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Tesla Model Y Owners Find Cooling System Cobbled Together With Home Depot-Grade Fake Wood (thedrive.com) 189

An anonymous reader quotes a report from The Drive: According to several owners of the all-new Model Y, Tesla has allegedly assembled their cars using what appears to be faux wood trim from a home improvement store. It all started with a forum post featuring a photo of a Model Y's frunk plastics removed. The original poster of the thread had reportedly spent more than ten hours disassembling their Model Y to correct poor panel fitment when they came across a large chunk of metal secured with green tape and a small strap. "Someone made a run to Home Depot to make Q2 numbers," jested the thread's original poster.

Shortly after, a few other posters chimed in with photos of the same part, showing more wood grain and a few plain white mounts as well. That part you're looking at is the Model Y's Liquid Cooled Condenser (LCC). Its job is essentially that of a heat exchanger, passing refrigerant through a large block where it transfers the thermal properties of the cryogen with other parts of the cooling system. This is just one small sliver of Tesla's unique octavalve cooling system found in the Model Y that is responsible for conditioning the car's cabin, battery, and drive unit simultaneously. The trim appears to be providing some strain relief for the strap holding the LCC in place, perhaps to keep the tension from providing unnecessary stress on the condenser during vibration or flexing, or to prevent any sharp corners from severing the strap itself. However, it's worth noting that Tesla didn't always use what appears to be akin to in-home molding in this application. In fact, several videos on YouTube show vehicles fitted with a clear plastic part in place of the trim. Interestingly, Tesla's own parts catalog doesn't show the any such mounting solution found on the various Model Ys in the thread. It's not clear if the part simply isn't documented, or if it was a rapid fix that has remained in production for quite some time.

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Tesla Model Y Owners Find Cooling System Cobbled Together With Home Depot-Grade Fake Wood

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  • by Lije Baley ( 88936 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @04:09PM (#60489726)

    Does it do the job? Will it last? Other considerations are for snobs.

    • by lessSockMorePuppet ( 6778792 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @04:12PM (#60489734) Homepage

      Your desire that products work well is snobbish.

      More typical concerns of corporate are,

      Will it fail precisely after the warranty period?
      Will be be able to lock "owners" into a licensing and subscription model for their "own" possessions?

      • Your attack on the product is snobbish. If it fails precisely after the warranty period, you have a class action case on your hands. This strap can neither lock owners into licensing nor subscription models. We are talking about a part that Tesla used alternatives for.
        • if it fails precisely after the warranty period, it'd be a lightbulb.

          There's nothing illegal about designing a product to only last a specific time. That started with lightbulbs and continues to this day.

          Nothing absolves you of warranty requirements you might be subject to, and you'd be foolish to design a product to fail within a warranty period you're required to provide--but companies can and do engineer their products to fail directly after the warranty.

          It's usually referred to as "cost optimization".

          • Comment removed based on user account deletion
            • AFAIK there's no proof that lightbulbs were designed with the intent that they fail after a set time.

              For incandescent light bulbs, there is a trade-off between duration and efficiency.

              Manufacturers can make them last longer by using a filament that is cooler but emits more light in the non-visible IR range. So you end up spending more on electricity than it would cost to replace a hotter and more efficient bulb.

              My only remaining incandescent bulb is in my chick warming box, where heat is the whole point. So the more inefficient the better.

            • by Khyber ( 864651 )

              Phoebus Cartel. Check it out.

            • by northerner ( 651751 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @11:33PM (#60490960)

              Manufacturers did intentionally limit the life of light bulbs to drive sales. They design bulbs to fail after an agreed-upon 1,000 hours.
              The Phoebus cartel existed to limit the useful life of bulbs and actually tested them to ensure they did not last too long. This was in the the early 20th century though (1925 onwards).

              A good article is "The Great Lightbulb Conspiracy" in IEEE Spectrum.
              https://spectrum.ieee.org/tech... [ieee.org]

              • by quenda ( 644621 )

                Manufacturers did intentionally limit the life of light bulbs to drive sales.

