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Transportation Government United States

New York Finally Legalizes Electric Bikes and Scooters (theverge.com) 95

Posted by BeauHD from the took-you-long-enough dept.
Included in New York's tentative budget agreement reached on April 1st is a provision that would legalize throttle-based bikes and scooters. The Verge reports: The budget language almost exactly mirrors a bill that passed the New York State Legislature last year but was inexplicably vetoed at the last minute by Gov. Andrew Cuomo. It changes state law to legalize e-bikes and scooters but would give localities the ability to decide for themselves how to regulate the vehicles. Throttle-based e-bikes favored by delivery workers would be legal, and dockless scooter services like Bird and Lime would need to be permitted by municipalities before launching. Scooters would stay illegal in Manhattan, though the city could eventually overrule that provision.

The budget language would create three classes of e-bikes: Class 1 is pedal-assisted with no throttle; Class 2 is throttle-assisted with a maximum speed of 20 mph; and Class 3 is throttle-powered with a maximum speed of 25 mph. E-scooters would be capped at 15 mph, and riders under 18 years of age would be required to wear a helmet. Helmets would also be required for riders of Class 3 e-bikes. (Food delivery workers, who favor these bikes, are already required by law to wear helmets.) But the budget is undoubtedly a huge win for delivery workers and immigrant rights groups that have been fighting for nearly a decade to overturn the rules.
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New York Finally Legalizes Electric Bikes and Scooters More

New York Finally Legalizes Electric Bikes and Scooters

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  • Hallefuckinglujah! Now stay inside!

  • Now NY can get rid of the Taxi & Limousine Commission, which has arrested people dropping off their spouses at LaGuardia for illegally competing with medallion taxi services.

    • So...what exactly is the difference between an "e-scooter" and an "e-bike" class 3?

      It appears the e-bike can go faster than the e-scooter so why is the e-scooter banned at this time?

      I'm thinking the scooter is just a different shape than a bike....2 wheels, a seat but no pedals and your feet are on more of a deck than pegs.....?

      I see the motorized versions of these currently on the roads....

      So, I'm try8ig to figure why scooters are not regulated the same as a bicycle.

      Frankly, if you're out in traffic

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Rhipf ( 525263 )

        From what I can tell the big difference is size. E-bikes are generally smaller than e-scooters. There is also the fact that e-bikes have pedals and (as you mentioned) e-scooters don't (generally). The addition of pedals classifies the vehicle as a power assisted bike and without the pedals it is just a motorized vehicle.

      • Ask a gun control advocate. The difference between a military / assault rifle and a hunting rifle.
        That should clear it right up for you!

        • Ask a gun control advocate. The difference between a military / assault rifle and a hunting rifle.

          Hmm...not sure how apropos this is to the conversation?

          But simply put a military assault rifle is a select fire rifle, that when switched to full auto, allows the gun to fire repeatedly as long as a single trigger pull is performed and held down.

          There are VERY few of these available for the average citizen and none manufactured since 1986 are legal to own by civilians.

          Anything that is non select fire, is p

          • Hmmm, which is more appropriate? "Woosh!", or "ping-yeow!" (Is there actually a sound effect for a bullet missing it's target, ricocheting, and killing an innocent bystander a hundred metres away?)

            Let's put it in terms that the average gun nut can understand : is an assault rifle more objectively beautiful in the eye of a huntsman than a hunting rifle is objectively beautiful in the eye of a soldier on patrol in enemy territory?

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by hipp5 ( 1635263 )

        Given the reference to Lime in TFS, "scooter" in this context probably means the stand-up scooters like kids use (Google "razor scooter"), and not vehicles similar to a Vespa.

        • Given the reference to Lime in TFS, "scooter" in this context probably means the stand-up scooters like kids use (Google "razor scooter"), and not vehicles similar to a Vespa.

          Ahh..ok, I didn't catch that.

          I"ve never really ever seen one of those Lime things....so, that isn't what popped into my head.

          LOL, reminds me of the old joke:

          "What does a moped and a fat chick have in common?

          You don't want your friends to catch you riding either one of them...."

