaints I hear about wasting cycles, I have yet to see OS-level effects or window animations seriously slow down my computer in any measurable way, even on specialized workstations I optimize for performance, like my digital audio workstation.
Animation actually has a real purpose in terms of UI design. For instance, an animation between a window in it's normal state and the minimized state is not just aesthetically pleasing, but helps the user to mentally connect those windowed positions, making it less likely for people to be momentarily confused about where their window disappeared to. Moreover, people generally like eye candy, and they like to be able to customize their system. It simply serves to make people more comfortable with the OS environment, but I'd argue that's actually important of any tech product intended for the masses as well.
Adding animations or some virtual gloss doesn't devalue an operating system and turn it into a tech toy, nor does making a product boring and dull enhance it's functionality in any way.
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I'd say I prefer my windows to just *be gone* when I minimize them. I know they end up in the system tray. I don't need an animation to tell me that my UI/Desktop Manager is doing its job.
You can provide status information visually WITHOUT animation.
Just to say: Some years back, I had a boss who, using a dual monitor station for software development, frequently hit the Windows 2000 Window Limit (64 I think).
I currently have 22 windows open. Of them, about 8 are tabbed browser windows so you can figure
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Because occasionally I forget to stop it after I play a game at the end of the day. My work laptop happens to also be my current steam platform since my gaming box is now out of support (XP). (By work, I mean 'the laptop I do useful work on' vs. 'the laptop provided by work').
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I have some of the animations in KDE 4 enabled, stuff like opening/closing windows, minimizing/maximizing, switching desktops and the like. I also have them set to "fast" rather than "normal". The animation is still clearly visible, but it's quick enough that they don't get in the way. Nothing at all like that horrible Crazy Compiz video linked in the summary.
Animations are perfectly OK, as long as they don't get in the way of actually using the system.
Re:Will Microsoft ever learn? (Score:5, Insightful)
I wonder when Microsoft will learn that a lot of us would rather use our CPU and GPU cycles for something other than eye candy? While computers can be used for fun purposes, we shouldn't all be left with the feel that what we have is little more than a technotoy.
Windows has always offered the option to turn off animations. (System Properties -> Advanced System Settings -> Performance gives a bunch of checkboxes for this on both Win7 and Win10.) Flip it around: why shouldn't those of us with good mid-range or high-end desktops be able to use a small portion of our CPU and GPU power to make things look nicer? Why should we be hamstrung to what the crappiest tablet with a half-dead battery can handle?
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This, This, this, I liked Aero, I had a PC that could run it, I like buttons that look like buttons that click whan you push em and have a bit o shiney hi-light.
I like translucent effects and stuff showing through.
Who really likes flat blah square windows with little indication as th who has focus and whats on top.
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I know this is Slashdot, but you must be talking about Google here.
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form over function? (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:form over function? (Score:4, Informative)
To be fair, this is a Technical Preview, and I wouldn't be surprised if these are "checked" debug builds, which are always going to be slower than a highly optimized build.
Captcha: OVERFLOW
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Seems to me like they have more to work on than animations - maybe they should focus on usability for a bit first.
You think they should focus first on the things where the desired user experience is well understood, so leaving the unknowns and exploratory experiments to be done much closer to ship time?
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Not saying there isn't work to do but I think betas/previews are debug builds with a lot of optimizations turned off. There is a minimum bar on all features I think before people start saying you don't look cool/add features etc. It is a constant battle as a developer pushing for a balance between new shinny and performance/maintenance.
Ridiculous (Score:2)
Helpful to newbies (Score:4, Insightful)
If done right, such animations can be helpful to newbies, showing the relationship between the icon and the newly opened window (versus say a randomly popping message or spam). But after a while such "training wheels" get annoying and slow you down.
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But after a while such "training wheels" get annoying and slow you down.
At which point you turn them off.
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That is my biggest complaint about windows phone: take a desktop animation then make it take 4X longer that is windows phone. Otherwise it is pretty nice though (if only they could convince more people to develop for it). I fully agree with you these days if someone is staring at a screen and clicks something they know what they expect to happen 90% of the time so you might as well just give it to them as quickly as possible.
Perhaps make the UI adaptive: have the wiz bang animations and after an hour ask th
Re:Ridiculous (Score:4, Insightful)
Dude, 'grok' has been around since 1961. Where the fuck have you been? It's over half a century old. Additionally, it's pretty damn standard amongst folks with half a brain.
