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Inside Twitter's Long, Slow Struggle To Police Bad Actors (wsj.com) 220

Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey has personally weighed in on high-profile decisions, frustrating some employees. An anonymous reader shares a report: When Twitter Chief Executive Jack Dorsey testifies before Congress this week, he'll likely be asked about an issue that has been hovering over the company: Just who decides whether a user gets kicked off the site? To some Twitter users -- and even some employees -- it is a mystery. In policing content on the site and punishing bad actors, Twitter relies primarily on its users to report abuses and has a consistent set of policies so that decisions aren't made by just one person, its executives say. Yet, in some cases, Mr. Dorsey has weighed in on content decisions at the last minute or after they were made, sometimes resulting in changes and frustrating other executives and employees [Editor's note: the link may be paywalled; alternative source], according to people familiar with the matter. Understanding Mr. Dorsey's role in making content decisions is crucial, as Twitter tries to become more transparent to its 335 million users, as well as lawmakers about how it polices toxic content on its site.

Last month, after Twitter's controversial decision to allow far-right conspiracy theorist Alex Jones to remain on its platform, Mr. Dorsey told one person that he had overruled a decision by his staff to kick Mr. Jones off, according to a person familiar with the discussion. Twitter disputes that account and says Mr. Dorsey wasn't involved in those discussions. Twitter's initial inaction on Mr. Jones, after several other major tech companies banned or limited his content, drew fierce backlash from the public and Twitter's own employees, some of whom tweeted in protest. [...] "Any suggestion that Jack made or overruled any of these decisions is completely and totally false," Twitter's chief legal officer, Vijaya Gadde, said in a statement. "Our service can only operate fairly if it's run through consistent application of our rules, rather than the personal views of any executive, including our CEO."

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Inside Twitter's Long, Slow Struggle To Police Bad Actors

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  • bad actors (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 03, 2018 @08:40PM (#57248334)

    you mean "everybody who hurt my feelings and whom i don't like"

    • by Anonymous Coward

      And even a lot of people that never even posted. All of my friends have had their Twitter accounts banned even though as far as I know, none of them have posted. Mine was banned a couple of months ago even though I never posted. I created it to follow my employer's account.

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • Re: bad actors (Score:4, Insightful)

      by e3m4n ( 947977 ) on Tuesday September 04, 2018 @09:13AM (#57250422)

      I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. Itâ(TM)s the only way to be sure.

  • by kqc7011 ( 525426 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @08:49PM (#57248352)
    Then when questioned on the application twitter spokespersons seem to offer this as a explanation, "its the algorithm that decides". If this banning / not banning continues then sooner or later, twitter (and others) may soon learn the hard way what "Common Carrier" means.
    • If this banning / not banning continues then sooner or later, twitter (and others) may soon learn the hard way what "Common Carrier" means.

      No, they won't. There is absolutely no valid argument that Twitter is a common carrier. To designate them as such, all ISPs and telcos would have to also be so designated, and that's never going to happen.

      • It happened in 2015. But reversed before it took effect by Ajit Pai and friends.

        Actually, ISPs were common carriers, back when the internet was on phone lines.
        • It happened in 2015. But reversed before it took effect by Ajit Pai and friends.

          Twitter was never considered by the FCC to be a common carrier.

          Actually, ISPs were common carriers, back when the internet was on phone lines.

          That's simply not true. When the internet was on phone lines, the phone lines belonged to a common carrier. However, the actual ISP were never considered common carriers.

      • If they are "editing" for content, then they are a publisher, then the rules for libel start to apply.

        • If they are "editing" for content, then they are a publisher, then the rules for libel start to apply.

          Now you're starting to understand why they're getting rid of bad actors like Alex Jones.

    • may soon learn the hard way what "Common Carrier" means.

      Common Carrier doesn't really mean anything to websites. They have some protection if they follow the DMCA, though.

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Maybe that explains why the US has such a huge problem with phone spam.

    • Then when questioned on the application twitter spokespersons seem to offer this as a explanation, "its the algorithm that decides".

      But that's a clear lie, because which users get banned for which behavior is not at all random. It's extremely targeted. Trump violates Twitter's policies regularly but he's not getting kicked off. Presumably the algorithm includes (if $twat = @POTUS then approvetweet) so you could argue that it is algorithm-based, but a human would clearly have decided.

  • by Anonymous Coward
    Considering the fact that @Jack is a bad actor, I doubt they'll ever do anything about it.
  • Facebook, twitter, etc should all (voluntarily) require all users to complete an identity verification process, and then real names should be used as handles.