  • Detroit is full of Birds and Limes (Score:5, Insightful)

    by moxrespawn ( 6714000 ) on Thursday April 02, 2020 @09:06PM (#59903306)

    Notable fact: Pedestrians and scooters move at substantially different speeds, and both use the sidewalks.

    You can probably infer some of the results.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by LynnwoodRooster ( 966895 )
      I most cities, use of e-scooters or bikes on sidewalks is prohibited.

      • Tell that to Detroiters.

      • Where to Ride
        Bicycles are to ride as close as practicable and safe to the right hand curb or edge of the road. However, there are a number of exceptions to this rule, which include:
        (1) when passing another bicycle or vehicle traveling in the same direction;
        (2) when preparing to make a left turn;
        (3) when conditions make the right edge of the road unsafe due to conditions such as debris, drain openings, uneven road surfaces, pedestrians, animals, or other obstacles;
        (4) when the lane is too narrow to p
        • Thanks! So peds have the right of way and bikes must announce their presence before passing - at a minimum. If they're even allowed on the sidewalk.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by dfghjk ( 711126 )

            Texas has the exact same language EXCEPT for the "peds have the right of way and bikes must announce" language. Does that suit your narrative? Do I get a "Thanks!" Is Michigan "most cities"?

            You sound like someone who cares only his own personal interests.

            • The point is that sidewalks are for pedestrians; IF a bike rides on it, they are to yield to pedestrians. They are not for bikes; bikes are allowed to use them as long as they give way to peds. If there is an accident, the biker is at fault.
            • Sidewalk Riding

              Texas does not have a statewide statute that specifically authorizes or prohibits the operation of a bicycle upon a sidewalk. Sidewalk riding is prohibited by local ordinance in some areas. Examples of areas of prohibited sidewalk riding include the campus of the University of Texas at Austin, Austin’s business districts, and Corpus Christi.

              Texas bicycle law [bikelaw.com]

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by dfghjk ( 711126 )

        Citation please. What constitutes "most"?

      • You're going to need a footnote for cities prohibiting use of e-scooters on sidewalks. They don't in mine and in many of the places I travel (pre-COVID-19).

        Put them out in traffic where they belong with positive legislation.

    • Legal ebikes do not go faster than i can pedal, except uphill. Your argument is a red herring.

      • I didn't say bikes on the sidewalks were any less problematic.

        • Regardless, its far safer overall to have bikes on sidewalks than bikes on roads. Its absolute simple math, F=MA.
          • Really we should be creating separate areas for foot traffic, bikes, and motor vehicles. Yes that's not something you can easily do in major cities that have buildings and such in the way, but it's not impossible either. Some streets could be converted into one-ways and have some lanes separated and given over to bicycle traffic. If you can create some major throughways for bicycle traffic that are fast for getting somewhere it'll help alleviate bicycle traffic on other streets even if it means a slightly l

          • Safer for whom? Not for pedestrians.

      • Here in the UK under EU law, ebikes are capped at 25kph (15.5mph), with max of 250W. For me, this is easy to exceed, except maybe against a headwind or uphill. The speeds mentioned in the this article of 20-25 mph for the higher classes are in to the territory that most cyclists cannot exceed.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Misagon ( 1135 )

      Where I live, e-scooters are allowed on sidewalks -- as long as riders don't ride faster than "walking speed", which is defined as 6 km/h (3.7 MPH).

      Of course, with scooters capable of 25 km/h (15 MPH), and people being people, this rule is practically impossible to enforce.

    • You can probably infer some of the results.

      An accident rate that is lost in a rounding error compared to gun crime and other stupidity which goes on in major US cities?

      • You should probably take another look at "gun crime". Consider first removing suicides and accidents from that number [pewresearch.org].
        Or skip it 'cause you know better, facts be damned, right?

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by spitzak ( 4019 )

          I don't quite get why you think removing accidents from gun deaths makes sense. I suspect if you remove accidents from scooter deaths the result is pretty close to zero.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by dfghjk ( 711126 )

      Cars and scooters also travel at "substantially different speeds". What's your solution, to ignore that?

