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Zuckerberg Says Steve Bannon Has Not Violated Enough Policies For Suspension (reuters.com) 153

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Reuters: Facebook Chief Executive Mark Zuckerberg told an all-staff meeting on Thursday that former Trump White House adviser Steve Bannon had not violated enough of the company's policies to justify his suspension when he urged beheading two senior U.S. officials, according to a recording heard by Reuters. Zuckerberg acknowledged criticism of Facebook by President-elect Joe Biden but said the company shared some of the Biden team's same concerns about social media. He urged employees not to jump to conclusions about how the new administration might approach regulation of social media companies.

Bannon suggested in a video posted on Nov. 5 that FBI Director Christopher Wray and government infectious diseases expert Anthony Fauci should be beheaded, saying they had been disloyal to U.S. President Donald Trump, who last week lost his re-election bid to Biden. Facebook removed the video but left up Bannon's page, which has about 175,000 followers. Twitter banned Bannon last week over the same content. "We have specific rules around how many times you need to violate certain policies before we will deactivate your account completely," Zuckerberg said. "While the offenses here, I think, came close to crossing that line, they clearly did not cross the line." Facebook spokesman Andy Stone said the company would take further action against Bannon's page "if there are additional violations."
Last Friday, independent activist network Avaaz alerted Facebook to a network of misinformation pages that Steve Bannon was involved with.

"We're a small team run with small donations," Quran told Gizmodo. "If we can spot this stuff, a multi-billion dollar company with tens of thousands of employees focused on the election and disinformation most certainly can. We are tired of doing their job for them." Quran added that Avaaz has been alerting Facebook to its problems all year. "If 2016 was an accident," Quran added, "2020 has been negligence."
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Zuckerberg Says Steve Bannon Has Not Violated Enough Policies For Suspension

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  • by h33t l4x0r ( 4107715 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @09:03AM (#60719184)
    For example, he can pretend to kidnap himself and demand a second term as the ransom.
    • by Nidi62 ( 1525137 )

      For example, he can pretend to kidnap himself and demand a second term as the ransom.

      Won't people realize it's a fake plot when the ransom note comes written in Sharpie?

      • Won't people realize it's a fake plot when the ransom note comes written in Sharpie?

        Maybe he'll have Eric do it to help throw them off, then it will be written in crayon instead.

        • Well played and funny mods well earned.

          Still, I think it is time to excise that proper noun. Note the difference between "need" and "must". Motivated by irrelevance, not fear.

          Being completely ignored is probably the worst punishment possible. And completely deserved.

          So to change the topic to something more important, I haven't read any of her books since the original seven Harry Potter books. They were pretty good, but descriptions of her later stuff have put me off. Sounded like she was burned out. Or mayb

          • I've only read the Potter books, so I can't help you there. I do want to read the new one so I can decide whether to be incensed about it, which I'm not yet. I prefer to actually have the facts in hand before I get butt-hurt.

            I hope she made enough money to satisfy her muse, though. After what she "gave" us (we did pay for it, but anyway) we should be satisfied.

    • by Adriax ( 746043 )

      He calls it Operation Blazing Saddles.

    • For example, he can pretend to kidnap himself and demand a second term as the ransom.

      Is it possible that we instead ask for a most gruesome death in exchange for not only not giving Trump a second term, but actually offering the presidency to Hillary? I'm sure even the democrats will take him up on that.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by tokul ( 682258 )

      > demand a second term as the ransom

      Three lifetime terms in some government facility will be even better.

  • Just absurd (Score:5, Insightful)

    by bignetbuy ( 1105123 ) <dm AT area2408 DOT com> on Friday November 13, 2020 @09:07AM (#60719192) Journal

    Bannon calls for a beheading yet FB continues to let him spew. What happens when he calls for Zuck's head?

    • Re:Just absurd (Score:5, Insightful)

      by The_Assimilator ( 7344480 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @09:09AM (#60719196)
      Why would Bannon call for the beheading of someone who is enabling his vile behaviour?

