Russia-Linked Ad Agency Smeared Vaccines Using Hundreds of Fake Instagram Accounts (nbcnews.com) 236
An anonymous reader shared this report from NBC News:
Facebook said Tuesday that it has removed hundreds of accounts linked to a mysterious advertising agency operating out of Russia that sought to pay social media influencers to smear Covid-19 vaccines made by Pfizer and AstraZeneca. A network of 65 Facebook accounts and 243 Instagram accounts was traced back to Fazze, an advertising and marketing firm working in Russia on behalf of an unknown client.
The network used fake accounts to spread misleading claims that disparaged the safety of the Pfizer and AstraZeneca vaccines. One claimed AstraZeneca's shot would turn a person into a chimpanzee. The fake accounts targeted audiences in India, Latin America and, to a lesser extent, the U.S., using several social media platforms including Facebook and Instagram. Russia has been actively marketing its Covid-19 vaccine, Sputnik V, abroad in what some analysts see as an effort to score geopolitical points...
The Fazze network also contacted social media influencers in several countries with offers to pay them for reposting the misleading content. That ploy backfired when influencers in Germany and France exposed the network's offer....
Facebook investigators say some influencers did post the material, but later deleted it when stories about Fazze's work began to emerge.
The article also summarizes reporting from the Associated Press about the offers received by those YouTube influencers. It "urged influencers not to mention that they were being paid, and also suggested they criticize the media's reporting on vaccines."
The network used fake accounts to spread misleading claims that disparaged the safety of the Pfizer and AstraZeneca vaccines. One claimed AstraZeneca's shot would turn a person into a chimpanzee. The fake accounts targeted audiences in India, Latin America and, to a lesser extent, the U.S., using several social media platforms including Facebook and Instagram. Russia has been actively marketing its Covid-19 vaccine, Sputnik V, abroad in what some analysts see as an effort to score geopolitical points...
The Fazze network also contacted social media influencers in several countries with offers to pay them for reposting the misleading content. That ploy backfired when influencers in Germany and France exposed the network's offer....
Facebook investigators say some influencers did post the material, but later deleted it when stories about Fazze's work began to emerge.
The article also summarizes reporting from the Associated Press about the offers received by those YouTube influencers. It "urged influencers not to mention that they were being paid, and also suggested they criticize the media's reporting on vaccines."
Twaddle (Score:2, Insightful)
Didn't anyone tell the ruskies that governments don't need help smearing vaccine.. They are doing a good enough job at that themselves!
Re:Twaddle (Score:5, Insightful)
Well they need to do something, I mean if enough family members or close friends die from being non-vaccinated even the Reddest of the necks realize that that they may be in the wrong, and perhaps could be wrong about other things that their echo-chamber had told them. So Russia needs to boost its efforts, making figure that their deaths would had happen even with the Vaccines, and probably would had died earlier. To keep these people in their echo chamber and confirmation biases. Because if you are consuming media that you implicitly trust, and you trust it because it aligns to you belief, it is really easy to push an other agenda and convince people to go against their and their communities self interests.
Re:Twaddle (Score:5, Interesting)
Well they need to do something, I mean if enough family members or close friends die from being non-vaccinated even the Reddest of the necks realize that that they may be in the wrong, and perhaps could be wrong about other things that their echo-chamber had told them.
I really wish this was true, but this is not at all what happens. If anything, it will cause a significant number of such people to double down on the "I will never be vaccinated" stances they have taken. I grew up in a small town that is filled with members of the Cult of Trump. Although I moved to a large city a long time ago, I still have some friends who live there and i see what they post in Facebook. Here are a few examples.
1) I've seen nurses insist that COVID is a hoax and refuse to get vaccinated and their jobs don't require it because, I guess, freedom.
2) I have a friend who is right on the edge between overweight and morbidly obese. She is a type 1 insulin dependent diabetic. I have watched in horror as she has gone from "Covid is real. Stay safe!" to "The COVID vaccines is 100% dangerous 100% of the time." to "All vaccines are dangerous all of the time." If she gets COVID I'm pretty sure she is going to the ICU - if they even have a bed - but she is so anti all vaccinations now that she will not ever get vaccinated for anything.
