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Microsoft Operating Systems Software

Windows 10 Upgrade Activates By Clicking Red X Close Button In Prompt Message (bbc.co.uk) 564

Posted by msmash from the let-Microsoft-make-a-decision-for-you dept.
Reader Raging Bool writes: In a move guaranteed to annoy many people, Microsoft has "jumped the shark" on encouraging users to upgrade to Windows 10. Microsoft has faced criticism for changing the pop-up box encouraging Windows users to upgrade to Windows 10. Clicking the red cross on the right hand corner of the pop-up box now activates the upgrade instead of closing the box. And this has caused confusion as typically clicking a red cross closes a pop-up notification. The upgrade could still be cancelled, when the scheduled time for it to begin appeared, Microsoft said The change occurred because the update is now labelled "recommended" and many people have their PCs configured to accept recommended updates for security reasons. This means dismissing the box does not dismiss the update.Brad Chacos, senior editor at the PC World wrote about this incident over the weekend, and described it as a "nasty trick".
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Windows 10 Upgrade Activates By Clicking Red X Close Button In Prompt Message More

Windows 10 Upgrade Activates By Clicking Red X Close Button In Prompt Message

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  • This steaming pile of rancid dung (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:07PM (#52172135)

    That's it, I'm getting my Commodore 64 out of the closet and booting up GEOS.

    • Re:This steaming pile of rancid dung (Score:5, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:20PM (#52172281)

      As soon as you boot up your Commodore 64, it'll ask you if you want to upgrade to Windows 10. Even if you say you don't, it'll force you to Windows 10 anyways.

    • Re:This steaming pile of rancid dung (Score:5, Interesting)

      by NotDrWho ( 3543773 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @02:09PM (#52172785)

      Well, if you're a horror fan, you won't find any game on the C64 that's scarier than doing the custom Windows 10 installation and seeing all the default settings for data collection and "privacy."

      Seriously, there is some REALLY crazy shit in there. If you go default, you're basically giving MS the right to watch and collect EVERYTHING you do online. IIRC, one of the default settings even lets them go through your old emails to "better serve you" or some shit. That Cortana is one nosy bitch.

  • So it's our fault (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:09PM (#52172163)

    For following years of best practice of automatically installing updates on home machines.
    Got it.

    • Re: (Score:3)

      by cfalcon ( 779563 )

      > So it's our fault // For following years of best practice

      No, but it arguably is everyone's fault for trusting Microsoft at all.
      Computer administration is an actual job, and OS manufactures and distributors have jumped through hoops to make this vastly better than "please visit our website and download and apply these patches at a command line". But in doing this, you end up trusting both the intentions and the technical competence of those involved. For a mainline Linux distro or a BSD, this is a sol

  • Red X? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by The-Ixian ( 168184 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:13PM (#52172181)

    Perhaps you mean the white X inside the red square?

    But, yeah, this is the kind of thing that malware authors use. It's pretty shady.... if people don't want to upgrade, they don't want to upgrade. You gave them the box and you downloaded (and expanded) all of the files... you have already done everything you can to "promote" Windows 10 (intrusively) on people's computers...

    Why are you stooping to this Microsoft?

    You may as well just not give people a "choice" at all and just install the damn thing... why the pretense of having a user click something?

    • Why? Probably to prevent legal troubles: "But ...people had a way to prevent the update"

    • why the pretense of having a user click something?

      Lawyers. They probably feel this is unethical as hell, but can probably get away without being pulled over the coals by various courts/authorities.

      • Re:Red X? (Score:4, Insightful)

        by number6x ( 626555 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @04:34PM (#52174237)

        The opposite, I think. The MS lawyers would have tried to stop this. This will absolutely lead to a class action lawsuit, and probably a shareholder lawsuit as well. Even if Microsoft wins the lawsuits, it will cost them tens of Millions, at a minimum.

        I think the lawyers would have tried like hell to stop this, so they must have been over-ruled. However much MS is expecting to make from user data over the next few years must be estimated to be vastly greater than they are expecting to pay out in lawsuits over this upgrade tactic.