                This is something of an urban legend, yes Phoebus cartel was real, and anti-competitive.
                But standardising the bulb life at 1000 hours was a good thing, resulting in higher efficiency.
                That 1000 hour standard persisted for generations after the cartel ended, and halogen, LED & fluorescent lights replaced them.

                • Yep, there's a correlation between filament lifespan, and its efficiency and running temperature.

                  Setting the standard at 1000 hours was a good thing. You can still buy "long life" 2000 hour filament bulbs with crap efficiency if you want them. We used to use them in our growth chambers to fill in the red/near infrared spectrum from the VHO T12 tubes because the spectrum slides farther down the scale as the filiment runs cooler (and lasts longer!).

                  Standardization is a good thing, but making this particular s

          • Yes, but it really isn't _usually_ that intentional. It doesn't need to be. Parts are selected to fit a cost profile, testing done to optimize profit and of coarse a good engineer can tell you 'about how long' it is likely to last , but so long as it can be sold withing the defined profile without 'too many' people complaining , no one would spend more on it because it would reduce profit.

            (sail price) - (production cost) = profit. So if quality ( aka time it last) goes up either profits go down ( or wors

      • Will it fail precisely after the warranty period?

        A great conspiracy theory which is easily debunked by the basically close to 100% within a rounding error of cars on the market well and truly outliving their warranty period.

        • Cars after warranty usually just need maintenance to run longer. Stuff like washing machines is made to break in such a way the repair is more expensive than buying new. And it's not too hard to make a device to fail after a specific period of time. Say, use bearings with a grease that dries or squeezes out at a consistent rate, or rubber seals that outgas and lose flexibility and sealing properties at specific rate.

          • by dcw3 ( 649211 )

            That's true about cars now, but wasn't just a few decades ago. Planned obsolescence was invented by the auto industry and adopted later by others.
            https://timeline.com/gm-invent... [timeline.com]

            • The things you and the article are talking about is very different to something breaking right after warranty period. That just flat out does not happen at any measurably relevant rate.

            • Tesla isn't in a position where they can afford planned obsolescence quite yet.
              The bulk of Tesla Cash right now is from Stock Sales. However their stock price is based off product sales, and expenses amongst other things.

              For the Auto market Tesla is still considered a startup. Who has a big job of winning over people hearts and minds. At this point their goal is to make sure they are as many Tesla's on the road as possible. This means making sure that in 10, 20 years from now that the old models are stil

          • Stuff like washing machines is made to break in such a way the repair is more expensive than buying new.

            Holy shit if those are the kinds of washing machines you're buying no wonder they don't last the warranty period. My washing machine is only 5x outlived it's warranty and has had one repair, the thermal release, that cost $50 for some guy to replace.

            And it's not too hard to make a device to fail after a specific period of time.

            I didn't say it was hard, I said it's a conspiracy theory that it happens. Most people who claim this happens are usually the same people who buy cheap arse Chinese shit and wonder why it doesn't smell like roses.

      • Your desire that products work well is snobbish.

        More typical concerns of corporate are,

        Will it fail precisely after the warranty period?
        Will be be able to lock "owners" into a licensing and subscription model for their "own" possessions?

        It is a mechanical strain relief secured by a strap, and constructed using various parts. What sort of idiot thinks you can plan when it will fail, when you built it with various random parts? Do you comprehend that when a company plans for a part to fail after a certain amount of time, they have to... plan that? Based on the specific materials in the part?

        And if it did fail, a mechanic knows how to tight a plastic strap. And in fact, car stereos are frequently installed using the same style of aftermarket

        • Wood is a wonderful material.
          I play Stand Up Double Bass (That "Big Cello" as passer bys call it.) I got it used about 25 years ago from a professional Jazz Bassist who stuffed it in a tiny car daily for Gigs , I expect it is probably around 50 years old. There are a lot of stresses on the instrument. The strings are applying about 100lbs of upward force, about 30 pounds of inward compression. Just sitting there. When actually played there are a whole sets of vibrations, and stresses going on, Then when

          • The problem with wood in an automotive context is what happens when the vehicle gets a water leak you don't notice, which is easy to have happen because there are drains throughout the vehicle to permit it to escape. It molds, it warps, it rots, it falls apart. All of this is why automakers rarely use real wood for trim any more, and if they do it's buried in so much varnish that it might as well be plastic.