3) The wife of a friend who lives in the large metro area I currently live in is a receptionist in a doctor's office. The doctor insisted that all of his staff had to get vaccinated when they were eligible in January so she has been fully vaccinated with 2 doses of either Moderna or Pfizer. All she posts any more on Facebook is how the vaccine is a hoax and COVID is a hoax. I could tell her how Trump did Operation Warp Speed to develop the vaccines we have but she long ago stopped caring about the truth.
4) If anything, when the rednecks get COVID and survive, they are concluding that the vaccines are worthless because you can still get COVID anyway, so why bother.
Re: (Score:2)
Yup, I see people showing political biases on both sides with seeing the same issue here and blaming it on their political opposites. Ie, someone posts a complaint on facebook that people are stupid for not being vaccinated. Then someone says "stupid liberals, I'll never understand them", and someone else says "why are conservatives so stupid". Because the anti-vax people straddle politics, but others are so caught up in the idea that politics is everything, and our side is smart and their side is stupid,
Re: (Score:2)
Because the anti-vax people straddle politics, but others are so caught up in the idea that politics is everything, and our side is smart and their side is stupid, etc.
It’s true antivax was not very partisan going into covid. However, one side is calling it a hoax, saying wearing a mask is equivalent to WWII genocide, and not only telling their constituents not to wear masks or get the shot but are actually making laws to stop mask wearing mandates. This is after they secretly got shots for themselves and their family because they don’t even believe the lies outta their own face. The other side is saying to get the shot and wear a mask.
So no it’s n
Re: (Score:2)
I've seen nurses insist that COVID is a hoax and refuse to get vaccinated
This one drives me crazy. Doctors, too.
They should know better.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I have a nurse acquaintance who's adamantly in the "covid is overblown" camp. Refuses to get vaccinated and lives in a state where it's unlikely to be mandated for health care professions. His fucking DAD caught covid and died. Literally, in the hospital, pulled off his O2 mask and suffocated to death on his illness (at least, this is what what the acquaintance himself said happened). Did that change his mind? Hell no. "MY dad died on his terms! He died FREE!"
What the ever loving fuck. Fucking morons.
Remind me of a poem (Score:2)
This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang but a whimper
About 200 people a day are dying (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
yes keep up supporting your misinformation campaign that only rednecks are the anti-vaxxers.
Bravo on reading GP's post and writing that response in just 5 minutes!
Wait, only one of their examples seems to fit your "misinformation campaign that only rednecks are the anti-vaxxers" strawman, unless I missed the obvious fact that nurses and urban dwellers belong in that category too? And if you're going to cherry pick the only piece of data from that study that supports your argument... who exactly is on a misinformation campaign again?
Re: (Score:2)
Facebook investigators say some influencers did post the material, but later deleted it when stories about Fazze's work began to emerge.
Did a single "influencers" post a retraction or send any money back?
Re: (Score:2)
Have you ever seen an influenza give anything back of the money they got for hawking snakeoil?
Re: (Score:2)
Didn't anyone tell the ruskies that governments don't need help smearing vaccine.. They are doing a good enough job at that themselves!
Or you just proved that the smear-job is doing an excellent job. I mean, we're at: "The sick people now are the ones that aren't vaccinated" and the arguments against vaccination are anything BUT that little detail.
Re: (Score:2)
I think the idea is to keep the snowball rolling down the hill and growing. So find the snowballs that are rolling mostly in the directions you like and nudge so that they keep going. Propaganda is all about influencing thought and it works best when it's subtle.
Re:Pawns: You will take these vaccine shots anyway (Score:4, Insightful)
Freedom success relies on most people making good decisions.
If experts, and most of the governments around the world mostly agree on something. Chances are this is the closest to the truth you are going to get, and you should probably act as it it is indeed truthful information. If you have doubts, you should ask yourself if you can do real research, such as looking up actual source information, not just sting your favorite news/echo chamber site. When doing research in something that you have doubts with, you need to put your ego aside, and go by the stance that you may be wrong, so you follow the research and most of the time the experts are on to something, if they are indeed wrong, you should have solid evidence to show that they are wrong.
If that amount of research is too much work. Then just do what the experts suggest. As most experts want to sleep at night, knowing that they did something to help society, because experts are defiantly not getting paid the big bucks like your favorite news commentator.
