Follow Slashdot blog updates by subscribing to our blog RSS feed

 



Forgot your password?
typodupeerror
×
Australia The Internet

Australia: VPN Users Aren't Breaching Copyright (abc.net.au) 117

Slashdot reader Zanadou writes: The Australian Government Productivity Commission in a draft report recommended that Australian consumers should be able to legally circumvent geoblocking restrictions that have prevented them from using foreign online streaming services like Netflix, and that the Australian Government needs to send a clear message that it is not an infringement of copyright for consumers to be able evade geoblocking technology. Karen Chester, a commissioner with the Productivity Commission, told the Australian Broadcasting Corporation that geoblocking restrictions have the opposite effect of encouraging internet piracy. "Making copyright material more accessible and more competitively priced online, and not geoblocking, is the best antidote to copyright infringement."

In probably related news, Australia topped the list of countries who illegally downloaded the Game Of Thrones season six premiere, this week.

In January Netflix's chief product officer admitted that the company has no magic solution to subscribers who use VPNs to circumvent geoblocking.
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

Australia: VPN Users Aren't Breaching Copyright

Comments Filter:
  • Copyright laws are negotiated through international treaties. That includes circumventing geographical restrictions. Australia is in violation.

    • by fustakrakich ( 1673220 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @09:55PM (#52020949) Journal

      That's okay. Treaties, like governments, should never last more than a generation anyway. Otherwise you enslave your kids to your bad deals.

      • by dryeo ( 100693 )

        That's not really true as some treaties deserve to last more then a generation. Should we scrap the treaty that keeps the Great Lakes a non-militarized zone? What about the peace treaty with England that recognized the newly independent country of the USA.
        Trade deals, which often aren't even treaties, should always have a reasonable out, eg for NAFTA I believe a participant can leave with 6 months notice and most trade deals and sometimes other treaties are like that, 6 months to a years notice and you can

        • by Calydor ( 739835 )

          Treaties should only last a generation. Then when they're about to expire they can be revisited and renegotiated.

          • by dryeo ( 100693 )

            So every generation we renegotiate the international borders? Renegotiate the price we agreed to pay? Perhaps Russia is not happy now at only getting a few million dollars for Alaska. Or the French want to renegotiate the Louisiana purchase.

            • Think of it as having to renew your marriage vows every 20-25 years or so.

              And international borders, they are prison walls, they should have been abolished with the end of World War 2. They only serve the stratification interests of business. All the nationalist/religious ideology is to motivate your army to work for cheap [nbcnews.com], but even those ISIS guys don't work for free.

        • by pedz ( 4127433 )

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism

          Thank you for the reference...

    • Copyright laws are negotiated through international treaties. That includes circumventing geographical restrictions. Australia is in violation.

      Good for Australia in this case. The rest of us will follow shortly.

    • by Anonymous Coward

      I didn't sign your treaty, and I don't recognise it.

    • by geekpowa ( 916089 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @10:43PM (#52021083)
      What treaty precisely hmmm? Australia is a soverign nation and we will make our own gorram civil laws thankyou very much. We have strong consumer protection laws, unlike the dsytopian hellhole where I assume you reside. One such law is the restrictive trade practices act. Restrictions on who trades with who are not permitted and it has far reaching implications in terms of preventing monopolistic and predatory retail practices. For example it prevents restricting franchisee holders from being compelled to source from a restricted list of 3rd parties. Geolocking is arguably a violation of this law and I would personally hope that this law will generally override any attempts to justify such practices under guise of copyright, though I imagine that is for lawyers and judges to sort out on a case by case basis.
      • The Berne Convention [wipo.int] seems referred to.
        • by Anonymous Coward

          Berne convention doesn't cover Geoblocks.

          Australia is a signatory to the Berne convention and does enforce it's copyright laws. It just doesn't do 3/4 of the shit the USA does outside the convention to please Sonny Bono and Disney.

    • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday April 30, 2016 @11:02PM (#52021117)

      G'Day, Australia here. I never claimed that I'd recognise region blocking as a component of copyright law - and my local laws are already quite clear on that fact. So long as my citizens are accessing the content in a manner that's legal in the region it was released, then that's fine with me.

      Speaking as a nation of course, I don't have a lot of patience for anyone who refuses to sell something here, then complains about my citizens buying that content somewhere else. I've even less patience for anyone who tries to stop my citizens buying their product, then complains about it being stolen!

      Sincerely Yours,
        The Sovereign Nation of Australia

      • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward

        Bingo

        It's not piracy if the person is watching US Netflix from Australia. It IS piracy if the video is an unauthorized distribution downloaded from BitTorrent.

        To frame this, you have to pay 10$/mo for the VPN on top of the 8$/mo for Netflix. So the Aussies are already paying for this geoblocking bullshit. It may become standard fare that everyone outside the US buys into a VPN just to circumvent restrictive content policies in their home countries, not just trying to access US content.

        For example, Germany a

    • by Dunbal ( 464142 ) * on Sunday May 01, 2016 @02:01AM (#52021395)
      A geographical restriction is a contract matter between a content publisher and a distributor. It has nothing to do with law, and everything to do with "rights agreements". A consumer, however, cannot be bound by a contract between two third parties. If I make a contract with my friend stating that you can no longer drive your car and try to enforce it in court I will be laughed out of the courthouse. Consumers are paying for the content - no copyright infringement is happening. An artist doesn't get to say when or where you're allowed to hear his music or play his CD.
      • An artist doesn't get to say when or where you're allowed to hear his music or play his CD.

        To a limited extent he does, if it is a public performance. Check out "right of publicity".

  • Wonderful! (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Nethead ( 1563 ) <joe@nethead.com> on Saturday April 30, 2016 @09:34PM (#52020867) Homepage Journal

    Does this mean I'll be able to watch MasterChef Australia and MKR in the US, without torrenting them like I do now? Maybe catch some extra videos from Ten's website?

    • Re: Wonderful! (Score:5, Interesting)

      by corychristison ( 951993 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @09:51PM (#52020931)

      Agreed.

      My wife is a fan of a few different Aussie shows. We used to use Unblock-Us.com to access Netflix content in a bunch of regions, and Australia was one of them.

      We live in Canada. We honestly didn't even care much for access to the US library, as many users did. Between access to AU, UK, and IR we got the shows we wanted.

      Now its back to pirating because i haven't a clue where else to find some of them. Amazon doesn't carry the DVD's, no luck at local distributors. Outside of traveling to these places and trying to buy them and bring back home (which introduces even more problem, even ignoring the travel cost), I don't know where else to find them.

      I guess they don't want my money, so fuck 'em.

      • Re: Wonderful! (Score:4, Interesting)

        by Nethead ( 1563 ) <joe@nethead.com> on Saturday April 30, 2016 @10:36PM (#52021073) Homepage Journal

        Agreed. We don't find much US TV that is all that interesting to us. I would say about 70% of our watching is UK or AU and most of the other 30% is PBS. We're really sad that DocZone is off the air now, our favorite CA show (I miss Corner Gas too.) Replying to this I'm actually watching Selling Homes Australia. I think the only mainstream US show we watch is Deadliest Catch, but we live in a small native fishing village on the Salish Sea. Our ISP is run by the Tribes so I'm not really worried about a copyright notice.

        So we don't have cable, our one big screen is just a monitor for the old linux box that is our torrent host. We have Amazon Prime but to be honest, it just as easy to torrent the show and not worry about buffering.

    • by msauve ( 701917 )
      Enjoy your panem et circenses..
    • Yeah mate no wucking forries, just use a service like this https://zenvpn.net/en/vpn-loca... [zenvpn.net]
      • by Nethead ( 1563 )

        I went with https://www.privateinternetacc... [privateint...access.com] for $40/mo unlimited. It also has UK endpoints.

