Trump Considers Clemency For Silk Road 'Kingpin' Ross Ulbricht (thedailybeast.com) 169
An anonymous reader quotes a report from The Daily Beast: In his final weeks in office before Joe Biden's inauguration, President Donald Trump is weighing granting clemency to Ross Ulbricht, the founder and former administrator of the world's most famous darknet drug market, Silk Road, The Daily Beast has learned. According to three people familiar with the matter, the White House counsel's office has had documents related to Ulbricht's case under review, and Trump was recently made aware of the situation and the pleas of the Silk Road founder's allies. Two of these sources say the president has at times privately expressed some sympathy for Ulbricht's situation and has been considering his name, among others, for his next round of commutations and pardons before the Jan. 20 inauguration of his 2020 Democratic opponent.
It is unclear if Trump has arrived at a final decision yet, but Ulbricht has gained some influential backers in the president's political and social orbit. Behind the scenes, he has the support of some presidential advisers, as well as criminal justice reform advocates with close ties to the administration and Trump family, including Alice Johnson, according to people with knowledge of the matter. "I've had documents forwarded to my contacts in the White House as early as February," activist Weldon Angelos, a former music producer and ex-federal inmate, said in a brief interview on Tuesday evening. "In the beginning of the year, [Ulbricht's] family had reached out to us for our support, and my organization and I have endorsed his full commutation, and I am hopeful that President Trump will commute his sentence in its entirety. This case has perhaps more support than I've seen in any case of this kind."
It is unclear if Trump has arrived at a final decision yet, but Ulbricht has gained some influential backers in the president's political and social orbit. Behind the scenes, he has the support of some presidential advisers, as well as criminal justice reform advocates with close ties to the administration and Trump family, including Alice Johnson, according to people with knowledge of the matter. "I've had documents forwarded to my contacts in the White House as early as February," activist Weldon Angelos, a former music producer and ex-federal inmate, said in a brief interview on Tuesday evening. "In the beginning of the year, [Ulbricht's] family had reached out to us for our support, and my organization and I have endorsed his full commutation, and I am hopeful that President Trump will commute his sentence in its entirety. This case has perhaps more support than I've seen in any case of this kind."
Full Arkham breakout (Score:5, Insightful)
Maybe this is why Batman has to keep fighting the same villains all the time, in the Batmanverse every few years they get a total shitbag President who lets all the supervillains out of Arkham...
So he's already released Rod Blagojevich, Joe Arpaio, and Roger Stone among and all the other criminal shitbags who worked with his campaign, who's next, Martin Shkreli? Maybe some far-right terrorists?
Shitbag?! (Score:5, Insightful)
Calling him a shitbag is a complement.
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All of that explains his war on justice.
He wants to create an environment in which criminals are pardoned for reasons which should be patently obvious, and probably are to most of us.
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At least Clinton exited somewhat gracefully without trying to tear down 2 centuries of American democracy.
That's a pretty low bar, but it's one that Trump couldn't clear.
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Hypocrisy is a prerequisite for going into politics. Hypocrisy is apparently also a prerequisite for becoming famous religious leades who encourage their followers to dabble in politics. In the New Testament, Jesus saves some of his best scorn for the hypocrites.
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Trump was not involved here, it was a state crime he was convicted on, not federal. Giving Trump credit for taking down Epstein is about as sycophantic as giving Trump credit for the rising of the sun.
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So he's already released Rod Blagojevich, Joe Arpaio, and Roger Stone among and all the other criminal shitbags who worked with his campaign, who's next, Martin Shkreli? Maybe some far-right terrorists?
Well, Mike Flynn has gone full on Q crazy and he pardoned him, so that's pretty close to a far-right terrorist.
Batman is not an cop and brakes the cop rules (Score:2)
Batman is not an cop and brakes the cop rules so the villains are not in an real prison and if they good lawyers they can get off easy.
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There has been reports of Trump inquiring if he can preemptively pardon himself and speculation wrt also doing so for his family and Rudy Guilliani https://www.npr.org/2020/12/02... [npr.org]
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There has been reports of Trump inquiring if he can preemptively pardon himself...
The Constitution says, "...and he shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment."
He can pardon himself for any offense, provided he is not currently being impeached for that offense. However, he would have to list the offense for which he is pardoning himself and/or his family and friends. So basically, there would have to be a confession and/or conviction of some offense before he could issue a pardon for it.