Now if a good number of people actually follow the advice from someone who is more knowledgeable on something chances are it won't have to be forced by law, because enough people are doing the right thing, and the few who don't are not causing too much problems. Being that most people will eat their vegetables, and will strive to a balanced meal, and not eat dessert all day. There is no law requiring people to eat healthy.
Re:Pawns: You will take these vaccine shots anyway (Score:5, Insightful)
Freedom success relies on most people making good decisions.
It is. If that does not happen, society is either protected by forcing some things (like, say, mandating that you stop at a red traffic light), or society erodes and everybody suffers (as can be seen, for example, in societies where traffic lights are regarded as "advisory" only). Nobody sane really wants to live in the 2nd type of society. Those few that do are welcome to move there, but they will have to accept the full package, no cherry-picking.
I agree to the the rest of your posting as well, well said!
Re: (Score:2)
"Research" is some of the problem, as it means different things to different people. Ie, the flat earthers always say, almost like a mantra, "do your own research". And what they mean is "look at all our youtube videos." Which is why you hear exactly the same broken arguments and invalid assumptions ("water always seeks its level"). Similarly, people who believe that 2020 election was stolen will say "do the research", by which they mean read and watch stuff produced by their thought leaders.
What we don
Re: (Score:2)
It sure doesn't help the "research" concept when groups are actively trying to confuse and mislead people with intentionally misleading arguments which mix fact and fiction.
I mean I think there was a time where a person could research a somewhat controversial issue and make a reasonable decision, but now everything is some crazy kaleidoscope view. You can keep shifting the image, but you really can't say which view is right.
Re: (Score:2)
Great post, but I think you lost 99% of Slashdot users right there.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
I would not say many cases. For grafts before the blood vessel network has grown completely and for certain rare conditions, yes. Although, in most of those conditions leeches are not needed and simply draining blood works.
Re: (Score:2)
In a world where the alternative was some priest to just put some oil on your head and say you should be cured, or if you die, you will go to heaven. Leaches were often far more effective. Leaches at least can help with some areas which they are infected, as well perhaps lower blood pressure.
So if in a hundred years we find something better than a Vaccine, that could had been used for COVID, that isn't going to help us now, as the Vaccine is very safe and effective now.
The study of Science, is a rather new
Re: (Score:2)
Given the evidence from around the rest of the world it suggests that what happens in Israel is something specific to the conditions there.
And that should certainly be looked into. But coming to the broad and sweeping conclusion that vaccines don't simply don't work is of the stupidest caliber.
You're like those Flat Earth Idiots who claim that this Allais effect, which works during solar eclipses
Re: (Score:2)
If you knew only a quarters as much about the rigor of deductive reasoning and rational thinking as suggested by your tone, you'd be aware of this common sophism.
If we see the same trends appearing everywhere, then it's evidence for something being up. Otherwise Israel works as an outlier that is likely caused by something else as the vaccine being ineffective.
Perhaps they've got some new Israel Variant that the
Re: (Score:2)
WMDs in Iraq. Strawman. Most of the world never believed that claim, because there was no evidence at all.
Bodies stacked. Not sure what you're playing on there. Going by the fallacy in the last sentence, it sounds like you think I made that claim. If that's it, then it would be another strawman fallacy, because that claim wasn't made.
After "I" also get it. Appeal to fear/emotion. I already had it. But then again my bloodline has some extraordinarily resilient respirat
Re: (Score:2)
Also that data is quite old. Like I said, things looked different in the early stages. But today we count over 600,000 COVID related deaths in the US. How does that compare to traffic related deaths in the US in that same time?
And again, cars are useful and pretty essential to many things in today's live. Drawing up that comparison between a car and a disease is beyond stupid.
So yeah, you're arguing like a fucking idiot.
Re: (Score:2)
BS. most doctors agreed leaching blood was the best treatment for everything for hundreds of years.
Yes, but that was before medical science was really a thing. Formalized rules for empiricism in medical discovery have been established. Many of the doctors of the past look like maniacs and butchers by comparison with doctors today. That does not mean that the doctors of today are always right, but they are the experts on medicine and an infrastructure has been created that checks and double checks them.
Re: (Score:2)
Meanwhile, in the real world, you can predict with a high degree of accuracy the year a doctor graduated by the basket of drugs the regularly prescribe.
Quite possibly. I'm not claiming that medical practice is perfect. I'm saying that the problems with medical practice are much smaller today than they were in the 1700's. Medical outcomes improve for the majority of patients who go to a doctor these days.