        Now this could be good or bad. If the people at MS who estimated how great a market share Windows phones would have, or how much Windows 8 would be loved did the estimation, MS has just destroyed its own future. They would have projected that the money to be made by mining and selling data from Windows 10 users would have made $ trillions, when it will actually be worth a few $ thousand. If actual actuaries and accountants with a realistic view of the world did the estimation and were able to still over-rule the lawyers, MS is going to be selling their windows 10 users down the river to make a ton of money, be prepared to be assaulted by advertising.

        • Re: (Score:3)

          by ewhac ( 5844 )

          The MS lawyers would have tried to stop this. This will absolutely lead to a class action lawsuit [ ... ]

          Uh, no. Microsoft's lawyers already have this base covered:

          10. Binding Arbitration and Class Action Waiver if You Live in (or if a Business Your Principal Place of Business is in) the United States.

          We hope we never have a dispute, but if we do, you and we agree to try for 60 days to resolve it informally. If we can't, you and we agree to binding individual arbitration before the American Arbitratio

          • What about the folks who decline the Windows 10 license agreement, which is of course presented after the upgrade has happened? Regardless of whether the ensuing rollback is successful, I would think you have a class action group right there, bound only by the license agreement of whatever OS they were using when their computer's day got suddenly worse.

  • Adult Supervision (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:16PM (#52172229)

    It seems like all adult supervision has disappeared at Microsoft.

  • Mimics Malware (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Luthair ( 847766 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:17PM (#52172241)
    Amusing that Microsoft wants us to love their stuff when they employ the same tactics as all the sites trying to confuse users into installing malware use.

    • Re:Mimics Malware (Score:5, Insightful)

      by stradric ( 983743 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:20PM (#52172289)
      It's not just this either. Have you upgraded Skype recently? It tries to set your homepage to MSN and make Bing the default search. It's like Java trying to install the Yahoo toolbar. It's almost like Microsoft and Oracle know they're headed toward irrelevance and are trying all the slimy tactics instead of actually just making better products.

    • I see your point. But when has malware every cared which button you clicked before installing?

      oh...yeah... I see your point.

      • Re:Mimics Malware (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Darinbob ( 1142669 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @03:34PM (#52173587)

        Malware authors don't have PR specialists on staff. Microsoft does. And the PR people probably suggested that at least allow the victims to click a button first so that MS can claim they didn't install anything without permission.

        Just look at the naive excuses Microsoft gives out, even with this latest fiasco.

        "Based on customer feedback, in the most recent version of the Get Windows 10 (GWX) app, we confirm the time of your scheduled upgrade and provide you an additional opportunity for cancelling or rescheduling the upgrade." (it's what customers wanted!)

        "With the free Windows 10 upgrade offer ending on 29 July, we want to help people upgrade to the best version of Windows." (they're being helpful!)

        ""Customers can choose to accept or decline the Windows 10 upgrade." (so it must be the customer's fault)

  • DMCA (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:18PM (#52172253)

    Cant the makers of XP Antivirus 2010 issue some sort of DMCA cease and desist against Microsoft for infringing on their intellectual property? I believe they were the first ones to invent "Pressing the [ X ] button will initiate installation of said software..."

  • No (Score:2)

    by wwalker ( 159341 )

    I don't think "jump the shark" means what you think it mean.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Wikipedia defines it as "an idiom popularized by Jon Hein that was used to describe the moment in the evolution of a television show when it begins a decline in quality, signaled by a particular scene, episode, or aspect of a show in which the writers use some type of gimmick in an attempt to keep viewers' interest, which is taken as a sign of desperation, and is seen by viewers to be the point at which the show strayed irretrievably from its original formula", so I'd say it's close enough.