        • I went with https://www.privateinternetacc... [privateint...access.com] for $40/mo unlimited. It also has UK endpoints.

          Whoa, I didn't even know they had that high-end a service!

          My $40/year account works just fine for me...

          • by Nethead ( 1563 )

            Good catch.

            • Good catch.

              Haha, no worries. I was honestly wondering if they maybe did have a secret super-ultimate-ninja account, only available to the select few...

              • by JazzLad ( 935151 )
                I've used PIA off and on for years, but a few months ago I let my sub lapse because even US -> US was being blocked by Netflix. Has this improved?
                • I've used PIA off and on for years, but a few months ago I let my sub lapse because even US -> US was being blocked by Netflix. Has this improved?

                  Actually...I haven't used it for Netflix for years now. I just don't find anything in the American catalog interesting enough to jump through the hoops, so sorry, not sure if it's 'fixed' yet!

                  Purchasing digital content from Amazon US however... :)

    • Re:Wonderful! (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Solandri ( 704621 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @11:19PM (#52021139)
      I think it's more a message to content producers to stop dropping the ball and start releasing your content in all markets, rather than hiding behind geo-blocking as a way to delay releasing it in markets where it's "inconvenient" or "doesn't fit with your profit-maximizing release schedule." If you want to implement different pricing in different markets, then sure go ahead. But don't stupidly withhold content from certain markets while the Internet is abuzz with talk about what happened in the latest episode, then come to the country's government complaining that people in that country are pirating the show.

      If those Australian show producers don't want to bother with separate releases in the U.S., then just allow people in the U.S. to subscribe to them online as if they were in Australia. Or if they are contracted with a U.S. affiliate to release those shows, then pressure those affiliates to release them in a timely manner. (And vice versa for shows from other countries in Australia of course.)
      • Re:Wonderful! (Score:4, Informative)

        by tlhIngan ( 30335 ) <slashdot.worf@net> on Sunday May 01, 2016 @03:53AM (#52021587)

        I think it's more a message to content producers to stop dropping the ball and start releasing your content in all markets, rather than hiding behind geo-blocking as a way to delay releasing it in markets where it's "inconvenient" or "doesn't fit with your profit-maximizing release schedule." If you want to implement different pricing in different markets, then sure go ahead. But don't stupidly withhold content from certain markets while the Internet is abuzz with talk about what happened in the latest episode, then come to the country's government complaining that people in that country are pirating the show.

        The reason content producers are doing it the way they are is simple. Money All the distributors are willing to pay $$$$$ for geographic distribution exclusivity. If they weren't granted it (say, to give Netflix the ability to show it too), then they'd only be willing to pay $, and Netflix pays $. So the math is obvious - with geographic limitations, you get $$$$$. With no geographic restrictions, you only get $$.

        It's no longer about timing or variable pricing - timing on a lot of shows can be 24 hours worldwide, and pricing is set locally - based again on the exclusivity.

        I'm sure Netflix COULD try to pay for worldwide distribution, but then you'd be basically paying $100/month for Netflix - because someone has to max up the difference in the money that the content producers will get going exclusive versus not.

        Remember, you're paying for a right to a virtual monopoly, so you're going to pay a lot of money. If you're going to have to compete, you're not going to pay a lot of money. That's where the difference in the money is.

        Now, more t hings like this could help reduce the payments - because those distributors will lean on the providers and tell them that unless they enforce the blocks, they're not going to pay so much anymore for the programming. Then it's a back and forth -- will the loss of money from that distributor be made up by offering other companies the right to distribute non-exclusively?

        • The reason content producers are doing it the way they are is simple. Money All the distributors are willing to pay $$$$$ for geographic distribution exclusivity. If they weren't granted it (say, to give Netflix the ability to show it too), then they'd only be willing to pay $, and Netflix pays $. So the math is obvious - with geographic limitations, you get $$$$$. With no geographic restrictions, you only get $$.