Frankly, I have a boatload of issues with doctors. Prescriptions and diagnoses selected by habit or insufficiently examined personal biases are certainly one of them. I'm all for rationalizing medicine more than it already is. Also, it seems like too many d
Re: (Score:2)
As someone else correctly pointed out, blood letting, in the right circumstances is highly effective.
Sure, "bloodletting" in that case was just shorthand for "the 99.9+% of times bloodletting was used". Obviously you might use it in cases of grafts or for certain specific medical conditions. If you want to stretch the definition, dialysis might count, for example. I think the context was pretty clear from both my own post and the series of posts I was replying to though.
My issue here stems from the self evident groupthink that covid19 is the worst thing to happen to humanity since the spanish flu.
Bear in mind that, if the Spanish Flu were to happen today, it might have far less fatalities - quite possibly fewer than COVID-19 - due t
Re: (Score:2)
->You're really going to have to clarify what you're trying to say here.
Isreal, 78% vaccinated, 6,687 COVID deaths, 9,326,000 population = 7 deaths per 10,000 population
India:8.9% vaccinated, 432,112 COVID deaths, 1,395,198,070 population= 3 deaths per 10,000 population
Pretty substantial evidence right there the vaccine hasn't helped.
I meant clarify the arbitrary car accident analogy. As far as your "proof" above, have you considered that Israel's population is about 7.5% rural while India's population is 65% rural? That's before you consider potential reporting difficulties in India. There are a lot of factors that make them difficult to compare directly.
The COVID-19 mortality rate in people 65 years old during the period of fatalities from the epidemic was equivalent to the mortality rate from driving between 4 and 82 miles per day for 13 countries and 5 states, and was higher (equivalent to the mortality rate from driving 106â"483 miles per day) for 8 other states and the UK.
You do realize that equivalent to in some cases + higher than in other cases adds up to higher than on average right? Distinctly not "is lower than serious injury or death from a car a
Re: (Score:2)
->You do realize that equivalent to in some cases + higher than in other cases adds up to higher than on average right?
Depends how many miles you drive I guess, The highest risk countries such as the UK is still lower risk than a road trip from Manchester to London.
You have to understand how ridiculous this car analogy is, right? It requires way too many hoops to jump through and fudging to make it look anything like an apples to apples comparison. It's very clearly really apples to oranges. In any case, the average person in the US drives 37 miles per day. That's inside the 4 - 82 miles range that you quoted. and it is clearly less than the mean average for that range. So that means that you're still definitely wrong according to your own source. Also, the UK average
Re: (Score:2)
37 miles driving a day is a lot more than the 4 miles a day risk of dying of COVID in India or 15 miles a day risk of dying of COVID in Germany.
First, you're cherry picking data from that one statistical study. Second, you still have not addressed the fact that the numbers you're quoting are for only a small fraction of the people who die of COVID. Saying that a small fraction of the people who die of COVID are smaller than some other arbitrary cause of death is nonsense. I can't tell if you're just really bad at analyzing data or if you're being disingenuous.
->What on Earth does Norway banning the Astra Zeneca vaccine have to do with the relative rural populations of India and Israel?
7 deaths per 10,000 in highly vaccinated is more than 3 deaths in 10,000 in the unvaccinated.
Maybe that is because of the differences in rural population, maybe its because.
https://www.bmj.com/content/37... [bmj.com]
And they are being recorded as COVID deaths rather than vaccine deaths.
But I stopped short of that - just pointing out the vaccines clearly haven't helped.
Or as I said earlier, not so much evidence the vaccines have helped.
Being recorded as COVID deaths rather than vaccine deaths? What nonsense. How exactly do y
Re: (Score:2)
->Being recorded as COVID deaths rather than vaccine deaths? What nonsense. How exactly do you think you've demonstrated that?
The fact that they haven't recorded any covid deaths, but Norway showed that of 30,000 vaccinated, 47 of them died or likely died because of the vaccine.
Norway has recorded 810 covid deaths. Where are you getting no COVID-19 deaths? Also, how does what you're saying above equate to vaccine-related deaths being recorded as COVID-19 deaths? You have not demonstrated that anywhere. Also, Norway has fully vaccinated about 3 million people. You're stuck on a study saying that the vaccines may be risky for the ex
Re: (Score:2)
->I'm sorry, what? You're claiming that upwards of 1 person in a thousand ("10 in 10,000") dies from being vaccinated for COVID-19?