      Personally, I'd h

      • Re:No (Score:4, Informative)

        by macs4all ( 973270 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @04:15PM (#52174033)

        Wikipedia defines it as "an idiom popularized by Jon Hein that was used to describe the moment in the evolution of a television show when it begins a decline in quality, signaled by a particular scene, episode, or aspect of a show in which the writers use some type of gimmick in an attempt to keep viewers' interest, which is taken as a sign of desperation, and is seen by viewers to be the point at which the show strayed irretrievably from its original formula", so I'd say it's close enough.

        Personally, I'd have gone with "Screwed the pooch" or "Shit the bed".

        But you forgot the originating reference [youtube.com]. It's makes no sense without that.

  • Almost as stupid as Skype (Score:5, Insightful)

    by UnknownSoldier ( 67820 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:29PM (#52172405)

    The X button means fucking **quit**, not "minimize", you UI retards. If you're going to hijack the last 40 years of WIMP then give users an option to enable / disable this shit. Preferably the default would be OFF.

    /Oblg. Microshift joke:

    Microsoft Windows: noun, A 64-bit compilation of 32 bit extensions and a graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit microprocessor written by a 2 bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition with 0 bit of understanding good UI.

  • Time for a class action. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by geekmux ( 1040042 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:31PM (#52172433)

    Microsoft, you gave us this OS and introduced the masses to the concept of windows in a UI. You were even arrogant enough to name your UI Windows.

    And all this time, we have gone through several iterations of your UI, but one constant has remained; the general understanding that if you click the fucking X located in a specific area of any window in your UI, it closes.

    This has been by design since the dawn of Windows.

    And since you've now taken the path of malware authors with this shady bullshit, we should treat you as such. It's one thing to ask users. It's one thing to force users. It's another matter entirely to trick and deceive users.

    Bottom line is it's time to start the class-action lawsuit. This should not be tolerated in any way. Put another way, if malware was introduced into the core OS and deceived users against Microsoft's wishes, you better believe they would be attacking the cause of that problem and look to put a stop to it.

    • OK (Score:5, Insightful)

      by ArchieBunker ( 132337 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @02:42PM (#52173059)

      Enjoy winning your lawsuit in a decade and getting a coupon for $10 off Office 2026.

  • I can't think of anything the fruit peddler has done that comes close to the arrogance Microsoft is showing regarding anything about Windows 10.

    It's enough to make a cynical paranoid think Microsoft is being paid to be this obnoxious and intrusive. Paid by whom? I'll leave that to the conspiracy theorists.

    Win 10 sounds like a data-collecting piece of spyware, don't it?

  • It's already scheduled, not caused by "X" (Score:5, Insightful)

    by BenJeremy ( 181303 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:36PM (#52172481)

    From what I see, it schedules the upgrade, and you have to opt out by going into some other settings to cancel.

    It's not that the "X" activates the upgrade - at that point, it's too late.

    Still, it's very shady not to give users an obvious choice on the popup, let alone not making it an "opt in" choice.

    All of my machines are running Windows 10... shrugs... at this point, all the bitching is basically all about the point of the matter. Win 10 runs fine on the machines I've installed it on (several laptops, 9 or 10 desktops, some 10+ years old). Unless you have some particularly specific niche software or hardware (that can't run in Win7, therefore, not in Win10, since the drivers are mostly the same), people really shouldn't have too many complaints.

    I'd be more concerned if Microsoft was pushing people to Win8 and the crappy fail that was the Metro Start Screen. Win10 dialed it back and makes more sense in the case of a desktop/mobile hybrid OS. Still, the exec who is pushing this sort of tactic needs to be fired ASAP.

    • Re:It's already scheduled, not caused by "X" (Score:5, Interesting)

      by sconeu ( 64226 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:44PM (#52172541) Homepage Journal

      You are missing the point of why people don't want Win10.

      I was planning on doing the upgrade. And then I read about the mandatory spyware. You know, the phone-home that you cannot disable unless you are running an Enterprise version?

      Some people don't want to have that. Others CANNOT have that and remain within the bounds of the law (*cough*HIPAA*cough*).