      Why would Zuckerberg call for the removal of someone who is enabling him to make money?

      Two morally bankrupt peas in a pod.
      • Re:Just absurd (Score:5, Insightful)

        by bignetbuy ( 1105123 ) <dm AT area2408 DOT com> on Friday November 13, 2020 @09:59AM (#60719338) Journal

        While you make a great point about FB being an enabler, from what I've seen people like Bannon can turn on a dime and go after companies or people with whom they might disagree at some point. Case in point - Fox News and Trump. While Fox News hasn't completely turned on Trump, they are leaning in that direction.

        Another case in point - Trump wanting to make a digital media channel to try and screw over Fox News - the very same org that enabled him over the last 4 years.

        • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

          by gtall ( 79522 )

          And like everything else the alleged president touches, a new media company will die due to the alleged president's managerial prowess. Fox has nothing to worry about, where is their audience going to go to get their daily right-wing nutjob fix?

          • by Merk42 ( 1906718 )

            And like everything else the alleged president touches, a new media company will die due to the alleged president's managerial prowess. Fox has nothing to worry about, where is their audience going to go to get their daily right-wing nutjob fix?

            OAN? Newsmax?

          • by shanen ( 462549 )

            Interesting collection of mod points you have there. Is that because the economic model of propaganda disguised as journalism has nothing to do with "managerial prowess"? Do you think the real deciders actually care if FAUX (or Clear Channel or OAN) makes money as long as it gets "the message" out? The advertising is just camouflage. The ratings still matter, but NOT because of the advertising, only because of the eyeballs for "the message".

        • Re:Just absurd (Score:4, Interesting)

          by Moryath ( 553296 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @11:44AM (#60719724)
          This isn't the first time Zuckerberg has had Facebook ignore the policies to give conservatives a pass [nbcnews.com].

          Two current Facebook employees and two former employees, who spoke anonymously out of fear of professional repercussions, said they believed the company had become hypersensitive to conservative complaints, in some cases making special allowances for conservative pages to avoid negative publicity.

          “This supposed goal of this process is to prevent embarrassing false positives against respectable content partners, but the data shows that this is instead being used primarily to shield conservative fake news from the consequences,” said one former employee.

          About two-thirds of the “escalations” included in the leaked list relate to misinformation issues linked to conservative pages, including those of Breitbart, Donald Trump Jr., Eric Trump and Gateway Pundit. There was one escalation related to a progressive advocacy group and one each for CNN, CBS, Yahoo and the World Health Organization.
        • by tlhIngan ( 30335 )

          Another case in point - Trump wanting to make a digital media channel to try and screw over Fox News - the very same org that enabled him over the last 4 years.

          Isn't that OAN (One America Network)? The only network that actually puts Trump in a good light these days after even Fox News got tired of him?

          It was so good, Trump put an OAN reporter as spokesperson for the FDA where she lasted about 20 hours before being turfed for some reason or another.

          And Trump loves the easy questions OAN asks to a fault.

      • Does Bannon really have that much of a following? How much money does Facebook really make on political engagement generally? Even in right wing politics, Steve Bannon isn't in the top 10 with audiences. He's not a beloved figure. This is what puzzles me. There are many more charismatic and entertaining political figures on both the far right and the mainstream right media.

        Facebook's business plan in regards to politics makes no sense. It's like if Wal Mart started selling sex toys. Why would they
    • Re:Just absurd (Score:5, Insightful)

      by vtcodger ( 957785 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @09:23AM (#60719214)

      Clearly, one must call for the beheading of at least three people in order to be banned.

      Rules are rules. If you bend them just because a guy is a demented sociopath, you'll end up harming your shareholders and for that you'll eventually burn in hell.

      • I'd guess one "Allahu Akbar" adds two bonus beheading calls to one it's combined with.