    If you aren't anonymous, then you are far less likely to be a jerk.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward

      If you aren't anonymous, then you are far less likely to be a jerk.

      Freedom is a high price to pay to get rid of "jerks".

    • Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @09:09PM (#57248420)
      Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • Facebook, twitter, etc should all (voluntarily) require all users to complete an identity verification process, and then real names should be used as handles.

      If you aren't anonymous, then you are far less likely to be a jerk.

      Perhaps, but not always [twitter.com] ...

    • by Anonymous Coward on Monday September 03, 2018 @10:40PM (#57248726)

      I was around back in the old days, when the university required my real name be on all of my usenet posts.
      I made the mistake of correcting a popular figure who was repeating some debunked bullshit. A few months later, I gave in. I moved house, changed my phone number, and have been very careful of my identity ever since. Neither of us was anonymous. Several of the people who called me to threaten me called from their home phones, and since it wasn't a repeated pattern of behaviour by them, the police said it wasn't legally harassment. My phone still rang off the hook with dozens of them every day.
      What you're advocating leads to mob rule, where the popular people get to say whatever they like and the little people have to suck it up. I mean, do you really think nobody ever knew what Harvey Weinstein was up to? Was he anonymous? He was just careful to choose victims well down the social ladder from himself. Anonymity is freedom for those of us living at the bottom of the social ladder, that's why it's so popular on sites full of bullying victims, like slashdot. Those of you living privileged lives higher up wouldn't understand.
      Yes, there's nazi's and whatever other bogeymen live under your bed down here, but there's a hell of a lot of decent people who just aren't quite as good at playing the social climber game as you. And though you don't want to acknowledge it, there's a lot of socially adept jerks strutting about under their real names because they know their victims will never be able to call them out on it.

  • by Anonymous Coward

    Most reasonable people are sick and tired of wading through filth whenever they read a news forum, entertainment forum, twitter feed, sports article, you name it. Many sites simply resort to shutting off comments altogether, which eliminates the angry hate filled trash, but also eliminates the relevant insightful commentary.

    The solution is to get rid of the the angry hateful speech...regardless of political leanings. If eliminating the hate and trash happens to impact a certain shade of ideology, well maybe

    • Some reasonable people think you shouldn't post braggadocio as an AC.

  • Politics (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    Dorsey didn't deliver on the Alex Jones ban. He chickened out and went for probation. That's breaking ranks.
    He pays the price now. Pressure is going to get ramped up until Dorsey is ousted from Twitter. Media hitpieces week in week out until he crumbles or the stock implodes or both.
    Because this isn't tech anymore. It's not even business. It's politics.

  • How does editorial control jibe with the DMCA safe harbor provisions?

    • It doesn't (Score:4, Insightful)

      by rsilvergun ( 571051 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @10:39PM (#57248722)
      DMCA is for copyright. This isn't about copyright, this is about negligence. Jones' listeners already have a history of going off half cocked [google.com]. My guess is google, Twitter, etc are worried about a negligence lawsuit the next time one of them fires a gun if it hits something.

      They could hide behind common carrier, but that's a very high bar to meet. It means being a dumb pipe, like the telephone company. It wouldn't be worth it. They couldn't even ban trolls from flood posting and the like. No social network could survive that.

      Instead they're policing their network as best the can. Make no mistake, they didn't want to kick Jones & his ilk off. His viewer's money spends the same as everyone else's and they'd be happy with the advertising dollars. The final straw was when he mimed shooting Bob Mueller.

      If you want a sci-fi take on what they're afraid of go read this [amazon.com]. I'm not saying Jones is trying to get somebody killed, but I'm saying words have power (as that Pizzagate business proved) and Jones is using them recklessly.
      • The final straw was when he mimed shooting Bob Mueller.

        So they have a standard where you can't "mime" violence? A standard they use against everybody?

  • by Marful ( 861873 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @09:12PM (#57248430)

    To some Twitter users -- and even some employees -- it is a mystery

    LOL. No it's fucking not. It's really fucking obvious who gets kicked off the platform.

    Are you a prominent conservative political figure that is currently in the focus of a lot of angry liberal people who like to mash the "report" button (for frivolous or false reasons) and aren't too big/connected that there will be business/corporate/financial retaliation if you get kicked off the site?
    Congratulations, have a boot to the head! You're banned!

    I'm still waiting for publicly known harassers and perpetrators of violent hate speach to get banned from Twitter like: Randi Harper, Zoe Quinn, Manveer Heir, Sarah Jeong, Robbi Rodriguez and all those antifa goons. They are guilty of actions that are at the least worse than conservative entities on twitter are accused of doing and yet they get to spew things like "murder all white people" or send pictures of their hairy assholes to other people, or use twitter to orchestrate a network of followers to harass both online and in real life people whom merely disagree with their ideology.