      • Well, to ignore you, anyway.

      • "Cars and scooters also travel at "substantially different speeds". What's your solution, to ignore that?"

        Yep. Scooter riders/drivers choose to use those vehicles. Pedestrians do not choose to share sidewalks with vehicles traveling three to five times faster than they can at a dead run.

        So get out in car traffic or stay home. I really don't care. Just stay off the sidewalk.

  • Next they will legalize electric cars (Score:3)

    by jfdavis668 ( 1414919 ) on Thursday April 02, 2020 @09:15PM (#59903338)
    and maybe even buses.

  • It would be good if all rooftop buildings all over the cities have complete photovoltaic cells system and battery storage banks alike - in the hands of people, and not in the hands of companies - so we could have access to more cheap (or even free) energy for Mankind.

    If we have a solar energy system spread all over the world like that, we could also have more access to cheaper technology using electric energy.

    • Even putting aside the nonsense about ownership of these systems, when you start building skyscrapers and packing dozens or hundreds of people into a building, rooftop solar isn't even going to come close to covering their energy needs. You could probably make it work in suburbia, but people can already install their own solar on top of their own homes.
    • In the hands of which people? Probably the building owner, right? Who pays to put it up there, and if it's the building owner - can they charge for the power to recoup their costs?

  • rented electric litter (Score:3)

    by awwshit ( 6214476 ) on Thursday April 02, 2020 @09:17PM (#59903352)

    Just keep your rented electric litter off of the sidewalk.

  • We Should Examine Who Banned Them (Score:5, Interesting)

    by BrendaEM ( 871664 ) on Thursday April 02, 2020 @09:19PM (#59903356) Homepage
    I remember years ago, when they were first banned. I could be wrong, but I guess that a bunch of cab drivers got together and decided how a city should be run, corruptly.

    • Re:We Should Examine Who Banned Them (Score:4, Informative)

      by Solandri ( 704621 ) on Friday April 03, 2020 @04:48AM (#59904080)
      I remember reading about this a few years back while researching ways to convert a bike to electric. While it's fun to dogpile on some company generally regarded as evil (and I would agree the taxi companies are evil), the truth is quite a bit more nuanced [citylab.com]. Opposition seems to have come primarily from the NYPD, from cycling groups (who supported pedal electric bikes which were already legal, but not throttle electric bikes for fear of the bad rap they would give electric bikes in general), and pedestrian advocacy groups (who didn't like delivery cyclists charging at them at >20 mph).

      This wasn't a ban on all electric bikes. Pedal electric bikes - where the electric motor assists your pedaling to make it easier to do things like climb up a hill - were already legal. This was a ban on throttle electric bikes - basically battery driven mopeds which looked like a bicycle.

  • "Inexplicably" (Score:2, Interesting)

    by xxxJonBoyxxx ( 565205 )
    >> inexplicably vetoed at the last minute by Gov. Andrew Cuomo

    Just follow the money for the "explica-nation". It's New York - do you think any legislation passes without a little bit of grift?
  • First there was a throttle. Then someone looked at it and thought, how do I make something useful out of it? I will build a bike out of it!!! Throttle-based e-bike. Genius!

  • Who? (Score:3)

    by dromgodis ( 4533247 ) on Friday April 03, 2020 @01:41AM (#59903832)

    a huge win for delivery workers and immigrant rights groups

    Why those?

    • Re:Who? (Score:4, Interesting)

      by thegarbz ( 1787294 ) on Friday April 03, 2020 @07:12AM (#59904214)

      a huge win for delivery workers and immigrant rights groups

      Why those?

      Interestingly there are cultural differences between the way people chose to move around a city. In the Netherlands it's also the same problem (just the other way). There are active campaigns to ban mopeds and scooters from bike paths in major cities. Amsterdam was a first mover here passing a law, only to spend the best part of a year in court (the constitution of the Netherlands prevents laws that are racist i.e. target a portion of the population). Apparently during the court case it was determined that 90% of the scooter population on the paths were ridden by immigrants and they actually tried to stop the law on racism grounds.