If he wanted to foreclose
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I believe it's commonly held that you can only impeach someone while in office, so with a month to go I'd say chances are less than slim. The need to list crimes in the pardon isn't spelled out in the constitution but is generally assumed, just like not being able to pardon oneself. In the case of nixon, the pardon is pretty much a blanket pardon the clarification is in the preamble, but since it was never challenged it's a bit up in the air. I don't think Trump will try all this, but he's been unpredictabl
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Whether or not Trump can pardon himself, or if he even tries it, it only applies to federal laws. Trump's worry is about New York state and he cannot pardon himself or anyone else over those laws.
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Maybe this is why Batman has to keep fighting the same villains all the time, in the Batmanverse every few years they get a total shitbag President who lets all the supervillains out of Arkham...
Are you implying that this is some Unbreakable universe, and he's actually trying to create a superhero like Batman by his actions?
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who's next, Martin Shkreli? Maybe some far-right terrorists?
Himself, of course.
Bitcoins were involved (Score:5, Funny)
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As a matter of fact, yes, there has been one. November 4th. One day after the USA election date. Pretty much around the time it became clear Trump would lose the election.
https://www.bbc.com/news/techn... [bbc.com]
Now, lo and behold, there's talk about Trump considering pardoning Ross Ulbricht.
I'm sure its all just a string of coincidences...
Kushner's bailed out of 666 Madison Avenue mistake (Score:5, Informative)
Or, how many Trump family members get bailed out of their billion-dollar financial blunders [vanityfair.com] by middle-eastern nation states suffering blockades orchestrated by the President's son-in-law? No bitcoin obfuscation required for payoffs via real estate transactions.
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Like investing in an apartment in a Trump Tower or a few Mierda Lago club memberships
Money and influence (Score:2)
Why not commute the sentences of all non violent drug offenders in federal custody then?
Oh right, because this is about money and/or influence (not necessarily doing the right thing) and they have neither.
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Why not commute the sentences of all non violent drug offenders in federal custody then?
Oh right, because this is about money and/or influence (not necessarily doing the right thing) and they have neither.
More than money - moralizing to appease his pseudo-Christian Evangelical base.
I need to write a new New Testament where Jesus turns hay into Weed.
That will appease those people. They have NO problem with wine, but weed; which is a mush safer drug? Nope.
And we can go into relatively recent history and get into the race aspects of weed. https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/19... [cnn.com]
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More, as in the level of legalization within any state goes too far, or simply because "too many" states legalized it?
I think the reality is you pretty much have to legalize production and retail sales regardless. Any half-way measure that makes personal possession and use not subject to any criminal penalties inevitably produces a large scale black market to supply the now legal possession and use.
It really makes no sense to only partially legalize marijuana, plus you lose massive amounts of potential tax
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We've had legal marijuana up here in Canada for over two years. Initially the chief problem was supply, and the black and gray markets prospered. Then there was the learning curve in the provinces, which lead to all kinds of regulatory chaos. Some provinces went with private sales, some went with distribution through government liquor stores. Where private sales were allowed, both Federal and provincial licensing rules made it a right pain for suppliers and resellers.
There's still a lot of illegal pot out t
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Alcohol has been legal for decades now and there is still illegal alcohol sales going on. 8^)
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But how many people do you know that actually buy bootleg liquor? I think finding heroin would be easier.
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Federal government is not, and that's where the obstacle comes for the industry. No federally chartered financial institution can handle their money, so it gets pushed into the very lucrative money laundering market that makes people like Robert Rubin insanely rich.
Re:Money and influence (Score:4, Informative)
The problematic people don't really care that much about what the scripture says.
The Bible texts do describe the type of person a lot of Evangelicals are as "Pharisee". Pharisee are usually depicted as the the bad guys by being self-righteous, thinking themselves to be morally superior and being judgmental in looking down upon others.
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Matthew 6:5-6: "And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you."
Now I wonder if this applies to the televangelists praying loudly on television, while exhorting their viewers to support Trump
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As far as I know it's the one and only instance in the Bible where Jesus used some kind of force to apply what he believed to be right.
According to scholars this was also the one event where Jesus went too far by alienating the establishment of the organized religion, leading to his incarceration and ultimately to his executi
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But Mexicans are the real problem? (Score:2, Insightful)
Odd. (Score:2)
There's no political advantage in this. Republicans are not the party of drug legalisation. Ulbricht has a few followers, but not the kind of numbers needed to have real influence in politics. No personal connections with strings to tug. There's nothing Trump would gain from this.