    • because that's what got Alex Jones banned. The final straw was when he mimed a gun shot talking about Mueller. The platforms are worked one of his listeners is going to go off and shoot somebody. This isn't idle speculation either. [nytimes.com]

      I looked up a few of the ones you listed. Manveer Heir is walking the same fine line Jones did with what can only be described as a left wing dog whistle. You're right, he's hot garbage (just trying to make a name for himself stirring up controversy). But I couldn't find an im
      • by Marful ( 861873 ) on Tuesday September 04, 2018 @04:01AM (#57249426)
        "Inciting Violence" isn't what conservative people are being banned for.

        Are you seriously arguing that making a "finger gun" at someone and going "bang" is inciting violence? Really?

        "Hate Speech" and "Harassment" (for disagreeing with someone) are what they are being banned for. In other words, "wrong think".

        • Are you seriously arguing that making a "finger gun" at someone and going "bang" is inciting violence? Really?

          If a mobster makes a finger fun at you and says bang then if you're not in fear of your life then you have shit for brains. So yeah in the actual real world context matters. Sometimes that gesture can be a very meaningful threat from someone with the means to deliver.

          • by Marful ( 861873 )
            So now Alex Jones is a criminal mobster? Really?

            Because Alex Jones is really going to murder someone that he finger-gunned, recorded and broadcast publicly. Do you realize how ridiculous you sound? Do you realize how much hyperbole and out-of-context bullshit you are spinning this?

            And then you had the chutzpah to say:

            So yeah in the actual real world context matters.

            ...while completely ignoring the context and spinning some media presence into being a murderous criminal mobster who takes "hits" out on people by notifying his hitmen by "finger gunnin

            • So now Alex Jones is a criminal mobster? Really?

              If you want to play a stupid game of "mobving the goalposts" then piss off.

              Mere speech can be legitimately threatening. You claimed otherwise. I provided proof that was not the case. If you want to make a different point, then do so. But we now both know your original point was a heap of shite.

      • by Raenex ( 947668 ) on Tuesday September 04, 2018 @04:14AM (#57249464)

        The platforms are worked one of his listeners is going to go off and shoot somebody. This isn't idle speculation either [nytimes.com].

        By that standard, MSNBC [usatoday.com] is guilty of incitement and should be taken off the air: "The next month, he cited the MSNBC's The Rachel Maddow Show as one of his favorite television programs, adding that a recent show had highlighted the contributions of 17 wealthy donors to the Republican Party."

        TL;DR: The Left isn't getting banned because they don't lean on violence.

        Bullshit. Funny how you excuse Antifa, who practice actual violence. Why were the Proud Boys banned, when the only violence they commit is to defend themselves when attacked by the likes of Antifa?

        Twitter has policies against promoting violence and racism, yet leftists accounts get away with it all the time [archive.is]. Say you hate black people, and you'll be banned in a nanosecond. Speak out in favor of white genocide, not only will Twitter let you keep your blue checkmark, they suspend [archive.is] the guy pointing [archive.is] you out.

        • I don't recall Rachel Maddow miming shooting Trump, and I'm pretty sure if she had Fox News would make damn sure I knew. I don't recall her accusing Republicans of Blood Libel. I don't recall her suggesting armed rebellion against Trump. Jones has done all these things. He did all this while courting an audience that believes Sandy Hook didn't happen. He did all this while he knew (based on testimony given under oath at his divorce trial) that none of the crazy conspiracy theories he spouts are real (which
          • by Raenex ( 947668 )

            I don't recall Rachel Maddow miming shooting Trump

            Did Alex Jones do the same for Pizzagate? No. So your comparison is just as invalid. Jones is no more responsible for the pizza shooting than Maddow is for her rabid and biased coverage of Republicans.

            If you're gonna do Whataboutism can you at least try harder than that?

            Why did ignore the rest of my post, where I pointed out how you excused the actual violence done by Antifa? Where I pointed out how the Proud Boys were banned but did not endorse or commit violence except out of self-defense from the likes of Antifa. Where I pointed out the massive white hatred from Twitter ve

      • because that's what got Alex Jones banned. The final straw was when he mimed a gun shot talking about Mueller. \

        I mimed a gunshot once. The assistant principal talked to me, realized that my fingers weren't going to shoot anybody, and that was that.

        • who are both well armed and prone to believe absurd conspiracy theories? Did you do it _after_ one of those people from your audience showed up at a pizza joint with a rifle and fired rounds into it? If so then yes, I would ban you from my platform if I was google or twitter. If only out of fear of a negligence lawsuit.
      • This cartel has been canning people who are *explicitly* anti-war and non-violence. Scott Horton, Dan McAdams, et. al.