    • by tchdab1 ( 164848 )

      Something is wrong when the CEO of this major company is intimately involved in the details of individual membership criteria.

      • What would you have him do, plug his ears up and ignore how his product is being used? Not to suggest that isn't where his head is at anyway - he's probably in mortal fear of people leaving the Zuckergarten, which they are starting to.

        You see, he didn't bring the issue up, but he did declare it a non-issue. The best place for it to be is under the rug. Hope that the people who will read it on FB won't care, and the people that would care won't read it. Which is by and large true due to filterly bubblage.

        • by tchdab1 ( 164848 )

          There should be effective policies in place to police membership, content, content manipulation, etc. Of course they're evolving in this kind of environment. Maybe the CEO is concerned with correcting these policies when egregious mistakes are made.
          To get involved with details/decisions about the membership & activity of a specific person who's known to lie and manipulate his content for political purposes puts Zuckerberg into question of supporting or enabling it.

    • When Bannon calls for the head of Zuckerberg's dick I am sure he will insert it without further ado.

    • by farrellj ( 563 )

      Bannon is not banned, but I got banned for 30 days for posting an article some crazy right wing conspiracy theory. They protect the Right Wingers...:-(

  • Comment removed (Score:4, Insightful)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @09:08AM (#60719194)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      Bannon did not "call for beheading government officials," he used a common expression: "put [X]'s head on a pike."

      Explain how you would put someone's head on a pike without beheading the person?
      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        Comment removed based on user account deletion
        • by Nidi62 ( 1525137 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @09:36AM (#60719266)

          Explain how you would put someone's head on a pike without beheading the person?

          Because everyone who isn't a super-serious, pain in the ass trying to score cheap political points knows that it's not a serious call for violence.

          We live in a world where people will read on the internet rumors about a child sex trafficking ring in the basement of a pizza parlor (that's in a building with no basement) and show up to "investigate" it with an AR-15 and start popping off shots. The "reasonable person interpretation" defense went out the window a long time ago.

        • by GrumpySteen ( 1250194 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @10:20AM (#60719396)

          We had a bunch of right wing idiots plotting to kidnap a state governor because she told everyone to wear masks.

          It's not about cheap political points. It's about high profile people whose words reach a large number of people, some small fraction of which are fucking psychopaths who will try to act on those words. These people MUST be held to a higher standard than the idiot in your break room.

        • by hey! ( 33014 )

          And Bannon's followers are morons. QED.

      • Explain how you would put someone's head on a pike without beheading the person?

        You can leave the head on the body and just run the pike from his ass all the up to the skull. Though technically it would be called "impaling"

      • Explain how you would put someone's head on a pike without beheading the person?

        http://www.readwritethink.org/... [readwritethink.org]

      • by Whibla ( 210729 )

        Bannon did not "call for beheading government officials," he used a common expression: "put [X]'s head on a pike."

        Explain how you would put someone's head on a pike without beheading the person?

        Metaphorically

    • by Bigbutt ( 65939 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @10:42AM (#60719464) Homepage Journal

      The problem of course is that reasonable people will understand it as a metaphor and know that he's not actually calling for someone to be beheaded.

      But it appears that there's a not insignificant number of Trump Supporters that would infer that yes, Bannon wants these two folks beheaded and their heads on pikes in front of the White House.

      That's been the problem for the past several years. Since Trump doesn't denounce White Supremacists outright, they feel he's one of them and is giving a wink and a nod when speaking. That way when some group of nutjobs actually plan to kidnap a Governor, he can deny actually telling them to do that. LIBERATE MICHIGAN! No no, I didn't mean actually do physical violence, *wink* *wink* say no more, say no more.

      And yes, I did read the transcript provided by the White House. Trump did say, "good people on both sides" and it wasn't until several minutes later and after reporters continued to ask him to confirm he was supporting White Supremacists that he said they are bad people. If I have to get you to say something under duress, it's unlikely to be true.