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The flat thing needs to go away (Score:5, Insightful)
I know, I know, Apple did it so it must be cool right? I really want the ability for people to change themes as they see fit come back. If you are on a low spec phone, tablet or PC, or just don't like effects, you should be able to turn them off. But if you want more effects, you should have the option. You could easily turn off the Aero Glass effect in Windows 7 and either stay with the less-transparent Windows 7 GUI or even go all the way back to Windows Classic. Why can't we have that option again?
I'm fairly certain you have that option. (Score:2)
Even if you don't, you should be able to download it and install it as a theme. Windows is pretty customizable. The desktop effects are under advanced computer properties and the theme is under personalization. You can also turn Aero glass off in the power management menu.
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This would add more work for Microsoft. Microsoft has been struggling with ever increasing monitor resolutions, i.e. the HighDPI issues that todays display cause. They have designed the Modern UI to be mostly resolution independent, whereas their own software sometimes broke with the "make text larger" solutions they had employed since XP.
There new UI for the desktop is designed to scale better, but they would need to redo all the assets and possibly reprogram the old code that makes up those old UI choices
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More than the looks (though flexibility in the looks would be welcome) I would like options to make the file manager not suck : optional left pane, favorites menu, no wasted space (show more damn files and folders per area), customizable toolbar.
Loss of the style of file manager I used in Windows 98 and XP was one reason that led me to flee to linux. What a pain in the ass.
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I actually don't understand what the problem is. Windows looks fine to me from 1200x800 all the way to 2K. What is the problem exactly? Chrome can show more tabs, you can have crisper wallpapers and everything is so nice!
"9860 class of releases" (Score:1)
Because build numbers mean something!
MUST... HAVE... MORE BUILD NUMBERS!
Is this a joke? (Score:2)
Meet the new MS same as the old MS.
Aero? (Score:4, Insightful)
Can we have our transparency back?
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I don't so much mind the flatness as the drive toward black-and-white UI icons. That is a UX "innovation" that needs to die, now. Even today when I fire up an old copy of Visual Studio 2010 I think the interface is so much nicer and richer than the minimalist BS of today.
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Black and white or grey UI is usually Google's apps. Windows is nicely colored, on the desktop as well as on the phone. They are the one who started the flat craze though.
For those of us who've been around ... (Score:2, Funny)
... we know damn well that Windows is an Apple knockoff.
Still more work to be done (Score:3)
This is a good start (assuming you can turn these animations off if you don't like them). Hopefully they'll bring back Aero Glass-style transparency soon.
There are also a lot more substantive flaws that need to be addressed. The Start menu (which is Win10's big selling point!) doesn't currently do DPI scaling properly. It's disappointing enough to see this flaw with third-party software, but for a core part of the OS, it's inexcusable. And there is still no way to remove the obtrusive Search and Task View icons from the taskbar. (Both of these issues have hundreds of votes on Feedback; hopefully they will be addressed.)
There are also a bunch of smaller annoyances – unlike in Win7, I can't get the useless "Homegroup" option to disappear from the left panel of File Explorer, even if I leave all homegroups completely. They also shove OneDrive down your throat. And if I rename "This PC" back to "My Computer", it displays under my preferred name in most places, but not in the tile half of the Start menu – it appears fine in the left-hand list portion, but the tile always says "This PC" no matter what it has been renamed to.
There are some encouraging signs, but this is definitely an alpha-class release in my experience. Glad I installed it in a VM.
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"And there is still no way to remove the obtrusive Search and Task View icons from the taskbar"
That one bugs me too, especially when activatng the taskbar on multiple monitors. I wouldn't mind if they were only on the main monitor, but thay are on all of them (back to display fusion I guess)
What's a "comprehensive feel"? (Score:2)
Are they bundling Candy Crush? (Score:2)
Hand me the Windows 10 installation CD, and I will go and get a hammer.
Because (Score:2)
It's a bird, it's plane, it's......a chair? (Score:2)
The Ballmer "Chair" interface, eh?
Seriosouly, though, I hope there is an option to switch that animation off. I like quick response, and switched off the XP and Win7 animations on my PC. Please, don't take that away, Mr. Nadella.
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Oh Great! Another lawsuit! (Score:2)
Looks like Apple's animation... must by a copyright infringement, or if not that a patent infringement, or if no that just really really bad. Fire up the lawyerbot.