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Back when Trump was considering this, Ulbricht had a fuckton of money hidden away. Maybe he still does, but not as much [wsj.com] as he might have earlier promised.
Comment removed (Score:5, Funny)
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The Republicans ought to be the party of drug legalisation, at the federal level because states rights. Sometimes it seems that states rights only extends as far as giving states the right to oppress women and gay people, and nothing else.
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State's rights only matter when they states align with your politics. As I've long held, neither major party has a solid set of ideals to stand behind, as their ideals keep changing every single election. Republicans are neither for small government nor large government, but whichever size of government serves their purposes at the moment. They want small government when it comes to their own personal freedoms, but they want big government when it comes to the restricting the freedoms of others (gay marr
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>By the end of the next 4 years Trump will probably look like a good president.
>Over 70 million people voted for him and the political and activist class ignore that fact at their peril.
You are so totally a trump fan. You may have tried your hardest to write a comment that you thought made you look like not a trump fan, but you totally failed. There is so much in that comment that reeks of trump-fan.
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Or is is one of the many millions who has to hold their nose and support the candidate they dislike the least.
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But Trump really is not a Republican. Pence is though, and Pence would not have done any of those actions as a president, probably neither would have Cruz, Rubio, or even Jeb. Trump is a populist, whose political ideals boil down to saying whatever the current audience wants to hear, and then doing whatever he feels like at the moment.
Remember, more thyan 70 million voted for Biden. If popularity actually matters in presidential elections, then Biden wins on that account (and so did Hillary for that matt
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Pence is the epitome of a Republican. I don't think there are any issues in which he deviates from the party line and policies.
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There's no political advantage in this. Republicans are not the party of drug legalisation. Ulbricht has a few followers, but not the kind of numbers needed to have real influence in politics. No personal connections with strings to tug. There's nothing Trump would gain from this.
He has connections. He knows or can find people who do the dirtiest of work. That's fairly useful if he could convince such people that he wasn't a narc.
Contracted 6 fucking murders (Score:2)
Keep him in for life.
Snowden? (Score:4, Insightful)
Any chance of a pardon for Snowden? It's already pathetic that "Peace Prize" Obama didn't grant him one...
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Pardoning Snowden was something he talked about in August. Seems to me there's nothing to indicate that Trump appreciated Snowdens whistle blowing and the speculation has been that it would be to get back at the security agencies; I don't know why he'd wait until the end of the term to do that so I don't think it's going to happen.
Re:Snowden? (Score:4, Funny)
Any chance of a pardon for Snowden? It's already pathetic that "Peace Prize" Obama didn't grant him one...
Trump did consider pardoning him. He also said Snowden should be executed. So who knows what Trump thinks about Snowden now (at a guess it would be "Who is he?")
Trump: "Who's snowed in? If It's Ivanka send a helicopter, if it's Eric, well. . . look, my interview's on Newsmax!"
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That orange-skinned occupant of the White House caused the deaths of Americans. I'm curious if you want to hang him as well.
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> Why does every thing have to revolve around Trump?
it doesn't, but the first word in the fucking title of this article is Trump, so you would expect him to come up a bit.
interesting use of the word "support" (Score:2)
"...I have endorsed his full commutation, and I am hopeful that President Trump will commute his sentence in its entirety. This case has perhaps more support than I've seen in any case of this kind."
Sure, because cases of this kind NEVER have the slightest "support" for clemency. And by "support" he mean "corrupt interest", the only currency Trump ultimately deals in. Also, this is an "ex-federal inmate" we're talking about here. Since when are felons experts in what justice is?
This is probably out of date (Score:2)
Note that many of the positive/hopeful remarks appear to date back to the beginning of 2020, back when Ulbricht still had something that Trump desperately, personally needs. But wasn't his big Bitcoin stash successfully obtained by the FBI just a couple months ago? Ulbricht might not have a way to make good on his end of the deal.
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Pardon everyone (Score:2)
Maybe Trump should pardon everyone especially those who were railroaded by the System for daring to challenge the authority of the System.
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especially those who were railroaded by the System for daring to challenge the authority of the System.
How many of those are there?
perfect... (Score:2)
I can see it now. Trump on his second term, with Stephen Miller and Ross Ulbricht in his cabinet. Perf
Didn't he try to have someone murdered? (Score:2)
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In what way does it strengthen democracy to remove the power of the people WE PICK to short circuit a system run by people we don't pick?