      [John]

      • Calling trump supporters stupid enough to act on a metaphor is exactly what the other side would say about you. How can you not realize the complete hypocrisy. “My side understands my violent metaphors and the other side doesn’t.” Meanwhile you had Hollywood cheering on an actual bloody beheaded model of Trumps head. It is complete and utter bias by these tech companies.
      • The problem of course is that reasonable people will understand it as a metaphor and know that he's not actually calling for someone to be beheaded.

        Let me suggest an experiment: set up a new Facebook account and call for Zuckerberg's head on a pike. See how long the account stays up.

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • by leptons ( 891340 )
      There is no meaningful difference between "head on a pike" and "beheading". Either way the purpose is to murder someone because of political differences - and that is terrorism.
    • If Kathy Griffin's obvious joke is worth investigating, Bannon is guilty of death threats.
    • Wow! Can you imagine the response if he had a dummy head of one of them, with bloody neck and holding a knife?

  • How many other people have been suspended for much less?
    • by RobinH ( 124750 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @09:25AM (#60719220) Homepage
      The difference is that those other people aren't big cash cows for Facebook. Bannon increases revenue.
      • by Nidi62 ( 1525137 )

        The difference is that those other people aren't big cash cows for Facebook. Bannon increases revenue.

        Maybe Zuckerberg assumes the Bannon problem will go away when he goes to jail for stealing money from his We Build the Wall "foundation"? Bannon is up on state charges so no pardon for him, if Trump would even want to after their falling out.

  • Isn't it common in the American use of the English language to exaggerate? I read something about that in "Once There Was a War" by John Steinbeck, so maybe these days Americans don't do that anymore.
  • One question (Score:2, Interesting)

    by DaveV1.0 ( 203135 )
    Did Bannon post the podcast on Facebook? No, not a link to the podcast but the actual podcast? Did he put the words directly on Facebook, or make a video of him saying it and post it directly on Facebook? If not, then he probably didn't violate Facebook's terms of service.
    • Re:One question (Score:5, Informative)

      by DRJlaw ( 946416 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @10:32AM (#60719432)

      Did Bannon post the podcast on Facebook?

      Why, yes, [facebook.com] he did.

      No, not a link to the podcast but the actual podcast?

      That's a line that Facebook doesn't draw, and it's a distinction without a difference.

      Did he put the words directly on Facebook, or make a video of him saying it and post it directly on Facebook?

      That's a line that Facebook doesn't draw, and it's a distinction without a difference.

      If not, then he probably didn't violate Facebook's terms of service.

      But he did. You should actually read the document that you're referencing. Your homework for the day [facebook.com].

      • No, not a link to the podcast but the actual podcast?

        That's a line that Facebook doesn't draw, and it's a distinction without a difference.

        There have been numerous stories and comments on Slashdot that argue that there is a distinction, generally involving linking to "pirated" copyrighted material.

        • by DRJlaw ( 946416 )

          There have been numerous stories and comments on Slashdot that argue that there is a distinction, generally involving linking to "pirated" copyrighted material.

          And that concerns copyright infringement, which is different from community standards concerning what sort of content you can post on Facebook. One is a statute that requires that you reproduce the content, the other is a set of conditions concerning how you can use a private service. Nothing in those conditions requires that you reproduce an actua

    • by MrL0G1C ( 867445 )

      If Bannon hasn't violated Facebook's terms of service by constantly deliberately spreading misinformation across Facebook on a large scale then the T's & C's should change.

  • I thought that Zuck told congress that the Cambridge Analytica company had done very very naughty things and he was very upset about it and pushed CA off his platform for harvesting data on millions and millions of people in violation of an agreement with Facebook and Facebook policy.... .... so the co-founder of that company who did all those terrible things still did not break enough rules?