            It's not like you can't buy sheets of plastic and cut them into pieces, and that's what they probably

    • Who Knows? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by JBMcB ( 73720 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @04:18PM (#60489772)

      Does it do the job? Will it last? Other considerations are for snobs.

      If this was an on-the-line fix, I'm assuming the wood-laminate particleboard quarter rounds have not been tested in an environmental chamber. So, who knows what will happen after exposure to high humidity environments. Will they fall apart? Will the epoxy used to hold the particleboard together leach out and gum up the heat exchanger? Will the stabilizer they use leach out and corrode the metal? Or drop onto something it's sitting on top of and corrode that? Will they vibrate loose? Who knows? Who needs QA/environmental/regulatory testing anyways? SHIP IT!

      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        I'm assuming the wood-laminate particleboard quarter rounds have not been tested

        The parts are not particleboard and are not laminate. They are plastic colored to look like wood.

        Here is a better article with close up photos and a description [jalopnik.com].

        This is a total non-issue. There is no reason to believe these parts are any less reliable than the clear plastic parts used in other Teslas.

        • by Pascoea ( 968200 )

          This is a total non-issue.

          Functionally, maybe not. But, I know I'd be pissed if I found this in a car I just dropped north of $60,000 on. It looks like something Jim Bob and Billy cobbled together to get their broken down tractor out of the field, not something on a production automobile.

        • Re:Who Knows? (Score:5, Informative)

          by AmiMoJo ( 196126 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @05:56PM (#60490202) Homepage Journal

          Plastic rated for domestic use is not suitable for use in a car, exposed to both high and low temperatures. Automotive grade parts have to be extremely robust to survive for a decade or more.

          This isn't an isolated incident either. There are reports of missing parts in the suspension. There are quality control and supply problems.

          https://insideevs.com/news/442... [insideevs.com]

          • The parts should be rated for high temperatures, sure, but anyone who lives in a northern state isn't likely to drive a Tesla during the winter. Primary control interface is an LCD screen. They don't work too well when the LCD is no longer liquid. Also, you end up using energy from your battery to heat the cabin, shortening the range of your car. With internal combustion, you get the heat for free.
            • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

              by random_nb ( 2453280 )
              Prairie-Canadian here. LCDs work okay in the extreme cold. The pixel response gets poor, but every screen from classic segmented displays onto modern HD ones keep working (and the modern ones fare better). By the time the car is warm enough to drive, the screens are all fine.

              I don't own a Tesla, but see enough of them in the winter. I'm sure the range take a dive, but people really do use 'em.
        • FTA (Score:5, Insightful)

          by JBMcB ( 73720 ) on Thursday September 10, 2020 @12:21AM (#60491010)

          "I have seen three separate Model Y’s. Our red one (vin 3300), our blue one (vin 700ish) and a white one (VIN 25000 ish).

          Each vehicle has the metal band but the parts were different on all of them. Different tape color, and the plastic pieces were clearly cut from a some quickly-sourced-stock-material."

          Different pieces used on the same model of car is absolutely an issue. You *have* to test this stuff, thoroughly. Three different parts in a single model year means they are doing no testing. I worked with automotive electronics OEMs and they'd spend hundreds of thousands of dollars testing even non-critical components, like radio antennas and in-door wiring harnesses. That's because if you miss something stupid, a single recall could blow the profit margin on an entire model year of a vehicle. And I'm talking about major Japanese/US/German companies, building hundreds of thousands of a single model. Not to mention, even non-critical parts can become critical if they fail in a particularly bad way.

          To top it all off, the impetus for this whole article was the original owner trying to fix fit-and-finish issues that Tesla refused to repair. This is rookie level production, and Tesla has been building cars for 10 years.

    • by MBGMorden ( 803437 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @04:21PM (#60489800)

      For a $56k car some snobbery is acceptable. If the only consideration is does it do the job there are quite a few new cars that will "do the job" for less than $20k.