Follow the money (Score:4, Informative)
Trump never does anything unless there is something in it for himself.
There is just one major ... (Score:2)
... test for a presidential commutation or pardon:
Is it legal?
If yes, move on.
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Actually, the Constitution makes it clear. The test is:
"is it an impeachment?"
If no. Move on.
Pardon everyone (Score:2)
Just do a blanket pardon for all past crimes by citizens of the US. Clean slate.
Exactly how much money changing hands? (Score:2)
How much money is on offer for this "consideration"? Need to know for the rap sheet.
Why? (Score:2)
Re:The overcharging problem (Score:5, Informative)
He did directly order at least 2 hits on people, on top of being indirectly responsible for the deaths that come with being a drug kingpin by default.
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That's what really got him busted. It all started with him using his personal email to advertise the silk road. All they had to do was find the first mention and surprise surprise it was sent him from.
Re:The overcharging problem (Score:5, Informative)
He did directly order at least 2 hits on people, on top of being indirectly responsible for the deaths that come with being a drug kingpin by default.
At the end of the day, the justice system works with what they can prove, which is not always what they know. When the legal system cannot prove the worst crimes, or when those crimes fall outside jurisdiction, the penalty for conviction of any other criminal offense is often near or at the maximum allowable.
Probably the most famous example: Al Capone was about as far as you can get from being an innocent. Despite his many known (but legally unproven) violent and ruthless crimnal activities, he was convicted of the relatively victim-less crime of tax evasion.
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Capone's tax evasion. (Score:3)
He was convicted of tax evasion because it was a Federal crime. The state courts, police and prosecutors were hopelessly corrupted by the mob in Illinois.
Re: The overcharging problem (Score:2)
Why wasnâ(TM)t he charged and convicted of those?
No person should be given an overly harsh sentence based on some crime they havenâ(TM)t been convicted of.
It is well known that the only reason he is doing this life sentence is because the judge felt he did those other crimes. Allegations he was not allowed a fair chance at disproving.
Re: The overcharging problem (Score:5, Informative)
This story explains it:
https://reason.com/2018/07/25/... [reason.com]
There is clear smoking-gun evidence of Ulbricht's attempts to have people killed by hitmen however, the contents of some of these emails has even been made public. If it went to trial it would be an open-and-shut case, but in the process law enforcement would have to air its dirty laundry about a crooked LEO who was involved.
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On the other hand, though the Supreme court didn't want to touch it, there are legitimate Constitutional questions about a judge using unadjudicated accusations when considering sentencing. Until there is a conviction, the justice system is to consider him innocent of those accusations. Using the accusations to decide on an unusually long sentence is effectively sentencing for those crimes without a trial.
As for the crooked investigators, I would say that airing that dirty laundry is in the public interest.
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there are legitimate Constitutional questions about a judge using unadjudicated accusations when considering sentencing
As of now the Supreme Court has ruled on this and judges can consider uncharged or even acquitted offences when determining sentences for charges the defendant has been convicted of. There are a number of cases where this has been upheld. Majority opinions of these Supreme Court cases generally reference 18 USC 3661 [house.gov] which states "No limitation shall be placed on the information concerning the background, character, and conduct of a person convicted of an offense which a court of the United States may receiv
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Why wasnâ(TM)t he charged and convicted of those?
He probably will be if Trump gives him clemency for the money laundering.
Prosecutors don't charge everything, they charge what is easiest to prove that gives the longest sentence. Unlike in imaginary-world (called teevee) if you are convicted of 10 things that each have a sentence of 10 years, you serve 10 years. (not 100) And if it was 11 things, then it cost the prosecutors office more money, but you served the same 10 years. Not 110.
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No person should be given an overly harsh sentence based on some crime they havenâ(TM)t been convicted of.
Unfortunately current case law, which has been upheld multiple times in the US Supreme Court, is that judges can consider unconvicted crimes or even crimes the defendant has been acquitted of. No limitation shall be placed on the information concerning the background, character, and conduct of a person convicted of an offense which a court of the United States may receive and consider for the purpose of imposing an appropriate sentence. [house.gov]
This is considered to be a loophole to double jeopardy and due process,
But has he ever spoken with... (Score:3)
"He whose name need not be spoken"? He promised to pardon everyone who has ever spoken to him.