      • Re:It's already scheduled, not caused by "X" (Score:5, Insightful)

        by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @02:52PM (#52173165) Homepage Journal

        The lack of control over updates and when the computer reboots is pretty awful too.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Kinwolf ( 945345 )

      From what I see, it schedules the upgrade, and you have to opt out by going into some other settings to cancel.

      It's not that the "X" activates the upgrade - at that point, it's too late.

      Still, it's very shady not to give users an obvious choice on the popup, let alone not making it an "opt in" choice.

      All of my machines are running Windows 10... shrugs... at this point, all the bitching is basically all about the point of the matter. Win 10 runs fine on the machines I've installed it on (several laptops, 9 or 10 desktops, some 10+ years old). Unless you have some particularly specific niche software or hardware (that can't run in Win7, therefore, not in Win10, since the drivers are mostly the same), people really shouldn't have too many complaints.

      I'd be more concerned if Microsoft was pushing people to Win8 and the crappy fail that was the Metro Start Screen. Win10 dialed it back and makes more sense in the case of a desktop/mobile hybrid OS. Still, the exec who is pushing this sort of tactic needs to be fired ASAP.

      I upgrade 2 out of 3 of our coputers to 10. But the last one is our HTPC with Windows 8 + Media Center on it. Media Center doesn't exist on windows 10 and never will so the last thing I want on that computer is the upgrade. Having to go through all this non-sense to avoid the "upgrade" is unacceptable. We're not dealing with a shady company from Ukraine or India here, this is Microsoft for crying out loud! This is insane. I am totally p*ssed at M$ right now.

    • Re:It's already scheduled, not caused by "X" (Score:5, Insightful)

      by StormReaver ( 59959 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @02:04PM (#52172725)

      Unless you have some particularly specific niche software or hardware (that can't run in Win7, therefore, not in Win10, since the drivers are mostly the same)....

      Windows 10 auto-installed on a customer's newish Windows 7 computer, hosing the entire installation. I installed Kubuntu 15.10, and now he's a happy camper. He said his computer works better now than it did before.

      Windows 10 is a gift to the Linux world.

  • So this is just now... (Score:4, Informative)

    by Lorens ( 597774 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:39PM (#52172505) Journal

    In a surprising coincidence, I had just finished reading this article when my son burst in saying "Hey Dad something's strange with the gaming PC, it's shutting down saying it's configuring itself for the Windows 10 upgrade, but I never accept that!"

    I have a backup . . .

  • One of my fellow engineers also owns a pet store (run by his wife and son). Over the weekend their computer that runs their point of sale software upgraded itself. The store's software does not run on Windows 10, so this was a mess for them while they spent the effort and time to downgrade. He is suitably pissed.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Merk42 ( 1906718 )
      Maybe your fellow engineer should manage that mission critical computer and not have it just install updates on its own.

  • Another Nasty Surprise: Flash installed by default (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Tiger4 ( 840741 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:42PM (#52172527)

    Over the weekend I set up a new Win 10 machine for Dad (store bought HP Envy). Going through updates and installs I found one nasty surprise, Flash was installed by default on this box. I was hoping to wean him over to HTML5 with this upgrade (from Vista !), but HP builds them with Flash already in place. Went ahead and made Firefox64 the default browser, and Chrome as an alternative, but since Cortana and all MS services default to MS Edge no matter what you set, it's going to be a mixed operation from now on

    • Let me guess, you can't uninstall those things, despite the EU ruling that doing that with Internet Explorer was illegal...

  • Given the long-held tradition of US FedGov doing jack-shit for consumers, I've hoped that the EU regulators will yet-again drag Microsoft by their tiny, tiny balls back into court and brutalize them like MS is doing to Win 7/8 users, but the silence is deafening. Perhaps Brexit is taking up all their cycles?

  • This is the same crap that malware distributors use to trick you into installing garbage on your system, displaying fake windows with fake widgets.

    Why not just force the install without any user interaction at all? That would be more honest. This aren't getting consent, they aren't allowing user choice, so why the trickery to somehow involve the user in a process you're going to do with or without them?