      • For a $56k car some snobbery is acceptable. If the only consideration is does it do the job there are quite a few new cars that will "do the job" for less than $20k.

        Of course, for a $56k car, the owner shouldn't have to fix panel/trim issues:

        The original poster of the thread had reportedly spent more than ten hours disassembling their Model Y to correct poor panel fitment

      • I'm thinking the price for beauty in parts that are hidden from view would be quite a ways north of $56k.

        • I don't know - even Kia and Hyundai have managed to keep faux wooden baseboard trim from Home Depot out of their engine bays. "Disproof by counterexample" applies here.

        • Don't talk about this so much.

          Next thing, to get the fake wood grain on the coolant unit holder, you will have to pay $5000 for the deluxe under-the-service-panel upgrade.

    • other considerations pffft
      that car just became a collectable.
      home depot alone could use this as a product branding advertisement and home improvement accessory.
      tesla can turn around and market this as just one example of american engineering that works better than those other solutions.
      it would not surprise me if lowels goes to tesla with a better deal
    • "Does it do the job? Will it last? Other considerations are for snobs."

      They install 3 or 4 different systems and the complaints will tell them which one is best.

    • Electric cars don't create as much heat as ICE cars. Not everything needs to be metal or plastic when a car doesn't exceed the specs for the part.

      Low grade wood. If kept dry and not exposed to too much stress can last longer than a plastic or metal part.

    • Excellent attitude. It is precisely the one I use when I am fixing my garden shed. Now, it has to be said that I am not a professional engineer who designs garden sheds, nor am I charging $55000 for them. So, when i dsigna car for you (that is actually my job) you'll be happy with duct tape and baler twine, if they do the job.

      great stuff, I want you for a customer.

      Fucking idiot more like.

    • Does it do the job? Will it last? Other considerations are for snobs.

      How about: Where can I get a replacement part that I know is within the specs? Can I just use any piece of plastic molding? If Iâ(TM)m wrong will it crack or melt and damage other things? According to the article, the parts aren't even acknowledged in the Tesla parts manual. Being concerned about how you can repair and replace a part in your car doesn't seem super-snobby to me...

  • by lessSockMorePuppet ( 6778792 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @04:10PM (#60489730) Homepage

    why do you care? I mean, as a hunk of metal and plastic, you're legally prohibited from using it as an automated flowerpot, because you'd be breaking their DRM...meaning you don't actually own it.

    You're just licensing it. Sorry to burst your bubble spare.

    • ok then landlord needs to cover all maintenance costs

      • Hey, landlords are already responsible for all reasonable wear. No argument there.

        I'm not against there existing rentals. I'm not against ownership. I'm against calling it ownership, but then turning around and claiming restrictions on what I can do with "my" property.

        Used to be, we called that fraud.

  • opening the door flags the car to have nag screens and forced dearer service vist $$$ to restore all functions

  • Did you look at the pictures and see how small that part is? What is the difference between a purpose made piece of plastic and one you can buy in a store? The only reason they noticed is the woodgrain. You can buy the same screws and bolts there, too.
    • What is the difference between a purpose made piece of plastic and one you can buy in a store?

      Because decorative corner molding is generally just that, a decorative piece. It isn't one designed for structural applications.

  • "...the original poster of the thread had reportedly spent more than ten hours disassembling their Model Y to correct poor panel fitment..."

    On a new $45000 (at least) car?

    What is this crap? Free vehicle repair and maintenance experience with every new Tesla?

  • One would hope that this hold-my-beer style of engineering is not prevalent across all of their divisions.
    • by Scutter ( 18425 )

      They seem to be plagued by fit-and-finish problems, so I'm gonna assume that your hope is misplaced.

    • Why not? Compare it to the original part. The original part being an acrylic edging with a tighter bending radius and thinner it was highly likely that if this component ever suffered any stress the jury rigged version would be sturdier than the original design. I for one would hope that every department in Telsa is innovative enough to find a quick solution to a sourcing problem that is as good as the original design.

      Kind of like where they had a mis-sized piece on a casing and decided to 3D print a part r

      • by Pascoea ( 968200 )

        that is as good as the original design.