Quick, what's the phone number? I gotta talk to someone. For a friend, of course.
("What's the frequency, Kenneth?" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org] )
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And again, if Trump does the pardon he again proves he is very un-Republican. Republicans have made drug use and drug dealing the highest order of crimes. Well, if you're black anyway, but if you're white it's still the second highest order of crimes. So for a Republican to pardon a drug dealer would almost be considered absurd, except for Trump and the resurgence of Dadaism.
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But implementing a free market, that's right on point for a republican who is trying to maintain the pretense that they like free markets.
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Depends on what you believe justifies a life sentence. Considering that money laundering is inherently associated with other crimes, it is serious in nature and context contributes to sentencing, context that you aren't considering.
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Money laundering as a charge means, "We really, really don't like this guy but there is no other charge we can prove."
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Money laundering as a charge means, "We really, really don't like this guy but there is no other charge we can prove."
I thought they usually used conspiracy for that. Even with money laundering you have to provide evidence that money (usually larger sums) was changing hands.
Re:The overcharging problem (Score:4, Informative)
No, it means you're part of a conspiracy to hide the proceeds of crime. You do understand that money laundering is about taking money gained by illegal means, and then using fronts to "launder" the cash through so the source is untraceable. Whatever is meant by "economic crime", money laundering is always used to hide the original source of the cash. Whether it's just for simple tax evasion or to hide moneys gained through illegal drug sales, extortion rackets, illegal gambling, it's a crime because it's the necessary step in taking ill-gotten cash and making it look like it was legitimately earned.
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The problem with money laundering as a crime is that first that it can bite almost anyone. Think about the last time you sold a house. How much do you know, really, about where the seller got his cash or down payment? If the source turns out to be tainted in some way by the broad powers that prosecutors have anointed themselves with to pursue such things, he goes to prison and you are left with no house and no money. The bigger problem is that just monitoring for it requires governments to assume all sorts
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Not always, sometimes it leads to a 4 year sentence to the White House.
I wouldn't be surprised to see a condition of the clemency being that he only launder future illegal revenue through the Trump Organization.
Re:The overcharging problem (Score:4, Interesting)
It wasn't really a sentence - more like he tripped, fell, and landed there. The stunt was supposed to culminate with the launch of a TV news network. Too many people enjoyed the circus, didn't have the heart to make it leave. Everyone just held their noses and tried to ignore the piles of elephant dung. Some even searched deep within the piles, thrusting their arms in down to the hilt, like that scene in Jurassic Park. Trying to find some nugget that might be valuable to somebody, somewhere. Hell, maybe they did find it. But they still ended up covered in shit.
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You thinking of Kim Dotcom?
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However, supposedly, we're to feel sorry for drug users even after they've been warned for decades about the dangers of drug use yet still go out of their way to show they know more than all the experts out there.
I wonder how many of the anti-vaxxers are drug users.
Re:From one criminal to the next (Score:5, Insightful)
* I don't care if you do drugs. I care when you say it's my responsibility to pay to clean up the mess you created by your actions. However, supposedly, we're to feel sorry for drug users even after they've been warned for decades about the dangers of drug use yet still go out of their way to show they know more than all the experts out there.
Except a significant portion of drugs users- particularly users of heroin or people who abuse prescription drugs- are normal, every day people who had an accident or surgery and, because companies such as Purdue Pharma encourage doctors to hand out pain pills like Pez candy, got hooked on pain pills then when the prescription ran out they were already addicted. But, because of people like you who assume every drug addict is a lazy, immoral, inherently broken person, they either have nowhere to turn to for help or the stigma of getting help is so high that they risk losing their jobs, alienating friends and family, etc.
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This ^
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"From everybody in politics, actually, how is handing out pardons for favors benefitting society at large?"
As the head of the Branch charged with executing and pursuing the law this allows the President to leverage pardons, exceptions, anything for himself or others short of impeachment to pursue the mandate the people have charged him/her with. It is critical that the President (or anyone working at his direction) need not fear anyone short of congress under articles of impeachment obstructing their work i
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Ah, this recalls Tennessee governor Ray Blanton who went on a spree of pardons including during his lame duck period, pardoning even convicted murderers, all white. He didn't pardon all of them, that would have been a lot of paper, ink, and time. It was so bad that the legislative leaders organized a method to bring in the next governor early to put an end to it (Lamar Alexander).