No, I concluded the vaccine hasn't helped and excluded other evidence that says the vaccine causes harm. Didn't find any evidence to say its helped - which if it did exist, would be really easy to find, instead articles like:
https://www.usnews.com/news/be... [usnews.com]
You literally wrote: "Well, evidence shows (that article) roughly 10 in 10,000 (conservative estimate) die from the vaccine" That means that 1 person out of every 1000 dies from the vaccine. You must be used to posting on forums where you can go back and edit your comments afterwards to hide your mistakes or something. It's definitely not "No, I concluded the vaccine hasn't helped and excluded other evidence that says the vaccine causes harm", you specifically wrote that 1 in 1000 dying from the vaccine is
Re: (Score:2)
->You literally wrote: "Well, evidence shows (that article) roughly 10 in 10,000 (conservative estimate) die from the vaccine" That means that 1 person out of every 1000 dies from the vaccine.
Yes, it does, doesn't it. How exactly does that disagree with a conclusion that vaccine hasn't helped?
It disagrees with that conclusion because it's obviously not true. Where are the 190,000 people in the US that should be dead from the vaccine? As I've already said, and you ignored, that would make it the fourth leading cause of death in the US behind cancer, heart disease and COVID-19. It would be obvious.
-> You link an article that's very clear that people in Alabama who are vaccinated die at a much lower rate than the unvaccinated
26 in 6000 is a much much higher rate than the death rates in the unvaccinated
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.go... [nih.gov]
In Alabama, since the vaccines were introduced, there have been about 270,000 COVID-19 cases, with about 6000 of them being in vaccinated people. In the same time frame, 26 vaccinated people have died an
Re: (Score:2)
Probably buried/cremated by now I guess, alongside the 400k that died from a raw covid infection.
It's clear from many sources, including the articles you have linked, that they are tracking deaths of people who have been vaccinated. Nowhere near that many vaccinated people have died.
Yet there are more sick and dying in Alabama of COVID than this time last year,
So its obviously not true that the vaccine helped.
Did you miss the part where only a bit more than a third of people in Alabama are vaccinated? Or the bit where there are new, worse strains? Vaccines only help if people take them, or if the number of people who don't take them is only a small fraction of the population. Also, over time, the various strains of the virus spr
Re: (Score:2)
BS. most doctors agreed leaching blood was the best treatment for everything for hundreds of years.
Was it the criticism of a noisy commenter on the internet that set them straight, perhaps armed with a Willy Wonka meme?
Re: Pawns: You will take these vaccine shots anyw (Score:2)
Well, they still use maggots to clean certain kinds of wounds.
I never really understood the leeches though; what was the first doc thinking?
Re: (Score:2)
Leeches do have the advantage of producing a fairly controlled and safe bleed. They take a pretty predictable amount of blood in a feeding without needing a lot of crude slashing at the patient. Also, while leeches could potentially pass on infections, they were probably a lot closer to something like sterile than the instruments a doctor would use since the leeches own immune system would take care of some pathogens that might be carried on dirty knives and needles. They should be less likely to infect the
Re: (Score:2)
Technically, the person you replied here was being a spelling Nazi rather than a grammar Nazi. Also, you misspelled "grammar". Regarding 2, that was not a very mature or reasoned response. I suppose they should not have told you to run in front of a bus, of course. In any case, you have never addressed the fact that vaccines have been used to drastically reduce or eliminate many terrible diseases.
Re: (Score:2)
No one was arguing that it was unintentional. Your reply just seemed like a variant of Muphrey's Law. Seeing that Encyclopedia Dramatica link, I have to wonder, do you spend a lot of time hanging out on 4chan, or 8chan or whateverchan?
Re: (Score:2)
Those are definitely not places I frequent. I've checked them out, but they're definitely not my thing. The level of "conversation" seemed to generally be pointless and hopelessly disjointed. Not to mention it seemed like many people just wanted to post disturbing/disgusting things just to get a reaction. They are basically forum services, so maybe they have less chaotic niches where valuable discussion takes place, but I've never searched for the answer to a programming question and had the answer turn up
Re: (Score:2)
I'm all for preserving Internet history, but I see very little value in preserving Encyclopedia Dramatica.