Free Upgrade??? (Score:2)
All I care about is if users that are stuck with the never-ending train-wreck that is Windows 8/8.1 going to get a free upgrade to Windows 10.
Welcome to 8+ years ago :) (Score:2)
>" It is a slick animation and if you have used OS X [(MacOS 10)], it is similar to the one used to collapse windows back in to the dock."
You mean like the one we have been using in Compiz/Beryl in Linux and then in KDE under Linux for many years?? Yawn.
Aero in season again yet? (Score:2)
Or.... you could be Edgy!! Yeah let's go with edgy...
Gnome 2 and Windows 2000 got it right. (Score:2)
Sensible, and functional, without an overload of useless crap.
JMHO.
who cares about how it looks? (Score:2)
Seriously, if you want it to look different, just get windowblinds and you're done.
What could microsoft do better? get functionality like windowblinds built-in and make it easy to use
incorporate ability to mount ftp drives
fix built-in defrag too to allow it to move page file so you can shrink partition to minimum size
get rid of the abysmal ribbon and change menus in office to allow typing (ie. type commands/keywords instead of browsing through menus/toolsbars)
how about improving built-in notepad to not
Typical (Score:2)
Sigh (Score:3)
Because what I want in an enterprise-class operating system, what I desire more than anything else, what I cannot live without, what my users are crying out for, what I will pay good money just to have... ... is more shit jumping out at me on the screen for no good reason.
Gimme WinFS and we'll talk. Gimme complete application isolation and I'll think about it. Otherwise, honestly, you're just papering over the cracks.
well (Score:2)
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The worst part is the animation duration, how in the hell can you use a system where it takes nearly two seconds for each menu to appear? It's completely insane!
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I think the default animation time in windows 7 menus is 200ms. Or at least that's what ClassicShell claims it to be in advanced mode that lets you adjust the timing.
If they actually push animation time as far as you suggest, I think that would just become another reason why people will stick to 7. OS needs to be functional first and foremost. That's why 8 failed, vastly impaired desktop desktop functionality. Too pronounced/delayed animations would likely fall in the same category.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkN-gEUnICI [youtube.com]
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FFS people.....
Eye candy might help some of you a bit, it'll hurt some of us others a bit.
Simple utility and well thought out design for usability makes a quite usable UI. Windows 2000 had a workable UI. So did XP if you put it in classic mode. So does 7. 8+... assssssssss.....
Xubuntu I quite like. Ubuntu before Unity isn't bad. I've seen Zorin lately and it looks okay.
A decent operator can learn a
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The animation is choppy because the screen recording is running at 10-15fps (my estimation), which is perfectly fine for showing off a piece of software, but not very good for showing fluid animations.
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Look at how the mouse moves. Have you every seen any desktop environment where the mouse update rate is that shitty? No, you haven't.
A lot of desktop recording applications run at 10-15fps to save space and/or bandwidth, and because it's plenty to adequately show off the user interfaces of most graphical applications. I've been using WebEx and other screen recording solutions (including FRAPS) for over a decade. don't try to school me on this.
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It seems like you want me to come back click hear to vote for me
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Posting AC since I already moderated here.
After going to the Youtube page, I gotta say - Just what the fuck?
So now in order to salve the wounds of people butthurt by the monumental sucakge of Windows 8, will be treated to the awesome best ever spectacle of rotating menu items, what they've always been waiting for?
Ahem. The youtube link (showing the flipping menus) shows a Linux desktop. It was intended by submitter jonas-supa to show how much more advanced Linux desktops are.
Can't wait until the fanbois come out and tell us how waiting for a menu to spin around a few times is based on extensive research done by Microsoft that proves once and for all that most users want the operating system to waste their fucking time, and that anyone who doesn't just love the steaming hot piece of shit is an idiot who doesn't kow that they are doing.
Lol. We have to wait for the Linux fanbois to explain why the hell Linux needs compiz and all of the (agreed: Horrid!) animations from that youtube link.
Way to go there, buddy.
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And stop shiny monitors as well. Literally the worst thing to happen to screens.
The low-frequency 200Hz backlight is the worst thing that has happened to screens. The glossy finish is a nice runner-up though.
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Dude your office seriously needs new hardware if the cursor in Word lags behind your typing. Although I agree that all Office apps have an irritating startup time that was not there earlier.
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http://www.worldofspectrum.org... [worldofspectrum.org]
B.C. Bill. Very apt naming...