          I think that's true in some markets, but not in others.

          In Australia (as in the UK), there isn't

        • Remember, you're paying for a right to a virtual monopoly, so you're going to pay a lot of money.

          Here's an interesting idea: given that they do have a monopoly over that content, how about we start enforcing antitrust/competition law on it? That would mean no more requiring a foxtel (cable, for non-Aussies) subscription to view a single piece of content. You could achieve this with the existing CCA, which defines markets (for the purpose of defining a monopoly) as having some element of substitution between products within them, though it would definitely be a novel interpretation.

          Alternatively, we cou

    • I actually thought we geoblocked that shit for the wealthfare of the rest of the world. I honestly don't know how anyone can stand to watch that shit.
  • Finally (Score:5, Insightful)

    by sir1963nz ( 4560389 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @09:57PM (#52020959)
    I can buy and import any (legal) physical product: Books, CDs, DVDs, Clothes, Shoes, Cars, computers, software, etc etc etc etc. Just because its a digital file rather than a physical item they want different rules ?, Why ? The ONLY reason for this is to reduce competition and increase prices. If I pay for it, I am entitled to it, legally.
    • Re:Finally (Score:5, Insightful)

      by rtb61 ( 674572 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @10:19PM (#52021025) Homepage

      To be fair, you just don't need to be able to pay for it, those selling it to you need to be able to legally do so ;). Free market principles of course demand all need to be able to access the market upon an equal market, otherwise the market is not free but cartel based, specifically designed to enrich the core cartel operators by excluding the majority from equal access to the market. So in Australia people do not want to pay for shitty foxtel with commercials, seriously what the fuck, pay to watch commercials, just to watch one series with the story busted up with rubbish commercials.

      Personally I just wait till the end of the season so I can binge watch. Make it available for sale and I will buy it, be dicks and block sale for years and well, I'll still watch it and fuck foxtel, corrupt shit heads.

    • Great.

      So, I also assume when you purchase such items overseas you declare them to Australian tax authorities, and make sure you pay the required tarrifs, GST, etc on them?
      You do realise that those need to be paid in most situations, right?

      Its a slightly different concern, however it also matters.
      How much local tax to you think Steam, Google, and Netflix pay on content accessed from the US?

      • GST, the only relevant tax, is only due on products with a value of over AU$1000. Consumers generally, there are exceptions, don't face state specific taxes in Australia so imports are processed for tax liability at the national border. I have imported multiple things that have exceeded that threshold, I receive notification from Customs that they are holding it pending payment of the GST liability. I pay it and they on ship it.

      • Well I am in NZ, but yes, when required to do so I have paid all of the taxes asked of me. However, taxes are NOT the issue here, it is being stopped from importing digital files that is the problem, oh and being told I am a criminal (pirate) when I have in fact legally paid for the item, and if required paid taxes on it. The laws/rules are designed to inhibit/kill competition by reducing the number of sources to ONE local source, and with them being to dictate terms and conditions. I buy in stuff from C
    • Some formats of movies and video games are supposed to be region locked.
      Cars are also region locked to some degree, as you usually have to pay a hefty price to get a car purchased abroad approved for driving locally.

      • An Australian was living in the US for a little while, and his son was in my scout troop. He really liked his Dodge Ram, so looked into what it would take to bring it into Australia (right hand driving country). It would cost $40k for the conversion of the $35k truck to be able to import it to Australia. That is very sad, why can't the poor Australians drive American style trucks!

  • A Book (Score:5, Interesting)

    by PPH ( 736903 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @10:13PM (#52021003)

    I traveled overseas a few years back. On my trip, I bought a book. On the copyright notice page it states that this book is only authorized for sale in the country I was visiting. I then flew back to the USA (where this particular edition is not available) with my book. Have I broken a law or violated a copyright?