Re: Pawns: You will take these vaccine shots anyw (Score:2)
Re:Pawns: You will take these vaccine shots anyway (Score:5, Insightful)
If you had told someone 40 years ago that somehow Russia will turn our love of freedom against us...
Re: (Score:2)
Quite frankly, I think the Russian trolls are basically trying to do _something_ to keep their jobs. Their activities are obviously not needed in any way. The oh so educated and smart westerners are doing it to themselves quite well without any outside prompting.
Re: (Score:2)
Hey, they duped idiots into doing their work, let them have the fruits of their labor.
Re: (Score:3)
It's about nudging them. That's what trolls do. When the flame wars start to simmer down, just pop in and say "but what about Hitler?" and the fights start back up again. So you can't really say that the Russian troll factories have caused the decline of American civil discourse directly, but they certainly have seen that civil discourse is breaking down and have taken advantage to keep prodding and poking at it so that it continues to break down.
Statistics (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Statistics (Score:5, Insightful)
Yes, that seems to be largely what happened. In spreading anti-vax propaganda, it seems that that Russia had two goals. First, was to cause chaos in the West. Second, was to promote their own Sputnik vaccine which they were hoping would be used in more places, beyond just the Russian sphere of influence, but in developing nations as well. Unfortunately, the Sputnik vaccine turned out not to be great. . Worse, their anti-vax propaganda in their own state run TV targeted at Pfizer, Moderna and AstraZenica apparently has spread to a general anti-vax attitude among the Russian population, to the point where they don't trust the Sputnik vaccine, and really really aren't happy with Russian now trying to also use the AstraZeneca vaccine. https://www.thedailybeast.com/state-tv-russians-are-using-prosthetic-arms-to-dodge-covid-vaccines [thedailybeast.com]
At some level, it is funny to see how Russia has shot themselves in their own foot with this. But that's not all that is going on here. People in Russia and elsewhere are suffering and dying as a result of Russia's own anti-vax propaganda. No one deserves to die because they listened to anti-vax propaganda, and the idea that people are dying because their own government spread it makes it even more tragic. Moreover, this is fundamentally a worldwide problem, and so taking steps to deliberately interfere with dealing with a worldwide pandemic which has already killed millions and is posed to kill millions more is terrible. I can't imagine anything that is a more clear cut crime against humanity in the most literal sense of the word. But Russia is already under major sanctions by many countries for their actions with Ukraine and Crimea, as well as some other activities. There's very little we can do about this, and politically it is clear that a lot of people don't really realize how absolutely awful this behavior is, fundamentally far worse than small scale revanchism.
Re:Statistics (Score:5, Insightful)
Undermine the competition to promote your own product. Basic business practices 101.
The Russian government actually operates on capitalist ideals rather than socialist ideals and, as a government, they aren't really restrained by pesky laws and regulations. They are what capitalism devolves into when left unregulated.
Don't believe me?
We spent a year being gaslighted by Trump with claims that covid didn't exist, that it was just the flu, that it would be gone in no time, that the vaccine wasn't necessary... the list of lies is too long to post.
Why? Because the areas that were hit hardest by covid at the beginning were blue states and the Trump administration thought they could undermine Democrats support if they suffered more. Just like Russia, however, the misinformation spread more rapidly in red states. Now we see the lowest vaccination rates and the highest infection rates in areas that lean heavily to the right.
It's the same goddamn story.
Re: (Score:2)
Please post the list?
"We spent a year being gaslighted by Trump with claims that covid didn't exist"
No, he said that the Democrats freaking out over it was a scam. It was.
"that it was just the flu,"
The IFR for COVID is 0.13ish, and that of the common influenza 0.09-0.14. The threat to humans from COVID is comparable to getting another new kind of flu. So fuck off with your paranoid fearmongering bullshit.
Frex; the news just breathlessly announced in the US 32 million cases, 625,000 deaths. But t
Re:Statistics (Score:5, Informative)
Re: (Score:3)
The commentator is likely accurate. There's a fair bit of evidence that the Trump people stopped focusing on COVID when they realized it was mostly hitting blue states. See here https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/07/how-jared-kushners-secret-testing-plan-went-poof-into-thin-air [vanityfair.com]. This isn't about finding common ground or fomenting discord, but just about what actually happened. A norm where one group can engage in terrible, tribalistic behavior, but pointing it out is fomenting discord is a pretty unhealthy one.