    The only think I can think is that it is a victim-blaming manipulation strategy. Most people will try

  • We are Microsoft.... (Score:5, Funny)

    by bev_tech_rob ( 313485 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @01:50PM (#52172611)

    We are upgrading your system...resistance is futile...

  • Not misleading in the least (Score:5, Insightful)

    by asvravi ( 1236558 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @02:03PM (#52172711)

    Look, there are a zillion things that MS did which are sneaky and downright reprehensible with regards to pushing Windows 10, but this is NOT one of them. Has anybody seen the actual dialog? It is NOT a question asking whether you want to upgrade. It is only a notification informing you that your PC is scheduled to upgrade since you have recommended updates turned on. Your PC would have updated to 10 in any case even if that dialog were not to popup, because 10 is a recommended upgrade. This notification is in reality offering you a chance to opt of it - I remember "click here if you want to change your update setting or cancel the upgrade" or something of that sort. Then an OK button. Clicking on "X" is not somehow "activating" an upgrade. It actually does nothing, as required of a notification dialog - it is just letting the already scheduled upgrade proceed, which is what one should expect.

    If anything is sneaky, it is TFA which portrays the dialog box in a false light. The entire media just repeats without once stopping to think - it has become fashionable in tech media to hit on MS pushing Win 10, but this kind of reporting only detracts from the credibility of reporting on all the real sneaky things that MS is doing.

    • Re:Not misleading in the least (Score:5, Insightful)

      by cnaumann ( 466328 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @03:34PM (#52173581)

      The message used to say something like "Do you want to install Windows 10 now, or do you want to schedule your Windows 10 installation for later?" Clicking the X was the only way to say 'neither'. Now clicking the X says yeah, go ahead. You don't see this as sneaky in any way?

      Remember a month ago when people were saying that there was no way you could accidently consent to installing Windows 10?

      The only sane solution is to turn off all updates from Microsoft.

      • And it's still true. MS has been telling people for quite some time now that Windows 10 is a recommended update and you will get it if you *opt in* to recommended updates. There's no accident involved. I don't have recommended updates enabled and none of my Win 7 hosts are doing anything than putting a notification in the system tray that the upgrade is available. Now, if you have *opted in* to recommended updates, Microsoft will keep reminding you about it to try to avoid the "THEY FORCED ME TO UPGRADE" co

  • Free Software Is Necessary (Score:5, Insightful)

    by mx+b ( 2078162 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @02:06PM (#52172749)

    This is exactly why free software (in the vein of what Richard Stallman calls for) needs to be supported. *YOU*, the user, must own complete control over your computer and the software it runs, not developers (much of the more liberal open source licenses are about developer rights, not user rights -- big difference!) or corporations.

    I know many of you would object, "But I bought this computer, it's not Microsoft's!". Well I wholeheartedly agree, but the thing is, Windows being proprietary closed source means that Microsoft has a claim to intellectual property rights. Microsoft believes that you license Windows, not own it. Essentially, they still own the software on your computer. Again, I know that *you* disagree, but it kinda doesn't matter what you think -- Microsoft has money and lawyers and they push for the outcome they want. Which is to own your computer. And if they own it, they're technically allowed to do whatever they want with it, including force upgrades. That is the nature of licensing agreements -- you agree to their licensing rules, which means they can do whatever they want.

    If this bothers you, switch to a free software OS. Some flavor of Linux or even BSD. Get involved in the free software community, both the technical community (making more/better free software) and the political community (that lobbies for changes to copyright law, tries to get government to adopt open standards, etc.). We have to fight back, or you can expect more behavior like this from Microsoft, Apple, etc., in the future.

  • It's the new business model (Score:3)

    by DidgetMaster ( 2739009 ) on Tuesday May 24, 2016 @04:54PM (#52174409) Homepage
    Everyone is doing it. 1) Turn on something by default. 2) Make you have to jump through a bunch of hoops in order to opt out or turn it off. 3) Charge you a lot of money if you fail to do so. My phone company does it. My satellite company does it. My credit card company does it......

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