    As I see it, Australian citizens are simply purchasing material at a point of sale within the USA (the VPN's point of presence) and then they are using private means to move the material to their home. I flew. They used a VPN.

  • http://www.theage.com.au/technology/technology-news/why-i-refuse-to-feel-sorry-for-pirating-game-of-thrones-20160428-gohqzi.html

  • by sg_oneill ( 159032 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @10:57PM (#52021109)

    This has most likely been legal regardless always. Back in the 90s we had a big drama over government laws introduced guaranteeing "parallell importation". The concept being that the consumer (and retailer) was guaranteed the right to bypass local importers and import their own stuff if they can get a better deal. This was particularly targetted at the music industry where CD distribution monopolies had kept album prices at around the $30 mark which in the 1990s was pretty damn exorbitant. The music industry had a fit about it, right down to big public scare campaigns about how it would ~somehow~ make music more expensive and cause australian musicians to go bankerupt because pirates would make cds in indoneisa or china and sell them cheap here legally. Which of course was nonsense since none of this authorized piracy. The laws also meant CD players where required to be multi region.

    Later the laws where used to prohibit sony and microsoft going after modchippers , and enforced DVD multi-region requirements. This all was going great until the conserative Howard government came in and I think, but I cant prove, they told the ACCC to stop enforcing the parallell import laws. And we got DMCA style laws for copyright which actually reversed many of the freedoms of parallell import.

    None the less, they ARE still on the book, so I guess this rulings most important result is clarifying that technological measures to circumvent geoblocking do not violate copyright laws.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Parallel Imports (I once worked for eBay Australia) was a laughable thing.

      We were told, point blank, to ignore all parallel import takedowns because they were overreach. You'd get companies like Microsoft and Adobe going after EVERY person selling their product in Australia that wasn't an authorized Adobe/Microsoft dealer for Australia. So the end-game here was that US legitimate companies would geoblock selling to Australia by removing the shipping options to Australia and instead the Australians would buy

  • by westlake ( 615356 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @11:16PM (#52021137)

    In January Netflix's chief product officer admitted that the company has no magic solution to subscribers who use VPNs to circumvent geoblocking.

    The population of Australia is 23 million. The number of Netflix subscribers in Australia is about 1 million. Respectable. But from the studios point of view these are not big numbers and a leak here and there isn't going to matter very much.

    They are big numbers to Presto and Stan, Netflix's rivals in Australia --- which means that for Netflix the Australian VPN is win-win.

    It undercuts its regional rivals, before they can become too strong, at very little cost to its own bottom line and without damaging its relations with the studios.

  • by martin-boundary ( 547041 ) on Saturday April 30, 2016 @11:36PM (#52021163)
    I don't think that what the Australian Government thinks matters here. Any customer who circumvents a protection method, no matter how stupid the method is, commits a crime under the DMCA. That's an American Law, and it applies to Aussies who do business in the US, even if technically their PCs are operating in Australia.

    It's a stupid law, it needs to be repealed, etc. etc. But Australians are doing it wrong if they argue they're morally or legally right in Australia. The only thing that matters is what happens in the US.

    That said, the beauty of breaking the law from within a foreign country is that it's a lot harder for the wronged company to get relief. Especially if the foreign government disagrees with the US. By hurting American companies economically, the trickle down effect *may* be that the stupid law will get revisited. So rock on Aussies ;-)

    • Does geoblocking always count as a "protection method" under the DMCA? Australia *does* have laws about breaking *DRM* that are akin to the US rules.
      • Geoblocking is clearly a method for protecting digital distribution rights. Netflix pays money to receive limited rights to show movies to some of its customers, but not all, ie not Australians in Australia.