Or this: https://nymag.com/intelligence... [nymag.com]
And in a terrible fit of irony, what they approved of in the early days when it was killing the libs - today it is affecting their base.
Re: (Score:3)
You never want to rely on the enemy being stupid. But sometimes the enemy is stupid.
Re: (Score:2)
Indeed. Also, sometimes you are stupid yourself and that is something you need to be prepared for or you cannot fix it.
Re: (Score:2)
True enough. If it were possible to know you're acting stupidly while you were doing that, it would never happen.
Re: (Score:2)
True enough. If it were possible to know you're acting stupidly while you were doing that, it would never happen.
I am not sure about that, but after-the-fact fixing of mistakes depends critically on seeing the mistake and being able to admit having made it. It is also the only real way to learn from mistakes.
ho hum.. (Score:2)
Na, its just run of the mill stock market manipulation, just like how blood clots were a huge deal for like a week (by coincidence the week leading up to earnings calls), adding predictable price shifts to the market, allowing a few people to make a quick buck. Smearing Pfizer and AstraZeneca this week, better buy Moderna. Then leak to NBC that the anti vax message was fake news from scary Russians (never mind that you were the one that hired them), reverse your position and rake in some more cash.
Re:Statistics (Score:4, Interesting)
Re: (Score:2)
Partner with the Indians. They know how to do manufacturing.
Re: (Score:2)
There's very little we can do about this, and politically it is clear that a lot of people don't really realize how absolutely awful this behavior is, fundamentally far worse than small scale revanchism.
Worse than giving us four years of Trump?
Re: (Score:2)
They've tried very hard to give us eight years of Trump, so yes, worse than giving us four years of Trump.
Re: (Score:2)
But which people in Russia, in what proportion? Might it not still be "good policy" (I'm talking from the point of view of the powers in charge), if their distribution of suckers happens to be different from America's?
I just realized I don't know what Putin has personally said, or how Russian media targets people. If pro-Putin supporters are getting vaccinated and anti-Putin people are being drawn into the
Re: (Score:2)
Twisting words: vaccine not perfect, but damn good (Score:3)
You're basically just playing with words on technicallity and trying to manipulate.
It all boils down to "in medecine and biology nothing is guaranteed to happen neither 100% nor 0% of time".
1) Herd Immunity is required to enable eonomic and social recover
Head immunity plays a important role, as keeping a geographical region hermetically sealed is hard.
Some country managed for now, but all it takes is a few missed cases for the epidemics to get there.
2) Vaccines are the only route to achieve herd immunity
The scientific consensus never said "only". Again, there no such thing a 100% or 0% in Bio-Med.
The current consensus is tha
Re: Statistics (Score:3)
What makes you think Russian citizens (Score:2)
Another background reading (Score:4, Informative)
I found this publication informative, as to the scope and forms of these activities:
https://primetimezone.com/worl... [primetimezone.com]
Wouldn't be surprised by the irony of this being funded from Nordstream (and expanded with -2) income.
Re: (Score:2, Funny)
In other news (Score:2)
Ursine faecal material is still being found in forests and the Pope has not been received into another church.
Nobody should be in the slightest surprised by this news, though it is a spectacular reminder of how far the Russians will descend to cause damage around the world.
Re: (Score:3)
Nobody should be in the slightest surprised by this news, though it is a spectacular reminder of how far the Russians will descend to cause damage around the world.
For a recent example of malfeasance in an unrelated area, you can turn to Russia accusing a NASA astronaut of drilling through their spacecraft [arstechnica.com] in 2018. It's thought this is to deflect criticism of their recent Progress glitch that put the entire ISS crew at serious risk. Essentially Russia is accusing a NASA astronaut of sabotaging their spacecraft in order to get an early return to earth. When the hole happened, NASA had provided Roscosmos with evidence of when the leak started and where all of their NASA
So you say it was a bad investment? (Score:3)
So yo are saying someone invested millions into a disinformation campaign with the intention to fail?
Re:In other news (Score:4, Interesting)
Thanks for providing proof that yes, it works.
Re: (Score:2)
You have to be a complete genetic moron to think that a few Instagram posts can somehow fundamentally shift the opinion of 330 million people.