        Meanwhile the people who actually drop bombs on school buses get a pass.

        It's hard to not use the term 'libtard' when that's how they're acting.

        • with the actual left. Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer aren't part of the American Left. They're right wingers running in districts that won't vote for Republicans. There's been attempts to kick them out via primary but they've got so much money they beat them back. Go look up the "Justice Democrats" on google if you want to see the actual American Left.
    • by Anonymous Coward

      The vast majority of my friends have been banned from Twitter, and they're nowhere near conservative. You're wrong. Twitter just bans thousands of account each day at random.

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Are you a prominent conservative political figure that is currently in the focus of a lot of angry liberal people who like to mash the "report" button (for frivolous or false reasons) and aren't too big/connected that there will be business/corporate/financial retaliation if you get kicked off the site?
      Congratulations, have a boot to the head! You're banned!

      All the evidence I have see suggests that is actually happens to progressive/left leaning users much more often. Especially on YouTube, but Twitter has issues too. A lot of this mobbing gets organized on 4chan, right out in the open, but it's very hard to get a human being at those companies to even notice, let along check the 4chan thread and realize what has happened.

  • "Our service can only operate fairly if it's run through consistent application of our rules, rather than the personal views of any executive, including our CEO."

    And yet Twitter's executive suite doesn't really care if the service truly operates fairly, it only cares if it has the APPEARANCE of operating fairly... and that can be accomplished without that niggling "consistent application of rules".

  • Alex Jones (Score:5, Interesting)

    by that this is not und ( 1026860 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @09:26PM (#57248486)

    I wouldn't call Alex Jones a 'far right wing' player. I'd call him a nutcase cultist. Back when I used to read the Drudge Report page (I quit frequenting it awhile back) if a link from Drudge took me to infowars.com I had a habit of instantly closing the page, because that site is a loony nest. This was particularly the case during the 2016 election, because you're not doing yourself a favor by hanging out in a loony echo chamber if you have sincere beliefs in a thought out political philosophy. There are similar fever swamps on the left, of course.

    -------------------

    This is an aside, but I was trawling around on the left political sites this weekend and noticed that the main Trotskyite newspaper in the US is now apparently defending Trump [themilitant.com] of all things.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Raenex ( 947668 )

      Alex Jones is a distraction from the far more pervasive censorship by Twitter. The real story is that Twitter was caught [hotair.com] mass shadowbanning those on the right, to the point that Republican senators got caught up in it.

      And now right before CEO Dorsey is supposed to testify before congress, magically the mass shadowbanning disappears [breitbart.com].

      And before you knee-jerk reflexively dismiss Breitbart, try attacking the argument, not the site.

    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Alex Jones just happens to pedal conspiracy theories from the far right, or invents his own that are popular with the far right... But isn't actually far right. I'm not sure the distinction matters, as long as nationalists and supremacists are keeping him in business,

  • by grungeman ( 590547 ) on Monday September 03, 2018 @11:48PM (#57248882)
    Twitter said that I have to verify my telephone number so I can continue using the Twitter service. Did not give any plausible argument why they kicked me off.

    I simply stopped using twitter and will not come back. F*ck it.
    • They want your # so they can sell/market/track/fully monetize you. They may have banned you specifically to see if they could coerce you into giving up your number as smart phones are the most amazing little behavior tracking devices.
    • by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      It's to filter out sock puppets. Phone numbers require more effort to generate than email addresses, so by requiring them it makes it harder for sock puppet accounts to be created.

      Assuming you are not a sock puppet it looks like yet another mistake.

    • by antdude ( 79039 )

      Instagram and Facebook did this to me too in the past. I'm not going to give them any of my selfies, personal datas, etc. Frak 'em.

  • "Mr. Dorsey told one person that he had overruled a decision by his staff to kick Mr. Jones off, according to a person familiar with the discussion."

    Ah, here we see another common tactic of the outrage industry: if we can't get X organisation to do what we want, then we'll just make up a rumour implicating one of the senior members, in order to personally pressure them into giving in.

  • Twitter is just a a platform for crazy old Trump to spew hatred, deceit, paranoia, racism, and generally working on destroying America.

    Do what I did, close your account.
    • I find it cathartic to use Twitter to yell at Trump and tell him what a douche bag he is. I know he never reads it ... because it involves reading ... but it's fun anyway.
  • I remember the bad old days, when police did the actual policing, and there was due process and stuff.

    Oh well. Forward!

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