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Microsoft is Separating Cortana From Search in Windows 10 (theverge.com) 86

Microsoft is making some big changes to Cortana in Windows 10. The company intends to decouple search and Cortana in the Windows 10 taskbar, allowing voice queries to be handled separately to typing in a search box to find documents and files. From a report: This change will be implemented in the next major Windows 10 update, currently scheduled for April. Windows 10 will direct you towards an built-in search experience for text queries, while Cortana will exist for voice queries instead of them both bundled together. "This will enable each experience to innovate independently to best serve their target audiences and use cases," explains Dona Sarkar, Microsoft's Windows Insider chief. "This change is one of several we've made throughout this release to improve your experience in this space, including updating the search landing page design, enhancing your search results, and integrating Microsoft To-Do with Cortana."
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Microsoft is Separating Cortana From Search in Windows 10

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  • by WoodstockJeff ( 568111 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @03:34PM (#57973482) Homepage

    But you'll have greater hope that it can be removed completely.

    It's so much more satisfying to crush people's hope right after you increase it....

    • And yet for the vast majority of users, where once there was a single standard, now there are two, sitting side-by-side, vying for your attention.
      • by rtb61 ( 674572 )

        One to listen to your search queries and the other one to just 'LISTEN', always and everyone knows it.

    • Spot on. My brain left out "in search" for a split second and in that fleeting moment felt the unfamiliar feeling of hope.
    • This is just going to be like any other component on Windows. It is part of the platform, so anything built for Windows can safely assume it can use it, like anything else (MFC, ShDocVw, etc),and sure, you *could* remove any of these, but it will break anything that tries to use it.
  • Not if they could take the wank hologram out of it completely.
  • by Zorro ( 15797 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @04:08PM (#57973676)

    'Hi, Would you like me to search the internet instead of your desktop for your Word File?'

    • by omnichad ( 1198475 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @04:22PM (#57973790) Homepage

      I can't even get most built in Windows programs to show up before we results. Most of which are actually in my start menu. On top of that, I have an SSD, so the web results come up after I've started to press the enter key on the result I actually want only to see it get replaced by a web result and open a browser.

    • Not far off. Clippy was an example of the Microsoft Agent [wikipedia.org] platform. With it came the Speech API (SAPI) [wikipedia.org] which had both a text-to-speech and a speech-to-text engine. You could think of Cortana as Microsoft Agent 3.0, in spirit
    • by vux984 ( 928602 )

      How did you get her to ASK? I'd take being given a choice again as a step in the right direction!

  • by jellomizer ( 103300 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @04:22PM (#57973794)

    This is something I don't think Microsoft really gets.

    The Average person don't need PC's anymore. Most of their computing experience can be done with a phone or tablet.
    For the people who do need PC's need them for real work.
    Microsoft is continuously making the UI meant for tablet and home users, while frustrating people who need to do real work. When I am on a PC, I am expecting to want to use multiple apps at the same time, take advantage of the big screen to have all the apps available visible and usable at once. I have a full keyboard, I am going to want to use it as much as possible, also I will still have a mouse or a pointer, the work layout doesn't allow for touch screen to be all that useful.

    Oddly enough, for me, I wish all the major OS's were not Windows (as in the UI methodology) based or full screen App. But had a good Frame type interface, where I can layout all my apps, resize the content where they are usable, but may be smaller then designed. Windows just get messy. and full screen, is just unproductive.

    • MS is not alone in this nonsense - those Gnome clowns have been trying to do the same thing for years now. And failing in a big way - nobody uses Gnome in phones or tablets (is it even available?) and the consistently negligible share of Linux in the desktop is public knowledge, the fact that not even here is Gnome top choice among those who need to get work done only adding insult to injury.
      • by Anonymous Coward

        Yeah, Gnome is the first thing I get rid of when configuring Linux. Cinnamon is much more usable.