So, how much did you get paid to write that comment? Did you have to take it in rubles, or do you only get kopeks?
Re: (Score:2)
Looks like you have missed how low in value ruble is these days. Kopeks are on their last feet, not minted (issued) anymore.
It turned me into a chimpanzee! (Score:2)
There's Your Influencers Folks (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Last time I said they should be more aptly spelled as "influenza" because they're a disease I got downvoted.
Wonder if that already changed or whether it takes a few more events like this.
Re: (Score:3)
That's a really good question. The problem isn't Russia buying ads, it's that people believe ads in the first place.
What is wrong with people?
Re: (Score:2)
That's a really good question. The problem isn't Russia buying ads, it's that people believe ads in the first place.
What is wrong with people?
They're pathologically incapable of installing an ad blocker?
Ignorance is bliss.
If its true... (Score:2)
Hopefully (Score:2)
the influencers that accept the money and sold their integrity are booted off Facebook and begin to fail at their other social media endeavors.
Re: (Score:2)
But the sheep believe them (Score:2)
Who is more Putin's tool, Trump or Zuckerberg (Score:2)
I can't keep track of which one Putin uses more, Trump or Zuckerberg, but he seems to have both under his thumb.
Re:Oh! We're back to "Russia! Russia! Russia!" aga (Score:4, Insightful)
In fact it never left, as the Russian propaganda machines have never stopped printing bullshit. This explains why you have been continuing to lap it up all this time. Specifically, you have bought the "nothing to see here" narrative that they have been promoting, and you are proud of it. This is why we can't have nice things, like democracy.
Re: (Score:2)
Not really. We cannot have a working democracy because people fall for this crap, whether it comes from outside or from within.
Re: (Score:2)
Specifically, you have bought the "nothing to see here" narrative that they have been promoting, and you are proud of it. This is why we can't have nice things, like democracy.
Not really. We cannot have a working democracy because people fall for this crap, whether it comes from outside or from within.
That's what I was saying!
Of course, people fall for this crap because our fearful leaders have compromised public education such that it doesn't teach people to think...
Re: (Score:2)
That's what I was saying!
Of course, people fall for this crap because our fearful leaders have compromised public education such that it doesn't teach people to think...
I don't think this is traceable to "fearful leaders". People manage to be this stupid all by themselves. The "fearful leaders" at best amplify this effect. I also do not think this is a failure of the education system. For example, some factions of the anti-vaxx movement are highly educated and would definitely be able to fact-check their stance. They _chose_ to not do that and go with some fuzzy gut-feeling instead. There are also smart and educated flat-earthers. Same fail.
No education system can fix tha
Re: (Score:2)
I don't think this is traceable to "fearful leaders". People manage to be this stupid all by themselves. The "fearful leaders" at best amplify this effect.
They're amplifying it when they should be reducing it, which can be done with meaningful education that promotes critical thinking and problem solving. Instead we mostly get indoctrination and people learn first and foremost to accept what they are told by sources they believe in. And they're not taught to evaluate sources, so they believe any stupid shit.
Re: (Score:2)
China was a bit slow this week (But look! They are talking to the Taliban!) so at the moment it is Russia that we have "always been at war with"....
Re: (Score:2)
This is the sort of dumb shit you say when you just ignore the data showing the partisan breakdown of vaccine-deniers.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Yeah when I want unimpeachable authoritative data on anything, I go to some guy on Twitter.
Re:Of far far greater reach (Score:4, Insightful)
A president, Biden that spent 6 months or more having this message broadcast long and loud - Do not trust the Trump vaccines.
[citation needed]
Re:Of far far greater reach (Score:5, Insightful)
You provide as a citation a tweet from a guy that glued together a whole bunch of out-of-context clips where Biden and Harris are saying that they wouldn't trust only Trump on the vaccine but instead the actual experts. Real smoking gun there, comrade.
I'll give you another question to go after - when the vaccine was finally available, where was Trump trying to convince people to take it? He wouldn't help with jack shit after he lost the election, he just strutted around proudly showing his butthurt. I guess, why should he help America anyway - he was only ever in anything for himself after all.
Re: (Score:2)
lololol your link is shit, it takes real quotes and provides them out of context and mischaracterizes them, even the videos are cut to take out the context.
If this is an example of what you think is quality journalism, no wonder people like you know fuck about shit.