        You make the assumption that this replacement "part" was put through the same proper engineering and QA processes as the part that was originally specified. If I was a betting man, I'd say that it wasn't. That means they have no idea if it will hold up as well, better, or worse than the standard part. You have no idea if engineering/QA even had any input whatsoever on substituting this part. This could very well have been some line manager running to Home Depot so they can continue slapping cars together

        • You make the assumption that this replacement "part" was put through the same proper engineering and QA processes as the part that was originally specified.

          You're making the assumption that it wasn't.

          Asses all around.

  • Upgrade (Score:4, Funny)

    by lazarus ( 2879 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @04:57PM (#60489970) Journal

    They should be happy. Porsche charges a lot of money for wood trim upgrades.

  • by Drunkulus ( 920976 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @05:17PM (#60490064)
    As long as it's just a problem with the car there's no need to worry. Tesla stock and regulatory credit sales remain strong.
  • Looks like long term stress over bumps will eventually lead to a stress fracture somewhere on that part because the designer didn't think to reinforce the support out to the far end of what looks like a heavy object that must retain coolant that is presumably under pressure.

    Without that strap a few good potholes probably results in that part sagging onto the slightly similar looking part below.

    LOL a 3 BILLION DOLLA COMPANY!
  • by PPH ( 736903 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @06:29PM (#60490302)

    ... in the supply chain. A new model with high demand and subcontractors having trouble keeping up. Partly due to Covid-19 shut-downs. Tesla scrambles around and finds something to make do. It remains to be seen whether the faux wood trim (plastic) will do any worse than the specified (plastic) part.

    I've seen far worse. Back when the 747-400 manufacturing was coming up to speed at Boeing, we had shortages of aircraft spec fasteners. Management had to run down to the facilities maintenance department (the people who hang light fixtures, repair plumbing, etc.) and issue an order not to issue standard hardware grade bolts to the airplane assembly workers.

  • Tempest meet Teapot (Score:5, Informative)

    by AlanObject ( 3603453 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @07:09PM (#60490446)

    As a recent Model Y owner I find it astonishing how little this concerns me. Had that part been painted black nobody would have ever heard of it.

    And don't kid yourself. I have seen some pretty kludgy line fixes on many other brands of cars over the years. This is nothing compared to some of them.

    BTW the AC in this car is fantastic. In Fremont and the surrounding region I have had to drive in 100F+ conditions fairly often of the past two months and haven't noticed it really until I had to park and step out of the car. And it isn't as if it was howling away at top fan speed.

    I do think Tesla does have some quality issues. The frunk panel on my Model Y is slightly misaligned and I would ask them to fix it if I had time. But it isn't very noticeable.

  • by w0mprat ( 1317953 ) on Wednesday September 09, 2020 @11:16PM (#60490948)
    This looks more like a repair job than something out of the factory. Factory would have easy access to the correct component and would not be so likely to do this. This was likely an "inventory" car ie from a cancelled order and the repair job conducted by Tesla staff rather than send it back to the factory as a quality issue.

    It might have also been done during a warranty claim. Found a rattle of some sort, strapped it down. Didn't tell the customer they'd done some hack job of dealing with a squeak or rattle.
  • by Waccoon ( 1186667 ) on Thursday September 10, 2020 @12:13AM (#60491006)

    If an engineer signed off on it, it doesn't really matter how terrible it looks.

    The real problem is the idea that this is not the "proper" part, with a real part number, which is used on each car. That means inconsistency, and that means a lot of potential quality control problems (this is Tesla, after all). Imagine going to a restaurant and everyone in a party ordered the same dish, but each plate was prepared with different ingredients that are similar enough to get the job done. Don't worry -- it may not be the exact recipe the chef created, but substituting veal with chicken is good enough, right?

    Come on. You wouldn't see this kind of stuff on a Kia, let alone Tesla's expensive wanna-be luxury vehicles.

  • Yes, even a return to bubble gum and bailing wire, if needs be.

    And if my grandpa used it to keep his car on the road, well, that's good enough for me!

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