        Due to the DMCA, in America, any method, no matter how flimsy, to protect the content from being seen by Australians in Australia is good enough. So because the method (aka geoblocking) now exists, the bad guys (aka Australians living in Australia) have been prevented and all is good in the world. But

        • holding a gun to someones head and demanding they don't watch something is also clearly a method for protecting digital distribution rights. But just like Geoblocking it is against Australian law and hence if you try to claim they were avoiding you holding a gun to their head you would have a pretty tough time in court.
      • Does geoblocking always count as a "protection method" under the DMCA?

        IANA(US)L, obviously, but the answer is "maybe". The question of what exactly constitutes a TPM was tested in the High Court of Australia, and they found that a TPM has to be a copy control measure, not just an access control measure. Hence, the mere circumventing of geoblocking is not illegal because you didn't try to get around copy protection, you only got around access control.

        In fact, the decision (which was about PlayStation modchipping) explicitly pointed out that differential pricing was a risk: "If

    • How exactly are we committing a crime in the US? I am in Australia. Netflix are providing access to me in Australia. I am making a trade with an Australian credit card and I am making the purchase in Australian dollars for an Australian account. All that is happening is that I connect to a VPN and Netflix provides me with different content. That they provide me with different content is their choice, not mine.

      I frankly don't give a fuck what the DMCA states. Or in fact any other law on US books. I am

      • Sure you are committing a crime. It's exactly the same principle as when you stand inside the USA near the Mexican border. You spy a Mexican trying to enter the country illegally, and you shoot him while he's on the other side. You've committed murder, even if technically all you did was shoot a gun in the air on US soil, even if technically you've been in the US during all this time, and even if nobody died or got injured inside the US. It's not true that the Mexican was simply killed in his country by a b
    • by NotAPK ( 4529127 )

      "I don't think that what the Australian Government thinks matters here."

      I think you'll find the Australian Government matters very much within Australia.

  • by ajdlinux ( 913987 ) on Sunday May 01, 2016 @01:39AM (#52021371) Homepage Journal

    Quite apart from the geoblocking issue - there's a whole tonne of interesting recommendations in the draft report [pc.gov.au].

    For those who aren't familiar, the Productivity Commission is a major Australian Government advisory body/think tank that conducts public inquiries into matters of economic policy. The Government requested a broad report into the economic effectiveness of the intellectual property system.

    This report is a draft - the Commission is presently taking public submissions that will be considered for the final report later this year.

    Highlights from the findings and recommendations:

    • 70 years after death is far too long a term for copyright - it would be more appropriate to limit copyright to 15-25 years after creation (noting that this has implications for international copyright treaties)
    • Repeal Australia's "parallel import" restrictions on books
    • Replace Australia's present "fair dealing" exemptions with a US-style "fair use" clause which would be much broader in scope
    • Ban software patents and business method patents
    • Reform pharmaceutical patents in various ways
    • Government should adopt an Open Access policy for publicly funded research

    All of which seems in line with what I consider sensible policy reform. Of course, whether the Government will consider any of these recommendations at all is a completely different question...

    • by Anonymous Coward

      > it would be more appropriate to limit copyright to 15-25 years after creation
      I wish that australia, or some other big western country would do this.
      Of course the US, and other countries would go into complete meltdown and probably throw up all kinds of sanctions to please their corporate overlords.
      But that is far more reasonable.

  • The call Australia "Treasure Island" because retailers can overcharge for so much out of date stuff here. Even downloads of software cost 30-80% more if your site is the .com.au locale.
  • by smileytshirt ( 988345 ) on Sunday May 01, 2016 @06:33AM (#52021857) Homepage
    This is a complete media beat up about Australians pirating GOT more than any country. The source of the information https://torrentfreak.com/game-... [torrentfreak.com] quoted its statistics after collecting only HALF A DAY'S worth of data - ie. while Australia was awake and the rest of the English speaking world asleep. The exact same controversy happened last year, with the exact same source and statistical integrity.

Get hold of portable property. -- Charles Dickens, "Great Expectations"

Working...