        But speaking of Windows audience, I was thinking about the Windows story recently where Microsoft wants to reserve 7GB of hard disk space just for updates. I'd be willing to bet that internally XBox does something like that, which makes me thing they may be making Windows on the desktop more like a gaming console from a "user control" standpoint. The forced updates sure point in that direction as well. They

    • Yes! This! Windows is full of so much crap that I don't need or want and it's impossible to disable/uninstall/delete much of it, Whortana included.
    • This is something I don't think Microsoft really gets.

      *Proceeds to write a list of things that user thinks is missing that Windows 10 still has*

      Seriously just because you can swipe from the right to get up an action center, or long touch the screen to bring up a menu that is more spaced than when you right click doesn't mean the OS is any less keyboard and mouse driven.

      Your list of complaints look perfectly served by Windows 10.

      *posted from a windows 10 PC using a keyboard and mouse while thoroughly confused about what it is you're complaining about.

    • Microsoft 100% does get that the average person doesn't need a PC. They invested millions trying to get windows phone to work. And now they have a really strong android presence (I currently use the Windows Android Launcher) with half decent versions of office as apps as well as the 365 offering. The decoupling of Cortana from search is most likely so that it can be packaged to better on android. The windows UI is heavily influenced by laptop/single monitor users and I don't see this changing any time soon
    • by jjbenz ( 581536 )
      Doing all my computing on a phone or tablet would be an awful experience.
  • Spay Cortana (Score:4, Informative)

    by Puls4r ( 724907 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @04:36PM (#57973902)
    The windows-key then type style search has been broken on 90% of our work computers. Does nothing. Much like searching in explorer. Broken too. The windows search features are so fucked up that it doesn't take me long to get pissed at it and just install a third party search program like agent ransack or it's equivalent.
    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      If you want to actually find stuff on your computer at instantaneous speed, use Everything [voidtools.com] by voidtools.
    • by cs96and ( 896123 )

      If you have turned off the "Allow apps to run in the background" setting in Windows, it stops search from working

    • Wow. Your IT administrators must be incompetent.

      In other news windows key + search still works just fine and explorer search has worked as good as it always has. Since it's safe to assume your entire work population didn't suddenly get stupid, maybe it's time to replace your IT staff.

  • Windows 7 expanded the search menu so that most things that I used to use win+r for, I can do just with win. And that search is more forgiving, in case I can't remember that computer management is "compmgmt.msc" or system restore is "rstrui,exe" I can type win+"restore" and it finds "system restore" for me. That was super helpful. But when it started giving me Bing results, it became useless again.

    This same issue happens with the combined search/URL bars in browsers. I type in "server1427north" because

  • Extras (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Artem S. Tashkinov ( 764309 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @04:52PM (#57974004) Homepage
    How about rolling back hideous "modern" PC settings, making telemetry opt-in, vs almost impossible opt-out and having a normal release cycle, i.e. a new version each 3 years?
  • Microsoft is not a monolithic entity. Of course no company that big is a monolith. But Microsoft takes turf warfare to a new level with perverse incentives.

    There are level 64 managers or whatever they are called, who are the top PHBs in charge of their bit of the product, and the assiduously build their empires within the company. In most other companies, these will build teams and fight for head count, budget etc. But in Microsoft they get a bit of the revenue generated by their pet piece of the product.

  • by Radical Moderate ( 563286 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @04:59PM (#57974046)
    Honestly: " "This will enable each experience to innovate independently to best serve their target audiences and use cases," explains ... Microsoft's Windows Insider chief.

    WTF does that even mean? Can we create a mandatory post-MBA bootcamp to beat this out of them?
    • Translation: An one-size-fits-all jack-of-all-trades master-of-none wasn't working as well as we thought, plus everyone bitched about it being so hard to disable and the constant excessive internet bandwidth usage, so we went back to domain specific searching that gives better search results by breaking up the bloat into smaller apps that function better and faster.

      • Well I have to admit, her version was shorter.....
        • by Anonymous Coward

          Also that translation was extremely generous. It implies the speaker or anyone connected to her understood the implications of the statement in those terms.