      They ultimately failed and the law was passed, but next time you see a scooter scoot past, take a look at who drives it. There are cultural backgrounds to how people prefer to move.

      (There's an anti-American joke in there somewhere, but I'm biting my metaphorical tongue ;-) )

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

        Do you have a reference for this? The only things I could find about legal action over the ban were about moped riders complaining that the roads are too dangerous for them because of the speed difference between mopeds and other vehicles.

        No mention of immigrants or racism. In fact most scooter owners seem to be Dutch from what I read, and there is a long history of them using cycle paths in the Netherlands. They are apparently known as "moustache bikes" for reasons I can't get to the bottom of.

        • They are apparently known as "moustache bikes" for reasons I can't get to the bottom of.

          LOL, a "snorfiets" is not a "moustache bike", but a "buzzing bike" :

          "snor": noun, moustache;
          "snorren": verb, to buzz.

        • Do you have a reference for this? The only things I could find about legal action over the ban were about moped riders complaining that the roads are too dangerous for them because of the speed difference between mopeds and other vehicles.

          Nope. I read it on ad.nl but my written Dutch is too poor to find it again. But it should come as no surprise. Half the laws here end up going through the courts on these grounds. That constitutional rule is a great catch all that gives everyone one last attempt to overturn laws.

          Rotterdam's ban on petrol cars over 20 years old went through the same court case again because it only affected 200 people and therefore they say they were being unfairly discriminated against. Most of these attempts are futile tho

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by dfghjk ( 711126 )

        This entire comment is racist. No, there is not a "cultural" aspect to who rides mopeds and scooters, nor would the thought that there was ever even cross my mind. In a society free of racism, this observation, with or without merit, would not even be made.

        • Yes, there are cultural aspects of how people choose to transport themselves, but they are mostly based on socioeconomic factors. In large parts of the world, scooters are the most common form of motorised transport - because that is what working class people can afford. And when they move to other countries, riding scooters is both familiar and usually less regulated (even though used cars can be found just as cheap in many western countries, getting a drivers license can be both difficult and costly), mak

        • This entire comment is racist. No, there is not a "cultural" aspect to who rides mopeds and scooters

          This entire comment is ignorant. The basis and history of a people are brought with them wherever they go. Just like Americans over here seem to drive cars that are excessively large, and the Dutch cycle everywhere. Restaurants where Asians congregate offer in total significantly more rice dishes. And practically every moped repair shop in Amsterdam is owned by a Moroccan or a Turk.

          That's not racism, that's observation. You'd do well to pay attention to the world around you.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Nidi62 ( 1525137 )

      a huge win for delivery workers and immigrant rights groups

      Why those?

      The cost barrier of cars means in a city an immigrant is more likely to own a scooter?

  • I somehow don't think he had this in mind.

    Legalize it [youtube.com]

  • I tried a Lime electric scooter when on holiday in Bucharest, Romania last year. The service had just started and the scooters were all over the place. There are only two ways to ride the scooter - on the pavement, which is not great because of pedestrians and parked cars, or on the road, annoying all the drivers because, although the thing is faster that you'd imagine when you first start to use it, it's no match for the speeding taxi drivers in Bucharest. A third option would be bike lanes but those are
  • Individual transport outdoors less contagious. About time. Cities are not as bad as cruise ships but the convenience Risk will need PPE improvements.

  • Glad to finally see this! E-bikes are wondrous.
    I got my folding e-bike online, but when I went into a bike shop here in Albany for the first time and they said,"Sorry, we can't help you because e-bikes are illegal and our owner is an attorney."
    What was infuriating was that they were selling expensive Trek e-bikes (they weren't able to justify this to me) but then using the illegality to try and justify why they couldn't work on my (much cheaper, easier to service) bike. They said they'd sell me one of their

  • The last time I visited the National Mall in Washington DC, I had the pleasure of renting electric scooters all over the area. Riding between monuments and landmarks makes for a huge convenience and a thrilling drive. You can cover much more of the city on an electric scooter than on foot.

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