  • Mixed Feelings (Score:2, Insightful)

    by JoeyDot ( 5981942 )
    I'm not always a fan of Zuck the Cuck but I think he's not really the worst. He looks like a ship to me battered in the storm. All the jealous folks and part of him still remembers what it was like to be on the internet in the olden days of the wild west when it was anti-establishment and they're trying to make him the establishment. He annoys everyone but I think somewhere deep down he's anchored. I think he's actually terrified for as powerful as he is he's being spun around and around like nothing before
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by drinkypoo ( 153816 )

      On the inside I do not truly believe that he abides by what his company is doing despite being unethical in its inception.

      Cuckerberg can do what he wants, within reason anyway, as he's running the company. But Facebook was created for nefarious purposes, and he had total disdain for its users from the beginning.

      The rude abides.

    • Re:Mixed Feelings (Score:5, Insightful)

      by MrL0G1C ( 867445 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @11:55AM (#60719772) Journal

      He's a white supremacist enabling scum bag. Facebook calls Breitbart a trusted news source even though they are extremely right wing and publish dangerous conspiracies as news. Facebook doesn't give the staff the ability to deal with fake news in a timely manner.

      Judging by the way Zuckerberg allows Facebook to be a breeding ground for racists and liars, it makes me think he is likely a far right racist and liar.

      This crap has been going on for years, making a mistake once is an accident, making the same mistake dozens of times is not a mistake, it's deliberate.

      • Zuck is just an asshole businessman obsessed with money and power. Any "side" will do if it suits his ends. Same mentality as Trump, really.

  • I bet if I went on Facebook and called for beheadings of multiple government officials I would get banned. Not really interested in testing that, but I'm willing to bet on it. I might get a visit from the FBI, too.

  • ...HAS "Violated Enough Policies For Suspension?"

  • to get banned from FaceBook.

  • Be honest: you want to get rid of Bannon because you hate him, and are just searching for justifications.

    Bannon is an odious dick, but this is just the prequel to the post election canceling of everything connected to, related to, or reminding anyone of Donald Trump. He should maybe talk to Louis CK and see what Purgatory feels like.

    Funny, it used to be that we recognized the best way to deal with odious fringe crazies was to let them have their say and laugh at how stupid they are. I mean look at the KKK

    • by mobby_6kl ( 668092 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @12:25PM (#60719896)

      You know that the KKK wasn't defeated by laughing at them while they were lynching people?

      • No, you're right.
        Those things were stopped by action, and I'm not trivializing it.
        But the KKK was made culturally irrelevant and marginalized as a CONCEPT by mockery, disregard, and shaming. That torpedoed their organization - and most importantly - their ideology, far more permanently than a few arrests.

        Let's remember that an esteemed Democratic senator passed away not so long ago that USED to not be ashamed that he was a Grand Wizard of the KKK. Did he stop talking about that because he was afraid of ar

  • "Steve Bannon had not violated enough of the company's policies to justify his suspension when he urged beheading two senior U.S. officials, "

    If people called Saïd and Mohammed would to the same thing, they'd go to jail or if they are located outside the US, perhaps a drone-strike.

    • by labnet ( 457441 )

      I see you are not mature enough to seperate a figure of speech from a demonstrated action.

      • "I see you are not mature enough to seperate a figure of speech from a demonstrated action."

        At 65 I'm mature enough to know how 'separate' is spelled you stupid whippersnapper.
        And now get off my lawn.

  • I live in insane la la land now. Our chief complaint is that our communications media don't censor enough, lol.
    • by labnet ( 457441 )

      Yup. It’s been super weird seeing /. turning from a fairly neutral place defending free speech, to a lefty virtue signalling echo chamber.

  • They'd have already performed a drone strike on his location.
  • by cfalcon ( 779563 ) on Friday November 13, 2020 @05:35PM (#60721222)

    When you're so correct that any opposing view must be banned by governments, hidden by search engines, and thrown off of tech giants, you are definitely not a baddie.

    That's how it works right?

    Also definitely downvote this opinion thanks. That hides it from view. It's not a troll, nor flamebait, so I suggest "overrated", which is immune to metamoderation.

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