          It also didn't characterise the approach as 'our attempt to dictate how people will use our systems to match an extremely impractical vision bill gates had about voice controls in the 90s, after too many shrimp cocktails and a chance meeting with James Doohan...'

    • Undoing a lobotomy is hard.

  • by MpVpRb ( 1423381 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @07:00PM (#57974604)

    I don't want any trendy, pop culture stuff
    I don't want to follow fashion
    I want a reliable operating system that does what I need .. reliably

  • Yawn (Score:5, Insightful)

    by WaffleMonster ( 969671 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @08:17PM (#57974904)

    Wake me up when they separate all of the creepy malware from Windows 10.

  • That was pretty much it. The further away I can get from Cortana, the better.

  • One more year (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Opportunist ( 166417 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @11:43PM (#57975506)

    Support for Win7 runs out in a year. I hope they pick up speed, if they continue at that pace, Win10 will not be ready for use by the time Win7 bites the dust.

  • by Fencepost ( 107992 ) on Wednesday January 16, 2019 @11:58PM (#57975548) Journal
    If you look at the field of "voice assistants" Cortana may still have a chance over time.

    Right now there are three:

    Google "we know who you are, where you are and have been, what you search for, what you shop for, every website you visit and which pages, how long you spend there, everything. We don't just know everything you like including porn, we know what kind of porn you don't realize you like. We're going to use all of this to target ads at you. Oh, and now we're getting you to add our microphones to your home even without using your phone." If you're on an iPhone they may know slightly less about your physical movements.

    Amazon's Alexa "We may not know as much about where you are, but we know everything you buy because even if you didn't buy it through us you looked at our reviews of it. We've had our voice assistants in your home for years now, they do all kinds of things, oh, and by the way now we're getting into advertising as the third largest online ad platform (for now) with better conversion rates than Google or Facebook. Oh, and would you like to get free shipping with that? Have you met Prime?"

    Apple's Siri "If you've bought into our high-profit-margin phones and tablets you can do some things with voice recognition, but we don't do as much or as well as the other two. On the upside we're much better about respecting your privacy!"

    So right now the voice assistant universe is pretty much covered by "creepy AF," "creepy and selly AF" and "not as good but hey isn't that a nice thousand dollar phone?" I'm pretty sure there's space in there if Microsoft wants to carve out its own niche if they handle it well.
    • by mjwx ( 966435 )

      If you look at the field of "voice assistants" Cortana may still have a chance over time.

      Right now there are three:

      Google "we know who you are, where you are and have been, what you search for, what you shop for, every website you visit and which pages, how long you spend there, everything. We don't just know everything you like including porn, we know what kind of porn you don't realize you like. We're going to use all of this to target ads at you. Oh, and now we're getting you to add our microphones to your home even without using your phone." If you're on an iPhone they may know slightly less about your physical movements.

      Amazon's Alexa "We may not know as much about where you are, but we know everything you buy because even if you didn't buy it through us you looked at our reviews of it. We've had our voice assistants in your home for years now, they do all kinds of things, oh, and by the way now we're getting into advertising as the third largest online ad platform (for now) with better conversion rates than Google or Facebook. Oh, and would you like to get free shipping with that? Have you met Prime?"

      Apple's Siri "If you've bought into our high-profit-margin phones and tablets you can do some things with voice recognition, but we don't do as much or as well as the other two. On the upside we're much better about
      hiding the fact that we've no respect for your privacy!"

      So right now the voice assistant universe is pretty much covered by "creepy AF," "creepy and selly AF" and "not as good but hey isn't that a nice thousand dollar phone?" I'm pretty sure there's space in there if Microsoft wants to carve out its own niche if they handle it well.

      TFTFY.

      Apple are just as big on selling your personal data as Google, Amazon and Microsoft... they're just less open and honest about it. If you believe otherwise, I've a bridge to sell you.

  • The first thing I do on a Windows 10 machine is disable cortana but that does make the search not work well. Now I can disable cortana and keep search! Yay!
  • Can you decouple Microsoft Search from Bing and point it to the Apple search back-end?

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